2008 Draft a success? Really!

[bjohnson1969]

Let me first start by saying that I've been a long time Bronco fan since losing the Superbowl to the Dallas Cowboys. Throughout that time my faith in the Bronco leadership has not faltered until this weekend. This draft for the Denver Broncos was a joke. Before you jump me let me explain. Although Clady is a good pick up, I believe we needed to pick up a impact player on offenese; not an offensive linemen but a runningback. Look at our Superbowl years, how many 1st round offensive linemen was on that squad?? i believe we could have addressed that position in the later rounds. No team fears Denver's running game anymore, not since Portis!! We have no backs on the roster that we can play ball control with; this is what Davis and Portis could do, but also hit the homerun. Teams are content to let us drive down the field and get to the 20 or 30 yard line now because play action and bootleg has become a joke in our system now. We have had since Portis, utility backs and that is the plain and simple truth. Our offense and team had a chance to be special this year, with the correct back taken in the draft; Johnathan Stewart. How can our young tightend and receiver continue to develop with no real threat in the backfield???? How??? Cutler's performance will be affected by a servicable running game. Denver needed a stud! Shanny got lucky with T. Davis. The elite teams of the AFC all have featured backs who we fear. Are we missing something here. Until we have that workhorse back we will continue to be a mediocore team at best. When we have Davis and Portis we kept teams guessing and off balance. No more!! You complain about lack of res[pect from ESPN; this is why dumb personnel moves. Now you guys talk about Torian being a great pick up; maybe so but not the impact Stewart or Mendenhall would have had in our system!! I'm not on here to argue just stating my opinion. Good day.

[Champs Chumps]

That's pretty funny.

So, you've been a fan for 30 years... but your faith is shaken because they didn't draft a rb in the first round? Never mind, your argument is TD was a stud, as was Portis.... yet neither of those guys went in the first round. Look I can see being frustrated with a 7-9 season... but to lose faith after a draft is a little drastic.

[Spyder]

Oakland drafted a RB with their first pick.

Maybe you outta switch teams?

[KWHIT97]

While I really wanted Stewart as well I will settle for Clady. I do feel that we need a stud RB and I am sick of these 5th round nobody's as well, but we must build our O-Line first and foremost.
Clady may be the best LT in this draft and was very good value at 12, I think that maybe next year they should go after Moreno hard, remember it's a re-building process, it will take time!

[LarryDean]

All I can say is im sorry that you feel that way...Also only other things I would want to point out is

The elite teams of the AFC besides the Chargers...

We fear their QB and not the their running game.Ie Manning,Brady,Big Ben....

Also everyone wants to rush to judgement about this years draft....

It is the draft pick of Jay Cutler atm that will make or break this team...

[pzmire]

Let me first start by saying that I've been a long time Bronco fan since losing the Superbowl to the Dallas Cowboys. Throughout that time my faith in the Bronco leadership has not faltered until this weekend. This draft for the Denver Broncos was a joke. Before you jump me let me explain. Although Clady is a good pick up, I believe we needed to pick up a impact player on offenese; not an offensive linemen but a runningback. Look at our Superbowl years, how many 1st round offensive linemen was on that squad?? i believe we could have addressed that position in the later rounds. No team fears Denver's running game anymore, not since Portis!! We have no backs on the roster that we can play ball control with; this is what Davis and Portis could do, but also hit the homerun. Teams are content to let us drive down the field and get to the 20 or 30 yard line now because play action and bootleg has become a joke in our system now. We have had since Portis, utility backs and that is the plain and simple truth. Our offense and team had a chance to be special this year, with the correct back taken in the draft; Johnathan Stewart. How can our young tightend and receiver continue to develop with no real threat in the backfield???? How??? Cutler's performance will be affected by a servicable running game. Denver needed a stud! Shanny got lucky with T. Davis. The elite teams of the AFC all have featured backs who we fear. Are we missing something here. Until we have that workhorse back we will continue to be a mediocore team at best. When we have Davis and Portis we kept teams guessing and off balance. No more!! You complain about lack of res[pect from ESPN; this is why dumb personnel moves. Now you guys talk about Torian being a great pick up; maybe so but not the impact Stewart or Mendenhall would have had in our system!! I'm not on here to argue just stating my opinion. Good day.

