The Great Combine Myth

[MindField]

Here are some of the records put up at the combine, mostly by players that never made an NFL team, let alone leaving a significant mark in the NFL.

As provided by NFLDraftScout.com:

40-yard Dash

4.24 Rondell Menendez, Eastern Kentucky, 1999.....never made it.
4.28 WR Jerome Mathis, Hampton, 2005.....Still don't know why the Broncos did not Draft him.
4.28 CB Champ Bailey, Georgia,1999...future Hall of Famer.

225-lb. Bench Press Reps

51 DT Justin Ernest, E. Kentucky, 1999.....jeez, what did they put in the water at EKU in 1999?...never made it.
45 DE Mike Kudia, Ohio St, 2006....I am sure someone will fall all over themselves trying to Draft this kid now.
45 DT Leif Larsen, Texas-El Paso, 2000.....never made it

Short Shuttle

3.73 WR Kevin Kasper, Iowa, 2001....ah, the vaunted shuttle drill....sure was an indicator for this kid, wasn't it?? Cut more times than a cat has lives...
3.76 WR Deion Branch, Louisville...Good player; SB MVP.
3.78 CB Dunta Robinson, South Carolina, 2004....Good player struggling to live up to his rep as an elite NFL corner.

Vertical Jump

46 S Gerald Sensabaugh, North Carolina, 2005....Not exactly Ed Reed.
45 1/2 LB Derek Wake, Penn St, 2005....who??
45 CB Chris McKenzie, Arizona St., 2005......... :coffee:
45 WR Chris Chamber, Wisconsin, 2001......The late Jack Elway told us he could play; we should have taken his advice.

Three-Cone Drill....(Antoher drill the Draft Nerds love so much)

6.45 CB Sedrick Curry, Texas A&M, 2000......Currently residing in the 'Where are They Now" files.
6.48 S Rogers Beckett, Marshall, 2000....Reportedly is one of Randy Moss' security team these days.
6.49 CB Carlos Rogers, Auburn, 2005....Has a chance to be a real good player.

Just a point of interest. I know I found it interesting....you just have to love how teams have fallen in love with the Mike Croel's and the Mike Mamula's of the past, when they look so good doing athletic drills in shorts, as opposed to noticing and understanding the vast amount of playingtime on film where they disappear and do exactly nothing for their teams.

[Cugel]

Here are some of the records put up at the combine, mostly by players that never made an NFL team, let alone leaving a significant mark in the NFL.

As provided by NFLDraftScout.com:

40-yard Dash

4.24 Rondell Menendez, Eastern Kentucky, 1999.....never made it.
4.28 WR Jerome Mathis, Hampton, 2005.....Still don't know why the Broncos did not Draft him.
4.28 CB Champ Bailey, Georgia,1999...future Hall of Famer.

225-lb. Bench Press Reps

51 DT Justin Ernest, E. Kentucky, 1999.....jeez, what did they put in the water at EKU in 1999?...never made it.
45 DE Mike Kudia, Ohio St, 2006....I am sure someone will fall all over themselves trying to Draft this kid now.
45 DT Leif Larsen, Texas-El Paso, 2000.....never made it

Short Shuttle

3.73 WR Kevin Kasper, Iowa, 2001....ah, the vaunted shuttle drill....sure was an indicator for this kid, wasn't it?? Cut more times than a cat has lives...
3.76 WR Deion Branch, Louisville...Good player; SB MVP.
3.78 CB Dunta Robinson, South Carolina, 2004....Good player struggling to live up to his rep as an elite NFL corner.

Vertical Jump

46 S Gerald Sensabaugh, North Carolina, 2005....Not exactly Ed Reed.
45 1/2 LB Derek Wake, Penn St, 2005....who??
45 CB Chris McKenzie, Arizona St., 2005......... :coffee:
45 WR Chris Chamber, Wisconsin, 2001......The late Jack Elway told us he could play; we should have taken his advice.

Three-Cone Drill....(Antoher drill the Draft Nerds love so much)

6.45 CB Sedrick Curry, Texas A&M, 2000......Currently residing in the 'Where are They Now" files.
6.48 S Rogers Beckett, Marshall, 2000....Reportedly is one of Randy Moss' security team these days.
6.49 CB Carlos Rogers, Auburn, 2005....Has a chance to be a real good player.

Just a point of interest. I know I found it interesting....you just have to love how teams have fallen in love with the Mike Croel's and the Mike Mamula's of the past, when they look so good doing athletic drills in shorts, as opposed to noticing and understanding the vast amount of playingtime on film where they disappear and do exactly nothing for their teams.

