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View Full Version : [Nuggets] 4 seconds left, down 1.. who should take the shot?



12and4
03-05-2012, 01:23 AM
Simple question. On a normal night, everybody healthy... who should take the shot?

Also, if you say andre miller.... i will litrully rip your tongue outta your mouf. litrully.

Broncoholic3233
03-05-2012, 01:25 AM
Well that's tough. As Karl has said multiple times, we don't have that one guy. We rely on whoever is on, to step up that night.


But for the sake of the question....

Gallo, AAA, Ty - in that order

12and4
03-05-2012, 01:26 AM
IMO it would be:

Gallo > Afflalo > Harrington > Lawson > Brewer > Rudy > the rest.

Lawson woulda been higher up but he's too prone to blocked shots.

DenverBlood
03-05-2012, 07:37 AM
Simple question. On a normal night, everybody healthy... who should take the shot?

Also, if you say andre miller.... i will litrully rip your tongue outta your mouf. litrully.

Well in that case maybe I should switch my vote from Gallo to test the theory.

:sad:

Axemaster
03-05-2012, 07:50 AM
Simple question. On a normal night, everybody healthy... who should take the shot?

Also, if you say andre miller.... i will litrully rip your tongue outta your mouf. litrully.

I think last night proved Ty is the man on this team!

We have said it before but it needs asked again. WHY is Miller even on this team? He almost cost them the game, AGAIN, last night!

:goz:

Eddiemac730
03-05-2012, 11:36 AM
Anybody but Andre Miller... (SMH) I'd say Gallo, when he's healthy of course...

underrated29
03-05-2012, 11:38 AM
Prater.

jhgljhlk

Bronco51
03-05-2012, 12:05 PM
Miller......because nobody in their right mind would bother covering him, so he should have a wide open look.

InElwayWeTrust
03-05-2012, 12:07 PM
Lawson or Gallo, but if I had to choose I'd go with Ty.

Hoserman117
03-05-2012, 12:34 PM
I'd probably say Gallo.

12and4
03-05-2012, 03:46 PM
btw, lawson was named WC Player of the week

nic.zeman24
03-05-2012, 04:19 PM
Miller......because nobody in their right mind would bother covering him, so he should have a wide open look.

Then he would miss it...

Amari24
03-05-2012, 05:44 PM
For the Nuggets, I don't think it matters. If you don't have that clutch go-to-guy it should always be the guy with the high percentage shot.

So if Gallo is open for the 13-footer he takes it. If Faried has the lane to the basket he takes it. You wouldn't want Afflalo taking it and shooting a fade away over two defenders. You won't win games like that unless you have Kobe or Melo on your team.

JakeNbake
03-05-2012, 06:10 PM
I picked Miller because he had the most options.

vLordChronicv
03-05-2012, 06:20 PM
JR Smith ;)

Broncoholic3233
03-05-2012, 06:23 PM
JR Smith ;)

This is a Nuggets thread. Not your Knicks.

Sorry.

vLordChronicv
03-05-2012, 06:24 PM
lol im not a Knick fan but ok.


Faried or Nene takes the shot then. because everyone else is terrible. :)

Broncoholic3233
03-05-2012, 06:26 PM
lol im not a Knick fan but ok.


Faried or Nene takes the shot then. because everyone else is terrible. :)

Yeah. Trolling is fun.

vLordChronicv
03-05-2012, 06:27 PM
relax man. it was a joke.

Broncoholic3233
03-05-2012, 07:02 PM
I will say though, once Chandler signs....depending on how he looks, I might say him.


He has one of the smoothest shots out there.

nic.zeman24
03-05-2012, 10:03 PM
AAA or Lawson

Broncoholic3233
03-05-2012, 10:05 PM
AAA has ice in his veins.


He's proved it multiple times this year.


I'm going to say AAA right now. It's a close one. I wouldn't mind any of these 3 taking it: AAA, Gallo, Lawson.