Not without an OLine they wouldn't - Just ask the 4 Horsemen of ND

I think you're cryin like the rest of BS Artists who think they know better than the Front Office. I think the Shanny and the rest of the FO got it right - Too bad you just can't see it yet - BTW I also havve been a Bronco Fan for 35 years

[bjohnson1969]

Have not lost faith because of a losing season but I do see personnel moves that is not helping us to get back on that elite level! Yes, I have been a fan since that time. I suffered through all the Superbowl losses, including the embarassing one to Washington. No Davis nor Portis was drafted in the first round; Davis due to a knee injury in college and Portis because there were other back rated higher. I'm not saying that Torian won't be great for us or that its always a must to draft a back in the first round but what I am saying when studs or special backs are available make the selection.

[bjohnson1969]

How many first rounders on the O-Line from the Superbowl years?????? Not crying at all. Just stating my opinion. Do not claim to be an expert but front offices make mistakes. Look at some our our moves in free agency and drafts from the past.

[kratos_godofwar]

To tell you the truth, I'm quite po'd as well that we didn't get a first day back. But Clady will help this team more in the long run. He's what we've been missing for the last 8-10 years ever since Zimmerman retired. Yeah, so even Shannahn knew that it all starts in the trenches. I wasn't high on LT in the first, only because I thought Clady would have been gone to the Chiefs. I'm glad they took Dorsey instead, he'll be a beast for them but we got the better offenisve tackle. He'll keep Cutler clean for many more years to come, meaning we won't have to worry about Cutler missing a few games like last year. I seriously thought we had lost Cutler for the year during that Detroit game.

[pzmire]

How many first rounders on the O-Line from the Superbowl years?????? Not crying at all. Just stating my opinion. Do not claim to be an expert but front offices make mistakes. Look at some our our moves in free agency and drafts from the past.

THE PAST - We made a significant change in philosophy in FA and Draft. Plus the last 3 drafts have all been better - Just this time we didn't trade away picks but added quality and depth

Also, I'm not sure where Zimmerman was drafted by Minnesota

[jlarsiii]

Boohoohoohoo

Another fan is upset that the player or position he desperately coveted wasn't drafted by the team and now wants to complain about it.

[Champs Chumps]

How many first rounders on the O-Line from the Superbowl years?????? Not crying at all. Just stating my opinion. Do not claim to be an expert but front offices make mistakes. Look at some our our moves in free agency and drafts from the past.

Okaaaaaayyyyyyyy.... deep breath.

But you do make my point... in fact, do you know how many first rounders were on the '98 starting line-up? 1 of 11... Elway.

Which makes my point... let's not "lose faith" because of the first round selection of a position we needed help with.

It's all good, man...

[bjohnson1969]

Not disagreeing that Clady was not a good pick but I do believe that if not a back in the first we could have definitely taken one in the second. I'm not down on Torian, I was just stating that in order to get back to that elite status and being feared in the running game and I'm not speaking about stats because as we see stats doesn't mean wins; we need a stud runningback!

[bjohnson1969]

Understood about having only on 1st rounder on the 98 team starting line up. my point exactly; why not target a stud back this year? They were available. I do believe he made some solid draft welections that will help the team in the long run. I was just staing my opinion and basically why not reverse the picks? running back 1st and O-Linemen second. Did not mean to offend anyone but people do have different opinions!!

[kratos_godofwar]

Not disagreeing that Clady was not a good pick but I do believe that if not a back in the first we could have definitely taken one in the second. I'm not down on Torian, I was just stating that in order to get back to that elite status and being feared in the running game and I'm not speaking about stats because as we see stats doesn't mean wins; we need a stud runningback!