Ah, yes! There's a blast from the past! Mike Croel! The worst draft pick in Broncos history, and one of the top 10 worst draft picks ever! :laugh:

Croel was later tabbed "the least instinctive player I ever coached" by one frustrated Broncos coach. The amusing thing is that Dan Reeves was so unwilling to admit that he'd totally BLOWN the #4th pick in the draft on Croel (tied for the highest pick EVER by a Broncos team with the #4 pick they traded for John Elway) that he actually took Croel with him to N.Y. for a season when he was FIRED by Pat Bowlen and hired to be the Giants head coach! :laugh:

Some guys are just work-out warriors who lack football skills. Yet teams blather endlessly about their "potential." :rolleyes:

[MindField]

Ah, yes! There's a blast from the past! Mike Croel! The worst draft pick in Broncos history, and one of the top 10 worst draft picks ever! :laugh:

Croel was later tabbed "the least instinctive player I ever coached" by one frustrated Broncos coach. The amusing thing is that Dan Reeves was so unwilling to admit that he'd totally BLOWN the #4th pick in the draft on Croel (tied for the highest pick EVER by a Broncos team with the #4 pick they traded for John Elway) that he actually took Croel with him to N.Y. for a season when he was FIRED by Pat Bowlen and hired to be the Giants head coach! :laugh:

Some guys are just work-out warriors who lack football skills. Yet teams blather endlessly about their "potential." :rolleyes:

Then there are others, like Alabama DE Mark Anderson last year, that had a great Sr. Bowl week and game, then tested out very well athletically, and yet teams STILL were not convinced the guy could play and Drafted him in the fifth round.

All the kid did this season was make a ton of plays and finish as a near miss in the Defensive Rookie of the Year honors.

But yeah, these NFL scouts, they're AWESOME!

Truth is, most of them would be used Car sales guys if the NFL didn't give'em a job.

I oncew knew two of the Broncos 'mid-west' (See Oklahoma, Texas, Nebraska area scouts) that were two of the most unimpressive individuals I have ever met in the game.

I know High School coaches that know more about the game than they did.

[lex]

Ah, yes! There's a blast from the past! Mike Croel! The worst draft pick in Broncos history, and one of the top 10 worst draft picks ever! :laugh:

Croel was later tabbed "the least instinctive player I ever coached" by one frustrated Broncos coach. The amusing thing is that Dan Reeves was so unwilling to admit that he'd totally BLOWN the #4th pick in the draft on Croel (tied for the highest pick EVER by a Broncos team with the #4 pick they traded for John Elway) that he actually took Croel with him to N.Y. for a season when he was FIRED by Pat Bowlen and hired to be the Giants head coach! :laugh:

Some guys are just work-out warriors who lack football skills. Yet teams blather endlessly about their "potential." :rolleyes:

Whats Marcus Nash doing these days?

[Cugel]

Whats Marcus Nash doing these days?
NO fair! Marcus Nash was the 30th pick in the draft. That's almost 2nd round! How many #30 picks have been busts? Probably lots!

But, when the #4 pick overall is a total and complete bust that's something else!

1994 is a classic example of things that make fans go ARRGH! :brick:

#1 Cincinatti - DT Dan Wilkinson
#2 Indy - RB Marshall Faulk

and it keeps right on going!

#3 Washington - QB Heath Shuler
#4 New England - OLB Willie McGinest

Doesn't that just crack you up? :laugh:

Wilkinson played for a lot of years but was decidedly mediocre, and to miss out on Marshall Faulk? Heath Shuler was just a bust, but he had a decent sense of humor as he displayed in his recent congressional campaign when confronted by fans who pointedly asked him if he noticed when they heckled him during a certain game. He replied "How could I hear you in a stadium of 80,000 people? Were you the guys who used to come to the stadium wearing dresses and bags over their heads?" :laugh:

[// / yardo]

You guys will appreciate these...

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/2005/04/15/draft.busts/content.1.html

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/2005/04/15/draft.busts/content.12.html

[lex]

4.33 Chris Henry???

[stnzed]

Players that don't run 4.33 fail too! Irons (4.51?) could be a bust, same as Peterson (4.38). Teams have other reasons to take Peterson over Irons.

You guy's may be missing the point of the combine!

Just because Chris Henry runs a 4.33 doesn't mean he's better than Peterson. But that's not the point of the combine! It never has been.

[TheFuture6]

You guys will appreciate these...

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/2005/04/15/draft.busts/content.1.html

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/2005/04/15/draft.busts/content.12.html

good find, that was fun to remember some of those guys. add Joey Harrington to that list. also, Charles Rodgers, Mike Williams if he doesnt go nuts this year.

[stnzed]

good find, that was fun to remember some of those guys. add Joey Harrington to that list. also, Charles Rodgers, Mike Williams if he doesnt go nuts this year.