Both AAA and Lawson have proved recently they can be that guy at the end though.

The Experience
03-05-2012, 10:07 PM
Both Lawson and AAA I am 100% comfortable taking the shot.

12and4
03-05-2012, 10:20 PM
its so funny... you'd think i knew it was gonna come down to this.


AAA and lawson are my top 2.

Project KSL
03-05-2012, 10:48 PM
I cant believe people are saying Afflalo with how he's been playing.

I'd say Lawson.

12and4
03-05-2012, 10:49 PM
I cant believe people are saying Afflalo with how he's been playing.

I'd say Lawson.

32 points... 8 points in a row to end both halves... both.

what are you talking about?

Hoserman117
03-05-2012, 10:59 PM
I cant believe people are saying Afflalo with how he's been playing.

I'd say Lawson.

Did you not see the game today?

12and4
03-05-2012, 11:02 PM
Did you not see the game today?

http://s3-ak.buzzfed.com/static/imagebuzz/web04/2011/9/6/11/oh-he-mad-27763-1315322164-29.jpg

Project KSL
03-05-2012, 11:26 PM
32 points... 8 points in a row to end both halves... both.

what are you talking about?

Yea I did.

I've also seen him this whole year.

12 ppg 1 apg 2 rpg

Doesn't scream $43 million dollars.

Or how bout his entire career?

8 ppg 1 apg 2 rpg


Pretty pretty pretty below average.

The Experience
03-05-2012, 11:27 PM
I cant believe people are saying Afflalo with how he's been playing.

I'd say Lawson.

Really?

You don't know much about basketball then....


AAA has been fantastic the last few weeks. He won us the game tonight.

Project KSL
03-05-2012, 11:29 PM
Really?

You don't know much about basketball then....


AAA has been fantastic the last few weeks. He won us the game tonight.

2 weeks doesn't negate an entire season and career of being below average.

Project KSL
03-05-2012, 11:29 PM
Really?

You don't know much about basketball then....


AAA has been fantastic the last few weeks. He won us the game tonight.


But I mean hey, If you think a guy that averages 8 ppg on his career is some superstar or something. More power to you.

The Experience
03-05-2012, 11:46 PM
2 weeks doesn't negate an entire season and career of being below average.

You obviously don't watch Afflalo then. He does so many things, some of them don't show up on the stat sheet. He is the most underrated SG in basketball and I guarantee that every NBA coach would love to have him on their roster.

Stats aren't everything KSL, you actually have to watch the games :thumb:

Project KSL
03-05-2012, 11:49 PM
You obviously don't watch Afflalo then. He does so many things, some of them don't show up on the stat sheet. He is the most underrated SG in basketball and I guarantee that every NBA coach would love to have him on their roster.

Stats aren't everything KSL, you actually have to watch the games :thumb:

The argument is "who do you want to be the closer of the nuggets?"

I'm sorry. But I don't want a 8 ppg career shooter taking the last shot.

johnlimburg
03-05-2012, 11:50 PM
Why with the snarky comments to fight. Are you a Nuggets fan because it was a great game and great finish and no need to fight about it.

I was pretty tough on AAA early on and yes I think rightfully so. His defense wasn't there and his scoring wasn't there. However all players have slumps. All of them. Even the greats. And no I am not saying he is a great. However he got back on track and as someone who said from the day he signed the extension that I think he is over payed, right now he is earning his paycheck and then some. Especially in recent weeks.

On his career stats. It is very unfair to say that he is averaging 8 so he is bad or below average. Well in two seasons he played in 149 games where he averaged less then 20 minutes per game. The stats really weigh down what he has done since he has done in Denver. Especially in the past two seasons where he has played over 30 minutes per game and averaged 12 plus points. And that is not being one of the top options on offense.

However the last say 3 weeks he has needed to become one of the first options on offense and his numbers represent this and he is back to his old self and is better than he ever was right now.