Agreed, but I think we could have had a real threat with Kevin Smith in the third by trading both our 4ths or our 4th, 5th, and 6th round pick to Detorit or some other team and get Jammal Charles instead. It just sucks that Shanahan didn't even make move a 1 of the more well proven backs. So next year, it's James Davis or bust for me. Unless we have a chance at James Laurinaitis, then we take him instead.

[Gr3yStreet]

There are stud backs EVERY year.

Why not be smart, and take a franchise LT when we actually have a pick high enough to secure one without trading away the draft to move up.

We wont be producing 1000 yard rushers again until we re-establish or offensive line, and we took steps to do that yesterday.

Hopefully, Clady establishes himself on the Left and either Pears, Kuper, Harris or Polumbus earns the RT spot.

THEEEEEN maybe next year, if our Oline plays well consistently for a whole season, we consider taking a stuf RB IF Torain doesnt work out.

This draft was to Left Tackles what 83 was for QB's. You'll be glag we got in on the sweepstakes when we had a chance.

Clady is the perfect fit for our team and for our system, and MOST importantly can be the guy to protect Cutler for years and years.

Shanahan KNOWS his RB's and he had the chance to take his choice of them and chose Clady.

[pzmire]

Agreed, but I think we could have had a real threat with Kevin Smith in the third by trading both our 4ths or our 4th, 5th, and 6th round pick to Detorit or some other team and get Jammal Charles instead. It just sucks that Shanahan didn't even make move a 1 of the more well proven backs. So next year, it's James Davis or bust for me. Unless we have a chance at James Laurinaitis, then we take him instead.

It just sucks that Shanahan didn't even make move a 1 of the more well proven backs.

In your Opinion - I for 1 thought it was great that we didn't give awasy draft picks and added qualitry depth

it's James Davis or bust for me. Unless we have a chance at James Laurinaitis, then we take him instead

Unless Torian turns out to be the next TD - No one thought much of him either - ie: limited speed - No moves and basically just a run-of-the-mill sort of back

[oregonbronc]

Just so that none of us forget, when the Bronco's won there SB's, they had a HOF left tackle (Zimmerman), followed by a Stud (Tony Jones) with one of the best left guards to play the game (Schlereth). Follow that with Nalen (future HOF) in the middle, and a combo of Tony Jones (see above) and Matt Lepsis (See Broncos Left Tackle blocking for Portis) at right tackle. With an offensive line like this, you do not need to be a Stud to gain yards, just good. They will get you 3 to 4 yards on every play. Your job is to get anything beyond that.

To drive this point home, just look at the stats of Larry Johnson, Shawn Alexander, Edge, Ahman Green, Ricky Williams, Kevin Jones, and Jamal Lewis, all studs, when there offensive line was considered weak. Even Portis in Washington, who has a good offensive line. None of them are as good without someone blocking for them. Then look at the numbers that Michael Turner, not a stud, puts up in LT's absence. HUGE ypc.

The last point is Tom Brady. By most accounts, the best QB in the game today. What happend in the SB when his O-Line did not give him ton's of time? He looked more like Trent Dilfer than Joe Montana.

Without studs up front, you will never be a SB winner, bottom line.

[bjohnson1969]

Thats who I was thinking Charles or Smith once he selected Clasy. I thought he would make a move to grab one or the other. I'm not down on Torian at all. Maybe Shanny sees something I don't; thats why he is the coach. I was just trying to make since of not taking a back earlier. I believe since Davis and Porter we all ahve been waithing for Denver to explode with the next stud back and move away from the utility type backs, but I'm pleased overall with the draft.

[bjohnson1969]

Not complaining about the first pick, just asked the question were thoise studs first round selections?? Not questioning that they had great careers but asking did we need O-Linement with the 1st pick? All that you mentioned were great players but where were they selected??

[Flatlander Fan]

There are stud backs EVERY year.

Why not be smart, and take a franchise LT when we actually have a pick high enough to secure one without trading away the draft to move up.

