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Mat'hir Uth Gan
11-09-2005, 07:01 PM
Full Name: Victor Adeyanju School: Indiana

Ht: 6-4 Wt: 265 40: 4.63 Yr: 5Sr

Pos: Developing defensive end with outstanding size\speed numbers. Fast in any direction, works hard and consistently makes plays. Explosive, quick and plays with excellent balance. Immediately alters his angle of attack and forceful off the edge.

Neg: Not polished and must improve his playing strength as well as develop more moves to shed blocks.

Analysis: Hard working, Adeyanju plays until the whistle blows. Offers terrific size\speed numbers and upside potential for the next level. Will reward a team that patiently develops his skills.


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Full Name: Mark Anderson School: Alabama

Ht: 6-4 Wt: 257 40: 4.82 Yr: 5Sr

Pos: Solid athlete that produces rushing the passer. Fast off the edge, quickly changes direction and makes plays in pursuit. Gets leverage on opponents, keeping his pads low to the ground. Works hands throughout the action and displays solid moves. Fluid dropping off the line and effective in space.

Neg: Undersized and easily turned from his angle of attack by large opponents.

Analysis: Possessing growth potential and a good upside for the next level, Anderson could grow into a starter in a conventional 4-3 defense.


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Full Name: Charles Bennett School: Clemson

Ht: 6-3.5 Wt: 244 40: 4.77 Yr: 5Sr

Pos: Speedy edge rusher also effective in pursuit. Plays with good pad level, immediately alters his angle of attack and redirects to ball carriers. Displays an inside move which he uses to beat blockers. Technically sound and works hard to make positive plays.

Neg: Not strong point of attack and slowed by opposing tight ends.

Analysis: A solid athlete with outstanding range, Bennett is undersized yet nicely fits in as a pass rushing end in the NFL or could stand-up over tackle in a 3-4 alignment.


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Full Name: Larry Birdine School: Oklahoma

Ht: 6-4 Wt: 249 40: 4.74 Yr: 4Jr

Pos: Exciting young prospect with tremendous upside for the next level. Explosive off the snap, outstanding in pursuit and makes plays in all directions of the field. Plays with good pad level and rarely off his feet. Knifes inside of linemen, getting through blocks to make plays against the run. Adequate job holding the point.

Neg: Must improve his playing strength. Not the most instinctive defender. Suffered a knee injury prior to the season and will sit on the sidelines this year.

Analysis: A defensive end who plays with great suddenness and consistently disrupts the opponents game plan, Birdine was an up and coming star prior to his injury. Needs to get back to playing form in 2006 yet a definite early round prospect to keep an eye on.


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Full Name: Ray Edwards School: Purdue

Ht: 6-5 Wt: 270 40: 4.71 Yr: 3Jr

Pos: Sensational athlete with outstanding upside for the next level. Plays low with leverage, immediately alters his angle of attack and makes plays in any direction of the field. Fast off the edge and gets a lot of penetration behind the line of scrimmage. Rarely off his feet. Quick and beats immobile blockers.

Neg: Flashy yet marginally productive early in his career.

Analysis: A defensive prospect who plays with great suddenness and explosion, Edwards has the potential to be a very early draft pick in the near future. Offers an array of skills but needs to take his game to another level.


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Full Name: Tamba Hali School: Penn State

Ht: 6-2 Wt: 267 40: 4.75 Yr: 4Sr

Pos: Good athlete who makes a lot of plays in pursuit. Quick off the snap, fast up the field and immediately alters his angle of attack, displaying outstanding range. Possesses a burst of speed closing to the play. Has a warrior mentality and very intense. Solid in run defense.

Neg: Undersized and smothered by large blockers. Must develop more moves with his hands.

Analysis: A consistent and productive defensive player at Penn State the past two seasons, Hali has continued to improve during his senior campaign. Lacks top growth potential yet could be very productive in the proper NFL-system.


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Full Name: Parys Haralson School: Tennessee

Ht: 6-2 Wt: 250 40: 4.75 Yr: 4Sr

Pos: Undersized pass rusher who also projects to outside linebacker at the next level. Adjusts off the initial block, immediately alters his angle of attack and makes plays in any direction of the field. Gets leverage on opponents displaying outstanding balance, body control and rarely off his feet. Creates a lot of havoc up the field and explosive.

