Someone talk me into OR out of liking Desean Jackson

[rockrules40]

As of now I have jumped onto the fence about this guy. I originally hated the thought of him in Denver and especially at #12. He reminded me too much of Ginn, whom I thought Miami took way too high.

But as of now I am officially on the fence about him. I went and looked at film (via youtube) and liked what I saw.

This guy does a lot of his work after the catch, with of course the big catch down the field. Which is what you need to do in the west coast system. Another think I saw was that on most receptions he caught with his hands and then brought it into his body. Many WR I have noticed that have failed in the NFL caught the ball with their chest, some of them being Lelie, David Terrell, and Ted Ginn (who's future is still up in the air) .

Things I don't like about him are #1 is size. He is a shade under 5'10 and only weighs 165-170 which is my height and weight. I know I could not take hits in the NFL. Also I think #12 is a little too high for him based on where mock drafts have been putting him.

So my mission to you guys is for someone to push me over the fence one way or another. Thank you. :salute:

[aberdien]

I'm on the fence too.

CONVERT ME!

[Max Power]

all the cool kids like D-Jax, so if you wanna be cool...

[CTM]

Mainly what I'm against is spending a 1st rounder on a guy who looks like he'll snap in half on the first hit he takes. I know he's fast and torched college secondaries but this is the pros. He wont be able to do the same damage going up against the better corners in the league who will jam him at the line. I would prefer we solve another are in the first and take WR later in the draft.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

Okay, here's what you do.

Close your eyes and imagine this skinny little guy whipping down the sideline for about a thirty yard gain, then suddenly he is drilled and the ball comes out. I mean he really gets drilled; totally decleated.
Then the hit becomes the joke of the week on SportsCenter because it was by a punter.:P:P

Does that help any?

[Max Power]

Okay, here's what you do.

Close your eyes and imagine this skinny little guy whipping down the sideline for about a thirty yard gain, then suddenly he is drilled and the ball comes out. I mean he really gets drilled; totally decleated.
Then the hit becomes the joke of the week on SportsCenter because it was by a punter.:P:P

Does that help any?

lol a punter won't be able to catch him let alone lay the wood on him. And since when do punters hit like linebackers unless it's Sauerbrun?

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

lol a punter won't be able to catch him let alone lay the wood on him.

Don't you remember Devin Hester getting decleated by Josh Brown last year. The punter plays safety, not pursuit, but whatever you say man. :salute:

[Max Power]

Don't you remember Devin Hester getting decleated by Josh Brown last year. The punter plays safety, not pursuit, but whatever you say man. :salute:

fluke play. 9 times out of 10 Hester blows right past him or jukes him out and dashes to the endzone. Most punters shy away from contact anyway. Josh Brown is a kicker, and no I don't recall that particular play.

[#7 all day]

well nobody can change your mind, you just have to watch him play, and think of what he can do as a bronco...

personally, i really wouldnt mind if the Broncos drafted him. Maybe not at 12, because that is too high for [I]any[I] wr in this draft class, but if we were to move down, and all of the top lineman(both D&O) are gone, plus Rivers...id go for it

yes he is small, but all he needs to do is gain 10-15 pounds, which he CAN do with the off-season workouts...if he can do that, we would have a PERFECT compliment to Brandon Marshall, and a potentially great return man in this league

i mean, does anyone besides bronco fans remember that "Glenn Martinez" returned our lonely return all season?
no
they would if we had him, as will the coaches...which means less focus on Marshall..

and so on and so on

their is a lot that this kid could do if we decided to bring him in

:salute:

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

fluke play. 9 times out of 10 Hester blows right past him or jukes him out and dashes to the endzone. Most punters shy away from contact anyway. Josh Brown is a kicker, and no I don't recall that particular play.


You are correct in what you are saying. I was making a point mainly for the sake of humor. But, yes Hester did get totally decleated, and the fact that he was the lightest man on the field did have something to do with it. That being said, I would love to have D. J., but just not in the first round.;)

[Ravage!!!]

Don't you remember Devin Hester getting decleated by Josh Brown last year. The punter plays safety, not pursuit, but whatever you say man. :salute:

there are no punters in the NFL that TRULY play safety on punts. They HOPE to play safety... but in reality.. they are just a body out there that would HOPE to trip up, or maybe slow a step, so that the real players can make the tackle.

[Ravage!!!]

You are correct in what you are saying. I was making a point mainly for the sake of humor. But, yes Hester did get totally decleated, and the fact that he was the lightest man on the field did have something to do with it. That being said, I would love to have D. J., but just not in the first round.;)

yeah.. how I feel. Certainly not at 12. If later in hte round, maybe.. but not at 12

[Dub-DeuceKnight]

If you watch tape of Desean Jackson, he plays tough for his size but the big thing to notice is how he takes a hit, his awareness on the field is very good, he always avoids taking a big hit and puts his body in good position to get up for the next play... I've seen him take 1 or 2 big hits but he always pops right up.

