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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butler By'Note View Post
    I'm not concerned with the 1 year as a coordinator, nor where that defense ranked. With a guy who hasn't been much of a coordinator during his career, the odds increase greatly that he'll have a DC with autonomy to do what he wants. Mike Tomlin comes to mind, he was a 1 year coordinator and was a staunch 4-3 guy (I believe he was a Tampa 2 guy) but he kept Dick Lebeau and let him do his thing with his 3-4.

    I'm more concerned with how Joseph deals with other coaches and players. Does he deal with them in a way they respect? Is he a leader? When he gives a rah rah speech will they follow?

    Those are what matter, because the odds are that he's not going to be running the defense. If Elway believes he's that guy, I'm okay with that.

    Question: Are you uncomfortable with him thinking he'll come in and want to do everything with the defense? Would you be more comfortable with him if he came in and immediately announced he's keeping Phillips and the entire defensive staff?
    I could tolerate it better if Wade and his staff are kept together and Wade has 100% control of the D. But Joseph would also have to hit a home run as far as OC goes, because as inexperienced as he is on D he has zero experience on offense.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by KWHIT97 View Post
    I could tolerate it better if Wade and his staff are kept together and Wade has 100% control of the D. But Joseph would also have to hit a home run as far as OC goes, because as inexperienced as he is on D he has zero experience on offense.
    Smart people know what they're stupid at. Smart people also tend to listen greatly to other people and they tend to surround themselves with other smarter people.

    Elway doesn't seem to be the type to put up with an ego maniac, he seems like a guy who wants the best possible choice and will choose the coach who will put himself int he best possible situation to succeed. If he taps Joseph as the guy then I'm thinking it's because Joseph has shown he'll be that person who will best put them in position to win.

    One of Elway's first questions is probably: Who would you have on your staff with you? Would you listen to suggestions? If Joseph answers in a way Elway doesn't like, I'm sure he'll move on.
    "I never lose, I either win or I learn."

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by samparnell View Post
    One thing for everyone to keep in mind about HC candidates is that position coach is different from coordinator which is different from head coach. A great position coach may never be a great coordinator, and a great coordinator may never be a great head coach. Each has its own job description and are three very different jobs.
    Which stands to reason. They'd need to be able to adjust their approach to be more macro instead of micro. This is also why sometimes a good guy or good coach who is not great at the minute details could very well make a great HC. It could mean they are more of a macro thinker. All in all it is quite rare for someone to be able to think just as well both on a macro and micro level.

  4. #34
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    You gotta wonder if potential coaches are thinking that even being successful isnt good enough for Elway. Fox let go after a Super bowl year and a proceeding 12-4 campaign and ANOTHER division title. Kubak "retired" after winning a Super bowl title and, later, leading the Broncos to a 9-7 record despite injuries left and right, toughest schedule in the league and possibly 4 or 5 plays from an 11-5 or 12-4 record. I hope the mile high expectations dont scare off candidates.

  5. #35
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    My speculation is this: if Broncos hire an offensive minded head coach, Wade stays to run the defense. If the Broncos hire a defensive minded coach, I think the whole staff gets shaken up. John has already stated that the new HC will be allowed to determine who is on his staff. I imagine any offensive minded coach would love for Wade to continue working with our defense. A defensive minded coach may want to put HIS stamp on the defense, which may interfere with Wade's stamp. Unless the defensive minded coach has worked with Wade or has similar philosophies, then it could work out.

    Either way, I'll just sit back and wait to see what John does. I know I'd prefer the Offensive Minded Coach myself, because I like where are defense is at, minus the slippage in run D. But who knows?

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArchAngel View Post
    You gotta wonder if potential coaches are thinking that even being successful isnt good enough for Elway. Fox let go after a Super bowl year and a proceeding 12-4 campaign and ANOTHER division title. Kubak "retired" after winning a Super bowl title and, later, leading the Broncos to a 9-7 record despite injuries left and right, toughest schedule in the league and possibly 4 or 5 plays from an 11-5 or 12-4 record. I hope the mile high expectations dont scare off candidates.
    Well, first of all, Kubiak is saying that it's a health issue for him. Mental and physical. So we can speculate about other issues leading him to retire but you can't really use them as the basis for a reasonable argument-because it's just speculation. As far as Fox and company is concerned: He had the team poorly prepared for a Super Bowl. You can't blame Fox alone for the loss but the team did not come out well prepared. In his next year they did well in the regular season...but they also had PFM who was the king of regular season victories. By the time the playoffs rolled around the team played like crap and the coaches were looking for other jobs. So...screw Fox, screw Jackass Del Rio and screw Adam Gase. Maybe not Adam Gase. I recall Elway wanting to go scorched Earth on the whole staff because the team played like crap. Maybe he should have given Gase a chance, maybe not. But that staff was let go because they weren't doing their jobs. Any candidate that comes in thinking that what that staff did was OK can go kick rocks. I don't want him here. Be better than that or don't show up for an interview.
    ~In Partibus Infidelium~

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bates View Post
    My 2 cents on this whole situation:

    I think Elway gave Kubes the choice to go out on his own terms or to be thrown out out of respect for him. I am so happy he is gone though.

    What angers me is how we played on Sunday. I get we played an Oakland team missing their QB, but we still played just as well as any playoff team right now. To miss the playoffs by more or less 1 game is just disgusting, and I blame it on Kubes and Norwood. Now we get to watch Oakland get decimated in the playoffs (to be honest we could be the ones getting decimated).