We wont be producing 1000 yard rushers again until we re-establish or offensive line, and we took steps to do that yesterday.


Clady is the perfect fit for our team and for our system, and MOST importantly can be the guy to protect Cutler for years and years.

Shanahan KNOWS his RB's and he had the chance to take his choice of them and chose Clady.


Man, I think gr3ystreet was reading my mind! :eek:

Every year there is the next great running back available in the draft. Sometimes they actually pan out, too. Just as often, IMO, the stud runner is taken later in the draft.

Unless the Broncos address the fundamental aspects of the lineup, it wouldn't matter how many "stud" skill players they have.

I don't know about others, but I fear the LINES of teams like Indy and NE. When you have the dominance there, you have control of the entire game...

[4th Amigo]

Not disagreeing that Clady was not a good pick but I do believe that if not a back in the first we could have definitely taken one in the second. I'm not down on Torian, I was just stating that in order to get back to that elite status and being feared in the running game and I'm not speaking about stats because as we see stats doesn't mean wins; we need a stud runningback!

Agreed.....we do need a stud runningback, no doubt about that. But you have to understand that just because Stewert was selected in the 1st does not AUTOMATICALLY make him a stud runningback. The ony thing we can do is wait and see if we made the right choice with Torian. Many of the draft guys said he would have been a 2nd round choice if not for his toe injury, much like T. Davis would have gone higher if not for his knee. So relax, for all we know, Mendenhall, Stewert, and McFadden could all be flame outs. 1st rounders aren't slam dunks.....so chill my fellow Bronco fan, it's gonna work out!

[bjohnson1969]

Clady could be a bust. Its understood that drafting a player is all based on one's assesment of that player. Maybe I should have phrased my original post differently, for that I apologive. Maybe it should have read that Stewart or Mendenhall would have been a stud in our system, thats in regards to their physical skills. I understand about Shanny selecting Clady, you guys make some really good arguments. It also needs to be noted that a solid running game promotes lets blitzing by opposing teams. I'm hoping CLADY is a beast and Torian pans out; just hate to see 5 years from now we look back and say what if!!!!!!!! I hope Shanny continues to build this team with young players rather than old. Hoping for a great season. 10-6. Thanks for all your replies to this posts. Its always graet to look at different views.

[gtown53]

How many first rounders on the O-Line from the Superbowl years?????? Not crying at all. Just stating my opinion. Do not claim to be an expert but front offices make mistakes. Look at some our our moves in free agency and drafts from the past.

You do remember who the Offensive Tackles were when we won two Super Bowls, in a row. One of the two just went into the Hall of Fame. Do you believe that Pears and Ryan Harris are of that caliber. I sure don't. They are journeymen, at best. And, I hate to say it, but I doubt either one would make the starting lineup of any other NFL team.

No, Clady was a must have tackle. And, at least according to the scouts, who make their living judging talent, there was not another tackle (other than Long) that compared to Clady. A great pick.

[CanDB]

A solid oline is sensible indeed. But, as in the case of the Pats, those studs don't always come from round one, or two for that matter. Only one of the Pats' oline came in round one, right near the bottom, and the rest came spread throughout the draft, and even "undrafted". Picking an olineman as early as we did must be almost a guarantee. That's a Jake Long, Joe Thomas deal. Maybe Albert as well. So I hope Clady is the "one".

Some other observations.....we could have pursued a higher rated RB with some draft strategy. It's okay to move on the board on dday. I don't get this "boy we learned our lesson" stuff. Do what's right. The Pats move around every year. Why? Because they have vision and they understand value. I don't buy this thing whereby we stop using the right strategy, just because we made mistakes before. In that regard, it's okay to get solid FAs. If you spend too much, it's your fault. My last observation concern is that I keep hearing how we can find gem RBs like TD in the back of a barn somewhere. I wouldn't get attached to that theory either. It's like saying that jumping off a building is okay, just because you lucked out and landed on a pile of mattresses.

But I do like the good character emphasis this year. That's a plus.