As far as people on the fence, I would like to see an elite DT, an OT or Desean Jackson. He brings another element to the offense and is an immediate threat on special teams. He will open up all kinds of avenues for our offense.

[Max Power]

If you watch tape of Desean Jackson, he plays tough for his size but the big thing to notice is how he takes a hit, his awareness on the field is very good, he always avoids taking a big hit and puts his body in good position to get up for the next play... I've seen him take 1 or 2 big hits but he always pops right up.

As far as people on the fence, I would like to see an elite DT, an OT or Desean Jackson. He brings another element to the offense and is an immediate threat on special teams. He will open up all kinds of avenues for our offense.

This is true... there is a video on youtube of a play in a Cal/USC game where he gets DRILLED by Kevin Ellison over the middle, but he got up after a few seconds on the ground. It was a vicious hit, a hit that any WR of any size would have felt. He's tougher than given credit for.

[antipas]

Just say no to Desean Jackson, or anything else that has anything to do with drafting a WR in the first! Especially when our lines, both offencive and defencive need help! Thankyou for your cooporation!:eek::P

[Dub-DeuceKnight]

lol to bad spelling in big letters, but I think everyone can agree that on upgrade on the offensive and defensive lines is in order... I would be very upset if we didn't snag 2,3 or 4 in the draft, it is almost vital.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

This is true... there is a video on youtube of a play in a Cal/USC game where he gets DRILLED by Kevin Ellison over the middle, but he got up after a few seconds on the ground. It was a vicious hit, a hit that any WR of any size would have felt. He's tougher than given credit for.

I am not questioning his toughness. I am sure he is a pretty committed athlete, if he wasn't, Jerry Rice wouldn't waste his time helping the kid work out.

I watched him a few times in college, and the kid is fun and exciting to watch, but the db's in the NFL are much larger, and unless he were to put on about 20 pounds he would struggle with bump and run coverage, imho.

[Max Power]

But what if the value for OT/DT isn't there? WR seems like the most logical option then. It was a big need before Marshall's injury IMO and that has only magnified it. Maybe the 3rd time's a charm for Shanahan drafting a 1st round WR.

[Al Wilson 4 Mayor]

It's hard to say, there will probably be an offensive tackle, or even a good linebacker. If we had to draft a wideout I would hope we would trade down, and yes take D.J., either at the end of the first round, or the beginning of the second, if he were available. I do think with our weight training program he would put on weight. Terrel Davis put on 15 pounds between his rookie and second seasons.

[Max Power]

OT would be acceptable, but I'd much rather get a WR in the 1st than a LB if the value is equal or better. Trading down for D-Jax is something I'm definitely on board with but it couldn't be at the end of the 1st; the Bucs won't let him slide past #20.

Check out my latest mock (http://forums.denverbroncos.com/showthread.php?t=113588) where I have an ingenious trade with Detroit which moves us down and still lands us D-Jax.

[Dub-DeuceKnight]

You would be an idiot to try and press Desean Jackson, look at all his college tape when we went up against NFL caliber players, no one would try to jam him at the line because if they mess up he is gone. Your safest bet is to give him a 4-8 yard cushion and run with him and be physical while you're running and try to prevent any separation, which with him is nearly next to impossible

[D_Broncs_913]

You would be an idiot to try and press Desean Jackson, look at all his college tape when we went up against NFL caliber players, no one would try to jam him at the line because if they mess up he is gone. Your safest bet is to give him a 4-8 yard cushion and run with him and be physical while you're running and try to prevent any separation, which with him is nearly next to impossible

nicely put, Im kinda leaning to taking him unless Clady is there. I mean the Panthers took a chance with Steve Smith, why shouldn't we try the same? Besides isnt that what training camps for? Putting on some muscle? OT has alot of depth in this years draft, and I'm loving Frank Okam as a sleeper till the 4th round. We need special teams, just ask the Bears how much it helps.

[SethGrandpa]

People who say he'll get hurt the first time he gets hit are just dumb. He's was big time college football player. But...oh...I forgot they play two-hand touch don't they? Give me a break.