Neg: Easily handled at the point by single blockers. Driven off the line when teams run in his direction.

Analysis: A pass rushing end in a conventional defense, Harrelson as the abilities to be a disruptive force up the field. May also be used standing up over tackle as a rush linebacker.


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Full Name: Eric Henderson School: Georgia Tech

Ht: 6-2.5 Wt: 265 40: 4.71 Yr: 5Sr

Pos: Athletic pass rusher who makes a lot of plays off the edge. Fluid with good movement skills, effective when he plays with leverage and flashes quickness. Easily redirects to the action displaying speed to the flanks. Effective if asked to twist or stunt. Makes a lot of plays in pursuit.

Neg: Slow shedding blocks and easily knocked to the ground by opponents. Not overly instinctive and occasionally takes himself from the action.

Analysis: A prospect who must improve his playing strength, Henderson is another solid pass rusher with first day potential.


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Full Name: Loren Howard School: Arizona State

Ht: 6-3 Wt: 275 40: 4.85 Yr: 4Jr

Pos: Former Northwestern star in the midst of a season ending knee injury and change of playing location. Intelligent, reads the action then quickly locates the ball. Explosive off the snap, plays with outstanding pad level and gets leverage on opponents. Displays an array of moves defeating blocks and works hands throughout the action. Tough as nails, plays while injured and consistently makes positive plays. Possesses excellent balance, body control and rarely off his feet. Immediately alters his angle of attack, flattening and pursuing from the backside with speed.

Neg: Suffered a knee injury prior to the season and taking a redshirt year. Transferred from Northwestern and will play at Arizona State in 06. Undersized and easily moved from his angle of attack by strong opponents.

Analysis: A defender who makes things happen, Howard has been a disruptive force the past two seasons. Played most of his junior campaign with an injured ankle yet still impacted the game. Must now prove he is healthy and comeback with a big senior season in Tempe.


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Full Name: Mathias Kiwanuka School: Boston College

Ht: 6-5.5 Wt: 260 40: 4.75 Yr: 5Sr

Pos: Explosive defensive end who possesses a great combination of athleticism and growth potential. Quick off the snap of the ball, displays force off the edge and tough to stop once he gets momentum going. Plays with outstanding leverage, balance and body control. Solid hand technique and possesses an array of moves getting off blocks. Tremendous range and consistently makes plays in all directions of the field. Instinctive football player who reads and diagnoses the action then takes good angles to the ball handler. Effective dropped off the line of scrimmage into space. Immediately alters his angle of attack, flattens and catches ball carriers from the backside. Resilient, slides off blocks and works to defend the run.

Neg: Slow shedding once engaged at the point and stands to improve his body strength. Has a long, linear build and lacks bulk.

Analysis: A productive player three years running, Kiwanuka is a dominant force and potential impact defensive player. Draws a lot of opinions yet consistently makes plays on the football field and force opponents to game planning around him. Very much in the mold of Jovan Kearse and Terrell Suggs.

Mat'hir Uth Gan
11-09-2005, 07:02 PM
Full Name: Manny Lawson School: North Carolina

Ht: 6-4 Wt: 235 40: 4.58 Yr: 4Sr

Pos: Solid athlete who plays bigger and stronger then his computer numbers. Quickly gets off the snap with a good first step, plays with good pad level and drives up the field. Collapses nicely from the outside defending the run, displays the ability to twist or stunt and quickly redirects to the action. Plays with a good degree of explosion and suddenness. Gets vertical to knock down passes and fast off the edge.

Neg: Turned off the point by blocks and has difficulty when opponents run in his direction. Swallow up by big lineman.

Analysis: Productive in all aspects of the game, Lawson is solid first day material next April. Could be used in a variety of ways and should produce on special teams.


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Full Name: Stanley McClover School: Auburn

Ht: 6-2.5 Wt: 245 40: 4.65 Yr: 3Jr

Pos: Outstanding athlete with tremendous upside for the next level. Plays with good pad level, fluid changing direction and immediately alters his angle of attack. Displays skill in pursuit. Remains disciplined and does more then mindlessly rush up the field. Plays with excellent balance and body control.

