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Deisel
08-29-2005, 11:18 PM
I was watching the BDSSP on fox sports rocky mountain tonight,not sure why,but probably because I left the station on after watching the Rockies play.
So that dork host,whatever his name is tries to drum up a little contro over the Clarett dismissal saying Shanahan blew it ,citing the Patriots mid round pick succsess.He fails to mention the Pat's picks had the drive and humility to make it.
Thanks to Rodney Peete for setting any viewers they might have straight,mentioning what a running back factory Denver is,and how you must compete,not just chill ,if you want to be on a pro team.By,Mo.

Broncofan4rmLA
08-29-2005, 11:29 PM
I was watching the BDSSP on fox sports rocky mountain tonight,not sure why,but probably because I left the station on after watching the Rockies play.
So that dork host,whatever his name is tries to drum up a little contro over the Clarett dismissal saying Shanahan blew it ,citing the Patriots mid round pick succsess.He fails to mention the Pat's picks had the drive and humility to make it.
Thanks to Rodney Peete for setting any viewers they might have straight,mentioning what a running back factory Denver is,and how you must compete,not just chill ,if you want to be on a pro team.By,Mo.

I saw the later part of the show and the same Rodney Peete you are thanking said the Broncos wouldn't make the playoffs. BTW, welcome to the boards(for your first post)...

Sevenis7
08-30-2005, 04:38 PM
I can't stand "Best Damn". Ever since "Sportscenter", all these sports reporters think they're comics. Some of us just want the highlights w/a bit of analysis. "NFL Primetime" and "NFL Match-up" are much better shows that this "Seinfeld" meets "Sportcenter" meets "Hawaiian Tropic Bikini Final" piece of garbage show.

OrangeShadow
09-01-2005, 09:12 AM
I enjoy nfl prime time and sportscenter but thats it

myoung
09-05-2005, 09:48 PM
I was watching the BDSSP on fox sports rocky mountain tonight,not sure why,but probably because I left the station on after watching the Rockies play.
So that dork host,whatever his name is tries to drum up a little contro over the Clarett dismissal saying Shanahan blew it ,citing the Patriots mid round pick succsess.He fails to mention the Pat's picks had the drive and humility to make it.
Thanks to Rodney Peete for setting any viewers they might have straight,mentioning what a running back factory Denver is,and how you must compete,not just chill ,if you want to be on a pro team.By,Mo.

Hey I am not a big fan of the show but shanahan did blow it. The only good thing about it was that he admitted it early and got the cancer off of the team. I have been saying since the draft that the Clarett and Paymah picks may have been the two worst picks of the entire draft (not just our team).

In the Clarett case it is easy to see why. In the Paymah case we took a guy in the third round that would have easily been available in the 5th round. Clarett would have been there in the 5th or 6th round. I still believe that we could have traded our first third round pick for a couple of fifth rounders. We could have picked both these guys up later and not wasted the pick we did on Clarett. We could have had a guy that would have stuck on the roster.

It was a mistake. Even Mike admits it. The best part of the pick was admitting the error early.

watchthemiddle
09-06-2005, 09:36 PM
Shanahan came out immediatly and said that they made a mistake. End of discussion end of story. SO why does all of the knuckleheaded monday morning general managers feel the need to degrade shanahan and also say it was a mistake.

myoung
09-06-2005, 09:50 PM
Shanahan came out immediatly and said that they made a mistake. End of discussion end of story. SO why does all of the knuckleheaded monday morning general managers feel the need to degrade shanahan and also say it was a mistake.

OK here is the problem.....

It is not just Clarett. Look back to our recent drafts and see how many players have stuck on the roster. It is very few. Sean Salisbury said it well this evening. Shannahan is one of the very best X and O s guy in the business and he is one of the worst GMs. I don't know that I would go so far to say he was the worst but he is not even average.

The knuckleheads are the ones that turn a blind eye and don't care that we draft three or four players a year that we reach on. This is the problem. This year the argument could be made that Williams, Paymah, and Clarett were all drafted high. Williams was certainly not as high as the other two. Last year Williams was a good pick but Watts was probably 2 rounds to high. Bell also went higher than expected but some of that can be explained by the run of RBs that was occuring at the time. It is not only that we reach. Guys don't stay on the roster long. This is the problem.

I think Shanny is one of the best offensive minds ever. I also believe that we don't have to take the bad with the good. We could be making better personel decisions (especially in the draft).

watchthemiddle
09-06-2005, 09:56 PM
OK here is the problem.....

