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ReleaseTheBeast7
02-03-2008, 09:20 PM
Pass rush wins championships.

Max Power
02-03-2008, 09:24 PM
Pass rush cures all. That would be sweet if we could find a way to get Sedrick Ellis. Maybe Kentwan Balmer, but I'd prefer a trade down first before taking him.

MindField
02-03-2008, 09:26 PM
Pass rush wins championships.

This is an ignorant statement...just like most novice fans, you look at the latest way a team wins it, and you think there is some sort of be-all, end-all, formula, and there just isn't.

BTW, genius, tell us where these great pass rushers were selected?

Starahan?
Osi U?
Justin Tuck?


Not a first round pick among them.

Momentum
02-03-2008, 09:28 PM
Pass rush cures all. That would be sweet if we could find a way to get Sedrick Ellis. Maybe Kentwan Balmer, but I'd prefer a trade down first before taking him.

If we could trade down, take Balmer and get Okam in the 2nd day, that would be ideal.

BroncoKazuki
02-03-2008, 09:31 PM
This is an ignorant statement...just like most novice fans, you look at the latest way a team wins it, and you think there is some sort of be-all, end-all, formula, and there just isn't.

BTW, genius, tell us where these great pass rushers were selected?

Starahan?
Osi U?
Justin Tuck?


Not a first round pick among them.

your wasting your breath Mindfield these guys think that a 1st round DT will solve the Defensive inexperienced woes.

We all know that the RB scrubs we picked up After Portis have done crap for us, while 1st round RB's have been in the playoffs and some into the Superbowl. I'm getting a head-ache from trying to keep explaining why we need a round 1 RB all I know is we keep wasting a pick on RB in the late draft every year because the scrub before them faltered at the end.

ReleaseTheBeast7
02-03-2008, 09:33 PM
This is an ignorant statement...just like most novice fans, you look at the latest way a team wins it, and you think there is some sort of be-all, end-all, formula, and there just isn't.

BTW, genius, tell us where these great pass rushers were selected?

Starahan?
Osi U?
Justin Tuck?


Not a first round pick among them.

I'm not a "novice" fan. And I'm not looking at the latest way a team wins it, I'm looking at the way they past 42 have won it. With defense, and a strong defensive line. Not offense and a first round running back. If you can get pressure on the QB, and stop the run, you'll win 9 out of every 10 games, guaranteed. Oh and I've been on the Justin Tuck bandwagon since he was at ND also.

Let's see
Brandon Jacobs?
Ahmad Bradshaw?

Which one was a first DAY pick?

Momentum
02-03-2008, 09:33 PM
http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p81/cnwilliams22/Kool-AidMan.jpg

mx_stiles13
02-03-2008, 09:34 PM
If we could trade down, take Balmer and get Okam in the 2nd day, that would be ideal.

You better get rid of your signature before I punch a hole in my wall :D

Rashard Mendenhall - RB - Illinois - Drafted by Broncos 1st round

Defense may have won the Superbowl for the Giants, but what side of the ball won it for the Broncos?

ReleaseTheBeast7
02-03-2008, 09:35 PM
your wasting your breath Mindfield these guys think that a 1st round DT will solve the Defensive inexperienced woes.

We all know that the RB scrubs we picked up After Portis have done crap for us, while 1st round RB's have been in the playoffs and some into the Superbowl. I'm getting a head-ache from trying to keep explaining why we need a round 1 RB all I know is we keep wasting a pick on RB in the late draft every year because the scrub before them faltered at the end.

Oh yeah? Portis wasn't a first round pick... And how many superbowls did we win with Portis(2nd round pick)? How about Tatum Bell(2nd round pick)? How many with Terrell Davis(6th round pick)?

stnzed
02-03-2008, 09:36 PM
I'd settle for pass rushers! Who did you have in mind?......

lancane
02-03-2008, 09:37 PM
If we could trade down, take Balmer and get Okam in the 2nd day, that would be ideal.

That would be a wasted draft...We need one defensive tackle, not a whole unit and fact is that Denver is high on a few of our younger tackles including Thomas. And if they can get Rogers...you can kiss the day one DT goodbye!

ReleaseTheBeast7
02-03-2008, 09:37 PM
You better get rid of your signature before I punch a hole in my wall :D

Rashard Mendenhall - RB - Illinois - Drafted by Broncos 1st round

Defense may have won the Superbowl for the Giants, but what side of the ball won it for the Broncos?

You need a running game, but you don't need a first round runningback.

lancane
02-03-2008, 09:38 PM
You better get rid of your signature before I punch a hole in my wall :D

Rashard Mendenhall - RB - Illinois - Drafted by Broncos 1st round

Defense may have won the Superbowl for the Giants, but what side of the ball won it for the Broncos?

That would be the offense...

mx_stiles13
02-03-2008, 09:38 PM
You need a running game, but you don't need a first round runningback.