Imo, all of these players you mentioned would've been better off had they not been drafted by the dogbutt Lions.

[TheFuture6]

Imo, all of these players you mentioned would've been better off had they not been drafted by the dogbutt Lions.

lol, yep, i dont know who i feel worse for, the lions or the players. nope, i just remembered how much i hate matt millen. poor joey and charles.... i dont like mike either...

[Javalon]

Just a point of interest. I know I found it interesting....you just have to love how teams have fallen in love with the Mike Croel's and the Mike Mamula's of the past, when they look so good doing athletic drills in shorts, as opposed to noticing and understanding the vast amount of playingtime on film where they disappear and do exactly nothing for their teams.
That just reinforces the point that combine results, by themselves, do not indicate future greatness. That's why teams look at a ridiculous amount of film on players. The combine should just enhance the other information they compile on players. It's the overall picture that matters.


And Cugel, at least Croel started for a few years and got a lot of sacks his first year. (Small consolation, I know! :D) What did we get out of Nash? Yeah, Croel was a lot higher first rounder but we should have gotten something out of Nash.

[lex]

Players that don't run 4.33 fail too! Irons (4.51?) could be a bust, same as Peterson (4.38). Teams have other reasons to take Peterson over Irons.

You guy's may be missing the point of the combine!

Just because Chris Henry runs a 4.33 doesn't mean he's better than Peterson. But that's not the point of the combine! It never has been.

Who is saying Henry is better than Peterson? I have yet to see anyone say this. What are you talking about. And btw, everyone knows people that dont run 4.33 fail too. Thats not what this thread is about though.

[TXBRONC]

Ah, yes! There's a blast from the past! Mike Croel! The worst draft pick in Broncos history, and one of the top 10 worst draft picks ever! :laugh:

Croel was later tabbed "the least instinctive player I ever coached" by one frustrated Broncos coach. The amusing thing is that Dan Reeves was so unwilling to admit that he'd totally BLOWN the #4th pick in the draft on Croel (tied for the highest pick EVER by a Broncos team with the #4 pick they traded for John Elway) that he actually took Croel with him to N.Y. for a season when he was FIRED by Pat Bowlen and hired to be the Giants head coach! :laugh:

Some guys are just work-out warriors who lack football skills. Yet teams blather endlessly about their "potential." :rolleyes:


From what I understand these guys prep for this just like you would for an exam.

[stnzed]

Who is saying Henry is better than Peterson? I have yet to see anyone say this. What are you talking about. And btw, everyone knows people that dont run 4.33 fail too. Thats not what this thread is about though.

I'm exaggerating to make a point!

People see 40 times being discussed and assume that we think Henry is the next great one!

We are smart enough to know better!

So they feel compelled to point out that 40 times apparently mean "Nothing".

Again, we are smart enough to know better!

Btw, do you think 40times/combine helped Gary Russell today or hurt him?

Did it help a team considering him? Or hurt them?

(And why do I get the feeling that he just shot up Shanahan's draft board? Does Russell like Grey Goose?)

[// / yardo]

It's all a crap-shoot. You really don't know what you're going to get. That's why they say the personal interview is probably the best pre-draft measurable to really gather what type of a player the person is. They're all great athletes otherwise they wouldn't be there. It comes down to what kind of football player they are.

This is a great one.

Tony Mandarich
OT, No. 2 overall, Green Bay Packers, 1989

Even for a No. 2 pick, Mandarich came into the NFL with an unusual amount of hype. SI called him the greatest offensive-line prospect of all time. Turns out he was just a workout wonder. After holding out for a huge deal his rookie season, he was a disappointment from the start. Mandarich played three seasons in Green Bay and seven total in the NFL. The next three picks in '89? Barry Sanders, Derrick Thomas and Deion Sanders.

[lex]

I'm exaggerating to make a point!

People see 40 times being discussed and assume that we think Henry is the next great one!

We are smart enough to know better!

So they feel compelled to point out that 40 times apparently mean "Nothing".

Again, we are smart enough to know better!

Btw, do you think 40times/combine helped Gary Russell today or hurt him?

Did it help a team considering him? Or hurt them?

(And why do I get the feeling that he just shot up Shanahan's draft board? Does Russell like Grey Goose?)

No, people dont assume Henry will be the next great one. Where do you get this stuff? Holy hell!

[stnzed]

No, people dont assume Henry will be the next great one. Where do you get this stuff? Holy hell!


That is my point!

You do know how to read, right?

Holy hell!!

[lex]

That is my point!

You do know how to read, right?

Holy hell!!

At least you admit your post was inane.

[stnzed]

At least you admit your post was inane.

"inane"


Yup! I'm sure of it...You can't read can you?

I think we're done here, Lex!!!!!!!