It is not just Clarett. Look back to our recent drafts and see how many players have stuck on the roster. It is very few. Sean Salisbury said it well this evening. Shannahan is one of the very best X and O s guy in the business and he is one of the worst GMs. I don't know that I would go so far to say he was the worst but he is not even average.

The knuckleheads are the ones that turn a blind eye and don't care that we draft three or four players a year that we reach on. This is the problem. This year the argument could be made that Williams, Paymah, and Clarett were all drafted high. Williams was certainly not as high as the other two. Last year Williams was a good pick but Watts was probably 2 rounds to high. Bell also went higher than expected but some of that can be explained by the run of RBs that was occuring at the time. It is not only that we reach. Guys don't stay on the roster long. This is the problem.

I think Shanny is one of the best offensive minds ever. I also believe that we don't have to take the bad with the good. We could be making better personel decisions (especially in the draft).

True, that being said, no teams have all of their draft picks all pan out. The only reason Shanahan is always under the microscope for his picks is because he never takes the obvious. Example: Last years draft in the first round with our #17 pick I think we traded down to something in the 20's and then drafted DJ williams when everyone else had us pegged to get the RB from Oregon State who is now with the Rams ( names slips my mind ). I am sure all GM's out there would say they have some draft busts. He doesn't do good in the earlyl rounds, but he sure does shine late. No one ever mentions that though.

rcsodak
09-06-2005, 10:50 PM
Tonight, they had Brown (the other GOAT), and they asked him about Clarrett.
Whether he'd talked with him lately? No
Whether he advised against the contract? No
What he DID advise? For Clarrett to play another year in college before coming out.

They also asked him whether he though Rice is the GOAT, and his answer was quite succinct.
He said he never played WR, nor did LTaylor, or Montana, or Butkus, etx.....
...his definition of a GOAT is not really important, as it's A TEAM SPORT, and that's all that should really matter.

CP's to Brown!!!!! :beer:

myoung
09-07-2005, 01:42 PM
True, that being said, no teams have all of their draft picks all pan out. The only reason Shanahan is always under the microscope for his picks is because he never takes the obvious. Example: Last years draft in the first round with our #17 pick I think we traded down to something in the 20's and then drafted DJ williams when everyone else had us pegged to get the RB from Oregon State who is now with the Rams ( names slips my mind ). I am sure all GM's out there would say they have some draft busts. He doesn't do good in the earlyl rounds, but he sure does shine late. No one ever mentions that though.

you couldn't be more incorrect. We traded up to the 17 pick far before the draft. Alot of experts felt we could use a RB and predicted we may take Steven Jackson. In reality not many of us on this board felt we would go that direction.

What do you mean he sure shines late? I assume you are talking about TD and Mike anderson because the last several drafts have sucked big time late. Look at the last four years and find me a guy that we have found late. It is time to stop saying Shanny is great because he picked TD. Don't you think it is more likely that he is a great offensive mind and about any RB we put back there will succeed? No one ever mentions it because it is not true anymore.

DJ has been a good pick but Jackson is no slouch and will put up big numbers this year in St. Louis. The problem is that last year we picked Watts in the late second round and it was at least one round and maybe two rounds too high.

Everyone had DJ predicted in the top 20. This was one of Shanny's good picks. The problem is that we have many times where we pick a guy he likes way way way too early. Most of them don't pan out and we end up wasting the pick. But the bigger problem is that guys like, Pierce, Watts, Foster, Clarett, Paymah all could have been taken at least one round later. We could have picked up another quality player and picked these guys up still. This is the definition of a bad job by a GM.

Now on that list foster has panned out but if we could have had him in the second round and a first rounder also wouldn't we be in a better position?

It is a question of value at the position picked and we just don't do well. At least we do better than the Raiders and the Seahawks so that is a start I guess.

myoung
09-07-2005, 01:44 PM
True, that being said, no teams have all of their draft picks all pan out. The only reason Shanahan is always under the microscope for his picks is because he never takes the obvious. Example: Last years draft in the first round with our #17 pick I think we traded down to something in the 20's and then drafted DJ williams when everyone else had us pegged to get the RB from Oregon State who is now with the Rams ( names slips my mind ). I am sure all GM's out there would say they have some draft busts. He doesn't do good in the earlyl rounds, but he sure does shine late. No one ever mentions that though.