Going back to the game after the back to back to back where he has really started to come on he is averaging 18.1 points per game. Yes this is a nitpicked stat but just showing he has been playing really well as of late and is bouncing back from his poor early season play.

Go Nuggets

The Experience
03-06-2012, 12:14 AM
The argument is "who do you want to be the closer of the nuggets?"

I'm sorry. But I don't want a 8 ppg career shooter taking the last shot.

Once again, you just look at stats KSL. If you had ever watched Afflalo you would know that he has made clutch play after clutch play since he arrived in Denver.

Since when does ppg have anything to do with if a guy is clutch or not?

Derek Fisher - 8.7ppg career average.

Would you not trust him with a clutch shot because he averages 8 points a game?

Fact: Fisher has made some of the biggest shots in Lakers history.

Project KSL
03-06-2012, 01:44 AM
Once again, you just look at stats KSL. If you had ever watched Afflalo you would know that he has made clutch play after clutch play since he arrived in Denver.

Since when does ppg have anything to do with if a guy is clutch or not?

Derek Fisher - 8.7ppg career average.

Would you not trust him with a clutch shot because he averages 8 points a game?

Fact: Fisher has made some of the biggest shots in Lakers history.

That's just so overblown.

He made the shot against the Mavs. Why do people seem to act like that's a common occurrence with him?

Do you have an actual number of game winners he's made? I'd really like to see.

Broncoholic3233
03-06-2012, 02:19 AM
That's just so overblown.

He made the shot against the Mavs. Why do people seem to act like that's a common occurrence with him?

Do you have an actual number of game winners he's made? I'd really like to see.

You are really not worth arguing with, but oh well....


He's clutch. Clutch does NOT mean he has had to hit a game winning shots.


He's had plenty of clutch moments in his career. He's had plenty of GREAT clutch defensive moments. If you'd actually watch, you'd have seen those. Sure, they aren't game winners, but by stopping CP3 lets say on the last play of the game, it's pretty much like he saved the game. Or shutting down top notch players in a huge game. That's clutch.


He's hit A TON of 3's when we really needed one. They've either pulled us a head and given us huge momentum, or started a huge run by getting us momentum. He's known for hitting 3's when we really need them.


He's not afraid to take that shot. He could be shooting poorly but if he is open, and we need a bucket, he's going to take the shot, not give it up (plenty do, they don't want that pressure on them).


He just did one of the toughest things in sport. Down by 3, having to hit 3 straight FT's to send it to OT. Sure, FT's should be pretty automatic for pros, but with that much pressure on you, it's tough to do. CP3 had the same opportunity tonight....he failed.



Those are all examples of why AAA is clutch. I'll say it again, clutch can be shown in many other forms than just game winning shots. I really don't know how many he's hit, and I frankly don't care. He's proved he is clutch, and that's why I trust him to take the last shot of the game.

Project KSL
03-06-2012, 02:32 AM
You are really not worth arguing with, but oh well....


He's clutch. Clutch does NOT mean he has had to hit a game winning shots.


He's had plenty of clutch moments in his career. He's had plenty of GREAT clutch defensive moments. If you'd actually watch, you'd have seen those. Sure, they aren't game winners, but by stopping CP3 lets say on the last play of the game, it's pretty much like he saved the game. Or shutting down top notch players in a huge game. That's clutch.


He's hit A TON of 3's when we really needed one. They've either pulled us a head and given us huge momentum, or started a huge run by getting us momentum. He's known for hitting 3's when we really need them.


He's not afraid to take that shot. He could be shooting poorly but if he is open, and we need a bucket, he's going to take the shot, not give it up (plenty do, they don't want that pressure on them).


He just did one of the toughest things in sport. Down by 3, having to hit 3 straight FT's to send it to OT. Sure, FT's should be pretty automatic for pros, but with that much pressure on you, it's tough to do. CP3 had the same opportunity tonight....he failed.