As I posted elsewhere, this looks more like a draft on "chemistry". Not a lot of immediate impact, other than Royal. Also, we may be able to gauge the RB scenario by how well Pittsburgh and Caroline do. I know, not an even comparison. But Tomlin said he liked the RB weapon vs filling holes in oline. It's how you want to slice it.

Guess I don't see this as a prime contender draft situation vs a wild card strategy for 08. If Clady and the boys play to potential, we may have something in 09.

[bjohnson1969]

I hope he plays up to the hype. I'm not discrediting his talent at all. I have flashbacks of Foster, which makes me leary of O-Linemen that high; just my opinion thats all.

[Flatlander Fan]

Clady could be a bust. Its understood that drafting a player is all based on one's assesment of that player. Maybe I should have phrased my original post differently, for that I apologive. Maybe it should have read that Stewart or Mendenhall would have been a stud in our system, thats in regards to their physical skills. I understand about Shanny selecting Clady, you guys make some really good arguments. It also needs to be noted that a solid running game promotes lets blitzing by opposing teams. I'm hoping CLADY is a beast and Torian pans out; just hate to see 5 years from now we look back and say what if!!!!!!!! I hope Shanny continues to build this team with young players rather than old. Hoping for a great season. 10-6. Thanks for all your replies to this posts. Its always graet to look at different views.

Welcome to the boards! :wave: As you can see, folks in these parts have STRONG opinions and aren't afraid to express them. I think you will fit in well based on your early posts.

Re: the topic at hand...

Any of the players drafted this weekend could be busts, including Clady, Stewart and Mendenhall. (well, maybe Mr. Irrelevant can't be a bust ;)) To pass too much judgment too early is a key pitfall most of us fans fall into after the draft. I myself do this, that's why I like to read the draft grades for the teams. :doh:

[gtown53]

CanDB mentions the New England O-line. Isn't it true that one of New England's guards never played a down of College football? I believe that is correct. But, remember how the Giants D-line was all over Brady? Yes, great O-line players can be had in later rounds, but I think it is crucial to give Cutler the best protection (from the blind side) money, and draft picks can buy.

I will never forget January 1, 2007 when Boise State beat a "top-of-the-line" football program in Oklahoma, in the Fiesta Bowl. Best college game I've ever seen. And, Clady played lights out.

[BRONCOMIKELEE]

BJOHNSON1969 is right. We can take lesser backs ( Tatum Bell, Mike Anderson ) and get 1000 yard seasons out of them. Imagine what we couldve done with a stude like Stewart! I think Shanny is content to use the backs by committee instead of getting a 1st round stud. We couldve had Steven Jackson a few yrs back. I just want to get back to the days where we had a great running game and that totally opens up the passing game. We all want the same thing. We want another TD! He was good for like 150 yrds a game easy. Hopefully Henry, Young, Torain, Mike Bell, whoevea! Will show up and take over. We need it!

[kratos_godofwar]

It just sucks that Shanahan didn't even make move a 1 of the more well proven backs.

In your Opinion - I for 1 thought it was great that we didn't give awasy draft picks and added qualitry depth

it's James Davis or bust for me. Unless we have a chance at James Laurinaitis, then we take him instead

Unless Torian turns out to be the next TD - No one thought much of him either - ie: limited speed - No moves and basically just a run-of-the-mill sort of back

People keep bringing up TD, there has and always be 1 Terrell Davis. I do not think Torain will be anything like TD, he'll be more like Travis Henry. A great powerback with quality speed but injuy prone. But I don't like these kinds of backs, they dissapear a lot in games if the Defensive line is playing extremely well. I like backs like Davis, Mendenhall, Stewart, Rice etc. Guys who can make plays happen out of nowhere.

Take for example LT, he was struggling against the Titans last year because of the Titans great defensive line. But as the game wore on, LT got better because he's special like that. We need a guy like that, not a guy who's going to pickup 2-3 yards every play and may break 1 for 10 yards. We have no homerun threat right now at RB. Selvin isn't as fast as people think, and with Torain in the mix now. I don't think Hall will even have a chance now, who is our fastest RB.