[JayCutty6]

People need to understand what he would bring to this team at the WR,PR,KR positions. Some say why spend a first round pick on a number two wide out......Well sorry but number 2 is only a title, Number 2 and 3 wide outs get touches. The only thing Jackson would have to do is learn how to block a bit, He runs great routes, He uses his hands to catch balls, He will make the tough catch, He will score touchdowns no matter what. As far as him being hit hard.......Ive seen him drilled in college plenty times and hes never been hurt. Hisonly injury was a pinky injury lol. Jackson will be a great Bronco. We need him, We need speed, We need play makers, You can measure a manz hieght and weight but u cant measure a manz heart and work ethic. Jackson has heart and a great work ethic and hes a team player. PLus he wants to play in Denver pretty bad. He loves the system And he fits the system. What would be better than drafting an talented player who fits exactly what you wanna do

[japfaff]

There is no argument for drafting Jackson.... He doesnt have the production. last year he had 2 100 + yard recieving games, and 8 games with less than 50 yards. He just doesn't have the numbers. Yeah he has speed, but BFD, you can get Dexter Jackson in the fourth or fifth round. He is just as fast.

JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE FAST DOESN'T MEAN THAT YOU CAN RETURN KICKS!!

[japfaff]

nicely put, Im kinda leaning to taking him unless Clady is there. I mean the Panthers took a chance with Steve Smith, why shouldn't we try the same? Besides isnt that what training camps for? Putting on some muscle? OT has alot of depth in this years draft, and I'm loving Frank Okam as a sleeper till the 4th round. We need special teams, just ask the Bears how much it helps.



Yeah but the Panthers took a chance on Smith in the 3rd round. Iwould be cool with drafting Jackson in the third round...Hell even in the second.....He is just not the best receiving prospect

[JayCutty6]

There is no argument for drafting Jackson.... He doesnt have the production. last year he had 2 100 + yard recieving games, and 8 games with less than 50 yards. He just doesn't have the numbers. Yeah he has speed, but BFD, you can get Dexter Jackson in the fourth or fifth round. He is just as fast.

JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE FAST DOESN'T MEAN THAT YOU CAN RETURN KICKS!!

Do you wanna post jackson highlights and dexters?? No comparison........And it not all about his SPEED, The man has great hands, ALl of his catches are made with his hands and tucked into the body. Runs great routes, Tell santana moss hes to small to play

[broncos9697]

I also like him as a first round pick fro denver but not at #12 if we are aiming for him we need to trade down like #22 he should still be there...then we will also pick up another draft spot from the trade

[BroncosTX77]

Do you wanna post jackson highlights and dexters?? No comparison........And it not all about his SPEED, The man has great hands, ALl of his catches are made with his hands and tucked into the body. Runs great routes, Tell santana moss hes to small to play

Give up. You're beating a dead horse and arguing with a Brick Wall. They will never see or understand any other argument than the one they have implanted in their head. I believe in DeSean Jackson. I want him to be a Bronco irregardless of the McD's bag, but now I will understand if they go in a different direction.

:salute:

[JayCutty6]

Give up. You're beating a dead horse and arguing with a Brick Wall. They will never see or understand any other argument than the one they have implanted in their head. I believe in DeSean Jackson. I want him to be a Bronco irregardless of the McD's bag, but now I will understand if they go in a different direction.

:salute:

Yeah you might be right, I just hate when people say a guy cant play because of his size. We all know the odds are against some people but you can never question the mans heart. Then some idiot says hes injury prone when his only major injury was like his pinky and that was last year

[rockrules40]

We do need a WR pretty badly. The only WR who is even worthy of starting other than B-Marsh is Brandon Stokely.

[utebroncofan]

Although I dont want Desean in the 1st rnd there is another problem if we take him.Putting a WR back to return kicks that you expect to start for you is a really stupid move.What happens if he gets hurt and misses 4-6 or more games because he gets hurt returning a kick.Then the Broncos have spent a lot of money at #12 on a WR/KR thats sitting on the sidelines.Remember the Broncos had to start Foxworth in the AFC Champ game a few yrs back because Darrent had gotten hurt returning a kick against the patriots the week before if I remember correctly.I'm not saying we would have won that game but it certainly did effect that game.

[Dub-DeuceKnight]

yeah and what if they slip on a mcdonalds bag and fall through a T.V.?

That was a stupid point, all players get injured. Jarvis Moss, our 1st round pick last year, got hurt but he'll probably be fine this year...

[D_Broncs_913]

You guys are think athletes are like some kind of superhero, injuries will happen. You can't really prevent them. You can lower your chances but cant stop them. Why so critical about his size, the man made it to college with a scholarship to play 1A Football, now how many people on this board can say they've done that. I wish DeSean the best and hope we draft him.

[Baconator]

D. Jackson 6' - Steve Smith 5' 9" similar player big upside
I dont see denver taking any one of the top OL prospects
Besides Ellis or Dorsey, who won't fall, who does Denver pick?

[rockrules40]

D. Jackson 6' - Steve Smith 5' 9" similar player big upside
I dont see denver taking any one of the top OL prospects
Besides Ellis or Dorsey, who won't fall, who does Denver pick?

Jackson is actually just under 5'10"

[duhyaj]

Tell santana moss hes to small to play

Once again we have someone syaing tell Something like this whe it is completely irrelevant, this is santana moss' size...