Neg: Has a long, linear build, lacks bulk and not strong. Driven off the line by opponents.

Analysis: A disruptive force, McClover offers outstanding potential for the next level. Needs to physically mature and improve his playing strength yet someone to watch next two years.


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Full Name: Darryl Tapp School: Virginia Tech

Ht: 6-1 Wt: 266 40: 4.77 Yr: 4Sr

Pos: Excellent athlete who makes plays in any direction of the field. Breaks down well playing with leverage, adjusts off the initial block and quickly redirects to the action. Terrific footwork through the trash, fast in pursuit and catches ball carriers from the backside. Slides off blocks or effectively uses hand technique to keep opponents away. Good tackling technique. Fights hard throughout the action. Quick and explosive in all aspects of his game.

Neg: Undersized, slow to shed and swallowed up by large blockers. Has trouble defending the run.

Analysis: A player with a nonstop motor, Tapp constantly makes positive plays on the field. Has size limitations which will depress his draft ranking yet intensity, intelligence and natural skill will be an asset to any NFL roster.


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Full Name: Moe Thompson School: Grambling

Ht: 6-3 Wt: 270 40: 4.81 Yr: 4Sr

Pos: Athletic pass rusher who can be a disruptive force. Quick off the snap, plays with good pad level and consistently in the opponents backfield. Displays an array of moves and hand techniques getting off blocks. Agile, immediately changes direction or alters his angle of attack. Plays with balance and rarely off his feet.

Neg: Does not go hard 100% of the time. Stymied at the point by lesser opponents. Lazy and chided for poor work habits. Labeled as an underachiever. A liability in run defense. Involvement in off-the-field incidents led to his dismissal from South Carolina.

Analysis: Possessing terrific inmates skills, Thompson is a forceful defender tough to stop when on his game. Needs to quickly change his ways and prove maturity to have a serious shot at sticking on an NFL roster.


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Full Name: Mario Williams School: North Carolina

Ht: 6-6 Wt: 285 40: 4.75 Yr: 3Jr

Pos: Tremendous athlete who displays continued progress on the football field. Quick off the snap, moves well laterally and collapses from the outside to make plays. Tenacious, stays on his feet and can drop off the line into space. Effective if asked to twist or stunt and does not move like a 290-pound man.

Neg: Not the most instinctive. Does not consistently use his size as an advantage. Must improve his playing balance.

Analysis: Possessing outstanding natural skills, Williams must improve several facets of his game yet possesses outstanding upside potential for the next level. A forceful defender and very high draft pick should he stay in school two more years.


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Full Name: Kamerion Wimbley School: Florida State

Ht: 6-3.5 Wt: 240 40: 4.63 Yr: 4Sr

Pos: Outstanding athlete who is an undersized speed rusher. Fast off the edge, fluid changing direction and makes a lot of plays in pursuit. Great range and speed in every direction of the field. Can drop off the line into coverage and effective on special teams.

Neg: Swallowed up by blocks or overpowered at the point defending the run.

Analysis: Consistently progressing on the field and taking his game to another level, Wimberly has potential at a variety of positions in the NFL. Could be used as a pass rushing right defensive end or tried at outside linebacker in a 34 defense.


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Full Name: LaMarr Woodley School: Michigan

Ht: 6-2 Wt: 258 40: 4.68 Yr: 4Jr

Pos: Tremendous athlete who can be used as a conventional end or rush linebacker in a 34 defense. Breaks down bending his knees and playing with good pad level. Solid job reading the action, remains disciplined and stays with assignments. Plays with balance and rarely off his feet. Forces the action up the field. Quickly alters his angle of attack, flattens from the backside and fast in pursuit. Nasty and works to finish.

Neg: Undersized and slow getting off blocks once engaged at the point.

Analysis: A solid athlete that lines up in a three-point stance or stands up over tackle, Woodley offers terrific upside for the next level. Lacks top growth potential yet will be very productive if placed in the proper scheme.