It definately helps... :coffee:

ReleaseTheBeast7
02-03-2008, 09:40 PM
I'd settle for pass rushers! Who did you have in mind?......

Trade first this year, and first next year, this year to move into the top 7 and take Sedrick Ellis. Then trade one or both of our 4ths for Shaun Rogers.

mx_stiles13
02-03-2008, 09:41 PM
That would be the offense...

Bingo! You know what I'm talkin about lancane.

I would give you a CP but my last one went to you too so you will have to wait :D

Max Power
02-03-2008, 09:42 PM
It definately helps... :coffee:

Tell that to the Bears (Cedric Benson, Curtis Enis, Rashaan Salaam).

ReleaseTheBeast7
02-03-2008, 09:43 PM
It definately helps... :coffee:

Helps who? It didn't help New England tonight, it didn't help the Bears last year, it didn't help the Seahawks the year before.

Who helped out the Giants, Colts, and Steelers though? Oh yeah.
Willie Parker (Undrafted)
Dominic Rhodes (Undrafted)
Ahmad Bradshaw (Undrafted)

MindField
02-03-2008, 09:44 PM
I'm not a "novice" fan. And I'm not looking at the latest way a team wins it, I'm looking at the way they past 42 have won it. With defense, and a strong defensive line. Not offense and a first round running back. If you can get pressure on the QB, and stop the run, you'll win 9 out of every 10 games, guaranteed. Oh and I've been on the Justin Tuck bandwagon since he was at ND also.

Let's see
Brandon Jacobs?
Ahmad Bradshaw?

Which one was a first DAY pick?

If you don't realize what a great running game can do for a team, you are a novice fan.

if you dissected all 42 SB winning teams, you would find alot of different formula's.

To me, the No.1 formula is Offensive balance, which is how, BTW, the Broncos won THEIR Super Bowls, so I really don't care what other teams did or how they did it. What the Giants did tonight is completely irrelevant to the Denver Broncos other than completely encouraging me, because obviously, I don't think they are that far superior to the Broncos right now.

The Broncos can makeup the most ground in one offseason by selecting Stewart or Mendenhall in the first round more than ANY other player you can Draft, period. A GREAT running game increases the effectiveness of the passing game, would be the best solution to the Broncos problems in the Red Zone, and would help the
Defense while the young players we already have mature and develop.

No one is suggesting we don't need more help on the Defensive front seven, but if you think Selvin Young or Mike Bell or the latest verson of that is enough to win a Championship, your flat wrong.

You may look at Terrell Davis and say he was a sixth rounder, but that is like saying you can get a QB like Tom Brady all the time in the sixth round...you simply CAN'T in either case; they were both incredible FLUKES.

SBboundBRONCOS
02-03-2008, 09:44 PM
Trade first this year, and first next year, this year to move into the top 7 and take Sedrick Ellis. Then trade one or both of our 4ths for Shaun Rogers.

that would be so dumb :goofy:

i will be so pissed if we traded 2 first rounders just to get ellis. considering the fact that he will likely not make a big impact for at least 1-2 years.

Momentum
02-03-2008, 09:45 PM
That would be a wasted draft...We need one defensive tackle, not a whole unit and fact is that Denver is high on a few of our younger tackles including Thomas. And if they can get Rogers...you can kiss the day one DT goodbye!

We still need LBs and safeties. Even a decent KR man that could be found on day one

jrfernan
02-03-2008, 09:47 PM
Pass rush wins championships.

He, he, he....<ad infinitum> :)

BroncoKazuki
02-03-2008, 09:47 PM
Oh yeah? Portis wasn't a first round pick... And how many superbowls did we win with Portis(2nd round pick)? How about Tatum Bell(2nd round pick)? How many with Terrell Davis(6th round pick)?

Lets see, Davis - retired (lighting will not strike twice)

Portis - doing very good as a Skin, Round 1 talent in round 2


Bell- disappeared and for the most part he should have been a 5th IMHO


yea I can see what we did with those.

One is a GOAT for our team and he's retired. I'd bet if Davis got more like he would be a round 1 pick.


Poritis - traded for champ

Bell- MIA


yea i see what our 2 round 2 and 6th picks only 1 traded , 1 disappeared and 1 won us 2 SB's and was a virtual fluke that we got him in the 6th round.

:coffee:

ReleaseTheBeast7
02-03-2008, 09:49 PM
If you don't realize what a great running game can do for a team, you are a novice fan.

if you dissected all 42 SB winning teams, you would find alot of different formula's.

To me, the No.1 formula is Offensive balance, which is how, BTW, the Broncos won THEIR Super Bowls, so I really don't care what other teams did or how they did it. What the Giants did tonight is completely irrelevant to the Denver Broncos other than completely encouraging me, because obviously, I don't think they are that far superior to the Broncos right now.