Santana Moss | #89 | WR Washington Redskins | Official Team Site. Height: 5-10 Weight: 200 Age: 28

this is the midget....
5'9" 168 lbs

[Utah#1Broncofan]

I like D. Jackson only if we can trade down and still get him. The major problem I see is if we draft him and not an OL men then how is Jay going to get the ball to him? If he gets rushed or sacked on every play.. We need to protect Jay if we are going to have a chance to win.... I think games are won/lost upfront IMO... But if we can get him and an extra draft pick I would be really happy:D

[Ravage!!!]

You guys are think athletes are like some kind of superhero, injuries will happen. You can't really prevent them. You can lower your chances but cant stop them. Why so critical about his size, the man made it to college with a scholarship to play 1A Football, now how many people on this board can say they've done that. I wish DeSean the best and hope we draft him.

Why worry about his size? Because of what you just said.... "you can lower your chances." The chances of injury are higher with smaller players. That just makes sense.

just HOW MANY successful 5'9" 165lb WRs can you name?? So whats the bigger chance of happening, this kid becoming one of the FEW very small successful NFL players, or this kid becoming like all the rest of the small players that tried to succeed in a BIG man's game? The odds are HIGHLY against him, and that doesn't seem to be a wise choice for our 12th pick.

He's a reach at 12. No matter what, even the DJ supporters have admitted its a 'reach'.. but they want to word it in a way like "thinking outside the box" or something similar. Either way. The last thing we need is to take a REACH on a runt with the 12th pick when we would be smarter (in a time the team is relying on the draft more than ever) and NOT reach for the 'stars' with this "hope" of a pick.

[Gr3yStreet]

Tell santana moss hes to small to play

Once again we have someone syaing tell Something like this whe it is completely irrelevant, this is santana moss' size...

Santana Moss | #89 | WR Washington Redskins | Official Team Site. Height: 5-10 Weight: 200 Age: 28

this is the midget....
5'9" 168 lbs

The difference between 168, and 200 in the NFL...is like the difference between a daewoo and a Cadillac.

Thats 30-35 POUNDS of MUSCLE that he has on a larger frame.

[berlownacyo7s]

OK. Why do you think his height matters? It doesn't. The only thing that matter is weight.
DeSean Jackson - 168
Bernard Berrian - 185
Kevin Curtis - 186
Donald Driver - 190
Tedd Ginn - 178
Dont Hall - 187
Marvin Harrison - 185
Devin Hester - 186
Santonio Holmes - 189
Chad Johnson - 192
Derrick Mason - 192
Santana Moss - 200
Randy Moss -210
Roscoe Parrish - 171
Antwaan Randel El - 190
Steve Smith - 185
Donte' Stallworth - 200

All of these come from nfl.com...

However I'm not worried. He's about 170 right. All he needs is 10-15 lbs of muscle and he'll be on par. He doesn't have to be up at 200 lbs because hopefully he will never have to be the guy we throw to every play... we have B Marsh for that.

All Jackson would have to do is return kicks and punts, and be the deep threat for our offense. He won't have to go over the middle. We have a "slot machine" in brandon stokely and we have a 230 lb beast in brandon marshall. All Jackson would have to do is get off the CB press and run deep.

But even seeing his weight now doesn't bother me. In case you guys don't watch, but they actually hit in college football too. It's not like he's coming from a flag football team or anything. He's coming from the university of california. he's been hit before and he's still ok.

I don't think he's worth the 12th pick though, however if we could trade down 5-6-7 spaces then i would be more than happy to get him.

The fact is that he's a playmaker and fun to watch, something the broncos havn't had in a while.

[GridironChamp]

OK. Why do you think his height matters? It doesn't. The only thing that matter is weight.
DeSean Jackson - 168
Bernard Berrian - 185
Kevin Curtis - 186
Donald Driver - 190
Tedd Ginn - 178
Dont Hall - 187
Marvin Harrison - 185
Devin Hester - 186
Santonio Holmes - 189
Chad Johnson - 192
Derrick Mason - 192
Santana Moss - 200
Randy Moss -210
Roscoe Parrish - 171
Antwaan Randel El - 190
Steve Smith - 185
Donte' Stallworth - 200

All of these come from nfl.com...

However I'm not worried. He's about 170 right. All he needs is 10-15 lbs of muscle and he'll be on par. He doesn't have to be up at 200 lbs because hopefully he will never have to be the guy we throw to every play... we have B Marsh for that.

All Jackson would have to do is return kicks and punts, and be the deep threat for our offense. He won't have to go over the middle. We have a "slot machine" in brandon stokely and we have a 230 lb beast in brandon marshall. All Jackson would have to do is get off the CB press and run deep.