    What makes me a little relaxed is the fact that I don't have to be a nervous wreck during the playoffs this year, I can watch them in peace. We sadly have to cheer for KC nad PIT because those will be the only 2 teams who have a chance at beating NE*.
    I would have preferred we won the last wild card spot (this was within reach). If only they could have won one more. Would it have been Houston and Brock coming to Denver this weekend. If Only. But Norwood cost us a couple times, and the O-Line is the weak link. Change was in order.

  8. #38
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    Can't stay away for now but it just came to me that Joseph may not be the right man just like McDaniel's wasn't the right man. It has something to do with Napoleon.

    As for Wade Phillips, I think tenure may be coming to an end as he ofttimes looked confused there on the sideline as the "D" faltered on many an occasion - especially with Tennessee letting Mariota escape one to many times just as did Smith, Bortles, Carr, Luck, and so on over the years. Then his tendency to go Soft Shell even Prevent to protect the few leads the team had when too much time was on the clock and the lead narrow. Also, against NE, Brady should have been on the ground (the hard Mile High dirt that Brady hates while playing on cushy cushy turf in the East) more when Coach (though with some success) backed off putting the"D" in to crush mode and implemented a three three man rush w/o success in getting Brady on the ground. Don't really know all the in & outs but feelings of confusion had too many times pricked my attention and confidence. Let's get the Offense going; stick with Wade; get one mean/diplomatic dude to back Wade; get the middle of the "D" shore up; do something about the lack of speed/reaction w/ many of them guys; and refine the footwork often lame on offense.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by colowoz View Post
    I would have preferred we won the last wild card spot (this was within reach). If only they could have won one more. Would it have been Houston and Brock coming to Denver this weekend. If Only. But Norwood cost us a couple times, and the O-Line is the weak link. Change was in order.
    If we won the last WC spot we'd be playing PIT. We'd take the spot MIA has.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArchAngel View Post
    You gotta wonder if potential coaches are thinking that even being successful isnt good enough for Elway. Fox let go after a Super bowl year and a proceeding 12-4 campaign and ANOTHER division title. Kubak "retired" after winning a Super bowl title and, later, leading the Broncos to a 9-7 record despite injuries left and right, toughest schedule in the league and possibly 4 or 5 plays from an 11-5 or 12-4 record. I hope the mile high expectations dont scare off candidates.
    If you are good at your job and IEan truly good at it then high expectations should be what you want. High expectations for true competitors should elevate their focus and force them to do better.

    So anyone who shy away from those expectations we probably didn't want them anyways.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rich_C View Post
    If you are good at your job and IEan truly good at it then high expectations should be what you want. High expectations for true competitors should elevate their focus and force them to do better.

    So anyone who shy away from those expectations we probably didn't want them anyways.
    The issue isn't high expectations. The issue is whether or not those expectations are realistic.

    If the expectations are realistic, the next issue is whether or not the consequences of falling short are fair.

    Are candidates going to be concerned that they will only be given one or two years to meet those expectations?

    Those concerns may be alleviated, if candidates believe Kubiak's departure is all about health and not about disagreement over coaching staff changes. If it's the latter, the job becomes less desirable.

    John Fox wasn't fired for being a bad coach. He was fired for disagreeing on how to improve the team, at least that's what was reported. Once the coach and his boss are on different pages, one of them has to go. That's the only reason I was okay with Fox being fired. I've only pushed back on the hate he gets around here.

    I guess I'm skeptical by nature. I don't accept what is said just because it came from an iconic figure like John Elway.

    I accept the possibility that Kubiak's departure is what he said it is, but I don't dismiss the possibility that it's something more than just that.

    In long run, I hope everything works out well for the Broncos and that Gary Kubiak is at peace with his decision, whatever the true nature of that decision is.
    Jesus Loves You, even if you don't love Him.
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  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArchAngel View Post
    You gotta wonder if potential coaches are thinking that even being successful isnt good enough for Elway. Fox let go after a Super bowl year and a proceeding 12-4 campaign and ANOTHER division title. Kubak "retired" after winning a Super bowl title and, later, leading the Broncos to a 9-7 record despite injuries left and right, toughest schedule in the league and possibly 4 or 5 plays from an 11-5 or 12-4 record. I hope the mile high expectations dont scare off candidates.
    Well time will tell in the next few years if Kubiak "retired" as you put it. If he takes another Head Coaching job then yeah, Elwaybashers on here will have even more AMMO! I truly believe Kubiak wouldn't lie , especially about something so important as HEALTH!!! Keep up that stress level and next time he might no be so fortunate.

    Shouldn't the expectations be high? Isn't that why Elway is here? Does anyone remember PRE 2011? One of the worst teams in the NFL!
    oh YEAH?

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axemaster View Post
    Well time will tell in the next few years if Kubiak "retired" as you put it. If he takes another Head Coaching job then yeah, Elwaybashers on here will have even more AMMO! I truly believe Kubiak wouldn't lie , especially about something so important as HEALTH!!! Keep up that stress level and next time he might no be so fortunate.

    Shouldn't the expectations be high? Isn't that why Elway is here? Does anyone remember PRE 2011? One of the worst teams in the NFL!
    Not to discredit John Fox but one thing that works in Elways favor is if you look at John Fox's record in Chicago, not so good! Lol

    However a lot of Elway bashers would credit that to Cutler being a disgruntled human being but still a lot of it falls back on Fox and will soon see how well the Bears play under Fox now that Jay is gone.

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