Those are all examples of why AAA is clutch. I'll say it again, clutch can be shown in many other forms than just game winning shots. I really don't know how many he's hit, and I frankly don't care. He's proved he is clutch, and that's why I trust him to take the last shot of the game.

So your answer is "No, I don't actual know how many game winners he has hit."?

That's all you had to say.

Broncoholic3233
03-06-2012, 02:36 AM
So your answer is "No, I don't actual know how many game winners he has hit."?

That's all you had to say.

No.

That is not 'all I had to say'. I was saying my piece, not SOLELY addressing your question.


What's wrong KSL? Why do you just love to hate on everything? Do you enjoy happiness at all? Or do you love just trying to rip on others and bring them down? I mean, your sole purpose in all our Denver threads is to troll, why even bother coming in then? You just make people mad.

12and4
03-06-2012, 02:45 AM
Dont even acknowledge his presence... he's just here to flame and troll.

Act like he doesn't exist.... thats what ima do from now on. Ignore listed

Project KSL
03-06-2012, 03:13 AM
No.

That is not 'all I had to say'. I was saying my piece, not SOLELY addressing your question.


What's wrong KSL? Why do you just love to hate on everything? Do you enjoy happiness at all? Or do you love just trying to rip on others and bring them down? I mean, your sole purpose in all our Denver threads is to troll, why even bother coming in then? You just make people mad.

I would like to express my deepest sorrow in regards to how my opinion makes you feel.

All I said was "I don't understand how people can say Afflalo."

Then you all flamed it into this.

I've been nothing but nice and respectful in this thread. You guys on the other hand want to continually look for an argument because i had a comment reflecting my opinion on Afflalo backed up by factual statistics.

If my opinion upsets you to the point of getting angry, I encourage you to add me to your ignore list. I'm not forcing you to read or respond to my
Opinion.

Thanks.

12and4
03-06-2012, 03:21 AM
So 3233, speaking of afflalo.... how tall is the shorts man in the world?

and how short is the tallest man in the world?


In seriousness though...

AAA's averaging 18.5 points over his past 13 games... he's worth the money.

The Experience
03-06-2012, 09:57 AM
I would like to express my deepest sorrow in regards to how my opinion makes you feel.

All I said was "I don't understand how people can say Afflalo."

Then you all flamed it into this.

I've been nothing but nice and respectful in this thread. You guys on the other hand want to continually look for an argument because i had a comment reflecting my opinion on Afflalo backed up by factual statistics.

If my opinion upsets you to the point of getting angry, I encourage you to add me to your ignore list. I'm not forcing you to read or respond to my
Opinion.

Thanks.

Here is the thing though. Afflalo is averaging 19ppg the last few weeks. He has been tremendous because he is now in GAME SHAPE.

Also the stats you provided proved absolutely nothing.

We didn't flame you on it because we have beef with you, we flamed you because your opinion was ignorant and wrong.

Broncoholic3233
03-06-2012, 10:13 AM
I would like to express my deepest sorrow in regards to how my opinion makes you feel.

All I said was "I don't understand how people can say Afflalo."

Then you all flamed it into this.

I've been nothing but nice and respectful in this thread. You guys on the other hand want to continually look for an argument because i had a comment reflecting my opinion on Afflalo backed up by factual statistics.

If my opinion upsets you to the point of getting angry, I encourage you to add me to your ignore list. I'm not forcing you to read or respond to my
Opinion.

Thanks.

Oh. Don't flatter yourself, you've seen me upset with things you've said, I'm not mad at all.


You upset others before I even joined in. I know your opinion on AAA, you love to hate him. Nothing I can do about that. I gave my piece and asked why you liked to troll and upset Denver fans in our section.


Nothing more, nothing less. I have 0 on my ignore list, and don't plan on putting you there...for now.

Hoserman117
03-06-2012, 11:15 AM
I don't have the official number for his entire career, but Derek Fisher made 8 game winning shots from 03-09, which was good for 10th in the NBA :D

Definition of game winning shot


24 seconds or less left in the game, team with the ball is either tied or down by 1 to 2 points.