But even seeing his weight now doesn't bother me. In case you guys don't watch, but they actually hit in college football too. It's not like he's coming from a flag football team or anything. He's coming from the university of california. he's been hit before and he's still ok.

I don't think he's worth the 12th pick though, however if we could trade down 5-6-7 spaces then i would be more than happy to get him.

The fact is that he's a playmaker and fun to watch, something the broncos havn't had in a while.


Problem... Jackson's frame is that of a 3rd grader... meaning I dont think he will bulk up, he will just tone up. His muscles will become "finer" but not bigger because he has such a small fame.

The kid is too small... If someone can convince me that he is not too small then I would consider this arguement... but until then... Jackson is a runt.


** Dont say Steve Smith because Steve Smith is RIPPED (not a toothpick) and not every single small WR coming into the league will be Steve Smith. There has been ONE Steve Smith named Steve Smith.

[ItalianBronco]

Check the combine stats:coffee:Almost every Wr Or "playmaker" ran the 4.3s,4.4s, Im not spending a #12 on 168 pound second rate reciver at best...most of his stats came off bubble screens and 2 yard throw and catch. You have so much talent out there Manningham in the 2nd, Fagg, Kelly, Sweed, Royal, Thomas... come on were picking him for Punts and Kicks ahla Deltha O'niel same thing we over look his true position which he is poor at becouse he can run one out of 85 kicks back...DO THE MATH...NO THANKS... lets protect Jay and lets get some DT's PLease...

[berlownacyo7s]

Problem... Jackson's frame is that of a 3rd grader... meaning I dont think he will bulk up, he will just tone up. His muscles will become "finer" but not bigger because he has such a small fame.

The kid is too small... If someone can convince me that he is not too small then I would consider this arguement... but until then... Jackson is a runt.


** Dont say Steve Smith because Steve Smith is RIPPED (not a toothpick) and not every single small WR coming into the league will be Steve Smith. There has been ONE Steve Smith named Steve Smith.


I never said he would be steve smith. Just because you don't think he'll bulk up doesn't necesarrily mean he won't. 10-15 lbs isn't out of the reach.

how can you say that he's too small? RECENTLY (last 5 years) has there been a top 20 player at this size who has failed? If not, how do you know that it won't work out... are you physic(i can never spell it right)? if you don't have anyone compatable to compare him with how are you so certain he will fail?

Afterall, there is a first time for everything... why couldn't now be the first time for a light-weight(170lbs) WR?

[Ravage!!!]

Afterall, there is a first time for everything... why couldn't now be the first time for a light-weight(170lbs) WR?

It could be. But do you REALLY want to take a stretch and reach at 12 when Shanahan has been criticized about reaching so many times in the past? WHY would anyone want to take a chance on a "maybe this will be the first" when there have been THOUSANDS upon THOUSANDS of kids drafted into the NFL. Does that really make sense???

If we were picking much later, and wanting to take the BPA, then maybe. But at 12 you want to 'HOPE' for the first time??
OK. Why do you think his height matters? It doesn't. The only thing that matter is weight.
Really? You don't really mean that I hope.:confused: Please tell me you dont really mean this.

[GridironChamp]

I never said he would be steve smith. Just because you don't think he'll bulk up doesn't necesarrily mean he won't. 10-15 lbs isn't out of the reach.

how can you say that he's too small? RECENTLY (last 5 years) has there been a top 20 player at this size who has failed? If not, how do you know that it won't work out... are you physic(i can never spell it right)? if you don't have anyone compatable to compare him with how are you so certain he will fail?

Afterall, there is a first time for everything... why couldn't now be the first time for a light-weight(170lbs) WR?

Why am I certain he will fail as a reciever?

Maybe because in the 10+ years i've payed attention to the NFL (hardcore) and the 30 years befoere I did there hasnt been a single WR that has been succesful at that size... nor do i predict there will be.

I can say i will place my money on the 999999999/100000000 chances that he wont work out rather than the 1/100000000 chances that he will.

I dont see a 5'9" guy that is 170lbs outmuscling anyone in the NFL... nor do i see him abusing bad CBs like he did in the college with speed. Everyone in the NFL is fast. Sure he might be faster, but he wont run circles around them. So what, we got Devin Hester (AT BEST) but slightly worse on ST and slightly better as a 3rd WR.

[berlownacyo7s]

But can you actually name a 170 lbs reciever who runs a 4.3** who failed in the NFL or are you just going off of intuition?

EDIT** who was a projected top 20 draft prospect.

[GridironChamp]

But can you actually name a 170 lbs reciever who runs a 4.3** who failed in the NFL or are you just going off of intuition?

EDIT** who was a projected top 20 draft prospect.

Can you name one that has worked? :confused:



Last small WR that failed, dont know his exact numbers and measurables, Sinorice Moss. He is 5'8" 180lbs. Ran a 4.38.

