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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Broncos-R-Great View Post
    Also have to remember, we had 2 QBs who were "basically" rookies (yes I know Siemian wasn't technically a rookie) take all the snaps, and a rookie RB start about half the games. That's a lot of inexperience in the backfield which will negatively affect the line.

    We had QBs who held the ball too long like all young QBs, they also ran into pressure often instead of avoiding it. We had a RB who struggled to see holes and at times would run right at defenders. With experience these issues should improve which will help the line.
    I am not going to argue that TS was not green as far as QB's go but there were multiple issues which I noted watching him which concern me a great deal.


    1. a critique which was even brought out into the public by Kubiak was TS dropping back to far in a post-game interview. Then in the very next game TS started in after a quarter or two he went right back to dropping back 1-3 steps to far and as a result got nailed a few times. Part of we worries if this is a habit he may not be able to break.

    2. He flat out missed open players on his first read of the entire field. Some of those misses were plays where his WR was free and clear in the open. These are the types of plays which he simply CANNOT miss. I can give him a pass on a few throws where he forced a few etc. I wont and cannot give him a pass on missing open players.

    3. There were also throws where he missed which should not have been missed. Throws where he had no pressure on him whatsoever but he was throwing it like he had a savage monster about to take a swipe at him...I supposed you could call that pocket awareness but overall it was just bad play.

    SO sure he and Lynch were basically rookies but TS has been in the league for a while and frankly made some pretty substantial errors. Here's hoping they can be corrected.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rich_C View Post
    This depends. HE did struggle in his last game he played in with a much deeper talent pool of players. One of the reasons why the Bowl games are played is to take some of the top rated prospects and put them on the field together. Some can argue that this is a bit more like an NFL setting as your looking at an overall deeper pool of talent on both sides of the field.



    This is a unique issue which appears to become more and more common as there is a wider and wider divide between the NFL offenses and College offenses.



    What I don't understand is why people aren't looking at a guy like Curtis Samuel as a guy who can be in the 1st round. If your looking at a versatile player (like a McCaffrey then he is a near clone and he runs faster.
    That is a head scratcher to me too. Samuel isn't listed as a RB but can play it similar to NE's fast guys. If we could get him in the 2nd and have addressed OL before that I could go for that.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by WYBRONCO View Post
    That is a head scratcher to me too. Samuel isn't listed as a RB but can play it similar to NE's fast guys. If we could get him in the 2nd and have addressed OL before that I could go for that.
    From what I have read (and watched some) Samuel is not the refined route runner that McCaffrey is. That may be okay at the college level, but in the NFL that could be the difference in being a safety valve for your QB or getting your QB sacked. Was bout up before that there are a few guys you can look at with similar skill sets, but the question becomes how long does it take to get the most out of them. Samuels could take an extra year or two to get to the readiness Christian is today.
    Ravens GM 2016 - Ravens are looking to trade down 4-8 spots

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rich_C View Post
    I am not going to argue that TS was not green as far as QB's go but there were multiple issues which I noted watching him which concern me a great deal.


    1. a critique which was even brought out into the public by Kubiak was TS dropping back to far in a post-game interview. Then in the very next game TS started in after a quarter or two he went right back to dropping back 1-3 steps to far and as a result got nailed a few times. Part of we worries if this is a habit he may not be able to break.

    I think this is one of the easiest corrections for any QB if the footwork is good, and TS has good feet. Something he definitely needs to improve as he made the OL look bad quite a few times.

    2. He flat out missed open players on his first read of the entire field. Some of those misses were plays where his WR was free and clear in the open. These are the types of plays which he simply CANNOT miss. I can give him a pass on a few throws where he forced a few etc. I wont and cannot give him a pass on missing open players.

    We don't always know the progression of the plays, but I think in McCoy's offense the reads will be a little easier on all QBs. 60% completion is not bad for a QB going in with no real time game experience. All QBs miss open throws, it happens. He needs to miss less though.