The Broncos can makeup the most ground in one offseason by selecting Stewart or Mendenhall in the first round more than ANY other player you can Draft, period. A GREAT running game increases the effectiveness of the passing game, would be the best solution to the Broncos problems in the Red Zone, and would help the
Defense while the young players we already have mature and develop.

No one is suggesting we don't need more help on the Defensive front seven, but if you think Selvin Young or Mike Bell or the latest verson of that is enough to win a Championship, your flat wrong.

You may look at Terrell Davis and say he was a sixth rounder, but that is like saying you can get a QB like Tom Brady all the time in the sixth round...you simply CAN'T in either case; they were both incredible FLUKES.

I never said you could win without a good running game, but you can win with a good running game and a below average running back.

And oh yeah, RBs are a dime a dozen, especially in a RB class that is as deep as this year. Felix Jones and Ray Rice, labeled as Late 1st-2nd round picks, would have been top 10 picks last year.

Or how about you just look in free agency for one? MICHAEL THE BURNER TURNER ANYONE?

ReleaseTheBeast7
02-03-2008, 09:52 PM
Lets see, Davis - retired (lighting will not strike twice)

Portis - doing very good as a Skin, Round 1 talent in round 2


Bell- disappeared and for the most part he should have been a 5th IMHO


yea I can see what we did with those.

One is a GOAT for our team and he's retired. I'd bet if Davis got more like he would be a round 1 pick.


Poritis - traded for champ

Bell- MIA


yea i see what our 2 round 2 and 6th picks only 1 traded , 1 disappeared and 1 won us 2 SB's and was a virtual fluke that we got him in the 6th round.

:coffee:

Ok, so who says if we draft Mendenhall or Stewart in the first, that they won't disappear like Tatum did?

Fact is, Portis was a 2nd round pick, has no superbowl ring yet.
Bell was a 2nd round pick, doesn't even play anymore.
Davis was a 6th round pick, he has a 2,000 yard season, an MVP, a superbowl MVP, 2 superbowl rings.

Look at the starting RBs for every team in this league and tell me how many were drafted in the first?

Max Power
02-03-2008, 09:55 PM
Ok, so who says if we draft Mendenhall or Stewart in the first, that they won't disappear like Tatum did?

Fact is, Portis was a 2nd round pick, has no superbowl ring yet.
Bell was a 2nd round pick, doesn't even play anymore.
Davis was a 6th round pick, he has a 2,000 yard season, an MVP, a superbowl MVP, 2 superbowl rings.

Look at the starting RBs for every team in this league and tell me how many were drafted in the first?

dude, Mendenhall is going to be a HOFer. [/sarcasm]

MindField
02-03-2008, 09:55 PM
I never said you could win without a good running game, but you can win with a good running game and a below average running back.

And oh yeah, RBs are a dime a dozen, especially in a RB class that is as deep as this year. Felix Jones and Ray Rice, labeled as Late 1st-2nd round picks, would have been top 10 picks last year.

Or how about you just look in free agency for one? MICHAEL THE BURNER TURNER ANYONE?

Whatever....what the Giants did tonight was a fluke. It was one game where they caught lightning in a bottle. If these two teams played ten times, the Pats would win eight of them.

If WE want to compete, we have to do so against teams like San Diego and Kansas City, in our Division, that DID invest first round picks in RB's....

As did New England with Maroney and the Colts with Addai. That is our competiton.

Selvin Young, et all won't cut it.

silkamilkamonic
02-03-2008, 09:56 PM
Jay Alford is one of the better pass rushing DT's on the Giants, and he was drafted in the third round.

Let's maneuver in the later rounds, and get a DT in the third round.

That way we can still get Stewart/Mendenhall, and still improve our pass rushing ability.

silkamilkamonic
02-03-2008, 09:57 PM
Whatever....what the Giants did tonight was a fluke. It was one game where they caught lightning in a bottle. If these two teams played ten times, the Pats would win eight of them.

The is sig worthy, and quite possibly the dumbest post in this thread of dumb posts.

Q_Ball22
02-03-2008, 09:58 PM
That would be a wasted draft...We need one defensive tackle, not a whole unit and fact is that Denver is high on a few of our younger tackles including Thomas. And if they can get Rogers...you can kiss the day one DT goodbye!

If Travis Henry is with the team next year you can kiss 1st round rb goodbye.

lancane
02-03-2008, 09:58 PM
We still need LBs and safeties. Even a decent KR man that could be found on day one

Rivers nor Conner are top fifteen picks at this time, Phillips will barely be a top 20 pick, Rivers will likely drafted early but Conners will stay...Balmer has flags galore, and a kick returner...like Jackson or Royal would be a big jump with our weaknesses and that would be a big mistake.