Ted Ginn Jr. 5'11" 178lbs. 40 time 4.38. Granted he is only a second year WR, he did NOTHING his first year.

Next question? :cheers:

[Momentum]

Peter Warrick.

[duhyaj]

Peter Warrick.

GOOD ANSWER!!!!!

[JayCutty6]

You idiots are acting like Hes playing RUNNING BACK. Hes a WR!!!!!!!!! WR is not a brutal position to play, You take big licks from time to time. And if its in your destiny to get injured then you will regardless of size, Big wide outs get hurt also. Small wide outs gets hurt. Cut the crap with this size thing and how theres never been a WR as small. Harrison is probably 5'10 and 1/2 and weighs about 180.....HOFer!!!!!!!!! I have no problem with Jackson catching the ball and falling to avoid the big hit every possesion. You shouldnt want any wide out regardless of size taking big hits consistantly period. Theres only 3-4 beast WR in the NFL and even they get hurt. If Warrick Dunn can have the career hes had being as small as he is playing RB then i like my chances with a wide out. Its all about heart and keepingyour body up. Jackson has never had a questionable work ethic. Stop hatin

[BroncosTX77]

Besides the whole point of this thread was to help someone who couldn't form their own opinions on a player so they will now decide whether they like DSJ and use others opinions as their justification....

:goofy:

[elevation INC]

You idiots are acting like Hes playing RUNNING BACK. Hes a WR!!!!!!!!! WR is not a brutal position to play, You take big licks from time to time. And if its in your destiny to get injured then you will regardless of size, Big wide outs get hurt also. Small wide outs gets hurt. Cut the crap with this size thing and how theres never been a WR as small. Harrison is probably 5'10 and 1/2 and weighs about 180.....HOFer!!!!!!!!! I have no problem with Jackson catching the ball and falling to avoid the big hit every possesion. You shouldnt want any wide out regardless of size taking big hits consistantly period. Theres only 3-4 beast WR in the NFL and even they get hurt. If Warrick Dunn can have the career hes had being as small as he is playing RB then i like my chances with a wide out. Its all about heart and keepingyour body up. Jackson has never had a questionable work ethic. Stop hatin





actually harrison is 6ft 0 and weighs 185 lbs. thats a 15 lb difference and a 3 inch height andvantage. if u ask me i say there is a difference.


oh and its not just the size thing its the simple fact that there hasnt been a wideout jackson's size to succede in the nfl as anything more than a returner


15 lbs is a difference in speed, route running and athleticism, jackson may have the frame to put on 15 lbs but his other attributes may suffer as a result


its not that were hatin, its that history is very much against him.........

[JayCutty6]

actually harrison is 6ft 0 and weighs 185 lbs. thats a 15 lb difference and a 3 inch height andvantage. if u ask me i say there is a difference.


oh and its not just the size thing its the simple fact that there hasnt been a wideout jackson's size to succede in the nfl as anything more than a returner


15 lbs is a difference in speed, route running and athleticism, jackson may have the frame to put on 15 lbs but his other attributes may suffer as a result


its not that were hatin, its that history is very much against him.........


Lol history is history for many reasons. Things change. Harrison is 185 on paper........6ft on paper. 7 years after he was drafted

[BroncosTX77]

actually harrison is 6ft 0 and weighs 185 lbs. thats a 15 lb difference and a 3 inch height andvantage. if u ask me i say there is a difference.


oh and its not just the size thing its the simple fact that there hasnt been a wideout jackson's size to succede in the nfl as anything more than a returner


15 lbs is a difference in speed, route running and athleticism, jackson may have the frame to put on 15 lbs but his other attributes may suffer as a result


its not that were hatin, its that history is very much against him.........

Again speculation. Nothing concrete. It's funny how history suits folks unless it is against their beliefs. (Not aimed at you) But when ppl show history of OL in Denver it is all excused or just overlooked because they have their heart set on one aspect of the team....

[stnzed]

As of now I have jumped onto the fence about this guy. I originally hated the thought of him in Denver and especially at #12. He reminded me too much of Ginn, whom I thought Miami took way too high.

But as of now I am officially on the fence about him. I went and looked at film (via youtube) and liked what I saw.

This guy does a lot of his work after the catch, with of course the big catch down the field. Which is what you need to do in the west coast system. Another think I saw was that on most receptions he caught with his hands and then brought it into his body. Many WR I have noticed that have failed in the NFL caught the ball with their chest, some of them being Lelie, David Terrell, and Ted Ginn (who's future is still up in the air) .

Things I don't like about him are #1 is size. He is a shade under 5'10 and only weighs 165-170 which is my height and weight. I know I could not take hits in the NFL. Also I think #12 is a little too high for him based on where mock drafts have been putting him.

