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View Full Version : Trent Richardson traded to the colts



MarkB
09-18-2013, 03:31 PM
Adam Schefter ‏@AdamSchefter (https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/380455668064337920)
Filed to ESPN: Browns RB Trent Richardson traded to Indy for Colts' first-round pick.

WhoDeyBengals
09-18-2013, 03:40 PM
Holy crap. Cleveland is totally tanking for Bridgewater.

Freyaka
09-18-2013, 03:44 PM
Holy crap. Cleveland is totally tanking for Bridgewater.

Poor Charlie...I mean seriously this franchise is the STUPIDEST franchise of all time. They waste draft picks more than any team I've ever seen...

assassin216
09-18-2013, 03:45 PM
reports are saying they're trying to get McGahee....it makes no sense at all...

FlagOnThePlay
09-18-2013, 03:46 PM
Stunning move by Indy.
Franchise QB and Rb in place.
Can't understand Cleveland's thinking on this one.
They draft a guy that turns out to be good, so they trade him ?!?

one5beast
09-18-2013, 03:47 PM
WOW. That's a surprise.

Browns are now competing with Jaguars for Teddy.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 03:47 PM
Like I said, Lombardi destroyed the team in the 90's getting rid of Kosar. nobody listens and everything I say comes to pass.

nickmeyer
09-18-2013, 03:50 PM
wow they are dumb.....

nickmeyer
09-18-2013, 03:51 PM
So what Qb do they target in the draft? If it is Teddy Bridgewater I will laugh if he stays for 1 more year....

Broncos-R-Great
09-18-2013, 03:57 PM
reports are saying they're trying to get McGahee....it makes no sense at all...

Oh that makes sense, get rid of a talented 23 year old RB and pickup a 31 year old RB who is coming off a serious injury.

Elway trade for Joe Thomas! We know you can do it!!

Amari24
09-18-2013, 03:57 PM
So what Qb do they target in the draft?

I think they'll get Marqise Lee with their top 3 pick and Johnny Manziel with Indy's mid-first round pick.

These guys are probably going to win three games at most this season.

one5beast
09-18-2013, 03:57 PM
tbh this could be a good move for Cleveland in the future. I'm assuming they use one of the 1st round picks on a QB. Most likely Bridgewater. I'd rather have a Franchise QB for the next 10+ years, than have a good RB stuck on a bad team for the next few years.

But this trade shows that theyre basically throwing in the towel and already getting ready for next season.

Broncos-R-Great
09-18-2013, 03:59 PM
tbh this could be a good move for Cleveland in the future. I'm assuming they use one of the 1st round picks on a QB. Most likely Bridgewater. I'd rather have a Franchise QB for the next 10+ years, than have a good RB stuck on a bad team for the next few years.

But... they were already going to have a high first round pick to draft a QB, and if there's one thing that can help a young QB its a stud RB.

broncoslover115
09-18-2013, 04:00 PM
Joe Thomas would be AWESOME!!!!

bahn
09-18-2013, 04:01 PM
why didnt cleveland wait till the end of the season to trade him?

Freyaka
09-18-2013, 04:03 PM
I think I just read the best comment in years because of this though.

"Wow. Weeden is so bad that another team actually picked off one of their players"

InsaneBlaze23
09-18-2013, 04:03 PM
Like I said, Lombardi destroyed the team in the 90's getting rid of Kosar. nobody listens and everything I say comes to pass.

It's fine Charlie, I believed your warnings...though it should always be expected for the Browns to be a train wreck. I mean seriously get rid of a player with the potential to be a top 5 back for a draft you'll waste on someone who'll be on another team his 3rd season.

Because lets be honest the Browns don't understand stand building a team. Their front office has the mindset that they can win right out the gate.

Seriously I've never seen a team waste draft picks the way the Browns do. Weeden was a 1st round pick, now that's a waste if they do draft a QB.

Seriously Matt Millen is laughing his ass off right now. "People made fun of me for drafting WR's for the Lions every year...look at the Browns."

Denver Mike
09-18-2013, 04:03 PM
I wish we coulda done the same trade.. haha

one5beast
09-18-2013, 04:07 PM
guess he didnt get along well with staff?

‏@RavensInsider 6m
Trent Richardson didn't mesh well with Rob Chudzinski, lobbied for carries, had bit of a diva attitude, per a source close to situation

@JeffDarlington 12m
A Browns starter tells me: "It makes sense. Trent has some things he needs to figure out before he becomes a dominant player in the league."

The Experience
09-18-2013, 04:12 PM
guess he didnt get along well with staff?

‏@RavensInsider 6m
Trent Richardson didn't mesh well with Rob Chudzinski, lobbied for carries, had bit of a diva attitude, per a source close to situation

@JeffDarlington 12m
A Browns starter tells me: "It makes sense. Trent has some things he needs to figure out before he becomes a dominant player in the league."

Well if thats the case, you have to get rid of him. When your a new regime trying to build a young team you can't have guys getting in the way who don't wanna be there.

Broncos-R-Great
09-18-2013, 04:16 PM
guess he didnt get along well with staff?

‏@RavensInsider 6m
Trent Richardson didn't mesh well with Rob Chudzinski, lobbied for carries, had bit of a diva attitude, per a source close to situation

@JeffDarlington 12m
A Browns starter tells me: "It makes sense. Trent has some things he needs to figure out before he becomes a dominant player in the league."

Well, when you have a QB who completes only around 50% of his passes, and has more INT than TD, any half way smart coach would be running the ball more.

So... basically they traded the guy for speaking the truth.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 04:16 PM
Well if thats the case, you have to get rid of him. When your a new regime trying to build a young team you can't have guys getting in the way who don't wanna be there.

When a new regime comes in and says they will run the ball 20-30 times a gameand he main RB will have 300+ carries on the year and he has 20 after two games, you start to question what they are saying. Fans where openly questioning Turner and Chudzinski. End of the year they all need their walking papers. Lombardi, Chudzinski, and Turner!

one5beast
09-18-2013, 04:18 PM
But... they were already going to have a high first round pick to draft a QB, and if there's one thing that can help a young QB its a stud RB.

true. but i think theyre just trying to get the most of what they can get for Richardson while value is high. trying to stack up picks.

or maybe theyre thinking that with Richardson it could put them out of reach for a good QB? :laugh:

BroncoFanBoy
09-18-2013, 04:21 PM
What on earth are the Browns doing??? Terrible move. He's their entire offense.

Freyaka
09-18-2013, 04:23 PM
Congrats to anyone who had week 3 in the "when will the browns give up on the season pool"

Al Wilson 4 Mayor
09-18-2013, 04:23 PM
Fire sale after game 2?

:confused:

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 04:23 PM
It is not the QB that is the problem it is the fact that they expect Filet Mignon when all they give him is Lard!

one5beast
09-18-2013, 04:42 PM
MAURICE CLARETT!! HAHAHA :laugh: :laugh:


@ReeseClarett13
@Browns can I get a workout? I still have plenty of mileage on these legs..!!!!!!

@ReeseClarett13
@Browns I had behavior problems that I cleaned up. Never had playing problems.

please make this happen

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 04:50 PM
MAURICE CLARETT!! HAHAHA :laugh: :laugh:




please make this happen

Might as well. They are a joke anyway. Jacksonville is letting out a sigh of relief now. They aren't the butt of everyone's jokes anymore!! Plus they still have a running back!!

HUMCALC
09-18-2013, 04:53 PM
Just when they're getting, arguably their best WR back. Strange. Why didn't they trade Weeden, too?

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 04:57 PM
Just when they're getting, arguably their best WR back. Strange. Why didn't they trade Weeden, too?

Everyone blames him when he has nobody to throw to!! A QB cannot throw and catch and block at the same time!!

58_VONDOOM_92
09-18-2013, 04:57 PM
Just when they're getting, arguably their best WR back. Strange. Why didn't they trade Weeden, too?

Wouldn't surprise me if they end up trading Weeden plus some other pieces before the season is over

one5beast
09-18-2013, 05:04 PM
Just when they're getting, arguably their best WR back. Strange. Why didn't they trade Weeden, too?

who would trade for him?

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 05:22 PM
who would trade for him?

Anyone needing a QB. Weeden is decent if he has WR around him. He has no WR in Cleveland and the team isn't interested in improving the position.

Rancid
09-18-2013, 06:01 PM
who would trade for him?

He would be an upgrade backup over Orton in Dallas.

Freyaka
09-18-2013, 06:02 PM
who would trade for him?

Jaguars????

BroncoooJohnson
09-18-2013, 06:03 PM
He would be an upgrade backup over Orton in Dallas.

I think Orton is one of the best backups in the NFL. A team like Minnesota or Jacksonville could use him, too.

HUMCALC
09-18-2013, 06:12 PM
Anyone needing a QB. Weeden is decent if he has WR around him. He has no WR in Cleveland and the team isn't interested in improving the position.

I agree, but Little, Gordon, and Cameron are talented + T-Rich (When he was there)

berlownacyo7s
09-18-2013, 06:42 PM
This is probably one of the worst trades I have ever seen. I'm SHOCKED. I bet Charlie is ticked!!! Trent Richardson for only a 1st round pick?!? Wow, I'm just stunned. Stinks to be a Browns fan I guess.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 06:45 PM
I agree, but Little, Gordon, and Cameron are talented + T-Rich (When he was there)

Little drops everything and is being demoted. His days on the team are done after this season. Gordon is nothing but trouble off the field. That is why he was suspended. He is one drug test away from a year long suspension.

BroncoFanBoy
09-18-2013, 06:48 PM
Anyone needing a QB. Weeden is decent if he has WR around him. He has no WR in Cleveland and the team isn't interested in improving the position.

Never thought I'd hear you say that. I thought you hated Weeden?

InsaneBlaze23
09-18-2013, 06:52 PM
I think Orton is one of the best backups in the NFL. A team like Minnesota or Jacksonville could use him, too.

Vikes? Sure Jags? No.
He wouldn't be an upgrade of Henne to be honest, whom in my opinion is better than Orton.

InsaneBlaze23
09-18-2013, 06:54 PM
Never thought I'd hear you say that. I thought you hated Weeden?

I think he just hates the pick not the player. I mean wouldn't you be made if Denver drafted a 29yr old QB with the 22nd pick instead of using that pick to fix obvious holes?

Again Detroit Lions reference. That's like when Millen drafted Charles Rodgers win clearly Detroit could've used that pick on something les.

BroncoFanBoy
09-18-2013, 06:55 PM
I now know who I'm picking in Survivor this week. No way the Browns beat Minnesota.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 07:11 PM
Never thought I'd hear you say that. I thought you hated Weeden?

McCoy wasn't the problem. The surrounding cast was. No WR no RB. The team picks Richardson giving McCoy a RB. Team just needed WR help. They selected Weeden instead. WR is still a problem. So, they trade away Richardson and now everyone wants Weeden out of there. The team has had 19 starting QB's since 99' next year will be #20 or #21 (if Campbell starts any games). Enough is enough address the WR issue. Leave the QB position alone.

theMileHighGuy
09-18-2013, 07:11 PM
If he was truly a headache in the Browns' locker room then the trade makes sense. BUT it's not like those coaches are going to be around for very long anyway.

Peerless
09-18-2013, 07:40 PM
:laugh: Browns....


So sorry Charlie...

RocketArm006
09-18-2013, 07:49 PM
It's kind of hard giving to Brown's FO the benefit of the doubt. If you just trade guys for picks, then trade those picks to move up to get a guy, then trade that guy for picks so you can trade up and get a guy....

You get my point. Hard to develop players and build from the draft when you keep burning through picks.

I suppose there is an argument that none of their picks in the past decade have been no good, but turning over a young roster for another young roster is hard to build a team from.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 07:51 PM
:laugh: Browns....


So sorry Charlie...

Can't even say "maybe next year" anymore. They just got rid of the best offensive player for peanuts and a geriatric that nobody else wanted. The front office is morons. Lerner would NEVER have stood for this. Has lam? He just wants to make money. Haslam even makes money from the "one before I die" shirts!!

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 08:04 PM
I'd like to weigh in if i may. I live in Ohio and this is my take and kinda kinda what im hearing. The Browns front office & the coaches were for this move because Trent wasn't their type of back, coach Chud is looking for a back thats more explosive for this system. I think the organization knew that this year wasn't going anywhere anyway. This new regime is gonna build the team the way they want with the type of players they want. Mr Weeden won't be around next year I'm guessing. You all know how it is when a new regime takes over they want their players not the players that were drafted by the regime they replaced. The Browns have seven picks in the first four rounds now and two in the first round. I'm guessing they will be drafting a Quaterback and alot of offensive players cause their defense is pretty decent and don't need much. Getting a first round pick for a running back they didn't like i think they felt like they won. Maybe they will steal a back next year in the fifth or sixth that will turn out like TD or Morris. But rest assure these will not be the same ol Brownies cause the owner has money that he will spend it and he wants to win....

HUMCALC
09-18-2013, 08:23 PM
I'd like to weigh in if i may. I live in Ohio and this is my take and kinda kinda what im hearing. The Browns front office & the coaches were for this move because Trent wasn't their type of back, coach Chud is looking for a back thats more explosive for this system. I think the organization knew that this year wasn't going anywhere anyway. This new regime is gonna build the team the way they want with the type of players they want. Mr Weeden won't be around next year I'm guessing. You all know how it is when a new regime takes over they want their players not the players that were drafted by the regime they replaced. The Browns have seven picks in the first four rounds now and two in the first round. I'm guessing they will be drafting a Quaterback and alot of offensive players cause their defense is pretty decent and don't need much. Getting a first round pick for a running back they didn't like i think they felt like they won. Maybe they will steal a back next year in the fifth or sixth that will turn out like TD or Morris. But rest assure these will not be the same ol Brownies cause the owner has money that he will spend it and he wants to win....

You don't get rid of a top 5 RB in his early 20's, and gamble on a pick, who has a 70% chance of doing worse than the guy you got rid of

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 08:28 PM
You don't get rid of a top 5 RB in his early 20's, and gamble on a pick, who has a 70% chance of doing worse than the guy you got rid of

It's all about the QB now. Lombardi is putting it all out there on next year's draft class. He'd better find the next Peyton Manning or he is out of a job. But you and I and everyone else knows he won't find that. He'll end up with Manziel who will suck and then get banned for off-field behavior and be Todd Marinovich 2.0

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 08:32 PM
You don't get rid of a top 5 RB in his early 20's, and gamble on a pick, who has a 70% chance of doing worse than the guy you got rid of

Top 5 back in what? The Nfl? In the Afc North? Trent isn't a top 5 back he had a decent rookie season 950 yards or so. To be honest he is still a gamble he was taken in top five this is his second year he hasn't proven anything in the league. So until he pans out he is still a gamble.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 08:38 PM
Top 5 back in what? The Nfl? In the Afc North? Trent isn't a top 5 back he had a decent rookie season 950 yards or so. To be honest he is still a gamble he was taken in top five this is his second year he hasn't proven anything in the league. So until he pans out he is still a gamble.

I hope he runs for 1300 yards and 12 touchdowns and has 250 to 300 receiving yards with Indy just to spite Banner and Lombardi. Then Modell (Haslam) will realize what tools he hired.

HUMCALC
09-18-2013, 08:55 PM
Top 5 back in what? The Nfl? In the Afc North? Trent isn't a top 5 back he had a decent rookie season 950 yards or so. To be honest he is still a gamble he was taken in top five this is his second year he hasn't proven anything in the league. So until he pans out he is still a gamble.

You do realize that according to multiple pre-season reports, he was a top 5 fantasy RB

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 09:07 PM
I hope he runs for 1300 yards and 12 touchdowns and has 250 to 300 receiving yards with Indy just to spite Banner and Lombardi. Then Modell (Haslam) will realize what tools he hired.

Don't you think running backs come a dime a dozen? Terrell Davis was drafted in the 6th round. They may be tools but the tools before them that drafted a running back that high and also drafted a 30 year old unproven Quarterback. Haslam will get the team in the right direction. Look what Cincinnati did they get rid of Palmer lose Chad johnson lose Housh and all these players then turn around and draft Dalton & Aj green. Now look at what they are one of the best rosters in the league went to the playoffs two years straight and will probably win a playoff game this year. With the draft picks Cleveland have they can do something similar. The defense is right there work on the offense, draft a Qb, WR, work on the offensive line get a Rb. I mean were the Browns going anywhere this year.

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 09:20 PM
You do realize that according to multiple pre-season reports, he was a top 5 fantasy RB

Ok and Tom Brady was projected to get me more than 21 points in my fantasy league last week but that didn"t happen. Projections are just guessing, opinions. M Lynch, A Peterson, A Foster, L Mccoy, J Charles these are all better backs and there are more. I live in Ohio i watch the Browns every week because my father was a Browns fan before he passed away i root for the Browns to win to succeed just as long as their not play Denver, i never seen anything special from Trent nothing Barry Sanders like. I'd take Eddie Lacy over Trent. But thats just my opinion & i can understand why Browns fans are mad because the fact that they traded Trent pretty much shows this season is already over.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 09:20 PM
Don't you think running backs come a dime a dozen? Terrell Davis was drafted in the 6th round.

Ever notice that established teams with established coaches and GM's find those gems? Crappy teams don't have that luxury. Teams like Cleveland and Jacksonville have to find that kind of talent in early rounds. Ever notice that Mike Shanahan always makes late rounders into top RB's? He's in Washington.

Cleveland's ownership is against hiring proven coaches. They like first timers. Don't ask me why they do - they just do. If I was the Browns owner I would target Gruden or some other PROVEN coach. That way maybe your argument would hold water. But inexperienced crappy coaches and GM's? No, they won't find a "gem" like you claim.


They may be tools but the tools before them that drafted a running back that high and also drafted a 30 year old unproven Quarterback. Haslam will get the team in the right direction. Look what Cincinnati did they get rid of Palmer lose Chad johnson lose Housh and all these players then turn around and draft Dalton & Aj green. Now look at what they are one of the best rosters in the league went to the playoffs two years straight and will probably win a playoff game this year. With the draft picks Cleveland have they can do something similar. The defense is right there work on the offense, draft a Qb, WR, work on the offensive line get a Rb. I mean were the Browns going anywhere this year.

Haslam is good? Hell no. He is Modell incarnate. He is about making money. Naming rights to stadium. Buying a part of the "1 before I die" shirts. Having a TV show to encourage media participation. It is about selling a brand to him. No matter the cost. Pilot J was investigated for the same things. Cheating customers and giving a lesser product. Haslam is a FRAUD. He is just another Modell.

HUMCALC
09-18-2013, 09:25 PM
Ok and Tom Brady was projected to get me more than 21 points in my fantasy league last week but that didn"t happen. Projections are just guessing, opinions. M Lynch, A Peterson, A Foster, L Mccoy, J Charles these are all better backs and there are more. I live in Ohio i watch the Browns every week because my father was a Browns fan before he passed away i root for the Browns to win to succeed just as long as their not play Denver, i never seen anything special from Trent nothing Barry Sanders like. I'd take Eddie Lacy over Trent. But thats just my opinion & i can understand why Browns fans are mad because the fact that they traded Trent pretty much shows this season is already over.

Lacy has a lot more to work with than T-Rich does. If Richardson was on GB, he'd be racking the yards up

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 09:36 PM
Also, Elway, if Richardson was such a waste on the team and they were right trading him, what about Joe Thomas? Last year his play slipped and so far this year the line has been terrible. Why not trade him away too? Certainly they can get a first rounder or more for him?!

BroncoFanBoy
09-18-2013, 09:40 PM
I think he just hates the pick not the player. I mean wouldn't you be made if Denver drafted a 29yr old QB with the 22nd pick instead of using that pick to fix obvious holes?

Again Detroit Lions reference. That's like when Millen drafted Charles Rodgers win clearly Detroit could've used that pick on something les.

Charlie used to say "Who's smoking WEEDen?" a lot. He used to say that plenty of times. He liked McCoy better.


McCoy wasn't the problem. The surrounding cast was. No WR no RB. The team picks Richardson giving McCoy a RB. Team just needed WR help. They selected Weeden instead. WR is still a problem. So, they trade away Richardson and now everyone wants Weeden out of there. The team has had 19 starting QB's since 99' next year will be #20 or #21 (if Campbell starts any games). Enough is enough address the WR issue. Leave the QB position alone.

I agree, they should've added more offensive talent instead of him, but I thought you didn't like him as a player and thought he was terrible.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 09:47 PM
Charlie used to say "Who's smoking WEEDen?" a lot. He used to say that plenty of times. He liked McCoy better.



I agree, they should've added more offensive talent instead of him, but I thought you didn't like him as a player and thought he was terrible.

I didn't like him because he was a quarterback. Just like I won't like whomever the next musical chair is next year. Manziel, Bridgewater, Boyd, or whomever else it is. Drafting Quarterbacks does not solve all your problems & ignoring those problems and drafting a quarterback because you didn't personally select his predecessor is idiotic. That is why Lombardi is looking at another QB. Because it isn't his guy. He refuses to even work with him. Two games in and he is calling it quits?! Two measly games!!!!

Also, in closing, the division leaders are tied at 1-1. Cleveland wins a game and one of these other teams lose and Cleveland us tied for #2 in the division. There was no need to call it quits.

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 09:50 PM
Also, Elway, if Richardson was such a waste on the team and they were right trading him, what about Joe Thomas? Last year his play slipped and so far this year the line has been terrible. Why not trade him away too? Certainly they can get a first rounder or more for him?!
No Charlie I wouldn't trade Joe. But I just don't think trading Trent is that big of a deal. Trade Weeden too if you can. We all know Cleveland will be drafting a Qb.

BroncoFanBoy
09-18-2013, 09:52 PM
I didn't like him because he was a quarterback. Just like I won't like whomever the next musical chair is next year. Manziel, Bridgewater, Boyd, or whomever else it is. Drafting Quarterbacks does not solve all your problems & ignoring those problems and drafting a quarterback because you didn't personally select his predecessor is idiotic. That is why Lombardi is looking at another QB. Because it isn't his guy. He refuses to even work with him. Two games in and he is calling it quits?! Two measly games!!!!

I question it too because the Browns actually did play Baltimore pretty good. They were held to just 14 points. Usually that would end up as a win. So why they would give up now is completely idiotic. I didn't think any FO was this stupid.

As for Weeden, I do remember you saying that he stares down receivers a lot and so. But they do need some offensive talent around him. I don't think he's very good honestly, but he'd definitely look better if he had a decent supporting cast.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 09:53 PM
No Charlie I wouldn't trade Joe. But I just don't think trading Trent is that big of a deal. Trade Weeden too if you can. We all know Cleveland will be drafting a Qb.

Why? He's playing like crap and being paid top dollar for it. Isn't that a waste? Why not trade him?! Lombardi, Banner, and Haslam are the most inept Front Office since Policy and Palmer.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 09:57 PM
I question it too because the Browns actually did play Baltimore pretty good. They were held to just 14 points. Usually that would end up as a win. So why they would give up now is completely idiotic. I didn't think any FO was this stupid.

As for Weeden, I do remember you saying that he stares down receivers a lot and so. But they do need some offensive talent around him. I don't think he's very good honestly, but he'd definitely look better if he had a decent supporting cast.

Exactly, even a decent surrounding cast will cover up most shortcomings. That's all I've asked for. But time and time again they change QB's for the sake of it and now they are about to do it again.

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 10:00 PM
Why? He's playing like crap and being paid top dollar for it. Isn't that a waste? Why not trade him?! Lombardi, Banner, and Haslam are the most inept Front Office since Policy and Palmer.
I don't recall calling Trent a waste, just saying he's not Jim Brown and 950 yards can be easily replaced. I'm not backing Banner or Lombardi, hell I liked Heckert but I believe Haslam will make the Browns better.
Deep pockets & wants to win. Had to learn something in Pittsburgh while they won a couple of rings being a minority owner.

BroncoFanBoy
09-18-2013, 10:10 PM
I don't recall calling Trent a waste, just saying he's not Jim Brown and 950 yards can be easily replaced. I'm not backing Banner or Lombardi, hell I liked Heckert but I believe Haslam will make the Browns better.
Deep pockets & wants to win. Had to learn something in Pittsburgh while they won a couple of rings being a minority owner.

The Browns just drafted him 3rd overall in 2012. Heck, they traded up one spot to grab him. He was supposed to be an elite back for them. You don't give up on a Top 3 pick like that after just one season. Besides, he still had potential. Ray Rice didn't do much in his rookie year, now look at him.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 10:10 PM
I don't recall calling Trent a waste, just saying he's not Jim Brown and 950 yards can be easily replaced. I'm not backing Banner or Lombardi, hell I liked Heckert but I believe Haslam will make the Browns better.
Deep pockets & wants to win. Had to learn something in Pittsburgh while they won a couple of rings being a minority owner.

Haslam doesn't have deep pockets anymore. He lost money in settling court costs and repaying customers he stole from.

The Browns are his cash cow. He is going to milk it for as much $$ as he can. In fact, he already is as I said earlier (naming rights, T-shirt sales, etc).

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 10:17 PM
The Browns just drafted him 3rd overall in 2012. Heck, they traded up one spot to grab him. He was supposed to be an elite back for them. You don't give up on a Top 3 pick like that after just one season. Besides, he still had potential. Ray Rice didn't do much in his rookie year, now look at him.
Haslam and his regime didn't draft Trent they have a different vision for the team. I guess they figured hey were not gonna do anything this year and couldn't turn down the pick. At the end of the day its just a running back. A unproven running back.

BroncoFanBoy
09-18-2013, 10:19 PM
Haslam and his regime didn't draft Trent they have a different vision for the team. I guess they figured hey were not gonna do anything this year and couldn't turn down the pick. At the end of the day its just a running back. A unproven running back.

He was drafted 3rd overall for a reason. Many teams wanted him. That's like if Von Miller had 7 sacks for us in 2011, and then in 2012 we got new management, and traded Miller after 2 games, regardless of how he was doing.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 10:25 PM
Lombardi and company are putting all their eggs in one basket next year. But, if the Browns go 0-16 or 1-15 who is to say they will have a job next year?!

Right now that is what it is looking like. 5-11 was too much for Haslam to handle last year, so he fired Heckert and Shurmur. What makes Lombardi and Chudzinski get a longer leash?

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 10:30 PM
He was drafted 3rd overall for a reason. Many teams wanted him. That's like if Von Miller had 7 sacks for us in 2011, and then in 2012 we got new management, and traded Miller after 2 games, regardless of how he was doing.

Running backs are easier to find then a player like Miller, big difference. This is a passing league. Trent hasn't proved anything. picking a running back that high now a days is not smart.

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 10:34 PM
Lombardi and company are putting all their eggs in one basket next year. But, if the Browns go 0-16 or 1-15 who is to say they will have a job next year?!

Right now that is what it is looking like. 5-11 was too much for Haslam to handle last year, so he fired Heckert and Shurmur. What makes Lombardi and Chudzinski get a longer leash?
I guess we will have to wait and see but they could knock the draft out of the park like I said the Bengals have been doing a good job at it and you know how Mike Brown was looked at for years because of his mess ups.

BroncoFanBoy
09-18-2013, 10:35 PM
Running backs are easier to find then a player like Miller, big difference. This is a passing league. Trent hasn't proved anything. picking a running back that high now a days is not smart.

True, it's not as often that backs are taken that high, but Richardson was a highly sought after player. The Browns weren't the only team that wanted him.

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 10:42 PM
True, it's not as often that backs are taken that high, but Richardson was a highly sought after player. The Browns weren't the only team that wanted him.

I understand but with season being a bust with Trent or without Trent And your the owner and you you think you can get a Rb next year just as good in the third round, then on top of that get a franchise Qb and a stellar Wr with your two fist rounders what would do?

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 10:43 PM
I guess we will have to wait and see but they could knock the draft out of the park like I said the Bengals have been doing a good job at it and you know how Mike Brown was looked at for years because of his mess ups.

You just don't get it. As a Bengals announcer once said, "You aren't Cleveland". The same goes with Cleveland especially now. Vinci is an established team with top notch players and a front office. Cleveland is perpetually rebuilding. Every year tearing it down and building it up again only to rinse and repeat ad nauseum.

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 10:53 PM
You just don't get it. As a Bengals announcer once said, "You aren't Cleveland". The same goes with Cleveland especially now. Vinci is an established team with top notch players and a front office. Cleveland is perpetually rebuilding. Every year tearing it down and building it up again only to rinse and repeat ad nauseum.
I do get it Cinci was the worst team of the 90s & haven't won a playoff game since the 90s. I understand your frustration being a fan of the Browns try having some faith in your new owner & some patience cause this is his first year in the job. You act like Learner & company left you with the 49ers roster like they left you with a gold mine and Haslam robbed it.
I understand the whole Flying J thing but it has nothing to do with football.

atwaterandstir
09-18-2013, 10:56 PM
Willis McGahee had 750 yards for a 4.4 average along with 26 receptions for 230 yds last season in 10 games...he also converted 53 total first downs. (43 rushing 10 receiving)
Richardson had 950 yards for a 3.8 average and 50 receptions for 350 yards in 15 games....he also converted 38 total first downs. (36 rushing 2 receiving)

Point being, Richardson is hyped up solely on potential.......potential that may or may not be achieved. Now sure the schemes, the lines, the qb all have bearing on the production, but without upgrading those key factors it was not going to improve. This move gives them the ammo to rebuild in a very good draft.

RBs can be found in the draft in FA or in trades.

The days of a work horse RB are fading fast, thats why they are now starting to slip to rd 2 and beyond. With 2 firsts, 2 seconds, and 2 3rds (from reports I have heard) they have great chance at targeting one especially with what will end up being 6 of the top 80 or so picks next season.

BroncoFanBoy
09-18-2013, 10:56 PM
I understand but with season being a bust with Trent or without Trent And your the owner and you you think you can get a Rb next year just as good in the third round, then on top of that get a franchise Qb and a stellar Wr with your two fist rounders what would do?

I give the RB who was drafted 3rd overall more time to develop. There's no guarantee that a third round back would be as good. Like Charlie said, they need offensive talent pretty much everywhere (except at RB). I have a young and upcoming back, and I would build around him. Not many talented young backs these days.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 11:00 PM
I do get it Cinci was the worst team of the 90s & haven't won a playoff game since the 90s. I understand your frustration being a fan of the Browns try having some faith in your new owner & some patience cause this is his first year in the job. You act like Learner & company left you with the 49ers roster like they left you with a gold mine and Haslam robbed it.
I understand the whole Flying J thing but it has nothing to do with football.

Faith and patience?! Ha ha. I've been with this version of the Browns since 99'. The first version I barely knew for two years. I've seen this same song and dance again and again and again and again.

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 11:02 PM
I give the RB who was drafted 3rd overall more time to develop. There's no guarantee that a third round back would be as good. Like Charlie said, they need offensive talent pretty much everywhere (except at RB). I have a young and upcoming back, and I would build around him. Not many talented young backs these days.

Again Haslam didn't draft Trent and It's easier to get a back in the later rounds example Gio Benard and so on. It's a passing league with this move they can get the Qb another Wr to go with Gordon a Rb & some o lineman, we got Beedles late he turned out good.

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 11:06 PM
Faith and patience?! Ha ha. I've been with this version of the Browns since 99'. The first version I barely knew for two years. I've seen this same song and dance again and again and again and again.
Well try watching your favorite team get beat in the super bowl 55 to 10 I feel your pain. The Browns will get there.

atwaterandstir
09-18-2013, 11:09 PM
I give the RB who was drafted 3rd overall more time to develop. There's no guarantee that a third round back would be as good. Like Charlie said, they need offensive talent pretty much everywhere (except at RB). I have a young and upcoming back, and I would build around him. Not many talented young backs these days.


The fans of the Browns should be happy the new regime seems poised to go all in this next draft and set the tone for the future. They have tons of picks and also some real good players like Thomas, Haden, Gordon, Taylor, Kruger, Cameron, among others.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 11:11 PM
Again Haslam didn't draft Trent and It's easier to get a back in the later rounds example Gio Benard and so on. It's a passing league with this move they can get the Qb another Wr to go with Gordon a Rb & some o lineman, we got Beedles late he turned out good.

Other teams find that. Not Cleveland. Linemen, running backs, quarterbacks, and receivers grow on trees for established teams. Not in Cleveland. The Patriots can find a franchise QB in the sixth round. Can Denver? No. They haven't they signed a furl tire Colts HOF player to be their QB. Washington? They can get a RB in any round. Great coaching and top players do that. Cleveland does not get that. Washington and Denver get experienced coaches like Shanahan and John Fox. Cleveland gets stuck with no-names like Shurmur and Chudzinski. Even top college coaches laugh the team off (look at Chip Kelly). Crap gets crap. Cleveland's 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounders stock shelves for a living.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 11:15 PM
The fans of the Browns should be happy the new regime seems poised to go all in this next draft and set the tone for the future. They have tons of picks and also some real good players like Thomas, Haden, Gordon, Taylor, Kruger, Cameron, among others.

Kruger was situational in Baltimore and hasn't shown much so far this year. Please, tell me who the "others" are. Cameron also has had a mere two games where he was the only person catching anything. That doesn't necessarily make him good. Gordon is just returning from a suspension and has a history of drug offenses.

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 11:20 PM
Other teams find that. Not Cleveland. Linemen, running backs, quarterbacks, and receivers grow on trees for established teams. Not in Cleveland. The Patriots can find a franchise QB in the sixth round. Can Denver? No. They haven't they signed a furl tire Colts HOF player to be their QB. Washington? They can get a RB in any round. Great coaching and top players do that. Cleveland does not get that. Washington and Denver get experienced coaches like Shanahan and John Fox. Cleveland gets stuck with no-names like Shurmur and Chudzinski. Even top college coaches laugh the team off (look at Chip Kelly). Crap gets crap. Cleveland's 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounders stock shelves for a living.
Mike Shanahan hasn't done anything since Elway retired. All these coaches started at the bottom just like Chud & became good. Gruden doesn't want to coach he's doing hooters commercials. Give Haslam & crew a few years before we say same ol Browns.

// / yardo
09-18-2013, 11:22 PM
I actually feel bad for Browns fans. What in the world is the front office doing over there? Makes me think of Major League where ownership was doing everything it could to sabotage the team.

Charlie Brown
09-18-2013, 11:23 PM
Mike Shanahan hasn't done anything since Elway retired. All these coaches started at the bottom just like Chud & became good. Gruden doesn't want to coach he's doing hooters commercials. Give Haslam & crew a few year years before we same same ol Browns.

No. Shurmur and company weren't good enough for Haslam after going 5-11. Any less than that is a step in the wrong direction and heads must roll.

ELWAY421
09-18-2013, 11:27 PM
Kruger was situational in Baltimore and hasn't shown much so far this year. Please, tell me who the "others" are. Cameron also has had a mere two games where he was the only person catching anything. That doesn't necessarily make him good. Gordon is just returning from a suspension and has a history of drug offenses.
Kruger,Haden, Taylor, Jackson, Cameron, Gordon, Benjamin, Mingo ect. defense is good. Draft offense and you will be better.

atwaterandstir
09-18-2013, 11:28 PM
Kruger was situational in Baltimore and hasn't shown much so far this year. Please, tell me who the "others" are. Cameron also has had a mere two games where he was the only person catching anything. That doesn't necessarily make him good. Gordon is just returning from a suspension and has a history of drug offenses.

Dont you find it odd your quick to label Richardson but hesitant to credit other young guys?
Richardson was hype built by potential and by a fan base who desperately wanted a face to back.....to the people who coached him and who are building the team to their preferences he was looked at as dispensable.

Its no secret the team has holes to fill and since this is a new regime and a boat load of picks coming up you fans should see some hope. I know you Browns fans are conditioned to expect the worst, but its a sad mind set to adopt.

The past failings of other regimes has zero bearing in the unknown future.

dizzolve
09-19-2013, 05:12 AM
WOW

This might help my fantasy team

But - at first glance doesn't make sense - but if the Browns can't block for his talented running - might as well get value? Maybe that's their logic

Who Knows

JayJack
09-19-2013, 06:04 AM
I know I stand alone on this, but I don't see this as a bad move at all.

Charlie Brown
09-19-2013, 06:28 AM
I know I stand alone on this, but I don't see this as a bad move at all.

I know you like it. But, you need to stop looking from the Colts perspective.

JayJack
09-19-2013, 06:41 AM
I know you like it. But, you need to stop looking from the Colts perspective.

Actually I haven't looked at it from the Colts perspective one time. Everytime I try to thing about it, I can't get Irsay and his damn happy twitter finger out of my head.

Spice 1
09-19-2013, 06:41 AM
I thought drafting Richardson was a mistake in the first place. I told some Browns fans I know that they should do whatever it takes to move up and draft RGIII, and they all pissed and moaned about that idea. So they draft a running back when the OLine can't run block to save their lives, and then draft an average quarterback who is already 30 years old. How stupid is that? At least now they'll get a do over on a quarterback. It just took two years and a regime change to figure it out.

This is what happens when you change GM and coach every two years. The new guy comes in and blows everything up. Rinse, repeat. You're franchise doesn't develop any stability, identity, or continuity. It's just a cycle of brief hope followed by misery and despair.

BluenOrnge4Life
09-19-2013, 06:51 AM
Saw a tweet on twitter yesterday: "I guess the Browns should have taken Tannehill and Doug Martin instead."

Charlie Brown
09-19-2013, 06:58 AM
Actually I haven't looked at it from the Colts perspective one time. Everytime I try to thing about it, I can't get Irsay and his damn happy twitter finger out of my head.

There is no possible way that getting rid of your best offensive player is a good move. The team has nothing. It is even lower when that player learns of the trade via the radio. Don't have the common courtesy to call and tell them? That is unprofessional and low. Alex Mack is the next to go. He will refuse to sign. Then will refuse to sign the franchise tag.

This front office cannot be here at the end of the year and the same goes for the coaches.

FlowdaBroncoFan
09-19-2013, 07:07 AM
I still think this is a bad move. They should have waited. Jax will be the worst team in the league unless Henne comes out on fire. Bridgewater will be wearing black and teal.

The Browns will not be able to pry him out of Jax.

Bad move!

In Indys case, this is a great move. Indy gets a top tier (potentially) RB for a late first rounder. Now teams will have to account for the ground game and passing game of Luck. Good move for Indy. They stole a #3 overal pick for #20+ probably. Lol

Charlie Brown
09-19-2013, 08:40 AM
Flowda, Cleveland plays against Jacksonville. So Cleveland can be worse.

CanDB
09-19-2013, 11:45 AM
Interesting.........Indy has the #1 and #3 picks in the 2012 draft.

Of course they owe their first rounder next year, which should be decent, but definitely nowhere near a top pick.

JayJack
09-19-2013, 03:10 PM
There is no possible way that getting rid of your best offensive player is a good move. The team has nothing. It is even lower when that player learns of the trade via the radio. Don't have the common courtesy to call and tell them? That is unprofessional and low. Alex Mack is the next to go. He will refuse to sign. Then will refuse to sign the franchise tag.

This front office cannot be here at the end of the year and the same goes for the coaches.

Hey, no matter what I say, you're still going to feel the way you feel. It's just a good move IMO.

Cajun
09-19-2013, 03:24 PM
Norv Turner putting his stamp on another team... "How to dismantle a team!"

BluenOrnge4Life
09-20-2013, 05:33 AM
Wow some revealing stuff in here... Does sound like Gordon and maybe Schwartz could be next... Also, Holmgren offered his entire draft for Luck a couple of years ago:


BEREA, Ohio -- Former Browns President Mike

Holmgren, who traded up a notch to No. 3 to draft Trent Richardson last year, ripped the Browns for trading Richardson to the Colts for a first-round pick in 2014, saying he'd quit as a head coach if a team traded away his best offensive player and that it was a knee-jerk reaction.

"I struggled with it,'' Holmgren said today on Sports Radio 950 KJR in Seattle with host Dave "Softy'' Mahler. "Philosophically, if I am the coach and someone came in anywhere and did that, I'd say 'OK, fire me, or I'm going to quit. Or we're going to both go into the owner and talk about this and the we'll see who's still standing.' ''

Holmgren, who was let go by new owner Jimmy Haslam and CEO Joe Banner at the end of last season, posed the question that many Browns fans are thinking.

"How do you make your team better by trading your best player?'' he said. "He's the best offensive player. He's a valuable, valuable guy.''

He said he watched the press conference conducted Wednesday by Banner and coach Rob Chudzinski and "clearly the coach is OK with this because they sat at the news conference together. I personally would not be OK with it. It was my best offensive player, a young guy. Not an eight-year vet. He's a young guy.''

He said if the GM told him in the owner's office he was making the trade, "I'd shake hands and walk. I would. Because if I disagreed with it vehemently, and I couldn't buy in, I mean, I'm not saying I'm right, I'm saying that's what I would do, because you have to be true to yourself in this business.''

Holmgren traded a fourth-, fifth- and seventh-round pick in the 2012 draft to Minnesota to move up a spot to draft Richardson at No. 3. Richardson rushed for 950 yards and 11 TDs last year, but averaged only 3.6 yards per carry, in part because he had broken ribs.

He said Browns players must feel like the front office is giving up on the season.

"You can't tell me some of those players aren't asking some of the questions you and I are asking,'' he said to Mahler. "They were friends with (Richardson). It's too wild. This sort of thing doesn't happen, and it happened, so asking questions about it would be natural.''

The current regime would not have drafted Richardson at No. 4 let alone trading three picks to move up to get him, league sources told Cleveland.com. What's more, they are not sold on Holmgren's pick of Brandon Weeden at No. 22, and are watching No. 37 Mitchell Schwartz, the right tackle, very closely. Banner and General Manager Mike Lombardi also would not have spent a second-round pick in 2013 on Josh Gordon in the supplemental draft.

The general feeling, the sources said, is that Holmgren and former GM Tom Heckert botched the top picks, and now the new group is paying the price.

"To me, they're putting all their eggs for next season,'' said Holmgren. "They started off 0-2, they couldn't score any points, I think it was a little bit of a knee-jerk reaction. There's a little bit of a 'what's going on?' I don't know this for sure but I can sense it.

"Indianapolis is probably going to have a pretty good year, so that pick is probably going to be 23, 24, right in there. And to package something (to move up in the draft), we couldn't package our 4 and our 7 for (Robert Griffin III) last year and we had more ammunition (Holmgren offered the No. 4 and No. 22 as well, but the Redskins offered three first-rounders)."

Holmgren said his daughter called him and told him about the trade.

"I thought she was kidding around,'' he said. "I didn't believe it. I went on my computer and saw it. I had a lot of emotions, because I really liked the young man and I really think he's an outstanding football player. It was something that we needed, and he had a really fine first year and he played through pain and injury, so I was startled by that. ''

He added, "on the surface, I tried to make sense of it. I wanted to know what in the world? It appears after seeing the press conference, they're not coming out and saying it, but they're preparing for next year's draft. I listened to the coach and he says we want to be competitive. Who's going to be the running back? They don't even know who's going to be the running back this week.''

How much better does this make the Colts?

"Oh boy, indoor and on turf?'' said Holmgren.

He re-iterated that he offered Colts GM Ryan Grigson his entire 2012 draft to move up to No. 1 to take Andrew Luck.

"I talked to him last year (at the owner's meetings) before we made the trade,'' he said. "I said, 'I'll give you all of our draft picks for the No. 1 pick and I'll take Luck. I'll give the whole draft to you.

"I said, 'Ryan let's do the deal, right now, right here.' He said, 'We're taking Luck.' We were by the pool, I might've even had a lemonade in my hand. He didn't take me seriously, because I was ready to pull the trigger. They were going to take him, and they should've taken him. They did the right thing, but he said if some craziness would've happened, they would've taken Trent Richardson. And now a year later, they get both of them. If you asked him last year, 'Would you trade your 24th pick in the first round for Trent Richardson,' you would do that easily.''

He said he doesn't know Chudzinski personally, but "I know people that know him. They say he's a great coach, a good guy and has been in the league long enough. You're right though, it's his first head coaching job, but boy-oh-boy, there would be a conversation.''

And over the next several years, you can bet there will be plenty.

Here is audio from the interview:

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/09/mike_holmgren_blasts_cleveland.html#incart_flyout_ sports

Charlie Brown
09-20-2013, 08:45 AM
Wow some revealing stuff in here... Does sound like Gordon and maybe Schwartz could be next... Also, Holmgren offered his entire draft for Luck a couple of years ago:



http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/09/mike_holmgren_blasts_cleveland.html#incart_flyout_ sports

Absolute idiots in charge. I always hated Lombardi for what he did to Kosar. He's just doing it again. He didn't draft Haden, Thomas, Mack, or D'Qwell either. Why not trade them too? Oh wait, Mack is leaving this offseason anyway!

Cajun
09-20-2013, 08:54 AM
Absolute idiots in charge. I always hated Lombardi for what he did to Kosar. He's just doing it again. He didn't draft Haden, Thomas, Mack, or D'Qwell either. Why not trade them too? Oh wait, Mack is leaving this offseason anyway!

I could not imagine being a browns fan right now.... well actually I can.. I just dont like remembering the McD days.

this image just keeps coming to mind when I think of the browns....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQppUxTpdzU

sorry charlie brown....

BroncoFanBoy
09-20-2013, 11:05 AM
I wish this happened to a fan base that doesn't exactly have a lot of fans, like St. Louis or Arizona. Cleveland has always had loyal fans, and they are definetly a football town. They deserve better management than this.

the0rangecrush
09-20-2013, 11:14 AM
Never a fan of tanking, and to me this is what the Browns are doing. I was never a fan of Richardson, and agreed with Brown when he said that he was "Just another guy", however he was still there best weapon. However, if it does indeed lead to a franchise QB then it was a good move. That said I understand the fan reaction, there has been no indication to show they can evaluate talent. Im also still skeptical on the new FO. However, this move does not bode well for Veterans. They probably will have reservations with the new FO now. Signing FAs and keeping there own just got harder.

BroncoFanBoy
09-20-2013, 11:26 AM
Oh and Charlie, I just read this recently:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1781274-mike-holmgren-would-have-traded-all-of-browns-2012-draft-picks-for-andrew-luck

I know it's from Bleacher Report, but it said that Holmgren even said he'd do it.


I talked to [Grigson] last year before we made the trade. I said, "I'll give you all of our draft picks for the No. 1 pick, and I'll take Luck. I'll give the whole draft to you." I said, "Ryan, let's do the deal, right now, right here." He said, "We're taking Luck." We were by the pool, I might've even had a lemonade in my hand. He didn't take me seriously, because I was ready to pull the trigger.

JayJack
09-20-2013, 12:50 PM
If I am Jacksonville and Cleveland wants that #1 spot, they are coming off both 1st rd picks, ATLEAST.

ERoyal248
09-20-2013, 12:58 PM
If I am Jacksonville and Cleveland wants that #1 spot, they are coming off both 1st rd picks, ATLEAST.

Cleveland has good pieces on defense, they aren't number one overall bad.

It will cost a lot if they want Teddy though.

JayJack
09-20-2013, 01:01 PM
Cleveland has good pieces on defense, they aren't number one overall bad.

It will cost a lot if they want Teddy though.

Oh yeah, they have some pieces over there, but Hoyer is starting (not sure how many games). I think they will be picking top 10, and if Jax has the #1 overall, they need to at least try and milk cleveland bone dry.

BluenOrnge4Life
09-20-2013, 04:20 PM
Absolute idiots in charge. I always hated Lombardi for what he did to Kosar. He's just doing it again. He didn't draft Haden, Thomas, Mack, or D'Qwell either. Why not trade them too? Oh wait, Mack is leaving this offseason anyway!
It's stupid. BIggest problem I see with it all is that you are just getting Gordon back for your offense - who has shown he can be a dynamic player - and you trade away RIchardson without giving the team a real chance to do anything. WIth Norv's vertical passing attack and Gordon's skillset, Gordon would've really stretched the defenses and made defenses pay for stacking the box to help stop trent richardson.

Instead, they traded Richardson away and essentially tanked the season in doing so. A lot of talent evaluators had CLeveland pegged as a potential wild card team pending on QB play. I'm not sure why Mike Lombardi felt the need to blow it up.. and so soon.

Cajun
09-20-2013, 10:00 PM
Oh yeah, they have some pieces over there, but Hoyer is starting (not sure how many games). I think they will be picking top 10, and if Jax has the #1 overall, they need to at least try and milk cleveland bone dry.

source for my info (http://mmqb.si.com/2013/09/19/trent-richardson-trade-two-views/).

Heres my problem with it. The browns traded up to get the #3 overall draft pick when they got him from the vikings

"To make the move, Cleveland gave the Vikings first-, fourth-, fifth- and seventh-round picks."


And the colts only have to give up a first round pick, which could be anywheres from 16 to 32...I think they make the playoffs which makes it that much higher. That alone to me is an idiot trade.

Personally, I believe I would be a much better GM and I dont even like the Browns. Where do I send in my resume? I figure if an idiot like the current GM got the job, my chances have to be greater!

JayJack
09-22-2013, 09:01 AM
Appearing on Sunday NFL Countdown, ESPN's Adam Schefter reports the Browns plan to pursue Texans free-agent-to-be Ben Tate in the offseason.
Tate is going to get paid by someone. After trading Trent Richardson away earlier this week, the Browns' running back of the future isn't on the roster. Willis McGahee is just a 2013 stop-gap, while Bobby Rainey and Chris Ogbonnaya are pure backups. Tate is averaging 8.2 YPC on 18 attempts this season. The Texans may not let him get away with Arian Foster showing signs of decline.

Related: BrownsSep 22 - 11:07 AM

Charlie Brown
09-22-2013, 09:59 AM
Appearing on Sunday NFL Countdown, ESPN's Adam Schefter reports the Browns plan to pursue Texans free-agent-to-be Ben Tate in the offseason.
Tate is going to get paid by someone. After trading Trent Richardson away earlier this week, the Browns' running back of the future isn't on the roster. Willis McGahee is just a 2013 stop-gap, while Bobby Rainey and Chris Ogbonnaya are pure backups. Tate is averaging 8.2 YPC on 18 attempts this season. The Texans may not let him get away with Arian Foster showing signs of decline.

That would be a horrible move.

coltsman451
09-22-2013, 01:37 PM
Just gave him a gift-wrapped TD run on his first carry as a Colt. Pretty nice, huh?:smug:

Charlie Brown
09-22-2013, 01:49 PM
Just gave him a gift-wrapped TD run on his first carry as a Colt. Pretty nice, huh?:smug:

Good. Hope he runs for at lease 99 more yards today and another touchdown.

For the year I want him to have 1200 yards rushing, 12 touchdowns & 300-400 receiving yards and another pair of TD's.

beastlyskronk
09-22-2013, 03:10 PM
Good. Hope he runs for at lease 99 more yards today and another touchdown.

For the year I want him to have 1200 yards rushing, 12 touchdowns & 300-400 receiving yards and another pair of TD's.

I don't, Ahmad Bradshaw is my starting RB on my fantasy team lol

91bronco
09-22-2013, 03:16 PM
source for my info (http://mmqb.si.com/2013/09/19/trent-richardson-trade-two-views/).

Heres my problem with it. The browns traded up to get the #3 overall draft pick when they got him from the vikings

"To make the move, Cleveland gave the Vikings first-, fourth-, fifth- and seventh-round picks."


And the colts only have to give up a first round pick, which could be anywheres from 16 to 32...I think they make the playoffs which makes it that much higher. That alone to me is an idiot trade.

Personally, I believe I would be a much better GM and I dont even like the Browns. Where do I send in my resume? I figure if an idiot like the current GM got the job, my chances have to be greater!

I think this gets a little lost in translation but I totally agree with you. It was a bad trade altogether IMO....

BroncoFanNC
09-22-2013, 06:27 PM
2.7 YPC on his first outing with the Colts.

He should get better, but if he doesn't then the Browns may have recouped some of that 3rd overall pick they wasted on him.

JayJack
09-22-2013, 11:42 PM
That would be a horrible move.

Why would signing Ben Tate be a horrible move? Your other options other then the draft that would be worth anything would be MJD or Darren McFadden.

fallforward3y+
09-23-2013, 12:24 AM
Top 5 back in what? The Nfl? In the Afc North? Trent isn't a top 5 back he had a decent rookie season 950 yards or so. To be honest he is still a gamble he was taken in top five this is his second year he hasn't proven anything in the league. So until he pans out he is still a gamble.

He's was definitely a top 5 back in Cleveland, lol. In all seriousness, Trent is a good player but it is complete nonsense the way he is being overrated by many in this thread. It is completely laughable that anyone actually thinks the trading of him alone destroyed some kind of great future.

The Browns would have required many more pieces to be a great team in the future, and if they attain those pieces this trade will be forgotten and not even close to seen as a bad decision by the Browns. I doubt they made this trade to tank the season, because this trade alone is not enough to tank the season.

The Browns already were one of the worst offenses in the league, they should have traded a key defensive player(the good side of their team) if they wanted to tank their season.

ruksak
09-23-2013, 07:21 AM
2.7 YPC on his first outing with the Colts.

He should get better, but if he doesn't then the Browns may have recouped some of that 3rd overall pick they wasted on him.

Bah....dude said he was more tired going into that game than any game he's ever played. He had only hours to learn some plays and was completely caught in a disposition. Trent is a beastly RB with a full elite skill-set.

TR and Luck are going to be killing AFC teams for many years to come.

PS: There's absolutely nothing Cleveland can do to recoup what they lost involving TR. They gave so much to get him, and now may end up with a 20th-28th pick in the draft for it. Very likely they get an O-lineman that takes a few years to find his groove, spends most of his time on IR and/or isn't even playing in the league/in Cleveland in a few years.

There's no way you can look at TR's history and exclaim he's not the real deal at NFL RB.

I say this to people all the time. You have to look beyond the numbers sometmes. Watching Trent's 11 TD's last year, one can see the elite capability here.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eT1BKy06nGM

....and it's not just Richardson. We have a backfield now that is among the very best in the league, suddenly, overnight we have one of the best RB tandems in football....and that's only a week after losing our phenomenal young, 2nd year starter for the year in Vick Ballard.

As for INDY, man this is great. We had one year of 'suck' and we used that #1 pick to completely rebuild the team around Luck. What happens because of this TR trade....it's like we were dimed an extra Top-5 pick to build around. It's like we had a 2nd year of 'suck' that never actually happened.

Spice 1
09-23-2013, 08:22 AM
Oh yeah, they have some pieces over there, but Hoyer is starting (not sure how many games). I think they will be picking top 10, and if Jax has the #1 overall, they need to at least try and milk cleveland bone dry.

There's no guarantee they'll go after Bridgewater if they sit at #2. They might as well draft Clowney if Jax doesn't. He's still a beast in a 3-4.

I wouldn't be surprised if Pittsburgh conveniently had a crap season out of the blue, and took him though. Kind of like Indianapolis two years ago.

BroncoFanNC
09-30-2013, 07:00 AM
Bah....dude said he was more tired going into that game than any game he's ever played. He had only hours to learn some plays and was completely caught in a disposition. Trent is a beastly RB with a full elite skill-set.

TR and Luck are going to be killing AFC teams for many years to come.

PS: There's absolutely nothing Cleveland can do to recoup what they lost involving TR. They gave so much to get him, and now may end up with a 20th-28th pick in the draft for it. Very likely they get an O-lineman that takes a few years to find his groove, spends most of his time on IR and/or isn't even playing in the league/in Cleveland in a few years.

There's no way you can look at TR's history and exclaim he's not the real deal at NFL RB.

I say this to people all the time. You have to look beyond the numbers sometmes. Watching Trent's 11 TD's last year, one can see the elite capability here.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eT1BKy06nGM

....and it's not just Richardson. We have a backfield now that is among the very best in the league, suddenly, overnight we have one of the best RB tandems in football....and that's only a week after losing our phenomenal young, 2nd year starter for the year in Vick Ballard.

As for INDY, man this is great. We had one year of 'suck' and we used that #1 pick to completely rebuild the team around Luck. What happens because of this TR trade....it's like we were dimed an extra Top-5 pick to build around. It's like we had a 2nd year of 'suck' that never actually happened.

I don't know how on earth you have one of the best RB tandems.

TR has been average at best already.

ruksak
09-30-2013, 12:49 PM
I don't know how on earth you have one of the best RB tandems.

TR has been average at best already.

Gotta give him a few weeks to get in. His talent is obvious to those whom have watched Trent and not just peeked at his woeful YPC average, which was the result of a terrible passing game and inept O-line play.

Bradshaw & Richardson is one of the best 1/2 punches in any NFL backfield, period. Name me 3 that are better?

BroncoFanNC
09-30-2013, 03:58 PM
Gotta give him a few weeks to get in. His talent is obvious to those whom have watched Trent and not just peeked at his woeful YPC average, which was the result of a terrible passing game and inept O-line play.

Bradshaw & Richardson is one of the best 1/2 punches in any NFL backfield, period. Name me 3 that are better?

Foster/Tate
Rice/Pierce
Peterson/Gerhart
Jackson/Spiller
Gore/Hunter
McCoy/Brown
Williams/Stewart
Lynch/Turban

Hard pressed for me to take TR plus anyone over those combos.

ruksak
09-30-2013, 04:20 PM
Foster/Tate
Rice/Pierce
Peterson/Gerhart
Jackson/Spiller
Gore/Hunter
McCoy/Brown
Williams/Stewart
Lynch/Turban

Hard pressed for me to take TR plus anyone over those combos.

I'd take TR over any one of those guys, save for Peterson and McCoy. Foster/Tate and Rice/Pierce are the only tandems I find more impressive than Bradshaw/Richardson. When we're getting into the realm of complete backs and disregarding just raw YPC, I think I have good cause to say what I'm saying. You look at intelligence, blocking and receiving capabilities, many of the rest of your examples folds fast.

Time will tell. I'll revisit this thread as the year progresses.

BroncoFanNC
09-30-2013, 07:10 PM
I'd take TR over any one of those guys, save for Peterson and McCoy. Foster/Tate and Rice/Pierce are the only tandems I find more impressive than Bradshaw/Richardson. When we're getting into the realm of complete backs and disregarding just raw YPC, I think I have good cause to say what I'm saying. You look at intelligence, blocking and receiving capabilities, many of the rest of your examples folds fast.

Time will tell. I'll revisit this thread as the year progresses.

Well of course you would, your team just paid a 1st for him.

Plus Bradshaw is out this week with an injury already, so I don't see how a brand new tandem that has done nothing is better than the established ones.

ELWAY421
09-30-2013, 07:33 PM
He's was definitely a top 5 back in Cleveland, lol. In all seriousness, Trent is a good player but it is complete nonsense the way he is being overrated by many in this thread. It is completely laughable that anyone actually thinks the trading of him alone destroyed some kind of great future.

The Browns would have required many more pieces to be a great team in the future, and if they attain those pieces this trade will be forgotten and not even close to seen as a bad decision by the Browns. I doubt they made this trade to tank the season, because this trade alone is not enough to tank the season.

The Browns already were one of the worst offenses in the league, they should have traded a key defensive player(the good side of their team) if they wanted to tank their season.

Lol, well said and yes he was a top five back in Cleveland. But i think St Ignatius has some good backs or did you mean just the Browns? lol

ruksak
10-01-2013, 02:51 PM
Lol, well said and yes he was a top five back in Cleveland. But i think St Ignatius has some good backs or did you mean just the Browns? lol

I don't mean to sound disrespectful, but TRich is 3x the RB than any man in the Denver backfield. You know darn well that if Denver had snatched TRich, you'd have been jumping up and down.

#87Birdman
10-01-2013, 03:25 PM
I don't mean to sound disrespectful, but TRich is 3x the RB than any man in the Denver backfield. You know darn well that if Denver had snatched TRich, you'd have been jumping up and down.
I wouldn't. There is better things we could spend a first on then another running back. If we would of sent a first I wouldn't be jumping in joy.

Our runningback by committee seems to be working just fine as we get 130ish on the ground and we are 4-0.

JayJack
10-01-2013, 03:37 PM
If Hoyer proves to be the Franchise QB going forward, this trade just got that much better.

ruksak
10-01-2013, 04:03 PM
I wouldn't. There is better things we could spend a first on then another running back. If we would of sent a first I wouldn't be jumping in joy.

Our runningback by committee seems to be working just fine as we get 130ish on the ground and we are 4-0.

The running game in Denver (http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/stats/_/name/den/denver-broncos) is the one thing that makes me nervous. Averaging only 4 YPC and under 120 YPG, I'd say a young stud RB would be a welcome addition to Denver.

Meanwhile, the Colts (http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/stats/_/name/ind/indianapolis-colts) are reeling off 4.9 YPC and 150 YPG.

Knowshon is a really good RB imo, highly underrated. Dude is rocking 5 YPC in 2013. What I'm saying is he needs a competent partner in that Denver backfield. Considering the Broncos will likely be picking between 30-32 in 2014, a first round pick traded for a hard-nosed blocker, excellent receiving, bruising stud 2nd year RB would've been gold for the Orange and Blue.

ruksak
10-01-2013, 04:06 PM
If Hoyer proves to be the Franchise QB going forward, this trade just got that much better.

Thing is they didn't shop TRich. The way things are looking, Cleveland is going to get AT BEST...a 22nd pick out of their 3rd round pick from last year, whom they gave (I believe) 3 draft picks to move up for TR in the first place.

I believe Pitt would've jumped on this offer, a trade that apparently would've secured the Browns a much better value for their fine young stud RB.

JayJack
10-01-2013, 04:07 PM
The running game in Denver (http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/stats/_/name/den/denver-broncos) is the one thing that makes me nervous. averaging only 4 YPC and under 120 YPG, I'd say a young stud RB would be a welcome addition to Denver.

Meanwhile, the Colts (http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/stats/_/name/ind/indianapolis-colts) are reeling off 4.9 YPC and 150 YPG.

Knowshon is a really good RB imo, highly underrated. Dude is rocking 5 YPC in 2013. What I'm saying is he needs a competent partner in that Denver backfield. Considering the Broncos will likely be picking between 30-32 in 2014, a first round pick traded for a hard-nosed blocker, excellent receiving, bruising stud 2nd year RB would've been gold for the Orange and Blue.

You are comparing 2 different offenses. We're a pass 1st team, Indy is a run 1st team, so i'd expect for Indy to be better than us in the run game.

ruksak
10-01-2013, 04:21 PM
You are comparing 2 different offenses. We're a pass 1st team, Indy is a run 1st team, so i'd expect for Indy to be better than us in the run game.

With the extraordinary threat posed by Manning and his historic passing attack, y'all should be running at a much higher average. Knowshon is the only legit NFL caliber RB Denver has. 1st round pick or not, Denver needs another dimension to their running game.

#87Birdman
10-01-2013, 04:28 PM
With the extraordinary threat posed by Manning and his historic passing attack, y'all should be running at a much higher average. Knowshon is the only legit NFL caliber RB Denver has. 1st round pick or not, Denver needs another dimension to their running game.
yet 80% of hillmans carry go for 3 or more yards. Which is first so hillman is fine. Blowing a first is pointless no matter how smart you think it would be.

ELWAY421
10-01-2013, 04:35 PM
I don't mean to sound disrespectful, but TRich is 3x the RB than any man in the Denver backfield. You know darn well that if Denver had snatched TRich, you'd have been jumping up and down.

I don't think i would be jumping up and down for any running back from Alabama, products of the system. I would rather wait it out and find that Arian Foster. Like ive been saying it's common knowledge you can get decent running backs in the later rounds & it's a passing league.

ruksak
10-01-2013, 04:41 PM
Like ive been saying it's common knowledge you can get decent running backs in the later rounds & it's a passing league.

I've watched my team try for "decent" RB's in later rounds for years. It's a hit 'n' miss scenario (mostly miss). What was solid about the TRich issue is......we had NFL game tape to watch on our "1st round pick" invested in TR.

ruksak
10-01-2013, 04:46 PM
yet 80% of hillmans carry go for 3 or more yards. Which is first so hillman is fine. Blowing a first is pointless no matter how smart you think it would be.

Hillman is a bumbling fumbling stumbler that is highly questionable in pass protection. Away with him.

southern cross
10-01-2013, 05:15 PM
Hillman is a bumbling fumbling stumbler that is highly questionable in pass protection. Away with him.

Wow. That's pretty brash, to come to the Bronco's forum and post something like that. :nono:

ELWAY421
10-01-2013, 05:39 PM
I've watched my team try for "decent" RB's in later rounds for years. It's a hit 'n' miss scenario (mostly miss). What was solid about the TRich issue is......we had NFL game tape to watch on our "1st round pick" invested in TR.

Let's just see how it plays out, with where Trent was picked he should be producing like AP but that's Highly Unlikely. The Browns getting a number one no matter what pick it is, it's a win. Well as long as they use the pick correctly. I just give my opinion & i think running backs are a dime a dozen, unless it's a back like Lynch, Peterson, Foster & that Trent is not & i'd be willing to bet he never will be.....

ruksak
10-01-2013, 06:46 PM
Wow. That's pretty brash, to come to the Bronco's forum and post something like that. :nono:

Excuse me?

First of all, buddy, this is the NFL forum for fair discussion of all 32 teams. You don't see me looming in the Broncos forum ripping on the players. I have more respect for the members of this forum than that.

Secondly, being honest and giving opinion should never EVER be tethered by homerism and the delicate feelings of those whom wish not to hear anything negative at all about their team.

What is your standard, personally? Do you think no one should be allowed to criticize a Broncos player unless said poster is a dedicated Broncos fan? Did you miss my post above where I praised Moreno, or did your selective comprehension edit that out of your mind?

If I constantly trolled the forums and only had negative things to say about the Broncos, you would have a point. I AM a Broncos fan. I have as much right to discuss all aspects of Broncos football as any member here.

ruksak
10-01-2013, 06:54 PM
Let's just see how it plays out, with where Trent was picked he should be producing like AP but that's Highly Unlikely. The Browns getting a number one no matter what pick it is, it's a win. Well as long as they use the pick correctly. I just give my opinion & i think running backs are a dime a dozen, unless it's a back like Lynch, Peterson, Foster & that Trent is not & i'd be willing to bet he never will be.....

And that's a very fair opinion. Yes, I agree. Considering the pick we gave up, TRich had better start upping his intensity and YPC. Dude deserves a 3-4 week period to digest his sudden transplant. He's not just learning a new system, a new team, new blockers and a new scheme.

He had to find a residence and move to a different city. These things weigh on a professional athlete. The excuses will run dry after a short time, however. So far, TR has had approx 33 carries and is under a 3 YPC average. He looks very non-aggressive and hesitant, almost confused. Which, IMO, is perfectly understandable for the interim.

I have yet to see him show the flash he displayed in CLE when given proper blocking and support.

I do agree though that TR must become a linchpin player to justify the expense.

ELWAY421
10-01-2013, 07:14 PM
And that's a very fair opinion. Yes, I agree. Considering the pick we gave up, TRich had better start upping his intensity and YPC. Dude deserves a 3-4 week period to digest his sudden transplant. He's not just learning a new system, a new team, new blockers and a new scheme.

He had to find a residence and move to a different city. These things weigh on a professional athlete. The excuses will run dry after a short time, however. So far, TR has had approx 33 carries and is under a 3 YPC average. He looks very non-aggressive and hesitant, almost confused. Which, IMO, is perfectly understandable for the interim.

I have yet to see him show the flash he displayed in CLE when given proper blocking and support.

I do agree though that TR must become a linchpin player to justify the expense.

You should just be blessed you were able to go from one hof qb to in my opinion another. Some franchises have been in that search for YEARS example Browns no pun intended. I like your coach also.

southern cross
10-02-2013, 06:30 AM
Excuse me?

First of all, buddy,

Please don't call me "buddy".


Secondly, being honest and giving opinion should never EVER be tethered by homerism and the delicate feelings of those whom wish not to hear anything negative at all about their team.

Um, then I would think that belongs on the Smack board.

What is your standard, personally? Do you think no one should be allowed to criticize a Broncos player unless said poster is a dedicated Broncos fan? Did you miss my post above where I praised Moreno, or did your selective comprehension edit that out of your mind?

Well, your posts strike me as more critical than positive. As a Broncos fan, I would like to consider myself a cheerleader for them, and not their antagonist.

If I constantly trolled the forums and only had negative things to say about the Broncos, you would have a point. I AM a Broncos fan. I have as much right to discuss all aspects of Broncos football as any member here.

(My response in color above, and below as well.)

A Broncos fan? Is that what you mean when you say this: "I've watched my team try for "decent" RB's in later rounds for years. It's a hit 'n' miss scenario (mostly miss). What was solid about the TRich issue is......we had NFL game tape to watch on our "1st round pick" invested in TR."

And this: "....and it's not just Richardson. We have a backfield now that is among the very best in the league, suddenly, overnight we have one of the best RB tandems in football....and that's only a week after losing our phenomenal young, 2nd year starter for the year in Vick Ballard."

And this: "As for INDY, man this is great. We had one year of 'suck' and we used that #1 pick to completely rebuild the team around Luck. What happens because of this TR trade....it's like we were dimed an extra Top-5 pick to build around. It's like we had a 2nd year of 'suck' that never actually happened."

So yeah, I am a little defensive of the players on the Broncos team, a team of which I am a fan. I see them as individuals, see their hopes and dreams of making it in the NFL, see their family's pride in watching them each week. So yeah, that makes me a homer. Well, so be it then.

Charlie Brown
10-02-2013, 07:21 AM
If Hoyer proves to be the Franchise QB going forward, this trade just got that much better.

Hoyer was signed in free agency. Cleveland only traded a 3rd overall pick, along with other selections that were used to trade up, in exchange for a possible 22nd overall pick.

Cleveland lost and lost big.

ELWAY421
10-02-2013, 08:01 AM
Hoyer was signed in free agency. Cleveland only traded a 3rd overall pick, along with other selections that were used to trade up, in exchange for a possible 22nd overall pick.

Cleveland lost and lost big.

They didn't lose big. They more or less got rid of stock that was dropping just like brokers do.

Charlie Brown
10-02-2013, 11:27 AM
They didn't lose big. They more or less got rid of stock that was dropping just like brokers do.

3rd overall draft selection plus other draft selections that were used to trade up to the third overall selection costs more than a late first round pick. I don't care what your judgement of the player is. Looking at pure draft value gaining a 22nd overall selection (estimate) for a 3rd overall plus the other picks originally traded to move up to the third overall selection is horrible value for Cleveland.

ELWAY421
10-02-2013, 11:57 AM
3rd overall draft selection plus other draft selections that were used to trade up to the third overall selection costs more than a late first round pick. I don't care what your judgement of the player is. Looking at pure draft value gaining a 22nd overall selection (estimate) for a 3rd overall plus the other picks originally traded to move up to the third overall selection is horrible value for Cleveland.

Once again i have to inform you that this regime DID NOT DRAFT TRENT!!!!!! If the Colts win the Super Bowl & the Browns get the last pick & draft a player who is better than T Rich then the Browns WON.............:D

JayJack
10-02-2013, 12:21 PM
Hoyer was signed in free agency. Cleveland only traded a 3rd overall pick, along with other selections that were used to trade up, in exchange for a possible 22nd overall pick.

Cleveland lost and lost big.

Cleveland did not lose by trading Richardson to the Colts, they lost when they traded all those picks to get him in the draft, so the way I see it, they actually recouped some value. Especially since RBs are not worth 1st rd picks anymore.

Truth be told, it's way to early to determine if it was a bad trade or not. I'm willing to wait and see exactly what the Browns are going to do with that pick. Will they stand pat or will they trade it and try to stockpile picks? At the end of the day, if they hit on their pick(s), this trade was great, especially if they can trade the pick for 3 picks and hit on 2 out of the 3.

ruksak
10-02-2013, 03:48 PM
(My response in color above.)

A Broncos fan? Is that what you mean when you say this: "I've watched my team try for "decent" RB's in later rounds for years. It's a hit 'n' miss scenario (mostly miss). What was solid about the TRich issue is......we had NFL game tape to watch on our "1st round pick" invested in TR."

And this: "....and it's not just Richardson. We have a backfield now that is among the very best in the league, suddenly, overnight we have one of the best RB tandems in football....and that's only a week after losing our phenomenal young, 2nd year starter for the year in Vick Ballard."

And this: "As for INDY, man this is great. We had one year of 'suck' and we used that #1 pick to completely rebuild the team around Luck. What happens because of this TR trade....it's like we were dimed an extra Top-5 pick to build around. It's like we had a 2nd year of 'suck' that never actually happened."

So yeah, I am a little defensive of the players on the Broncos team, a team of which I am a fan. I see them as individuals, see their hopes and dreams of making it in the NFL, see their family's pride in watching them each week. So yeah, that makes me a homer. Well, so be it then.

I cannot make sense of your post. Perhaps you should try a little harder at better post-formatting? That being said, I think you're overreacting to what was a passive comment by me about Hillman. I don't care for him. Many Denver fans do not care for Hillman.

