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AC1
01-29-2008, 01:06 PM
Let's say Shanahan's new-found appreciation for building through the draft leads him to a policy of only picking the best player available at each draft spot that we have (no trading up or down). Factoring in some amount of the current state of our team into the equation (i.e. a team set at QB, TE, DE, and CB, as well as one that employs a zone-blocking offense), he decides to rank the players without considering which position is the greatest need, and then pick the highest ranked player available.

At #12, these would likely be the players making up the top of his list -

Rashard Mendenhall
Jonathan Stewart
Malcolm Kelly
Desean Jackson
Ryan Clady
Sam Baker
Chris Williams
Sedrick Ellis
Kentwan Balmer
Keith Rivers
Dan Connor
Kenny Phillips

In what order would you rank these players? Please feel free to add names I may have missed out that might slot into this bunch or remove names that don't belong to this list, in your opinion.

Now, by no means am I advocating drafting with this strategy. That's a topic for a different discussion. We've been spending quite some time discussing which position to draft with our first pick. I just thought it would be interesting to see what we thought of the players themselves, regardless of position.

gyldenlove
01-29-2008, 01:58 PM
I would list the players at 12 like this, not counting the ones who right now obviously won't be there:

1. Sedrick Ellis. He is a huge longshot to be there, because many teams have needs at DL and there are no really good DE's.
2. Ryan Clady. I don't think he will fall this far, OT is a very attractive position in the draft and many teams have needs.
3. Keith Rivers. I think he is by far the best LB in a strong LB draft. I ranked above his teammate Rey Mauauleuga.
4. DeSean Jackson. He is the best WR in the draft I think as a package. He lacks some finesse and isn't shrinkwrapped ready to be in the NFL like Calvin Johnson.
5. Malcolm Kelly. Top WR prospect, he has a Brandon Marshall like size and decent speed.
6. Sam Baker. He will not get as much hype as some of the other OT. Clady, Williams, Long and maybe even Otah will get more hype, but Baker is hugely athletic and very solid technically.
7. Derrick Harvey. Some say he is better than Jarvis Moss, he has only played for one season because of the Gators strong DL, he came on for Ray McDonald who went in the 2nd last year.
8. Chris Williams. His very solid senior bowl can have made him a lot of dough. He showed some fire and meanstreak.
9. Jonathan Stewart. I think he is the 2nd best RB in the draft, just ahead of Felix Jones.
10. Dan Connor. He will slip a bit on draft day, he will however be a very good pro and if he falls to the bottom of the 1st or even top of the 2nd he will have Pozlusny or Demeco Ryans like numbers in his rookie year.

AC1
01-29-2008, 02:04 PM
Figured I'd take a stab at it myself. Ranked in order -

Sedrick Ellis
Ryan Clady
Desean Jackson
Kenny Phillips
Dan Connor
Chris Williams
Rashard Mendenhall
Sam Baker
Keith Rivers
Jonathan Stewart
Malcolm Kelly
Kentwan Balmer

AC1
01-29-2008, 02:12 PM
I would list the players at 12 like this, not counting the ones who right now obviously won't be there:

1. Sedrick Ellis. He is a huge longshot to be there, because many teams have needs at DL and there are no really good DE's.
2. Ryan Clady. I don't think he will fall this far, OT is a very attractive position in the draft and many teams have needs.
3. Keith Rivers. I think he is by far the best LB in a strong LB draft. I ranked above his teammate Rey Mauauleuga.
4. DeSean Jackson. He is the best WR in the draft I think as a package. He lacks some finesse and isn't shrinkwrapped ready to be in the NFL like Calvin Johnson.
5. Malcolm Kelly. Top WR prospect, he has a Brandon Marshall like size and decent speed.
6. Sam Baker. He will not get as much hype as some of the other OT. Clady, Williams, Long and maybe even Otah will get more hype, but Baker is hugely athletic and very solid technically.
7. Derrick Harvey. Some say he is better than Jarvis Moss, he has only played for one season because of the Gators strong DL, he came on for Ray McDonald who went in the 2nd last year.
8. Chris Williams. His very solid senior bowl can have made him a lot of dough. He showed some fire and meanstreak.
9. Jonathan Stewart. I think he is the 2nd best RB in the draft, just ahead of Felix Jones.
10. Dan Connor. He will slip a bit on draft day, he will however be a very good pro and if he falls to the bottom of the 1st or even top of the 2nd he will have Pozlusny or Demeco Ryans like numbers in his rookie year.


Looks like we have our Connor and Rivers swapped in our lists :)

As for Phillips and Mendenhall, do you think they will have been taken by #12 or aren't good enogh to be on the list?

Max Power
01-29-2008, 02:16 PM
1. Sedrick Ellis
2. Kenny Phillips
3. Dan Connor
4. Keith Rivers
5. Jonathan Stewart
6. DeSean Jackson
7. Chris Williams
8. Ryan Clady
9. Kentwan Balmer
10. Rashard Mendenhall
11. Malcolm Kelly

1-4 are choices I'd love, 5-8 I'd deem acceptable, and 9-11 would be disappointing.

Gr3yStreet
01-29-2008, 02:20 PM
Every defensive player is worth more. First round talent on defense is so much more important than offense.

AC1
01-29-2008, 02:56 PM
1. Sedrick Ellis
2. Kenny Phillips
3. Dan Connor
4. Keith Rivers
5. Jonathan Stewart
6. DeSean Jackson
7. Chris Williams
8. Ryan Clady
9. Kentwan Balmer
10. Rashard Mendenhall
11. Malcolm Kelly

1-4 are choices I'd love, 5-8 I'd deem acceptable, and 9-11 would be disappointing.