Oh... guess who lead the NBA in game winning shots through that time?

MY MAN LEBRON JAMES

Link (http://82games.com/gamewinningshots.htm)

Broncoholic3233
03-06-2012, 11:16 AM
I don't have the official number for his entire career, but Derek Fisher made 8 game winning shots from 03-09, which was good for 10th in the NBA :D

Definition of game winning shot



Oh... guess who lead the NBA in game winning shots through that time?

MY MAN LEBRON JAMES

Link (http://82games.com/gamewinningshots.htm)


You may excuse yourself. :coffee:

Hoserman117
03-06-2012, 11:19 AM
You may excuse yourself. :coffee:

:dance: :dance: :dance:

Don't hate. Stats say LeBron made 17 game winning shots from 03-09. All this blah blah blah he isn't clutch stuff is garbage, but that's for another discussion.

Anyways, career stats have nothing to do with how good a player is right now. Why does what Afflalo did in Detroit several years ago have anything to do with his ability to make a game winning shot right now?

Broncoholic3233
03-06-2012, 11:21 AM
:dance: :dance: :dance:

Don't hate. Stats say LeBron made 17 game winning shots from 03-09.

Anyways, career stats have nothing to do with how good a player is right now. Why does what Afflalo did in Detroit several years ago have anything to do with his ability to make a game winning shot right now?

To LBJ and you :cheeky:

On to the AAA bit...Exactly. I've made that argument to KSL in a thread before and he just twists it. He will only use that if it helps his argument.

AAA had 0 chances in Detroit. He was there for a while, it greatly skews his career stats. Last year was the first year he really was given a big chance and started.

The Experience
03-06-2012, 11:38 AM
:dance: :dance: :dance:

Don't hate. Stats say LeBron made 17 game winning shots from 03-09. All this blah blah blah he isn't clutch stuff is garbage, but that's for another discussion.

Anyways, career stats have nothing to do with how good a player is right now. Why does what Afflalo did in Detroit several years ago have anything to do with his ability to make a game winning shot right now?

LeBron isn't clutch. I'm sorry, but watching him with Miami, He passes up a game winner to pass to...... UDONIS HASLEM?????

LeBron does not have the killer instinct.

Kobe >>>>>>>>> Lebron and it will always be that way.


But this is not a LeBron thread so if we want to debate this lets take it elsewhere

Hoserman117
03-06-2012, 12:57 PM
LeBron isn't clutch. I'm sorry, but watching him with Miami, He passes up a game winner to pass to...... UDONIS HASLEM?????

LeBron does not have the killer instinct.

Kobe >>>>>>>>> Lebron and it will always be that way.


But this is not a LeBron thread so if we want to debate this lets take it elsewhere

It's better to make the right basketball play than jack up a shot when you're doubled just because you need to 'have a killer instinct'. I'm sure you'd rather have Afflalo pass out of a double to an open man with the game on the line than force a shot in order to keep up some sort of reputation as a closer.

Asking who should take a final shot and who should have the ball in the closing seconds are two different things. For example on the Nuggets I'd probably prefer Afflalo to take the final shot, but if I want the ball in someones hands with 10 seconds left I'd probably prefer to give it to Lawson because he can create his own shot and pass better than Afflalo. Clutch doesn't always have to be measured by your ability to bury a shot to win the game, it's a measure of your ability to make a winning play under pressure.

If you just look at percentages from that link, from 03-09, take three players. Melo is 13/27 (48%) with 1 game winning assist and 4 TO's, LeBron is 17/50 (34%) with 6 game winning assists and 4 TO's, and Kobe is 14/56 (25%) with 1 game winning assist and 5 turnovers.

You want to go with percentages, Melo dominates it. It's not about the number of times you make the shot (LeBron), the willingness to take the shot (Kobe), but who more often than not makes a game winning play. The Nuggets don't have a 'Melo' player on the team right now, so I think the question should be more phrased along the lines of 'who should have the ball on the final possession to get one of these guys the ball'.