    3. There were also throws where he missed which should not have been missed. Throws where he had no pressure on him whatsoever but he was throwing it like he had a savage monster about to take a swipe at him...I supposed you could call that pocket awareness but overall it was just bad play.

    I think all 3 of these go hand in hand. Better drops, better timing (internal clock) all help to get better accuracy. Why coaches preach footwork so much. Like a golf swing, need consistent mechanics to produce those consistent results.

    SO sure he and Lynch were basically rookies but TS has been in the league for a while and frankly made some pretty substantial errors. Here's hoping they can be corrected.
    I think TS has very good footwork and a consistent release, should see improvement in year three. Really do think McCoy takes TS to another level if he gets the chance.
    Ravens GM 2016 - Ravens are looking to trade down 4-8 spots

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by MHSalute View Post
    From what I have read (and watched some) Samuel is not the refined route runner that McCaffrey is. That may be okay at the college level, but in the NFL that could be the difference in being a safety valve for your QB or getting your QB sacked. Was bout up before that there are a few guys you can look at with similar skill sets, but the question becomes how long does it take to get the most out of them. Samuels could take an extra year or two to get to the readiness Christian is today.
    Thank you. That clarifies some things.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rich_C View Post
    I am not going to argue that TS was not green as far as QB's go but there were multiple issues which I noted watching him which concern me a great deal.


    1. a critique which was even brought out into the public by Kubiak was TS dropping back to far in a post-game interview. Then in the very next game TS started in after a quarter or two he went right back to dropping back 1-3 steps to far and as a result got nailed a few times. Part of we worries if this is a habit he may not be able to break.

    2. He flat out missed open players on his first read of the entire field. Some of those misses were plays where his WR was free and clear in the open. These are the types of plays which he simply CANNOT miss. I can give him a pass on a few throws where he forced a few etc. I wont and cannot give him a pass on missing open players.

    3. There were also throws where he missed which should not have been missed. Throws where he had no pressure on him whatsoever but he was throwing it like he had a savage monster about to take a swipe at him...I supposed you could call that pocket awareness but overall it was just bad play.

    SO sure he and Lynch were basically rookies but TS has been in the league for a while and frankly made some pretty substantial errors. Here's hoping they can be corrected.
    Eh, it was his first year, with a young o-line and no run game, I think he played well considering. I don't know a QB not named Aaron Rodgers or Tom Brady who would've been successful in this offense.

    I'm interested to see what he can do healthy, with a new OC, and a full offseason. If we're still seeing the same problems out of him by the middle of next season, then we should be concerned.

    Anyway, Siemian has been discussed to death here, I don't want to turn this thread into him.

  7. #67
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    I am looking at the teams picking ahead of the Broncos and some of them have serious issues at OT. For example, the Colts and Ravens. Free agency is pretty much over for OTs. If this is not a deep OT class, then you better get one of the top guys before the OT board is obliterated.

    Colts: RT Joe Reitz retired this offseason. Their only viable option to replace him is Le'Raven Clark. If the Colts think Clark is not ready or if they see him as a swing OT, they might take an OT in the 1st round to keep Andrew Luck upright. They could use a RT and also an upgrade at OG.

    Ravens: Ricky Wagner left in free agency and their only viable replacement is Alex Lewis. If they want to move Lewis to RT, they will need a new LG. If they keep Lewis at LG, they have no RT. Ozzie Newsome loves his Alabama guys. Cam Robinson makes a lot of sense for the Ravens as a potential LG or RT.
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  8. #68
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    I was watching the 2014 draft again and the Dolphins picked OT Ja'Wuan James, who was considered a big reach at #19. They needed a RT and used their 1st-round pick to get that fixed.

    So, Elway better be ready for the possibility of the Colts and Ravens targeting a RT in the 1st round. If Elway really likes one of these OTs, he might have to trade up ahead of the Colts and Ravens to secure his player.