That's an interesting list, Max. I like how they're neatly grouped into defense at the top and offense in the middle :)

I'm surprised to see Connor and Rivers over Clady. Is that influenced by our need at LB v/s OT or just the fact that you think Connor and Rivers are more talented players?

AC1
01-29-2008, 03:01 PM
Every defensive player is worth more. First round talent on defense is so much more important than offense.

Would you say that holds true for any team or just our team?

If the latter, the point of this thread is to put the respective ranking of our team's need aside and just get opinions of the prospects themselves.

If the former, is there any particular reason you think so?

Max Power
01-29-2008, 03:50 PM
That's an interesting list, Max. I like how they're neatly grouped into defense at the top and offense in the middle :)

I'm surprised to see Connor and Rivers over Clady. Is that influenced by our need at LB v/s OT or just the fact that you think Connor and Rivers are more talented players?

They're all talented, I'm a bit more familiar with Rivers and Connor than I am with Clady, and I do think LB is the safer pick than OT in the 1st round. I think either of those LBs can come in and help the defense right away, whereas Clady might not be an immediate contributor given Shanahan's history of favoring experience, especially on the O-line. I think they are both big needs, but because our defense overall is in worse shape than the offense, I'll take the LB.

aldenbroncos
01-29-2008, 06:39 PM
we don't really need a Running back in the first round though I'm in love with all of them. What we really need is linebackers and o-line men assuming we fix the d-tackle and safety in free agency and trades. And hopefully travis comes back to start at running back. /Users/ajmoir/Pictures/iPhoto Library/Originals/2008/Jan 4, 2008_5/Ian_Gold.PNG/Users/ajmoir/Pictures/iPhoto Library/Originals/2008/Jan 4, 2008_23/Javon_Walker.PNG
Bye Bye

BroncoKazuki
01-29-2008, 08:20 PM
1 Rashard Mendenhall
2 Jonathan Stewart
3 Chris Williams
4 Ryan Clady
5 Sedrick Ellis
6 Malcolm Kelly
7 Sam Baker
8 Kentwan Balmer
9 Keith Rivers
10 Dan Connor
11 Kenny Phillips
12 Desean Jackson


The Run game and the O-line must come first over the Defense, other then Dorsey and Ellis im not too fond of the DT class this year, the ILB class this year nor the Safety Class this year. Im elated at the prospects of the DT,ILB and S class in the 2009 draft who by far has more defensive prospects in that year then this year.

This year we have our pickings at the Best RB, OT, and OLB's in the draft and be able to draft Depth within our D-line and Safety core.

Next year will be the best to shop for an DT and Safety. theres an S in the 2009 draft that runs a 4.3 in the 40 and comes from USC now imagine that kind in a Bronco Uni playing Special teams and Defense. :)

AC1
01-30-2008, 11:32 AM
1 Rashard Mendenhall
2 Jonathan Stewart
3 Chris Williams
4 Ryan Clady
5 Sedrick Ellis
6 Malcolm Kelly
7 Sam Baker
8 Kentwan Balmer
9 Keith Rivers
10 Dan Connor
11 Kenny Phillips
12 Desean Jackson


The Run game and the O-line must come first over the Defense, other then Dorsey and Ellis im not too fond of the DT class this year, the ILB class this year nor the Safety Class this year. Im elated at the prospects of the DT,ILB and S class in the 2009 draft who by far has more defensive prospects in that year then this year.

This year we have our pickings at the Best RB, OT, and OLB's in the draft and be able to draft Depth within our D-line and Safety core.

Next year will be the best to shop for an DT and Safety. theres an S in the 2009 draft that runs a 4.3 in the 40 and comes from USC now imagine that kind in a Bronco Uni playing Special teams and Defense. :)

I'm starting to lean in the direction of an offensive draft much more, especially with Ellis out of reach, and Okam dropping down the boards. It appears we are two drafts away from building an elite team, and rounding out our offense and letting them grow togther probably optimizes talent better right now, leaving us to focus solely on defense in next year's draft.

However, we do need a starter at DT. Even if we disregard all other positions on defense for one year, a starting DT is still a must. Ideally we get him through FA.

Warhawk
01-30-2008, 01:25 PM
The top tier:

1. Sedrick Ellis - no brainer if available... the best in this list by far
2. Ryan Clady - great size and quickness... perfect fit for a ZBS
3. Kenny Phillips - solid in all aspects of the game, natural safety
4. Jonathan Stewart - the bomb!
5. Keith Rivers - smooth in coverage & pursuit, big hitter, good instincts
6. Desean Jackson - pure lightning... big play threat as a KR and WR

The middling guys:

7. Dan Connor - I like him better than Rivers as a football player, but Rivers has higher value due to his athletic ability
8. Chris Williams - great athlete, great pass protection
9. Rashard Mendenhall - excellent all-around back, decent size, good speed

The grey area:

10. Sam Baker - great technician at LT, would probably be the starter day 1... but how much better would he get?
11. Malcolm Kelly - big strong WR with a knack for big plays - problem is, we already have a better version of this in Brandon Marshall

The toilet bowl:

12. Kentwan Balmer - too much hype w/o any clear separation from the second level of DT's (Dre Moore, Trevor Laws, Pat Sims, etc)

jlhawkins9
01-30-2008, 02:27 PM
Sedrick Ellis----- if he falls to 8 trade with Bal and get him asap a 09 3rd and 4th this year or a 09 2nd
Kenny Phillips
Ryan Clady
Rashard Mendenhall
Jonathan Stewart
Malcolm Kelly
Desean Jackson
Keith Rivers
Sam Baker
Chris Williams
Dan Connor
Kentwan Balmer