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Full Name: James Wyche School: Syracuse

Ht: 6-5 Wt: 260 40: 4.97 Yr: 5Sr

Pos: Big, athletic lineman who flashes skill. Plays with good pad level, body control and rarely off his feet. Fluid changing direction, strings plays out to the flanks and displays ability in pursuit. Works hands throughout the action and tough to move off the point.

Neg: Not quick thinking nor does he immediately locate the ball. Lacks a sense of urgency and does not consistently play at a high level of intensity.

Analysis: A prospect with adequate size and growth potential, Wyche offers upside for the next level yet needs to improve his consistency and take his game to another level. Has yet to have the breakout campaign NFL scouts are waiting for.

BroncoRT
11-09-2005, 11:57 PM
I like Lawson, Tapp or Henderson with the second round pick. I still haven't seen Hali, Edwards or Woodley play yet. We should hopefully get one or two of these guys. :coffee:

BroncoDefense
11-10-2005, 07:21 AM
I watched most of Penn State-Wisconsin last saturday. Tamba Hali is an animal. The guy had four sacks and was camped in the Wisconsin backfield. Keep in mind that Wisconsin was ranked #14 at the time. They constantly helped out the tackles with tight end help, and he routinely beat them both. I remember one play were he did a speed rush to the outside and when the tight end and tackle committed, spun back inside (ala Freeney) to get to the quarterback, without being touched by either player. He was truly amazing. I would love to see him come to Denver.

Mat'hir Uth Gan
11-10-2005, 07:50 AM
I expect Denver to be picking twice in the top 25.

I expect 1) Kiwanuka and 2) Williams to be drafted in the top 10-15.


The guys I see that may slip to 25, providing they all come out, are:

3. Ray Edwards
4. Tamba Hali
5. Elvis Dumervil (Oddly absent in this breakdown)

And these guys are the two that are probably projected in the late first, early 2nd.
6. LaMarr Woodley
7. Kamerian Wimbley


With these guys being 2nd round selections:
8. Eric Henderson (early)
9. Darryl Tapp (late)
10. Manny Lawson (late)

BroncoRT
11-10-2005, 09:31 AM
I expect Denver to be picking twice in the top 25.

I expect 1) Kiwanuka and 2) Williams to be drafted in the top 10-15.


The guys I see that may slip to 25, providing they all come out, are:

3. Ray Edwards
4. Tamba Hali
5. Elvis Dumervil (Oddly absent in this breakdown)

And these guys are the two that are probably projected in the late first, early 2nd.
6. LaMarr Woodley
7. Kamerian Wimbley


With these guys being 2nd round selections:
8. Eric Henderson (early)
9. Darryl Tapp (late)
10. Manny Lawson (late)

I really like Tapp and Lawson, they both have good motors on them and they are play makers. They seem to be a little under the John Abraham level.

OhNoKoolAid
11-10-2005, 12:15 PM
I expect Denver to be picking twice in the top 25.

I expect 1) Kiwanuka and 2) Williams to be drafted in the top 10-15.


The guys I see that may slip to 25, providing they all come out, are:

3. Ray Edwards
4. Tamba Hali
5. Elvis Dumervil (Oddly absent in this breakdown)

And these guys are the two that are probably projected in the late first, early 2nd.
6. LaMarr Woodley
7. Kamerian Wimbley


With these guys being 2nd round selections:
8. Eric Henderson (early)
9. Darryl Tapp (late)
10. Manny Lawson (late)

I get the sense that these reports were compiled based on early games, as some recent revelations may effect the status of several players in this report, as well as explaining a possible omission of Dumervil, who started hot, but his ability to maintain prosuction is what makes him a solid prospect. My question rests with Edwards, who has been benched for lack of effort and production in Purdue, in favor of a senior whose name escapes me at the moment. I'm not sure this measure helps improve Edwards' stock, considering he is interested in leaving this year. I'm not sure how a player who went from starter to situational as a junior can leave early and be considered a high pick this year. He has some proving to do to earn that. Good athlete, but no coach salivates over a player benched in his final college season for little effort and production.