If we traded way down and picked up more then I see what picking some of those players would do...but you also forget Shanahan is an offensive coach, Bowlen is a bonified offense lover, and Bates got a huge defensive draft last year...do you really think that Shanahan with the lack in the first round will ignore his offense for defense? I do not believe so...but you differ, I do not think he will ignore the defense. But I do think he will take a running back at least in the top of the draft, he may go heavy defense for the next few picks...I just do not see a good pick defensively in round one! And I love defense, I have always been huge on defense and there is not one player that will be available to us that impresses me.

lancane
02-03-2008, 09:59 PM
If Travis Henry is with the team next year you can kiss 1st round rb goodbye.

Opinions vary...not like we haven't drafted players for a position that we have filled right, maybe you should call Plummer and tell him that as well!

:coffee:

mx_stiles13
02-03-2008, 10:01 PM
Ok, so who says if we draft Mendenhall or Stewart in the first, that they won't disappear like Tatum did?

Fact is, Portis was a 2nd round pick, has no superbowl ring yet.
Bell was a 2nd round pick, doesn't even play anymore.
Davis was a 6th round pick, he has a 2,000 yard season, an MVP, a superbowl MVP, 2 superbowl rings.

Look at the starting RBs for every team in this league and tell me how many were drafted in the first?

You are just mad that we didn't draft Antonio Pittman.

... like he is as good as Mendenhall... :coffee:

MindField
02-03-2008, 10:01 PM
Ok, so who says if we draft Mendenhall or Stewart in the first, that they won't disappear like Tatum did?

Fact is, Portis was a 2nd round pick, has no superbowl ring yet.
Bell was a 2nd round pick, doesn't even play anymore.
Davis was a 6th round pick, he has a 2,000 yard season, an MVP, a superbowl MVP, 2 superbowl rings.

Look at the starting RBs for every team in this league and tell me how many were drafted in the first?

That is true of ANY Draft pick....name a prospect that is a sure-fire guarantee at any position...there aren't any.

There are more first round QB busts than anything else, and I don't see anyone in their right mind suggesting you should NEVER take a first round QB.

How are RB's any different?

I trust what I see, and all I am waiting for is the Combine numbers to confirm what I already know, but Jonathan Stewart and Rashard Mendenhall are both going to be outstanding runners, just as I knew Larry Johnson, Stephen Jackson and Shawn Alexander would be as well.

Bronkster
02-03-2008, 10:04 PM
It's funny how wrong some of y'all are about our running game. The Broncos can plug anyone in and make him productive. So why waste our #1 pick on a RB when a #6 will be just as productive. A decision so easy..........http://www.imageyenation.com/images/blog-gallery/so_easy_a_caveman_can_do_it_tv_show_announcement.j pg

mx_stiles13
02-03-2008, 10:08 PM
It's funny how wrong some of y'all are about our running game. The Broncos can plug anyone in and make him productive. So why waste our #1 pick on a RB when a #6 will be just as productive. A decision so easy..........http://www.imageyenation.com/images/blog-gallery/so_easy_a_caveman_can_do_it_tv_show_announcement.j pg

jeezus :brick:

If a nobody can gain 1000+ yard in this offense, think about how far a 1st round talent can go!

Bronkster
02-03-2008, 10:11 PM
jeezus :brick:

If a nobody can gain 1000+ yard in this offense, think about how far a 1st round talent can go!

I mean, who needs a 3,129,401,328 yard rusher when our defensive blows. It doesn't matter. Ok. I'll give in. We do need a goal-line back. BUT NOT IN THE FIRST ROUND.

Max Power
02-03-2008, 10:11 PM
I mean, who needs a 3,129,401,328 yard rusher when our defensive blows. It doesn't matter. Ok. I'll give in. We do need a goal-line back. BUT NOT IN THE FIRST ROUND.

exactly. 1st round RB is a luxury, not a need, especially with our pressing needs on DEFENSE.

BroncoKazuki
02-03-2008, 10:12 PM
It's funny how wrong some of y'all are about our running game. The Broncos can plug anyone in and make him productive. So why waste our #1 pick on a RB when a #6 will be just as productive. A decision so easy..........


and every year we do that takes 1 draft pick away from the Offense and Defensive side. :coffee:


While we have a chance to grab the pick of the litter in an RB, and go defense the rest of the draft (that I wouldnt mind)


but each year we keep throwing money and picks at RB's that show flashes but when they get into our backfield they dull out.

T.Bell is gone - that pick could have gone to the Defense or Offense.

Porits - we traded for a Defender.

the rest of our picks... uh wasted money.

so yea I can see us drafting a sub-par RB, and make it a constant need every year taking valuable picks away from the lines (D and O) and the Defensive secondary.

:rolleyes:

I mean we did the same thing with Cutler we drafted him to solidify the QB positon when jake came off his best season in his entire career, I dont see why we cant do that with an RB in round 1 to finally solidify that position so we can finally focus our attention to the Defense and Offensive-line.

Bronkster
02-03-2008, 10:16 PM
Porits - we traded for a Defender.