So my mission to you guys is for someone to push me over the fence one way or another. Thank you. :salute:

Denver most likely isn't going to be able to trade down, so DeSean Jackson at #42 is a good pick......Jackson at #12 is stupid.

If Denver intends on drafting Jackson, I'll wait to see where he's picked to decide whether or not I like him......

[stnzed]

You idiots are acting like Hes playing RUNNING BACK. Hes a WR!!!!!!!!! WR is not a brutal position to play, You take big licks from time to time. And if its in your destiny to get injured then you will regardless of size, Big wide outs get hurt also. Small wide outs gets hurt. Cut the crap with this size thing and how theres never been a WR as small. Harrison is probably 5'10 and 1/2 and weighs about 180.....HOFer!!!!!!!!! I have no problem with Jackson catching the ball and falling to avoid the big hit every possesion. You shouldnt want any wide out regardless of size taking big hits consistantly period. Theres only 3-4 beast WR in the NFL and even they get hurt. If Warrick Dunn can have the career hes had being as small as he is playing RB then i like my chances with a wide out. Its all about heart and keepingyour body up. Jackson has never had a questionable work ethic. Stop hatin


Obviously the Broncos don't want anybody taking a big hit, but this is pure Bullsht.

The Broncos still run an offense with West Coast Offense influences, meaning run after the catch yards are critical......not that this statement isn't pure BS with any other offense in the NFL.

You need to get your mancrush under control, just because these people don't want the Broncos to waste the 12th pick on a runt, it doesn't mean they're idiots......

[GridironChamp]

Again speculation. Nothing concrete. It's funny how history suits folks unless it is against their beliefs. (Not aimed at you) But when ppl show history of OL in Denver it is all excused or just overlooked because they have their heart set on one aspect of the team....

I dont flip flop...

Historically/statistically Jackson will FAIL as a WR in the NFL.

Throw that into the fact that he looks like a 3rd grader... You got BUST, not STUD.

[JayCutty6]

Obviously the Broncos don't want anybody taking a big hit, but this is pure Bullsht.

The Broncos still run an offense with West Coast Offense influences, meaning run after the catch yards are critical......not that this statement isn't pure BS with any other offense in the NFL.

You need to get your mancrush under control, just because these people don't want the Broncos to waste the 12th pick on a runt, it doesn't mean they're idiots......

Of course there not idiots, But hes still not a runt, Hes still a great run after the catch guy so thanks for making my point..........

[BroncosTX77]

Denver most likely isn't going to be able to trade down, so DeSean Jackson at #42 is a good pick......Jackson at #12 is stupid.

If Denver intends on drafting Jackson, I'll wait to see where he's picked to decide whether or not I like him......

Ha now that is exactly what I am talking about. Y'all put conditions on everything....

Why not like him when picked at #12? He is the exact same player and person whether picked at #12, #42 or #202.

That statement was ludicrous and offers the short sighted biased view of this board.

Fact of the matter is the only reason y'all don't like him is because of his size and that is it. Why? because that is the only argument you can come up with. Plain and simple.

I love how this board gets brainwashed so easily. First it was the Frank Okam train everyone blindly jumped on until he sucked at the Sr. Bowl. Then it was the Rashard Mendenhall train until THC restructured. Now its the Chris Williams train because he has 'Great Chemistry' with Cutler and Ryan Clady is dumb as a bag of rocks. Point is everyone spewed the same crap why Denver needs to draft that person and it was all recycled garbage instead of something original.

If anyone dares try to think outside the box it is the same way. Everyone jumps on the hatewagon and they all spew the same argument like it is mandated to do so.

/rant off

Peace Out

[GridironChamp]

Blindy jumping on bandwagons = DeSean Jackson.


If you actually thought, in any depth whatsoever, about him being your #2 or #1 WR (this year) you could tell it just wont pan out. Sure, drafting a dynamic 3rd WR (at best) and great return man with the 42nd pick would be livable and maybe lovable... But with the 12th overall pick you want a starter (that means offense or defense not ST) and when I say starter... I mean starter on 98% of NFL teams.

Jackson looks like a third grader. (In which i mean frame, not height and weight)
He LACKS ANY STRENGTH.
Can he take a hit?
Can he block anyone, scratch that anything (which would include a house cat)
How many Randy Moss-esque (not playing hard) games will he have throughout his career?
I saw a ball hit him in the facemask on a ball thrown LATE on a curl route (meaning he had time to locate the ball)... lack of focus much? Too busy thinking about YAC?


I just gave you 6 reasons not to take him with the 12th overall pick without directly mention his size.

[stnzed]

Ha now that is exactly what I am talking about. Y'all put conditions on everything....

Why not like him when picked at #12? He is the exact same player and person whether picked at #12, #42 or #202.

That statement was ludicrous and offers the short sighted biased view of this board.