From what I've seen in the last month, Mario Williams has caught fire, improving his effort and understanding of offenses tremendously. He has passed Kiwi in my book and now looks like a shoe-in top ten, and possibly the first defensive player off the board. He's made those comparisons to Julius Peppers look rather appropriate in the last month. He's a rare breed and a once-every-few-years type talent that will make an immediate and sustaining impact on a defense.

I have also started having concerns regarding Hali. While his effort is unrelenting, his ceiling may not be as high as others in this class, and I'm not sure he is a consistent double digit sack guy, what you'd expect from a first rounder. His first step is great, but his total agility and change of direction doesn't appear to be of the caliber of others mentioned in this report. His ceiling may be Chike Okeafor, with a likelihood of an Ebenezer Ekuban type career. If your expectations are mild, he can be a solid player, but if you want upside, he may not be the guy.

Henderson is a riser who looks like a very good pass rusher for the next level, hovering in the 9-12 sack range in the NFL. He is most similar to Terrell Suggs in stature, but his game compares favorably to John Abraham. His injury history effects his status, but if he tests as well as he plays, he'll be a late first/early second player with real upside at the right end position. Should we continue our success through the remainder of the season, he could be worth our first round pick, provided we don't trade up.

Dumervil is the better of the two undersized players, Tapp being the other. Like most Virginia Tech prospects, Williams included, Tapp was fairly underwhelming in their loss. Tapp also seems unable to slip blocks once engaged. If he can get the edge, great, otherwise he gets stonewalled pretty easily. He won't have Hugh Douglass's career, and comparisons to Freeney are laughable. Dumervil bears watching. He has Freeney's build and Freeney like quickness in the college game. I will not pass judgment on him until I see his test results, but he could be a special player in a one gap system (not us, unfortuneately). Freeney is elite, though, so comparisons to Dwight may be too lofty of praise.

Woodley is a less athletic version of Merriman of last year, and is a guy I've started to follow. He's my type of edge rusher and could play end without trouble. He may creep into the bottom of round one should he come out and test well. Another one that bears watching, his versatility and athleticism for an end could be intruiging.

What it comes down to is how much of a need will right end be? In my opinion, it is our biggest concern, but I don't make the decisions. If Shanahan see it the same way, it is very likely that we could move up in the draft to aquire Williams or Kiwanuka, because there is a considerable drop off behind the two. Both are Pro Bowl talents and can make immediate impacts. Remember three years ago the Jets were able to move up to the second pick. The position of our two first round picks won't be as low, but two firsts and a second next year may be enough to move up in the draft to aquire one of the two. Shanahan also has shown a desire to make such a move in the past. If we had a second first round pick in 2003, we'd be singing the praises of our Pro Bowl end Terrell Suggs, aquired with Minnesota's first round pick. In theory, I'm not in agreement with moving up, but I believe you take each individual case into consideration. In the case of Williams and Kiwanuka, if the means are available, you have to move up. It is hard to find this type of talent at end in just any draft.

MileHighSpirit
11-17-2005, 08:05 PM
Not only is Dumervil absent (which is really strange considering he is a Bronko Nagurski finalist), but Brandon Guillory of Louisiana-Monroe is absent as well.

Guillory is no doubt the Demarcus Ware of this year's draft. Anyone who runs a sub 4.6, has a 38" vert, and is 6'4" 250lbs will gain some attention. That player will become a totally different animal (as Guillory should be considered) when he combines computer numbers with production.

Guillory has 35 tackles, 9.5 sacks, 4 pds, and 2 blocked kicks. The only real knock on him is that he plays in the Sun Belt Confrence and has the "poor competition" factor. The combine should change all of that. Expect Guillory to be at least a day one selection with a great degree of upside.



On another note, Adeyanju looks to be the best DE for Denver's system outside of the top 2 (Kiwi/Williams). He won't be a rookie starter, but his upside is high as he has better than average measurables. His production has been good this year, and he plays as fast as he timing reports say he does. The combine should solidify his late first day spot.

OhNoKoolAid
11-17-2005, 08:21 PM
Not only is Dumervil absent (which is really strange considering he is a Bronko Nagurski finalist), but Brandon Guillory of Louisiana-Monroe is absent as well.