Is there any conceivable way you could be saying that with a bitter tone? Is there any way ANY Broncos fan could say they would rather have PORTIS than CHAMP? You think our D was bad this year? IMAGINE it without Champ Bailey. This is becoming laughable...

BroncoKazuki
02-03-2008, 10:24 PM
Is there any conceivable way you could be saying that with a bitter tone? Is there any way ANY Broncos fan could say they would rather have PORTIS than CHAMP? You think our D was bad this year? IMAGINE it without Champ Bailey. This is becoming laughable...

Yea and the contary can be said as well

If we had Porits then we could use this draft to fix the D-line with any of the Defensive stars that are out this draft.


See what that trade did, it moved one Hole from one side to the Other. Thats all we did was just move the Hole from one side to the other.

The Defensive Secondary had a Hole so we traded Portis who finally matured into the Back that we wanted.

We wasted a 2nd rounder on T.Bell who became the ultimate backup.

So lets look at the big picture.

Lets say for the moment we kept Portis, drafted Cutler, and between those picks were used on fixing the D-line and the Secondary. This year may have put us in the playoffs if we only kept Portis. (My gut tells me that we would have still drafted Cutler because Jake just sucks and has too many limitations)


so yea I can see what that trade did (dont get me wrong I think that was a great trade at the point but hindsight says that we may have screwed up a little)

silkamilkamonic
02-03-2008, 10:26 PM
We wasted a 2nd rounder on T.Bell who became the ultimate bust.


Uhm, Bell was an average starting RB at Denver. Not great. And not terrible. He was also arguably the NFL's best backup RB at Denver.

Labeling him an "ultimate bust" isn't going to help your case for any other argument in this thread.

BroncoKazuki
02-03-2008, 10:30 PM
Uhm, Bell was an average starting RB at Denver. Not great. And not terrible. He was also arguably the NFL's best backup RB at Denver.

Labeling him an "ultimate bust" isn't going to help your case for any other argument in this thread.

I changed it to Ultimate backup instead :D


but really T. Bell never really impressed me. I just wish we can actually solidify a position first before we keep making that position a need every year.

Bronkster
02-03-2008, 10:31 PM
Ok. Let's agree to disagree. We all love the Broncos, and I keep trying to imagine what it would have been like if that had been us tonight....Jay on the cover of SI and all. But it's past mid-night here in VA, and I am going back to school tomorrow. Goodnight and God bless.

ReleaseTheBeast7
02-03-2008, 10:46 PM
jeezus :brick:

If a nobody can gain 1000+ yard in this offense, think about how far a 1st round talent can go!

Who cares? As long as we keep production in the backfield I'm good.

However, our defense is horrid.

stnzed
02-03-2008, 10:48 PM
Who cares? As long as we keep production in the backfield I'm good.

However, our defense is horrid.


Denver picked a bad year to need defense......

ReleaseTheBeast7
02-03-2008, 10:50 PM
Uhm, Bell was an average starting RB at Denver. Not great. And not terrible. He was also arguably the NFL's best backup RB at Denver.

Labeling him an "ultimate bust" isn't going to help your case for any other argument in this thread.

Precisely.

With him and MA in 05, our offense was the most dangerous in the league that year. He was a homerun threat EVERY time he touched the ball.

With that being said, even with the most explosive offense in the league, we still didn't even get to the superbowl that year... Why not? Our front 4 couldn't get after Big Ben on 3rd down and he tore us apart with that.

ReleaseTheBeast7
02-03-2008, 10:54 PM
Denver picked a bad year to need defense......

If we had kept Coyer our D would be solid.

But anyways... Why did we pick a bad year to need defense? We have a top 15 pick which we can finally use of a franchise defensive linemen, Haynesworth may be available, Rogers is on the block, etc.

If you want to make the argument that "We need a RB", this is the strongest draft in awhile for RB, as I've said before. And we needed a RB just as bad last year, we just didn't look in the right spot for one.

If we had taken Marshawn last year, this argument would be non-existent right now. Oh and just so you know, if Marshawn had been in this years draft class, he would have been a 3rd round talent, that says something about this draft class for RBs(You can find one late and they'll turn out great).

If you want a RB who will be more than productive in this system, you should be looking at this dude(Who can be had in the 4th round):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UackJIOqFNU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bbaIF22NGQ

Or like I said, we could sign Michael Turner who would be an absolute beast in this system.

There's no reason to draft a RB in the first round this year, NO REASON

BroncoKazuki
02-03-2008, 11:03 PM
If we had kept Coyer our D would be solid.

But anyways... Why did we pick a bad year to need defense? We have a top 15 pick which we can finally use of a franchise defensive linemen, Haynesworth may be available, Rogers is on the block, etc.

If you want to make the argument that "We need a RB", this is the strongest draft in awhile for RB, as I've said before. And we needed a RB just as bad last year, we just didn't look in the right spot for one.