The Experience
03-06-2012, 02:23 PM
It's better to make the right basketball play than jack up a shot when you're doubled just because you need to 'have a killer instinct'. I'm sure you'd rather have Afflalo pass out of a double to an open man with the game on the line than force a shot in order to keep up some sort of reputation as a closer.

Asking who should take a final shot and who should have the ball in the closing seconds are two different things. For example on the Nuggets I'd probably prefer Afflalo to take the final shot, but if I want the ball in someones hands with 10 seconds left I'd probably prefer to give it to Lawson because he can create his own shot and pass better than Afflalo. Clutch doesn't always have to be measured by your ability to bury a shot to win the game, it's a measure of your ability to make a winning play under pressure.

If you just look at percentages from that link, from 03-09, take three players. Melo is 13/27 (48%) with 1 game winning assist and 4 TO's, LeBron is 17/50 (34%) with 6 game winning assists and 4 TO's, and Kobe is 14/56 (25%) with 1 game winning assist and 5 turnovers.

You want to go with percentages, Melo dominates it. It's not about the number of times you make the shot (LeBron), the willingness to take the shot (Kobe), but who more often than not makes a game winning play. The Nuggets don't have a 'Melo' player on the team right now, so I think the question should be more phrased along the lines of 'who should have the ball on the final possession to get one of these guys the ball'.


LeBron has displayed time and time again that he doesn't want the ball at the end of games.... Game winning play? To Udonis Haslem? Haslem is a good player, but he shouldn't be taking the last shot. If he passed to Wade or Bosh then I could understand.

I know you love LeBron but he is NOT clutch, all you have to do is watch him blow FTs at the end of games and pass up the final shot.

Not to mention the greatest disappearing act in NBA history last year in the finals cost his team a championship.

As for the Nuggets, I agree, no body has proved they can consistently be that guy. I think AAA, Gallo and Lawson could grow into that though.

Cyrend
03-06-2012, 05:32 PM
Back to the topic, I personally want the order to be

Ty > AAA > Gallo

Ty proved this last night and the night before. His ability to drive to the basket and a sick pull up jumper is perfect for an isolation, last shot of the game type of play. Make defenders respect your speed and back off, it gives you space for the jumper. Don't respect it, blow right past them.

If you are looking at a contested jumper tho, I'd probably go with Afflalo.

Axemaster
03-06-2012, 06:20 PM
Really?

You don't know much about basketball then....


AAA has been fantastic the last few weeks. He won us the game tonight.

I would say Ty Lawson won the game. I would also and still would say Lawson every night takes the last shot. Has everyone seen the last two games, or was I watching somone else?

Also why is Miller even TAKING shots??? Period. All he can do is dish assists. He should be point gaurd ONLY when he is in there!~

Broncoholic3233
03-06-2012, 06:36 PM
I would say Ty Lawson won the game. I would also and still would say Lawson every night takes the last shot. Has everyone seen the last two games, or was I watching somone else?

Also why is Miller even TAKING shots??? Period. All he can do is dish assists. He should be point gaurd ONLY when he is in there!~

I don't know about that.

Ty hit the game winner and had a double double....but AAA had 32 points, compared to Lawson's 16.

AAA scored 8 straight to end the 2nd quarter and tie it. He scored 8 straight to end the 4th quarter to tie it. Not to mention hitting a 3 with 8 seconds left....and 3 free throws with .6 left.

AAA was the player of the game and won us that game.

vLordChronicv
03-06-2012, 06:41 PM
as long as i get tacos, i dont care who takes the shot :)

Papa-pwn
03-07-2012, 12:32 AM
Gallo or Lawson. With Gallo's injury I'd lean towards Lawson unless Gallo had some momentum working for him in said game.

Axemaster
03-07-2012, 05:07 PM
as long as i get tacos, i dont care who takes the shot :)

You had TACOS???:thumb: