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bronx_2003
11-15-2015, 06:03 PM
Beckham goes up, leaps for the ball, catches it... And then one foot lands, then the second foot lands... After the second foot is down, and it clearly was down while he still had possession, the DB swings and smacks ball out of his hand.

Not sure the rule... Nobody knows what a catch is... But, the WR had possession, two feet landed inbounds, in the end zone... He is standing there, with two feet down, has ball... Not sure how that isn't a catch...

I thought it was pretty clear that it was dropped..... but then if they give Tate that TD against the Bears a few weeks back I'm not sure what the difference is

ArchAngel
11-15-2015, 06:03 PM
Fox is gonna bring the house if Manning plays. Manning is making bad decisions in the face of heat and when he does get his passes off, the balls flat like theyre loaded with helium. Bears have a good line that can bring it. I dont like our chances.

ABQBronco25
11-15-2015, 06:03 PM
So begins a fun week of who should start... .Oz or Manning. SMH

If we had a halfway decent O-line either might have a chance to succeed. Peyton reads defenses better, OZ has some mobility. Right now I don't care who starts next week, I more ticked off at back to back losses.

Even if Oz has to wait yet again for his first career start, I think the past 3.5 years have done wonders for him. There is nobody better to learn from than Peyton, and regardless of who plays here on out, or how this season ends, I would sign Brock to an extension for sure. Losing Peyton's salary off the cap will definitely give the team some nice leeway. Brock and Von would be my two priorities.

Blondie79
11-15-2015, 06:04 PM
With this probably being mannings final season, (maybe even game who knows) the Broncos have to let brock play imo, they need to see what they have for the future.

dizzolve
11-15-2015, 06:04 PM
Manning stunk today and deserves the benching he got.

But don't be fooled with Brock.... defense plays differently against Manning than Brock.
Just saying.

yeah - so did the QB. It's not like they backed off. Don't YOU be fooled - this isn't the Indy Peyton Manning

fraguela09
11-15-2015, 06:05 PM
No it was a good call. No TD
We all just wanted it to be

What is the rule then? Two feet down, possession, in end zone... I thought they changed that rule, after the debacle in DET about having to possess ball through the falling down... Or whatever... Not clear n the rule tho... But, you're know if that were us... It would be ruled a catch.

JesseH
11-15-2015, 06:06 PM
Only games I watched this year and actually was impressived by peyton was KC game...which he sucked until the 4th, and green bay where the whole offense looked good.

I would like to know everyone's opinion, is it all on Manning or is the o-line still "sucking" as well? KC was also getting good pressure on Brock. So it makes me think that the o-line is still not clicking. At this point, I'm wondring if the talent, maybe experience just isn't there.

theMileHighGuy
11-15-2015, 06:06 PM
The difference is, Manning was the ONLY part of the team that played well against Indianapolis, for example. He also has 4 game winning/go ahead drives in 4th quarters of games this year. He also has lots of drives that moved down the field only to stall in the red zone, where Brock would likely have stumbled well before getting it that far.

Manning has done positive things this year. His presence changes the way defenses have to play, not matter how he looks from one week to the next. Generic pressure and containment will shut Brock down.

That first bits just a flat out lie.

His presence does change the way defenses have to play. They can sit on his short dump offs, bubble screens, and other easy stuff, and force us to run the ball or worse challenge Peyt to go over the middle or take a coin flip deep shot. That latter two which have produced INT after INT.

fraguela09
11-15-2015, 06:07 PM
How long does a DB get to bat the ball out... GEEZ. That was a catch... two feet in..not even a dragged toe. two feet and two steps. That call was BS

It so subjective... Nothing is clear... We have to remember, it was ruled a TD on the field... Replay clearly show WR has ball in hands, second come foot has touched down... Then ball is punched out a nanosecond after it...

colts_fan55
11-15-2015, 06:08 PM
yeah - so did the QB. It's not like they backed off. Don't YOU be fooled - this isn't the Indy Peyton Manning

Get a grip - nowhere did I say this was the old PM.

Chiefs were playing prevent defense..if you didn't see that then oh well.

I have no clue who Kubiak will start next week - but with that OL-- doesn't matter.

Colem9r
11-15-2015, 06:08 PM
Well I honestly don't see us making the playoffs, chiefs or raiders will overtake us for division. Really who we going to beat Rest of season at Chicago (L), NE (L), at SD (maybe a win due to their injuries) , Raiders (L), at Steelers (L), Cincy (L) and SD (if they beat us first time they will second time also so 7-9 maybe 9-7 don't think good enough for playoffs, with manning at the helm.

Starbroncs
11-15-2015, 06:08 PM
I would like to know everyone's opinion, is it all on Manning or is the o-line still "sucking" as well? KC was also getting good pressure on Brock. So it makes me think that the o-line is still not clicking. At this point, I'm wondring if the talent, maybe experience just isn't there.

honestly its both, of course the line sucks and it hurts manning. However even when manning gets the ball off....even when he isnt pressured....he still throws ints or incomplete passes.

Broncoholic JS
11-15-2015, 06:09 PM
What do we as Broncos fans have to do to be as lucky as New England fans?

I mean, really. Why do they get everything and all calls go their way?

What soul must we sacrifice for it to happen?

Tired of watching them get everything handed to them.

colts_fan55
11-15-2015, 06:09 PM
It so subjective... Nothing is clear... We have to remember, it was ruled a TD on the field... Replay clearly show WR has ball in hands, second come foot has touched down... Then ball is punched out a nanosecond after it...

That is what even boggles my mind... what conclusive evidence did they see to turn that call over....

colts_fan55
11-15-2015, 06:10 PM
What do we as Broncos fans have to do to be as lucky as New England fans?

I mean, really. Why do they get everything and all calls go their way?

What soul must we sacrifice for it to happen?

Tired of watching them get everything handed to them.

Cheat!

But no fan base wants that. I'd rather be a loser than a cheater.. seriously.

Broncos-R-Great
11-15-2015, 06:10 PM
That is what even boggles my mind... what conclusive evidence did they see to turn that call over....

Patriots get all of the calls, it is what it is....

mozzerpete
11-15-2015, 06:10 PM
Chicken Parm you taste no good. :hurt:

BroncoSynapses
11-15-2015, 06:11 PM
Unreal. Collins drops a pass that he caught and went to the ground with - a game clinching INT against Brady - and the Patriots eek their way down the field for the game winning FG as a result.

How much luckier can they get?

Hopefully they lose in the Superbowl. Not sure who it could be from the NFC, but hope they can do it.

Broncos-R-Great
11-15-2015, 06:11 PM
Brady has about another year in him, then he'll go downhill as fast as Manning, we saw a preview of it early last year.

colts_fan55
11-15-2015, 06:12 PM
Well I honestly don't see us making the playoffs, chiefs or raiders will overtake us for division. Really who we going to beat Rest of season at Chicago (L), NE (L), at SD (maybe a win due to their injuries) , Raiders (L), at Steelers (L), Cincy (L) and SD (if they beat us first time they will second time also so 7-9 maybe 9-7 don't think good enough for playoffs, with manning at the helm.

you guys will still make the playoffs. Get Ware and Talib back - Brock just has to be a game manager... (but he looks better than that) and let your defense win games.

Springs
11-15-2015, 06:13 PM
The difference is, Manning was the ONLY part of the team that played well against Indianapolis, for example. He also has 4 game winning/go ahead drives in 4th quarters of games this year. He also has lots of drives that moved down the field only to stall in the red zone, where Brock would likely have stumbled well before getting it that far.

Manning has done positive things this year. His presence changes the way defenses have to play, not matter how he looks from one week to the next. Generic pressure and containment will shut Brock down.

So your evidence that we would be 2-7 with Brock is a game we lost anyways? Yeah, if Brock was in we would have lost super hard.

And yes, Manning had a few good drives, digging us out of holes he created. This isn't a matter of a poor defense Manning bailed out, the defense was solid. All we needed was a slightly competent offense to win those games. We didn't have it, but some last minute turnovers and a few good plays bailed us out anyways. Implying that Manning saved us in those games is ridiculous.

Starbroncs
11-15-2015, 06:14 PM
you guys will still make the playoffs. Get Ware and Talib back - Brock just has to be a game manager... (but he looks better than that) and let your defense win games.

except it will most likely be peyton. I know everyone says we say a look at our future and have hopes for brock to be even average so we dont have to watch manning any longer but....lets be honest the odds are we see manning again next week.

BroncoSynapses
11-15-2015, 06:15 PM
Patriots get all of the calls, it is what it is....

Wonder if Kraft gave a few bonuses to the refs. I wouldn't put it past him.

ABQBronco25
11-15-2015, 06:15 PM
Brady has about another year in him, then he'll go downhill as fast as Manning, we saw a preview of it early last year.

Exactly. This "playing 7 or 8 more years" talk is complete wishful thinking. He'll hit the age cliff just like Peyton and Favre. Brady is not above Father Time.

Broncoholic JS
11-15-2015, 06:17 PM
Wonder if Kraft gave a few bonuses to the refs. I wouldn't put it past him.

If this is the case, I truly hope this league folds and it ceases to exist.

I know Goodell and Kraft have a love affair. Wouldn't put it past them.

Broncoholic JS
11-15-2015, 06:17 PM
Exactly. This "playing 7 or 8 more years" talk is complete wishful thinking. He'll hit the age cliff just like Peyton and Favre. Brady is not above Father Time.

Is it wrong I hope Miller takes him out in 2 weeks?

KansasKrista
11-15-2015, 06:18 PM
I've always suspected that the fix was in with the Patriots.
I think the only reason Brady was suspended by the league was to save face. There was such an out cry from the media and public.

Goddell and Kraft are best buddies.. The Pats aren't that good and they can't be that lucky so do the math.

BroncoSynapses
11-15-2015, 06:19 PM
Well I honestly don't see us making the playoffs, chiefs or raiders will overtake us for division. Really who we going to beat Rest of season at Chicago (L), NE (L), at SD (maybe a win due to their injuries) , Raiders (L), at Steelers (L), Cincy (L) and SD (if they beat us first time they will second time also so 7-9 maybe 9-7 don't think good enough for playoffs, with manning at the helm.

Yup, 2009 all over again. Ugh. Going to be hard to watch. But, at least we'll make a few good plays to cheer for and we still get to watch Bronco football, even if a majority are losses. And we'll always have the Green Bay game! lol

bronx_2003
11-15-2015, 06:20 PM
Is it wrong I hope Miller takes him out in 2 weeks?

That would be fantastic to see. I have zero respect for Brady after he dragged the league through the courts. Him getting carted off in a few weeks would be justice

FL BRONCO
11-15-2015, 06:21 PM
Wow Dungy just said Manning should sit for a couple of weeks and Kubes was quoted as saying he should not have played Manning-----We may just see a change

bronx_2003
11-15-2015, 06:22 PM
Yup, 2009 all over again. Ugh. Going to be hard to watch. But, at least we'll make a few good plays to cheer for and we still get to watch Bronco football, even if a majority are losses. And we'll always have the Green Bay game! lol

We're win this division because its awful, but have zero chance of winning in NE. This season from the Broncos point of view is a complete waste of time.... they are just waiting for Manning to retire now

BroncoSynapses
11-15-2015, 06:22 PM
If this is the case, I truly hope this league folds and it ceases to exist.

I know Goodell and Kraft have a love affair. Wouldn't put it past them.

It would hard to still support the league. And I hope it's not the case, but with NE's track record. You have to think they're stretching the rules somewhere.

Peanut
11-15-2015, 06:22 PM
I've always been proud that Broncos fans = class.

arapaho
11-15-2015, 06:23 PM
Then the Broncos would be 2-7.

Thats a tear in the bucket

He would not have played worse thsn manning....unless your saying manning made the defense dominate

Manning did nothing that brock couldnt have

BroncoSynapses
11-15-2015, 06:23 PM
Wow Dungy just said Manning should sit for a couple of weeks and Kubes was quoted as saying he should not have played Manning-----We may just see a change

I saw that, and I think if Brock started today, we would have won. Just to remove the turnovers gives this team a chance.

Blondie79
11-15-2015, 06:24 PM
Wow Dungy just said Manning should sit for a couple of weeks and Kubes was quoted as saying he should not have played Manning-----We may just see a change

We will only see a change if manning is hurting still, people can blame injuries all they want, but he has not played well through 9 games at all. I was not ready to see manning on the bench but that all changed today i do not think he will improve and its sadly the end for him imo.

Broncoholic JS
11-15-2015, 06:24 PM
It would hard to still support the league. And I hope it's not the case, but with NE's track record. You have to think they're stretching the rules somewhere.

I agree with you.

They do have a long track record of cheating.

tonray
11-15-2015, 06:24 PM
I blame Elway and the coaching staff. They had all pre-season and practice for 8 weeks to see that Peyton was washed up and yet they continued to play him. That is just incompetence. You mean to tell me that Peyton was throwing bullets in practice, hitting everyone in stride and yet in games he sucks ? They all knew what was going to happen and let it....fire Kubiak. He is not a coach but a fool.

And Peyton....why would you embarrass yourself for a few meaningless records...you could have retired after last year and be thought of much more highly. Now when I think of Peyton I think of the guy who pretended to be healthy and able just to get some personal records even though he knew he would be screwing his team....he should be ashamed of himself.

Starbroncs
11-15-2015, 06:25 PM
I saw that, and I think if Brock started today, we would have won. Just to remove the turnovers gives this team a chance.

the defense didnt play great but they actually usually held them to field goals even though the chiefs usually got the ball at mid field. Take away mannings 4 turnovers and we probably would have had a chance....plus the momentum.

Broncoholic JS
11-15-2015, 06:25 PM
Can Manning just announce his retirement already? This way we are handed a Super Bowl like Pittsburgh (Bettis) and Baltimore (Lewis) were.

bronx_2003
11-15-2015, 06:28 PM
I agree with you.

They do have a long track record of cheating.

If a Bronco player had been called out for bending the rules and instead of taking his punishment started crying through the media and dragged the league through the courts I would completely lose interest in said player.

Brady is no different. How any fan of the sport can support him I will never know. Lets just hope that at some point justice is done ..... the sort of justice that the legal system often fails to provide

Colem9r
11-15-2015, 06:28 PM
I blame Elway and the coaching staff. They had all pre-season and practice for 8 weeks to see that Peyton was washed up and yet they continued to play him. That is just incompetence. You mean to tell me that Peyton was throwing bullets in practice, hitting everyone in stride and yet in games he sucks ? They all knew what was going to happen and let it....fire Kubiak. He is not a coach but a fool.

And Peyton....why would you embarrass yourself for a few meaningless records...you could have retired after last year and be thought of much more highly. Now when I think of Peyton I think of the guy who pretended to be healthy and able just to get some personal records even though he knew he would be screwing his team....he should be ashamed of himself.

I think Elway wanted to let peyton make the decision, I don't think its bad just Elway trying to be classy due to Mannings legacy. As for Manning I think its EGO, he wont retire with the rings he should have gotten. But he will with the TD and passing yardage records.

Freyaka
11-15-2015, 06:29 PM
Manning hasn't played well save one game this year... the way he played today he should have been benched earlier, I'm sure we'll go back to Manning, I'm not certain I agree that we should though.

I actually think we'll give brock the start for the next 1-2 games and unless he plays so well that the coaches have no choice but to leave him in, I'm thinking once Manning is healed he'll have one more attempt at recovering this season.

Colem9r
11-15-2015, 06:30 PM
I actually think we'll give brock the start for the next 1-2 games and unless he plays so well that the coaches have no choice but to leave him in, I'm thinking once Manning is healed he'll have one more attempt at recovering this season.


Not if Brock beats NE. Then its his team.

OPP
11-15-2015, 06:31 PM
The defense was solid? you are a huge Manning hater. The WHOLE team sucked. Take off your anti Manning blinders.


The defense wasn't THAT bad considering the 5 INT and the bad field position all day long... They didn't play great but they still did a decent job... With a good offensive with would habe been a complete different story

Blondie79
11-15-2015, 06:32 PM
The Defense was on the field for what seemed like hours, can hardly blame them for the loss.

Broncoholic JS
11-15-2015, 06:32 PM
Not if Brock beats NE. Then its his team.

I agree. If that happens we could see the passing of the torch in the AFC/NFL.

Wouldn't that be awesome to witness Brock's rising and Brady's fall?

colts_fan55
11-15-2015, 06:32 PM
except it will most likely be peyton. I know everyone says we say a look at our future and have hopes for brock to be even average so we dont have to watch manning any longer but....lets be honest the odds are we see manning again next week.

I seriously think Manning is physically hurting and tried to play through. However he is now hurting the team.... he will be benched ala "phantom injury" .

canadiansbronco
11-15-2015, 06:36 PM
The difference is, Manning was the ONLY part of the team that played well against Indianapolis, for example. He also has 4 game winning/go ahead drives in 4th quarters of games this year. He also has lots of drives that moved down the field only to stall in the red zone, where Brock would likely have stumbled well before getting it that far.

stalled due to his play half the time....
Manning has done positive things this year. His presence changes the way defenses have to play, not matter how he looks from one week to the next. Generic pressure and containment will shut Brock down.

dude just drop it, manning has been hot garbage all year outside of a play here and there. Defense aren't scared of him and they definelty dont game plan like it was 2013....

He is done just accept it

broncos SB2010
11-15-2015, 06:42 PM
I blame Elway and the coaching staff. They had all pre-season and practice for 8 weeks to see that Peyton was washed up and yet they continued to play him. That is just incompetence. You mean to tell me that Peyton was throwing bullets in practice, hitting everyone in stride and yet in games he sucks ? They all knew what was going to happen and let it....fire Kubiak. He is not a coach but a fool.

And Peyton....why would you embarrass yourself for a few meaningless records...you could have retired after last year and be thought of much more highly. Now when I think of Peyton I think of the guy who pretended to be healthy and able just to get some personal records even though he knew he would be screwing his team....he should be ashamed of himself.

Os hasn't proven he is any better....get over it........

Freyaka
11-15-2015, 06:47 PM
Not if Brock beats NE. Then its his team.

I don't see that as an overly likely possibility, I'd love to be proven wrong.

AZ Snake Fan
11-15-2015, 06:48 PM
.



I agree with you Frey !

Some of you need to chill out.
Denver is 7-2.
I can only think of 3 out of 32 NFL teams with a better record.
Denver is almost a lock for the AFCW Division Title.

Sure, we're not happy right now but the end of the world it ain't.
We're just spoiled.
Guaranteed, most of the other NFL teams' fans would gladly trade places with us.

.

Broncoholic JS
11-15-2015, 06:49 PM
Kubiak said in his postgame that he shouldn't have started Manning today. Wow.

gmjones2001
11-15-2015, 06:54 PM
Clearly they didn't have a plan for the o-line this past off season.

Exactly.

...and with Kubiak coming in as HC proclaiming he wants to run the ball well you have to wonder how we ended up with the results we've seen on the field for NINE games. Our O line has sucked golf balls through garden hoses, especially the run blocking. The pass blocking has been mediocre until today, where it was terrible. How did Elway and and the FO miss this one?

colts_fan55
11-15-2015, 06:56 PM
I blame Elway and the coaching staff. They had all pre-season and practice for 8 weeks to see that Peyton was washed up and yet they continued to play him. That is just incompetence. You mean to tell me that Peyton was throwing bullets in practice, hitting everyone in stride and yet in games he sucks ? They all knew what was going to happen and let it....fire Kubiak. He is not a coach but a fool.

And Peyton....why would you embarrass yourself for a few meaningless records...you could have retired after last year and be thought of much more highly. Now when I think of Peyton I think of the guy who pretended to be healthy and able just to get some personal records even though he knew he would be screwing his team....he should be ashamed of himself.

Yes - I may be biased towards Peyton here....however these professional athletes, especially Peyton's caliber - this is their life, this is what they love to do, don't know how to do anything else.
I don't know him personally - but I doub't he went back to just play for his personal records... its all about the ring and all about the football life. It is what they love and know,may not be right, but it is what it is.

Can't fire Kubiak..lol he is 7-2 and his team is leading the division.

bobertlt29
11-15-2015, 06:59 PM
Brock has to be the starter next week, question about it.

Yes I have a question about it. He has scored garbage time points. What makes you think he can do well the rest of the game. Remember Peyton scored garbage time points against the Hawks late in the game in the superbowl

PhoenixDread
11-15-2015, 07:12 PM
With Brock there is zero fear because he won't read a defense as well, won't be as accurate, and won't lead game-winning drives at the end. All of those are more important than movement. How is movement working for Rodgers the last 3 games? Newton, a guy who can move, has the 2nd least amount of pocket movement among QB's in the league. Why? Because movement leads to injuries, tired o-linemen, and busted plays. It's all about the pocket. The best QB's will ALWAYS be the ones who can do the work stationary.