If we had taken Marshawn last year, this argument would be non-existent right now. Oh and just so you know, if Marshawn had been in this years draft class, he would have been a 3rd round talent, that says something about this draft class for RBs(You can find one late and they'll turn out great).

If you want a RB who will be more than productive in this system, you should be looking at this dude(Who can be had in the 4th round):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UackJIOqFNU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bbaIF22NGQ


We wouldnt be in this hell hole if we kept Portis Hind sight is very beneficial am I right when your trying to prove a point.

the fact is next years draft is depleted in talent for RB's, if Jones, Stewart and Mendenhall didnt declare this year I would have been all over Ellis because he would have been in range, or Ryan Clady.

Hell before Mendenhall declared I had Clady as the number 1 draft pick in my mock.

The thing is, RB has been expendable because our system can make a medicore/sub-par RB look like a super-stud. We need to find that talent that can put that system over the top. I doubt next years RB's could fix that.

Like I said, if we dont solidify the RB it will always be a need. When that RB that comes out that ends up being the next Davis/LT/Portis/Lynch/Mendenhall/Stewart/Jones/McFaddon and our aging D-line needs to be re-vamped we'll be right back at this because we keep throwing money and picks at RB's that cannot stick or just fade away.

lancane
02-03-2008, 11:06 PM
Who cares? As long as we keep production in the backfield I'm good.

However, our defense is horrid.

Not really...they are young, what about having a team in a new scheme with only three starters do you guys not get? I really want to know where you believe eight new starters will really come together, let alone some are rookies or sophmores and become a great defense! Saying they are horrid is a lack of intelligence into the basic fundementals of the game...Ekuban our defensive line leader and veteran was injured, Moss our top pick was injured, our shotty replacements for Warren sucked...Dumervil and Engleberger for crying outloud started? Crowder (Rookie), Dumervil (Sophmore - great pass rusher and the best lineman we had), Engleberger (decent veteran backup), Marcus Thomas (Rookie), Alvin McKinley (1st Year veteran who was an okay backup), Kenny Peterson (1st Year veteran signed late and a decent backup), Steven Harris (Rookie who Denver really likes but is not starting material), Josh Mallard (1st Year veteran who was signed late and is an okay backup), Larry Birding (Rookie basically who was signed late and may be an okay backup), Dre Bly (Good cornerback but first year in system), D.J. Williams (Good linebacker, first year at new position), Hamza Abdullah (basically a sophmore in the system) and Nate Webster (Former backup mike linebacker moved outside first year starter)

How is it that anyone expected all those players in new positions, not from the system or young to come together and be effective? God only knows...

stnzed
02-03-2008, 11:20 PM
If we had kept Coyer our D would be solid.

But anyways... Why did we pick a bad year to need defense? We have a top 15 pick which we can finally use of a franchise defensive linemen, Haynesworth may be available, Rogers is on the block, etc.

If you want to make the argument that "We need a RB", this is the strongest draft in awhile for RB, as I've said before. And we needed a RB just as bad last year, we just didn't look in the right spot for one.

If we had taken Marshawn last year, this argument would be non-existent right now. Oh and just so you know, if Marshawn had been in this years draft class, he would have been a 3rd round talent, that says something about this draft class for RBs(You can find one late and they'll turn out great).

If you want a RB who will be more than productive in this system, you should be looking at this dude(Who can be had in the 4th round):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UackJIOqFNU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bbaIF22NGQ

Or like I said, we could sign Michael Turner who would be an absolute beast in this system.

There's no reason to draft a RB in the first round this year, NO REASON

Actually, I completely agree with you on Coyer, had they drafted him some DE's. Maybe Gerrard Warren would still be around, too.

But there are legitimate reasons for Denver to draft a RB.

1--That's where the value is at 12.
2--Finally put an end to this constant revolving door at RB.
3--There are no DE's to take at this point.
4--There are no DT's to take at this point (Most significant reason).
5--There are no LB's that are a better value at 12.
6--The Broncos will never draft a legitimate Elite LT (Not that taking a RB in the first round is a much possibility).
7--Stewart would improve the redzone offense as much as possible with that joke of an O-line.
8--There are no WR's to take that high.
9--Drafting RB's is the one thing they've proven they can do consistently, so taking a RB with a pick that high may be the safest pick.
10--Henry is unreliable, Young is a China Doll and Hall is......
11--[Edit] The Broncos are much closer to winning on the strength of it's offense than it's defense. And since the answers on defense are much more harder to find, putting the finishing touches on what could be an elite offense helps you better compete with the Colts and Patriots.

Granted, it's still way early, but RB is a possibility, imo.

As far as Forte, count me out, I'd hate the pick......but the Broncos are sure to love him......

BroncoKazuki
02-03-2008, 11:25 PM
Actually, I completely agree with you on Coyer, had they drafted him some DE's. Maybe Gerrard Warren would still be around, too.