[Mount-n-Groan]

THE PAST - We made a significant change in philosophy in FA and Draft. Plus the last 3 drafts have all been better - Just this time we didn't trade away picks but added quality and depth

Also, I'm not sure where Zimmerman was drafted by Minnesota

For the record:

In 1984, Zimmerman was drafted in the 2nd round (36th overall) by the Los Angeles Express in the 1984 USFL Draft.

Originally selected by the New York Giants in the first round of the 1984 supplemental draft (3rd overall), Zimmerman's signing rights were traded to the Minnesota Vikings for two second-round picks in the 1986 draft.

[CanDB]

CanDB mentions the New England O-line. Isn't it true that one of New England's guards never played a down of College football? I believe that is correct. But, remember how the Giants D-line was all over Brady? Yes, great O-line players can be had in later rounds, but I think it is crucial to give Cutler the best protection (from the blind side) money, and draft picks can buy.

I will never forget January 1, 2007 when Boise State beat a "top-of-the-line" football program in Oklahoma, in the Fiesta Bowl. Best college game I've ever seen. And, Clady played lights out.

I'm banking on your more "hands on" assessment of Clady. I have not seen him play too much, going more with so called expert opinion, which is all positive, but he's still got some work to do. Hope you are right. For sure, Cutler needs protection...... and weapons.

By the way, I was looking for another more highly rated back, but I could see the logic with Clady. My hope was to land the stud RB, and potentially land a solid OT in round 2 (or beyond). Also like Trevor Laws. Can't have everything, right??

[pzmire]

[B][U]People keep bringing up TD, there has and always be 1 Terrell Davis I do not think Torain will be anything like TD, he'll be more like Travis Henry. A great powerback with quality speed but injuy prone. But I don't like these kinds of backs, they dissapear a lot in games if the Defensive line is playing extremely well. I like backs like Davis, Mendenhall, Stewart, Rice etc. Guys who can make plays happen out of nowhere.

Take for example LT, he was struggling against the Titans last year because of the Titans great defensive line. But as the game wore on, LT got better because he's special like that. We need a guy like that, not a guy who's going to pickup 2-3 yards every play and may break 1 for 10 yards. We have no homerun threat right now at RB. Selvin isn't as fast as people think, and with Torain in the mix now. I don't think Hall will even have a chance now, who is our fastest RB.

My point was we will not know until he takes the field - He could be. I've never heard Shanahan refer to a lower round RB draft choice as having a 1st round grade. Until he proves different I think I'll believe the coaching staff over anyone else

[bjohnson1969]

FLATLANDER, thanks for the welcome. Referring back to Terrel Davis, he could have gained 1200 yards behind last years line. The opposing defense would have had to stack the box to stop him which would have opened up our passing game. Once the defense adjusted to the passing game would have allowed Davis to run wild. Just speculative but my opinion. Remember those games when Shanny set Davis late in the 3rd quarter where he had 150 plus yards and pounded the defense into submission, which allowed the passing game to thrive, thats what I miss, not backs who give you 115 yards that mean nothing!! I hope Denver gets back to this sort of football. How about the Elway bootlegs and passes all over the field to Sharp, Smith, and Mc Caffery? Gotta miss it! Not only was our running game feared but the passing game also.

[kmcgough25]

A couple things I noticed from last season...against decent D-lines, especially in the red zone, our OL was barely getting a push at all. Hence, the poor TD ratio.

Also, our run prodction dropped signifigantly, from the 1st quarter to the 4th quarter, which means the line was wearing down due to bigger, stronger D-lines wearing us down.

I apprecciate the need for a big time RB, but I think we are a year away from that being fulfilled. It is my belief (no stats to back it up) that Lineman take a year to adjust in the NFL, whereas a RB can start to play immediatly.

Just my 2 cents....and welcome to the boards.