    Considering the current hole at LT while Elway focused on paying top money for an OG, I think there are only 3 options:

    1) Elway must really like one of the top OTs in this draft to start at LT from day one;

    2) There is a trade agreement behind the curtain depending on how the draft unfolds;

    3) There is no plan and the o-line is really screwed.
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  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by -Rod- View Post
    I was watching the 2014 draft again and the Dolphins picked OT Ja'Wuan James, who was considered a big reach at #19. They needed a RT and used their 1st-round pick to get that fixed.

    So, Elway better be ready for the possibility of the Colts and Ravens targeting a RT in the 1st round. If Elway really likes one of these OTs, he might have to trade up ahead of the Colts and Ravens to secure his player.

    Considering the current hole at LT while Elway focused on paying top money for an OG, I think there are only 3 options:

    1) Elway must really like one of the top OTs in this draft to start at LT from day one;

    2) There is a trade agreement behind the curtain depending on how the draft unfolds;

    3) There is no plan and the o-line is really screwed.
    Let the Colt and Ravens take those OTs. None of the prospects are worth trading up for and we miss out on bigger impact players at other positions.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by -Rod- View Post
    I was watching the 2014 draft again and the Dolphins picked OT Ja'Wuan James, who was considered a big reach at #19. They needed a RT and used their 1st-round pick to get that fixed.

    So, Elway better be ready for the possibility of the Colts and Ravens targeting a RT in the 1st round. If Elway really likes one of these OTs, he might have to trade up ahead of the Colts and Ravens to secure his player.

    Considering the current hole at LT while Elway focused on paying top money for an OG, I think there are only 3 options:

    1) Elway must really like one of the top OTs in this draft to start at LT from day one;

    2) There is a trade agreement behind the curtain depending on how the draft unfolds;

    3) There is no plan and the o-line is really screwed.

    Given Elway's track record, 3 seems unlikely haha!

    I could see Elway really feeling like one of the LT who could be there at 20 would be ready to start on opening day. I think if we pass on a tackle, or a team like BAL or Indy beats us to the guy we want, in round 1 there are still some options out there in rds 2-3.


    I think Robinson would be a fine pick at 20 if he's there. If we don't like our options at tackle in round 1 I would be fine with us looking at Roderick Johnson. I think he's a guy who could develop into a top LT and for whatever reason hasn't been getting a lot of buzz and could be available to us in rounds 2-3.

  11. #71
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    I would avoid the OT's in round one. The only one worth taking is Robinson and he is not worth trading up for, and I don't think he falls to 20.

    I don't like any of the other tackles and drafting purely out of need is never the way to go.

    I thought we would have made a push for Wagner. The OT pickings were slim and I'm not a big fan of Reiff and Whitworth got alot for his age, but Wagner made a lot of sense.

    Watson is pencilled in for RT, I guess the coaching staff think that either Stephenson, Schofield, or Ty can be an effective LT.

    There has been a lot of reports that Elway was not happy with the coaching on the OL.

  12. #72
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    Robinson. We need to get bigger and meaner.

  13. #73
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    I hope we don't take a lineman in the first

  14. #74
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    Does anyone think Dion Dawkins could stick at LT? That's the position he played at Temple, and unlike Forrest Lamp, he has 35 inch arms. I don't know much about the guy, but he could probably be had with our second round pick. Thoughts?

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alabama Bronco View Post
    Does anyone think Dion Dawkins could stick at LT? That's the position he played at Temple, and unlike Forrest Lamp, he has 35 inch arms. I don't know much about the guy, but he could probably be had with our second round pick. Thoughts?
    Yes, it's possible. He's one of the better options after round 1. The fact that he's not very tall and has long arms might be an advantage. A 6'4" OT with 35" arms can win against the edge rushers with long arms, but also his height will help him play with a lower stance to block the shorter edge rushers (like Dumervil) or the edge rushers that can really bend (like Von Miller). Dawkins' 3-cone drill (7.30) was very impressive.

    He's one of my favorites players for the 2nd round. Even if he can't play LT, he is, at the very least, a much better OG prospect than Garcia or Schofield.
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