Guillory is no doubt the Demarcus Ware of this year's draft. Anyone who runs a sub 4.6, has a 38" vert, and is 6'4" 250lbs will gain some attention. That player will become a totally different animal (as Guillory should be considered) when he combines computer numbers with production.

Guillory has 35 tackles, 9.5 sacks, 4 pds, and 2 blocked kicks. The only real knock on him is that he plays in the Sun Belt Confrence and has the "poor competition" factor. The combine should change all of that. Expect Guillory to be at least a day one selection with a great degree of upside.



On another note, Adeyanju looks to be the best DE for Denver's system outside of the top 2 (Kiwi/Williams). He won't be a rookie starter, but his upside is high as he has better than average measurables. His production has been good this year, and he plays as fast as he timing reports say he does. The combine should solidify his late first day spot.

Several Indiana guys have compared Adeyanju to ex-Hoosier Adwale Ogunleye, albeit a better athlete. He's raw, and guys like this can get lost in the shuffle, but he is certainly a quality investment who could sneak into the lineup as a pass rush specialist as a rookie.

Guillory will also suffer from lack of preseason hype. He will need a great week of All Star games, not just a good combine, because I think we are going to see some real good workout numbers at end this year, so he may not stand out like one might expect.

The more I see Dumervil, the more impressed I become. Dwight Freeney is too high of praise, but how about Bert Berry? Similar body type with frame to add more weight, great speed and pass rushing instincts. He's behind Henderson in my book, but that doesn't make him any less of a talent.

MileHighSpirit
11-17-2005, 08:28 PM
Several Indiana guys have compared Adeyanju to ex-Hoosier Adwale Ogunleye, albeit a better athlete. He's raw, and guys like this can get lost in the shuffle, but he is certainly a quality investment who could sneak into the lineup as a pass rush specialist as a rookie.

Guillory will also suffer from lack of preseason hype. He will need a great week of All Star games, not just a good combine, because I think we are going to see some real good workout numbers at end this year, so he may not stand out like one might expect.

The more I see Dumervil, the more impressed I become. Dwight Freeney is too high of praise, but how about Bert Berry? Similar body type with frame to add more weight, great speed and pass rushing instincts. He's behind Henderson in my book, but that doesn't make him any less of a talent.

You know, for all the hype that he has built up I haven't been able to watch Dumervil at all. Anybody that has 20 sacks deserves a look, and the type statistical performance he has made doesn't come along all that often. Work has been taking up a lot of time these days..... :coffee:

OhNoKoolAid
11-17-2005, 08:31 PM
I almost forgot, where is Gaines Adams? The guy owned FSU in the tape I watched (although, who doesn't?) and he could be the best early entry defensive end in the draft. I actually will clump him with Hali, Dumervil and Henderson, but with his size and athleticism, he may have the highest upside. He may not leave early because the draft looks stocked with defensive ends, but he would be an ideal fit in Denver's gap control attack. If you haven't seen him play, I highly suggest watching a Clemson game. Adams, Bennett on the line, Hill, the best cover guy in the draft, at corner, and the drafts most physically gifted pocket passer in Whitehurst (note, I said physically, not mentally). Lot to see, so take them in if you have the chance.

OhNoKoolAid
11-17-2005, 08:34 PM
You know, for all the hype that he has built up I haven't been able to watch Dumervil at all. Anybody that has 20 sacks deserves a look, and the type statistical performance he has made doesn't come along all that often. Work has been taking up a lot of time these days..... :coffee:

School for me. My DVR is full from unwatched games and the Rome mini-series. I have my reservations with Dumervil still, and e was handled by Pitt's Spencer, but I think that says more about Spencer than it does about Dumervil. You can't put up those numbers and not be worth a late first round pick. I think that alone speaks for itself. His game will just be limited by his size, unless he really is a Freeney clone. If he runs a 4.5, we take him, plain and simple. Nobody is better than Freeney right now, not even Peppers...