But there are legitimate reasons for Denver to draft a RB.

1--That's where the value is at 12.
2--Finally put an end to this constant revolving door at RB.
3--There are no DE's to take at this point.
4--There are no DT's to take at this point (Most significant reason).
5--There are no LB's that are a better value at 12.
6--The Broncos will never draft a legitimate Elite LT.
7--Stewart would improve the redzone offense as much as possible with that joke of an O-line.
8--There are no WR's to take that high.
9--Drafting RB's is the one thing they've proven they can do consistently, so taking a RB with a pick that high may be the safest pick.
10--Henry is unreliable, Young is a China Doll and Hall is......

Granted, it's still way early, but RB is a possibility, imo.

As far as Forte, count me out, I'd hate the pick......but the Broncos are sure to love him......

If only there was a way to Draft Mendenhall/Stewart/Jones and an elite OT then everyone would be happy:salute:.

ReleaseTheBeast7
02-03-2008, 11:25 PM
We wouldnt be in this hell hole if we kept Portis Hind sight is very beneficial am I right when your trying to prove a point.

the fact is next years draft is depleted in talent for RB's, if Jones, Stewart and Mendenhall didnt declare this year I would have been all over Ellis because he would have been in range, or Ryan Clady.

Hell before Mendenhall declared I had Clady as the number 1 draft pick in my mock.

The thing is, RB has been expendable because our system can make a medicore/sub-par RB look like a super-stud. We need to find that talent that can put that system over the top. I doubt next years RB's could fix that.

Like I said, if we dont solidify the RB it will always be a need. When that RB that comes out that ends up being the next Davis/LT/Portis/Lynch/Mendenhall/Stewart/Jones/McFaddon and our aging D-line needs to be re-vamped we'll be right back at this because we keep throwing money and picks at RB's that cannot stick or just fade away.

I never said we don't need to solidify the RB position on our team, I agree that we need to draft one this year. However, because of the depth at the position in this draft class, I don't feel we need to draft one in the first, ESPECIALLY with more pressing needs, it's just my opinion. Everyone's entitled to theirs.

Jay2Javon4life
02-03-2008, 11:29 PM
I never said we don't need to solidify the RB position on our team, I agree that we need to draft one this year. However, because of the depth at the position in this draft class, I don't feel we need to draft one in the first, ESPECIALLY with more pressing needs, it's just my opinion. Everyone's entitled to theirs.

i agree haha

BroncoKazuki
02-04-2008, 12:05 AM
I never said we don't need to solidify the RB position on our team, I agree that we need to draft one this year. However, because of the depth at the position in this draft class, I don't feel we need to draft one in the first, ESPECIALLY with more pressing needs, it's just my opinion. Everyone's entitled to theirs.


But the best Defensive Players will be out of reach, plus from this stance you'll be ok with letting RB be a constant need every year or every 2 years then.

If Mendenhall/Stewart/Jones didnt declare this year.. read the following.

in my honest opinion I would take Ellis or Dorsey over Phillips

I would take an OT over Phillips

uh thats about it Phillips may climb back up but he may also slip into the 2nd. I think at best Phillips is best valued at the 2nd to late 1st. That may be due to how his team played, but he could also have valued some more from maturing 1 more year in College. Imagine if he had 1 more year he could be a bonified top 5 pick instead of a 1st round 20-32 pick and be more well rounded skill set wise.

To me Phillips seems a bit raw and could use more maturing.

Yet the 3 RB's i have my eye on did declare this year so going RB and solidifying that would be a no-brainier and allow us to go Defense next year.

in 2009 Draft I would be happy if we could draft a guy like William Moore from Missouri, Derek Pergues from Mississippi, or Nick Harris from Oklahoma. Witch would all be seniors. These are also all FS and I think Phillips in my mind jump the gun to pull away from these guys by going into the draft this year. How that will effect him is unknown but to me He had a chance to be in the top 5 Safety class and could be a bonified top 10 pick next year if he matured more. Plus I mean next Years Safety class would be huge and we would be able to grab Phillips without over-extending ourselves.

KWHIT97
02-04-2008, 12:18 AM
Trade first this year, and first next year, this year to move into the top 7 and take Sedrick Ellis. Then trade one or both of our 4ths for Shaun Rogers.

Let's all get a gigantic hard-on because the G-Men won a title with a great pass rush. Whoopdy freakin doo.
Every team wins with there own formula, I agree that a good passrush helps alot, but it has been proven time and time again that running the football and stopping the run is the key to winning titles!
Let's keep in mind that we spent 3 draft picks on the D-line last year, Moss will be good, Crowder will be solid, and Thomas is a 8 year starter for us, let's not forget that we also have HALF-PINT Dumervil on our side!
A RB is in order, face it!!!

Road_Apples
02-04-2008, 12:39 AM
and the fact that the G-men stopped the patriots running game is a massive reason why they won!