You mean like Elway was?

Sophia23
11-15-2015, 07:25 PM
Wow Dungy just said Manning should sit for a couple of weeks and Kubes was quoted as saying he should not have played Manning-----We may just see a change

I think through at least the Bears game it would be a good idea. I think he could use some rest, and hopefully heal up to finish up the season. I think Brock and Peyton both have the plus sides ... but Peyton has looked rough all season, and maybe a week or two on the bench would do us good for the remaining season.

cornrose
11-15-2015, 07:32 PM
Patriots get all of the calls, it is what it is....

There were actually some brutal calls against NE early in their game today...

What makes it so easy for NE fans is not the refs' constant love but the fact they have by far the best HC/QB combo in the sport and have for some time...

What makes it so frustrating for every NFL fan outside of New England is that Belichik and Brady are two of the most subtly despicable human beings in the league... cheating for years against equal or superior foes, running up scores against helpless weaker foes, walking off the field without shaking hands/congratulating the victor when they lose (Belichik in SB XLII - the most classless move I've ever seen in 40+ years of watching the NFL).

Belichik intentionally makes reporters' jobs harder at press conferences with his grim demeanor and lack of responses and Brady always lets the 'little guys' take the fall for his on-the-field transgressions (in NE and at Michigan) and has f-ed over every woman he's been with before Giselle (and probably her, too). They are just not good people so it's tough to stomach their success, whether they get the benefit of refs' doubts or not...

dizzolve
11-15-2015, 08:03 PM
Kubiak will never be fired. He'll retire. He'll probably have the longest leash of any Broncos coach ever. Hopefully we wont be looking at it like that but, he and Elway are pretty much a match made in heaven. At least from their perspective...... and maybe mine too.

If it was easy to build a championship NFL team, everyone would do it .......... lol. Fact is, only 1 can be world champs each season no matter how good your team is. It's tough, competitive business where luck DOES factor in.

I believe in Kubiak's (shanny's) system. Kubiak is having to be someone he isn't quite because Manning is playing. And it's been the right choice. Even Tebow was the right choice back in the day. It had to run it's course. It's just the way it has to be. Eventually Kubiak will have this team where he can run it with his own vision and then .... it'll be ON.

The Manning experiment was fun and I don't know why he's really bad this season except that he's old. So what do you do - give him the rest of this season and call it? Or just cut him short for the sake of winning despite his choice to come to Denver and help the Broncos be competitve the past 5 years. Do you thank him by allowing him to play out the season? Or do you only show loyalty to ..... 'best chance to win'. That's what I'm interested to see. Just where is the line going to be drawn

bobertlt29
11-16-2015, 06:09 PM
Gotta respect the deep ball

For the most part, Manning has been pretty accurate with deep balls.

#24 Next Champ
11-16-2015, 07:23 PM
For the most part, Manning has been pretty accurate with deep balls.

Unbelievable.......10

#24 Next Champ
11-16-2015, 07:28 PM
Btw anyone who argued that call against NE is blatantly wrong

He did not complete the process of the catch and I love how the rule is....and I find it absolutely clear, blatantly clear

I don't get what is so confusing to most people about what is or is not a catch

It's simple. You have to control the ball throughout the entirety of the catch...through contact or through hitting the ground. SIMPLE.

#24 Next Champ
11-16-2015, 07:32 PM
Heard the refs bailed out the Pats today. Took away a TD from NYG.

No they didn't. He clearly did not maintain control. Ball was knocked out as he came down with it. Simple, easy call.

bobertlt29
11-16-2015, 07:34 PM
I blame Elway and the coaching staff. They had all pre-season and practice for 8 weeks to see that Peyton was washed up and yet they continued to play him. That is just incompetence. You mean to tell me that Peyton was throwing bullets in practice, hitting everyone in stride and yet in games he sucks ? They all knew what was going to happen and let it....fire Kubiak. He is not a coach but a fool.

And Peyton....why would you embarrass yourself for a few meaningless records...you could have retired after last year and be thought of much more highly. Now when I think of Peyton I think of the guy who pretended to be healthy and able just to get some personal records even though he knew he would be screwing his team....he should be ashamed of himself.

Seriously. The guy wanted to contribute to this team and win a Super Bowl. Even today he took blame for his poor play and didn't try to take the easy way out and blame the injuries.