MileHighSpirit
11-17-2005, 08:48 PM
School for me. My DVR is full from unwatched games and the Rome mini-series. I have my reservations with Dumervil still, and e was handled by Pitt's Spencer, but I think that says more about Spencer than it does about Dumervil. You can't put up those numbers and not be worth a late first round pick. I think that alone speaks for itself. His game will just be limited by his size, unless he really is a Freeney clone. If he runs a 4.5, we take him, plain and simple. Nobody is better than Freeney right now, not even Peppers...

Well you also have to remember why Freeney is so good. The Colts defensive line is ALWAYS pass rushing. They play the pass first; then the run. This allows Freeney, Mathis, Brock, and Reagor to simply punch one gap and react afterwards if it is a run. With so much stunting it is tough to run the ball as there will likely be that one stop in the backfield that kills a drive (although there will be several long runs as well).

Dumervil would benefit from a scheme like the Colts, but for a gap control/zone blitz team like the Broncos he may not find a good home.

BroncoRT
11-17-2005, 09:33 PM
Well you also have to remember why Freeney is so good. The Colts defensive line is ALWAYS pass rushing. They play the pass first; then the run. This allows Freeney, Mathis, Brock, and Reagor to simply punch one gap and react afterwards if it is a run. With so much stunting it is tough to run the ball as there will likely be that one stop in the backfield that kills a drive (although there will be several long runs as well).

Dumervil would benefit from a scheme like the Colts, but for a gap control/zone blitz team like the Broncos he may not find a good home.

Very good point. If Freeney was in Denver he wouldn't put up the numbers he does under Dungy's system. Also with Hayward he seem more effective in Jax system than Denver's. That is why I think we will draft a DT with the first pick. With a 15-20 pick Denver should get a solid DT in either Wroten, Wright, Watson or Mahelona. All of these guys will be solid pro's and would be effective in Denver's system. Or they could trade up and make a move for Ngata.

Shanny's philosphy is to have speed at LB's, have the Dlineman hold their gaps and zones and have the LB's and safety's roam around and make plays. I don't think Shanny will draft a DE in the first round for this reason.

MileHighSpirit
11-17-2005, 10:35 PM
Very good point. If Freeney was in Denver he wouldn't put up the numbers he does under Dungy's system. Also with Hayward he seem more effective in Jax system than Denver's. That is why I think we will draft a DT with the first pick. With a 15-20 pick Denver should get a solid DT in either Wroten, Wright, Watson or Mahelona. All of these guys will be solid pro's and would be effective in Denver's system. Or they could trade up and make a move for Ngata.

Shanny's philosphy is to have speed at LB's, have the Dlineman hold their gaps and zones and have the LB's and safety's roam around and make plays. I don't think Shanny will draft a DE in the first round for this reason.

Of the four names that you mention in the 15-20 range there is simply too many questions about them.

Wright is a cronic underachiever. A tough, motivating coach may be able to light a fire under him and make him the next Marcus Stroud, but Denver most certainly doesn't have that coach. Shanahan is a offensive-minded strategic coach. He is not the Bill Cowher or Marvin Lewis type. That fact alone makes him just too much of a question in my book.

Watson is a great person and has undeniable talent, but he as well has motivation problems.

Mahelona seems limited in upside. Sure, he can start and play at a high level, but that is about it.

Wroten looks to be a great player, but he will most likely not fit the type of player we need. IMO he has the best chance of being a great player of the four names you listed, but I still wouldn't take him in first if I had other options as Denver.


Oshinowo is just as solid, and he will still be there in the late 2nd where we will definitely have a pick. He also fits our scheme perfectly and should give us lots of beef and leverage next to Warren. If not Oshinowo then go for Orien Harris who has first round upside, but at least people are still rating him according to his drive to play. Watson and Wright get too much on talent.

OhNoKoolAid
11-18-2005, 01:49 PM
Well you also have to remember why Freeney is so good. The Colts defensive line is ALWAYS pass rushing. They play the pass first; then the run. This allows Freeney, Mathis, Brock, and Reagor to simply punch one gap and react afterwards if it is a run. With so much stunting it is tough to run the ball as there will likely be that one stop in the backfield that kills a drive (although there will be several long runs as well).

Dumervil would benefit from a scheme like the Colts, but for a gap control/zone blitz team like the Broncos he may not find a good home.