BRONCOS_OWN_U16
02-04-2008, 12:45 AM
I mean, who needs a 3,129,401,328 yard rusher when our defensive blows. It doesn't matter. Ok. I'll give in. We do need a goal-line back. BUT NOT IN THE FIRST ROUND.

if we had a 3,129,401,328 rusher we'd win every game

Momentum
02-04-2008, 01:22 AM
But the best Defensive Players will be out of reach

So you can see into the future now?

"oh noo teh onlyee playa worf #12 is teh mendan hall"

:rolleyes:

lancane
02-04-2008, 01:33 AM
So you can see into the future now?

"oh noo teh onlyee playa worf #12 is teh mendan hall"

:rolleyes:

:coffee:...keep it up I tell you, I see that maybe we need to start age restrictions on the boards!

BroncoKazuki
02-04-2008, 01:37 AM
So you can see into the future now?

"oh noo teh onlyee playa worf #12 is teh mendan hall"

:rolleyes:

I would take Ellis or Dorsey over Phillips/Conor any day.

But unless Ellis or Dorsey really stink it up I dont see them falling out of the top 10 let alone the top 5.

guess you wont get it either then....:coffee:

Momentum
02-04-2008, 05:00 AM
I would take Ellis or Dorsey over Phillips/Conor any day.

But unless Ellis or Dorsey really stink it up I dont see them falling out of the top 10 let alone the top 5.

guess you wont get it either then....:coffee:

Just say no.

BroncoKazuki
02-04-2008, 03:05 PM
Just say no.

if your gonna come up with an arguement or are you gonna keep spamming?


so far you've given me no reason on why we shouldnt take Mendenhall Im close to hitting that button again and putting spam.


so for the sake of arguement and intellectual thought please give some substance to your arguements.

Max Power
02-04-2008, 03:10 PM
if your gonna come up with an arguement or are you gonna keep spamming?


so far you've given me no reason on why we shouldnt take Mendenhall Im close to hitting that button again and putting spam.


so for the sake of arguement and intellectual thought please give some substance to your arguements.

The reason why we shouldn't take Mendenhall is because there will be better value at #12 that actually address defense. I prefer Stewart to Mendenhall if we were to go RB, but I don't think it's in their best interest to do so.

BroncoKazuki
02-04-2008, 03:16 PM
The reason why we shouldn't take Mendenhall is because there will be better value at #12 that actually address defense. I prefer Stewart to Mendenhall if we were to go RB, but I don't think it's in their best interest to do so.

see Max thats why I like you :thumb: your actually giving me an arguement to go against.

I'll just cp you for that.

but momentum hasnt given me anything at all and just keeps repeating himself.


But right now with everything at it is, i'd wait for pro and combine to finally ascertain the worth of the 12th.

If Mendenhall hovers at the 14-15th spot the trade with DET would be a no-brainer as we kill 2 birds with one stone literally.

Im not all against Stewart either but i also think we have a pounder in Henry. Stewart would just be a more talented, even healthier version of Henry. Witch isn't bad either. If we cant get either of them then we have to target Jones.

If we cant get all three then were better off waiting to the 4th to get a sleeper RB (not fodder like Heart whos even more worse injury wise then Henry)

kratos_godofwar
02-04-2008, 04:05 PM
You better get rid of your signature before I punch a hole in my wall :D

Rashard Mendenhall - RB - Illinois - Drafted by Broncos 1st round

Defense may have won the Superbowl for the Giants, but what side of the ball won it for the Broncos?

LOL, yeah me too. That sig boils my blood. :mad:

The only defensive players worth taking, won't even be there come the 12th pick. Ellis, Long, and Dorsey will all be long gone. A trade up is out of the question because that's just too much to give up for one player.

Not drafting the next Terrel Davis would be stupid, Mendenhall is already in Orange and Blue. Why not make it for the rest of his career. Henry will not give us a great running game next year, neither will Selvin. They are very injury prone and don't have what it takes to make this offense special. Henry may not even be with the team next season.

Tour
02-04-2008, 07:02 PM
Just say no.

You don't like mendenhall at 12? or you don't like Mendenhall at all?

I think our primary goal in the draft should be trade down, if Clady its gone. I think most of the players ranked between the 10 and 15 picks are overrated.

If we trade down, I think we all agree, Balmer would worth the pick also, the LT from Vanderbilt, and if they don't we steel would have a (I don't know) average 3th round S to develop. I think.

BTW, when you rush the passer extremely well like the giants did last night, you're death. When you got a 3 man rush, working like a nickel blitz, and 8 man dropping back in coverage, its like you were facing a 16 men defense, 8 man blitzing 8 man in coverage. Pass rush does wins championships, but don't take my word, ask Bill Bellichik.

And just to finish, go to nfl dot com, there, you can sort teams by sacks and if you didn't knew it you'll receive a surprise.