Other than that, perhaps you don't understand that many NFL fans are exactly that, fans of the game, of more than one team. I am a fan of the game first, a fan of the Colts second and a fan of the Broncos as well.

I bleed blue but I also adopt other teams that I wish to see have success.

Charlie Brown
10-02-2013, 08:21 PM
Once again i have to inform you that this regime DID NOT DRAFT TRENT!!!!!! If the Colts win the Super Bowl & the Browns get the last pick & draft a player who is better than T Rich then the Browns WON.............:D

I know they didn't draft him. They didn't draft Sheard, Rubin, Taylor, Jackson, Gordon, Thomas, Cameron and a myriad of others.

roushmartin6
10-03-2013, 12:52 AM
3rd overall draft selection plus other draft selections that were used to trade up to the third overall selection costs more than a late first round pick. I don't care what your judgement of the player is. Looking at pure draft value gaining a 22nd overall selection (estimate) for a 3rd overall plus the other picks originally traded to move up to the third overall selection is horrible value for Cleveland.

I agree. Look how long the Rams kept Jason Smith, hoping and praying that he would pan. Definately more than 1 season

BroncoFanNC
12-01-2013, 02:00 PM
Guess he was benched today.

BroncoFanNC
12-03-2013, 03:30 PM
I'd take TR over any one of those guys, save for Peterson and McCoy. Foster/Tate and Rice/Pierce are the only tandems I find more impressive than Bradshaw/Richardson. When we're getting into the realm of complete backs and disregarding just raw YPC, I think I have good cause to say what I'm saying. You look at intelligence, blocking and receiving capabilities, many of the rest of your examples folds fast.

Time will tell. I'll revisit this thread as the year progresses.

Time has told an unfavorable story so far for Trent.

Someone posted this run of his on twitter.

He took the yellow route.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BaljOSqCEAAbUhM.jpg:large

Peerless
12-04-2013, 10:07 AM
The good thing is, he's still young so he could get it together. Look at Knowshon Moreno...

He's a disappointment now, but he COULD turn it around.

BroncoFanBoy
12-04-2013, 10:58 PM
Browns easily won this trade. I was completely wrong, Richardson sucks, and the Browns got good value. If they can't put those picks they got to good use, then that team will never be good.

roushmartin6
12-05-2013, 01:31 AM
Browns easily won this trade. I was completely wrong, Richardson sucks, and the Browns got good value. If they can't put those picks they got to good use, then that team will never be good.

Trent has definately been a bust so far with the Colts but he could turn it around like Knowshon.

BroncoFanBoy
12-05-2013, 01:43 AM
Trent has definately been a bust so far with the Colts but he could turn it around like Knowshon.

Maybe, but the Colts did give them a first round pick. To live up to compensation like that is pretty tough.

Spice 1
12-05-2013, 10:44 AM
Maybe, but the Colts did give them a first round pick. To live up to compensation like that is pretty tough.

I think Knowshon's biggest problems were injuries and ball security. I don't remember Knowshon ever running up to the line of scrimmage and stopping to tie his shoes.

There was no way for anyone to know that Richardson going to bust this hard. I like how some people come on here act like they knew Lacey was going to out perform Ball. Based on what, exactly? The awesomeness of Ingram and Richardson? Nobody's buying that. We know these people aren't breaking down game tape better than NFL scouts are. Besides, I think Ball is still going to be very good for the Broncos.

BroncoFanBoy
12-05-2013, 12:21 PM
I think Knowshon's biggest problems were injuries and ball security. I don't remember Knowshon ever running up to the line of scrimmage and stopping to tie his shoes.

There was no way for anyone to know that Richardson going to bust this hard. I like how some people come on here act like they knew Lacey was going to out perform Ball. Based on what, exactly? The awesomeness of Ingram and Richardson? Nobody's buying that. We know these people aren't breaking down game tape better than NFL scouts are. Besides, I think Ball is still going to be very good for the Broncos.

What does Eddie Lacy or Montee Ball have to do with this topic? I was only talking about Richardson.

Spice 1
12-05-2013, 12:42 PM
What does Eddie Lacy or Montee Ball have to do with this topic? I was only talking about Richardson.

Uh, you were responding to a post that discussed KnoMo, so you tell me? Alabama running backs? I dunno.

It was more about the discussion in general than a direct response to you, I guess. My bad.

the0rangecrush
12-05-2013, 12:50 PM
Lombardi has done a pretty good job for his first year IMO.

roushmartin6
12-05-2013, 12:58 PM
Lombardi has done a pretty good job for his first year IMO.

I would give him an A- so far. I dock him for not squashing the Josh Gordon rumors one and for all. Josh Gordon is legit and they would be idiots to trade him away

ELWAY421
12-06-2013, 05:29 PM
Maybe one day Trent will get it together, but I tried to tell Ruk & Charlie Cleveland got the better deal in this trade. I also told Charlie that Josh Gordon was the Browns best offensive weapon....

ruksak
12-08-2013, 10:33 AM
Maybe one day Trent will get it together, but I tried to tell Ruk & Charlie Cleveland got the better deal in this trade. I also told Charlie that Josh Gordon was the Browns best offensive weapon....

After 8 or 9 games, hard to call it. In this age of instant gratification, I'm not surprised by the calls of "BUST" chattering about.

Cleveland will get a late 1st round pick. We have a question mark, which is all anyone gets with a late first round pick. It takes years for some really good backs to emerge, to figure out NFL defenses, offensive line minutia and to adjust to NFL speed. The guy that Trent now sits behind (Brown) was a late 1st round back who took 4 years to emerge as a valid NFL back. The list is too long to cite the numerous good backs whom took years to develop.

Time will be the judge of all this. If Trent stays for 5+ years and develops into that 5YPC back many think he can be, then we got our value.

ELWAY421
12-08-2013, 06:27 PM
After 8 or 9 games, hard to call it. In this age of instant gratification, I'm not surprised by the calls of "BUST" chattering about.

Cleveland will get a late 1st round pick. We have a question mark, which is all anyone gets with a late first round pick. It takes years for some really good backs to emerge, to figure out NFL defenses, offensive line minutia and to adjust to NFL speed. The guy that Trent now sits behind (Brown) was a late 1st round back who took 4 years to emerge as a valid NFL back. The list is too long to cite the numerous good backs whom took years to develop.

Time will be the judge of all this. If Trent stays for 5+ years and develops into that 5YPC back many think he can be, then we got our value.

There is no denying Josh Gordon though...

BroncoFanNC
12-08-2013, 06:31 PM
After 8 or 9 games, hard to call it. In this age of instant gratification, I'm not surprised by the calls of "BUST" chattering about.

Cleveland will get a late 1st round pick. We have a question mark, which is all anyone gets with a late first round pick. It takes years for some really good backs to emerge, to figure out NFL defenses, offensive line minutia and to adjust to NFL speed. The guy that Trent now sits behind (Brown) was a late 1st round back who took 4 years to emerge as a valid NFL back. The list is too long to cite the numerous good backs whom took years to develop.

Time will be the judge of all this. If Trent stays for 5+ years and develops into that 5YPC back many think he can be, then we got our value.

You were calling him and Bradshaw top 3 duo after what, 2 games? Works both ways man.

ruksak
12-08-2013, 07:13 PM
You were calling him and Bradshaw top 3 duo after what, 2 games? Works both ways man.

I said they could be one of the best backfields in the league, yes, before they even hit the field together. Okay, so I drooled a bit. Immediately afterward Bradshaw busted for over 90 yards in a whoopin' of the 49ers and was then put on IR.

Certainly I was excited about having two 1st round picks in the backfield backing up the best blocking RB in the league. I was .....a bit too excited, perhaps. Dwayne Allen, a phenomenal looking 2nd year TE with great blocking skills figured to be a big part of the running game. He was also put on IR immediately afterward.

Our O-line is a dumpster fire. Our front office has much work to do in the off-season. Perhaps my comments were a bit premature. Similarly, I feel the calls of this trade being a total bust for the Colts are equally premature.

ELWAY421
12-08-2013, 07:15 PM
I said they could be one of the best backfields in the league, yes, before they even hit the field together. Okay, so I drooled a bit. Immediately afterward Bradshaw busted for over 90 yards in a whoopin' of the 49ers and was then put on IR.

Certainly I was excited about having two 1st round picks in the backfield backing up the best blocking RB in the league. I was .....a bit too excited, perhaps. Dwayne Allen, a phenomenal looking 2nd year TE with great blocking skills figured to be a big part of the running game. He was also put on IR immediately afterward.

Our O-line is a dumpster fire. Our front office has much work to do in the off-season. Perhaps my comments were a bit premature. Similarly, I feel the calls of this trade being a total bust for the Colts are equally premature.

Cincinnati put one on you today man. You could use Josh Gordon, that would have been a good trade. :D

ruksak
12-11-2013, 05:00 AM
Cincinnati put one on you today man. You could use Josh Gordon, that would have been a good trade. :D

http://media1.giphy.com/media/BinjLhciLF2gM/giphy.gif

fallforward3y+
12-17-2013, 03:14 AM
I said they could be one of the best backfields in the league, yes, before they even hit the field together. Okay, so I drooled a bit. Immediately afterward Bradshaw busted for over 90 yards in a whoopin' of the 49ers and was then put on IR.

Certainly I was excited about having two 1st round picks in the backfield backing up the best blocking RB in the league. I was .....a bit too excited, perhaps. Dwayne Allen, a phenomenal looking 2nd year TE with great blocking skills figured to be a big part of the running game. He was also put on IR immediately afterward.

Our O-line is a dumpster fire. Our front office has much work to do in the off-season. Perhaps my comments were a bit premature. Similarly, I feel the calls of this trade being a total bust for the Colts are equally premature.

If them being first round picks was why you were excited, it's no surprise you were disappointed. That means nothing once they go to training camp. That, and overestimating the significance of an every down back.

The every down back is sort of the 'holy trinity' in the NFL, with fantasy football and all but it really isn't that important for the carries to all be given to one guy. A rotation works better, using each back for their skill set. Even when somebody has a monster season, you never see an every down back team be the number 1 run game anymore.

fallforward3y+
12-17-2013, 03:21 AM
There is no denying Josh Gordon though...

This was the biggest issue I had with people overhyping the trade. Everyone was saying CLE was probably tanking their season, and even that they completely wrecked their future over a back who had done fairly well, but wasn't near the top in any area yet. There's just no way that trade could have screwed their future that much.

Josh Gordon was their best offensive player, and would be still if Richardson was around. The Browns aren't good, but they never were with Richardson. Having Gordon and Cameron playing together made the Browns offense better after Richardson left, which clearly showed that there were offensive players who impacted the Browns more than Richardson.