And by the way last year I won our draft challenge by successfully predicting that Mike would pick DJ in the first round. There were several others on this board that predicted it as well. There were also several draft experts that predicted it.

A better example for you point would have been the surprise pick of Clarett, because that did shock everyone..... But how did that go anyway????

Charlie Brown
09-07-2005, 01:48 PM
I can't stand "Best Damn". Ever since "Sportscenter", all these sports reporters think they're comics. Some of us just want the highlights w/a bit of analysis. "NFL Primetime" and "NFL Match-up" are much better shows that this "Seinfeld" meets "Sportcenter" meets "Hawaiian Tropic Bikini Final" piece of garbage show.

I watch NFL Primetime on occasion. But they are extremely biased .. like all sports shows. I have NFL network too - but it is like all repeats.

Skywalker
09-07-2005, 02:45 PM
OK here is the problem.....

It is not just Clarett. Look back to our recent drafts and see how many players have stuck on the roster. It is very few. Sean Salisbury said it well this evening. Shannahan is one of the very best X and O s guy in the business and he is one of the worst GMs. I don't know that I would go so far to say he was the worst but he is not even average.

The knuckleheads are the ones that turn a blind eye and don't care that we draft three or four players a year that we reach on. This is the problem. This year the argument could be made that Williams, Paymah, and Clarett were all drafted high. Williams was certainly not as high as the other two. Last year Williams was a good pick but Watts was probably 2 rounds to high. Bell also went higher than expected but some of that can be explained by the run of RBs that was occuring at the time. It is not only that we reach. Guys don't stay on the roster long. This is the problem.

I think Shanny is one of the best offensive minds ever. I also believe that we don't have to take the bad with the good. We could be making better personel decisions (especially in the draft).


Darrent Williams has been proving that he was worth that pick....

myoung
09-07-2005, 08:16 PM
Darrent Williams has been proving that he was worth that pick....

First we haven't even had a regular season game so don't jump the gun.

Second you are missing my point. It is not whether the guy turns out to be a good player. It is whether he was a good value at that spot. No one else in the league had him rated that high. It was a surprise to all the draft experts. Most likely he would have been around near our next pick. This is a problem when most guys we pick are valued at least one round lower than where we take them. It puts us at a competitive disadvantage when it comes to young talent on the roster.

Just look at the last few drafts and see how many guys are still on the roster. It is sickening to see all the picks we wasted.

raiderhaterinaz
09-08-2005, 01:11 PM
As much as I love Shanahan, I have to agree that he is a poor drafter. He drafts in an arrogant way - deciding who he wants and taking them with little regard for what others think or in what round they realistically would go. There would be no problem with that, if he were right most of the time and drafted better than everyone else, but he is very often wrong and wastes many draft picks. I have often thought he would be more successful just looking at Kiper's player rankings and taking the highest ranked player remaining on the list. It would save a lot of scouting money too. Of course, that will never happen.

Two other observations:
- He drafts for need too much instead of grabbing the best player
- He keeps forgetting to consider character and thus keeps getting burned (Dale Carter, Daryl Gardener, Maurice Clarett, etc)

Jared
09-08-2005, 02:59 PM
Two other observations:
- He drafts for need too much instead of grabbing the best player
- He keeps forgetting to consider character and thus keeps getting burned (Dale Carter, Daryl Gardener, Maurice Clarett, etc)


I just wanted to point out that drafting for need is pretty much what everyone does unless someone highly rated falls down a round or two for some reason (like Clinton Portis).

Also, only Clarett was a draft pick, of the names you mentioned.

While I do not think Shanahan is a great drafter, the reasons you give do not support that argument.

Skywalker
09-08-2005, 07:39 PM
As much as I love Shanahan, I have to agree that he is a poor drafter. He drafts in an arrogant way - deciding who he wants and taking them with little regard for what others think or in what round they realistically would go. There would be no problem with that, if he were right most of the time and drafted better than everyone else, but he is very often wrong and wastes many draft picks. I have often thought he would be more successful just looking at Kiper's player rankings and taking the highest ranked player remaining on the list. It would save a lot of scouting money too. Of course, that will never happen.

Two other observations:
- He drafts for need too much instead of grabbing the best player
- He keeps forgetting to consider character and thus keeps getting burned (Dale Carter, Daryl Gardener, Maurice Clarett, etc)


why should any team go by Mel Kipers player rankings?



Mel Kiper is an idiot.



and.....GM's know more about drafting and ranking players than Mel Kiper.