I see what you are saying, but I will not agree to the point that Freeney is good only because of his system. He's the only end that gives Ogden nightmares, or better yet, every left tackle nightmares. Pass rushing is the name of the game with ends, and there is not one player better at it than he. He's also learned to use leverage and quickness to become an above average run defender. Freeney would be a stellar player anywhere, and most scouts I believe would share this opinion.

Mat'hir Uth Gan
11-18-2005, 04:02 PM
Of the four names that you mention in the 15-20 range there is simply too many questions about them.

Wright is a cronic underachiever. A tough, motivating coach may be able to light a fire under him and make him the next Marcus Stroud, but Denver most certainly doesn't have that coach. Shanahan is a offensive-minded strategic coach. He is not the Bill Cowher or Marvin Lewis type. That fact alone makes him just too much of a question in my book.

Watson is a great person and has undeniable talent, but he as well has motivation problems.

Mahelona seems limited in upside. Sure, he can start and play at a high level, but that is about it.

Wroten looks to be a great player, but he will most likely not fit the type of player we need. IMO he has the best chance of being a great player of the four names you listed, but I still wouldn't take him in first if I had other options as Denver.


Oshinowo is just as solid, and he will still be there in the late 2nd where we will definitely have a pick. He also fits our scheme perfectly and should give us lots of beef and leverage next to Warren. If not Oshinowo then go for Orien Harris who has first round upside, but at least people are still rating him according to his drive to play. Watson and Wright get too much on talent.


I don't know, Babitunde could sneak into the 1st round. He was a 1st round prospect in "some" scouts eyes before the season, and its universal that he's exceeded expectations this season with his play. He just needs more press.

OhNoKoolAid
11-18-2005, 04:11 PM
I don't know, Babitunde could sneak into the 1st round. He was a 1st round prospect in "some" scouts eyes before the season, and its universal that he's exceeded expectations this season with his play. He just needs more press.

I think his upside is fairly limited. Sure, he'll be a solid gap control guy, but I don't see top fifteen DT in his future, which will rule him out of first round consideration from some teams. Great character and effort will keep him in this league along time, but he's more of a role player than a future stud, for what that is worth.

stnzed
11-19-2005, 10:24 PM
I see what you are saying, but I will not agree to the point that Freeney is good only because of his system. He's the only end that gives Ogden nightmares, or better yet, every left tackle nightmares. Pass rushing is the name of the game with ends, and there is not one player better at it than he. He's also learned to use leverage and quickness to become an above average run defender. Freeney would be a stellar player anywhere, and most scouts I believe would share this opinion.
Freeney is the best in the biz, he could play anywhere! anyone in their right mind would take him in heartbeat. Even someone as "personel evaluationally" challeged as "Shanny". If Freeney played QB for the Eagles they would be undefeated.

BroncoRT
11-23-2005, 09:15 AM
Of the four names that you mention in the 15-20 range there is simply too many questions about them.

Wright is a cronic underachiever. A tough, motivating coach may be able to light a fire under him and make him the next Marcus Stroud, but Denver most certainly doesn't have that coach. Shanahan is a offensive-minded strategic coach. He is not the Bill Cowher or Marvin Lewis type. That fact alone makes him just too much of a question in my book.

Watson is a great person and has undeniable talent, but he as well has motivation problems.

Mahelona seems limited in upside. Sure, he can start and play at a high level, but that is about it.

Wroten looks to be a great player, but he will most likely not fit the type of player we need. IMO he has the best chance of being a great player of the four names you listed, but I still wouldn't take him in first if I had other options as Denver.


Oshinowo is just as solid, and he will still be there in the late 2nd where we will definitely have a pick. He also fits our scheme perfectly and should give us lots of beef and leverage next to Warren. If not Oshinowo then go for Orien Harris who has first round upside, but at least people are still rating him according to his drive to play. Watson and Wright get too much on talent.


I saw Wroten and Watson play this past weekend and I am liking Wroten more and more. He is quick and explosive with a good motor. He would be great in a Denver uni. Watson was so-so, nothing special except for the 330lb's of beef he carries. Wroten was in the backfield all day and Watson didn't stand out at all.