Fact of the matter is the only reason y'all don't like him is because of his size and that is it. Why? because that is the only argument you can come up with. Plain and simple.

I love how this board gets brainwashed so easily. First it was the Frank Okam train everyone blindly jumped on until he sucked at the Sr. Bowl. Then it was the Rashard Mendenhall train until THC restructured. Now its the Chris Williams train because he has 'Great Chemistry' with Cutler and Ryan Clady is dumb as a bag of rocks. Point is everyone spewed the same crap why Denver needs to draft that person and it was all recycled garbage instead of something original.

If anyone dares try to think outside the box it is the same way. Everyone jumps on the hatewagon and they all spew the same argument like it is mandated to do so.

/rant off

Peace Out

Because he's too small to take at 12. Why do need this explained to you in every single thread about the guy?

He's F'ing tiny!

That is the only argument I'm even trying to make, plain and simple. I need no other argument, as I am not trying to change your mind about it.

What if Denver picks him at 12 and he can't beat press coverage? Brandon Marshall still has problems with this at times (Cedric Griffin, Minnesota game).

What if Cromartie and Jammer/Asomugha and Hall play Bump and Run coverage and the little guy can't even get of the LOS?

At his size this is entirely possible, whether you're able to see that or not, or whether or not you understand why some players are worth the 42nd pick and not the 12th......makes no difference to me.

I can think for myself, TX, believe that! I don't blindly follow a damn thing...:D...

And maybe everybody spews the same arguement because of your inability to come up with legitimate reasons for wasting the 12th pick on a 169LB WR. Maybe you should try a different angle instead of the same recycled garbage (although your "If he's worth the 42nd pick then he's worth the 12th pick" argument is new to me).

I like the kid, TX, I just don't like him at 12, you're just gonna have to accept that. If Denver picks him at 42, I love him......if Denver picks him at around 2something I like him......if Denver picks him at 12, I don't like him (and I'm blaming you :D)......

[stnzed]

Btw, nothing that's happened this offseason has changed my mind about this draft.

I still want Clady/Williams/Stewart/Mendenhall <------In that order.

There is a lot of other players I like, but at 12, that's where my wish list starts......

[Ravage!!!]

Ha now that is exactly what I am talking about. Y'all put conditions on everything....

Why not like him when picked at #12? He is the exact same player and person whether picked at #12, #42 or #202.

Because he isn't as much of a financial investment at 12 as at 202. At 202, if he makes the team its a bonus. At 12, you are expected to draft STARS and pro-bowlers. You do NOT take REACHES at 12... simple as that.

If anyone dares try to think outside the box it is the same way. Everyone jumps on the hatewagon and they all spew the same argument like it is mandated to do so.


"Thinking outside the box" is just another way of saying "lets REACH" for this guy. I don't want to REACH this much at 12. You are NOT thinking outside the box. You are thinking outside of logic. You are thinking with emotion instead of common sense. I would rather our FO sticks with some more common sense and logic when picking at twelve rather than "taking a shot and a hope" with a 12th pick. THAT is the difference between picking him early and picking him late. Picking late allows you more room to take a 'shot on a runt' .... not in the top 15 picks.

[Lorcust]

Every time I see him play, the song "Short People" by Randy Newman plays through my head. :laugh:

[goeagles99]

The draft is all about probability and projection.

DeSean is arguably the best playmaker in the whole Draft. The reason he isn't thought of as a top 15 prospect is because he's 167 lbs. How many playmakers are in the NFL at that size?

Marvin Harrison is considered very small at 180-185. That is several buffet trips bigger than DJ. Can Jackson hold up to the beating that NFL players take?

With pick 12 you want as much of a sure thing as possible. Jackson doesn't make sense that high. Drop down to pick 15 or 20 and get him. Then you have lowered your investment and added an additional resource.

The only hedge I'll make is this...if you (the front office) really believe in a player, you go get him. The Colts did that with Dwight Freeney. You have to make sure that you truly value the player at the pick you're using on him.

[armchair scout]

i can't do it. He has too much upside to hate and too many questions to sell effectively. He certainly wouldn't hurt our team. His receiving skills are tops for a guy with that much return ability. I won't be sad if we take him, but i won't be too surprised if we don't.

If our trenches were solid, I would grab him for sure...just in case.:salute:

[elevation INC]

But can you actually name a 170 lbs reciever who runs a 4.3** who failed in the NFL or are you just going off of intuition?

EDIT** who was a projected top 20 draft prospect.




DANTE HALL AND ROCKET ISMAIL

[JayCutty6]

DANTE HALL AND ROCKET ISMAIL

Niether of them have the skills Jackson has and potential. But Being a Bronco fan like i am i sure do remember Hall ripping the Broncos heart out on crucial big time returns..........