Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Corona virus

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • I don't believe I'm "splitting hairs" and my post is not directed at any one member but I struggle when the word theory is used versus opinion.

    Agree....disagree?

    Theory
    NOUN
    1. a supposition or a system of ideas intended to explain something, especially one based on general principles independent of the thing to be explained.
    • a set of principles on which the practice of an activity is based.
    • an idea used to account for a situation or justify a course of action.

    Opinion
    NOUN
    1. a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.
    • beliefs or views of a large number or majority of people about a particular thing.
    • an estimation of the quality or worth of someone or something.
    • a formal statement of advice by an expert on a professional matter.
    • a formal statement of reasons for a judgment given.
    Utah Bronco Freak

    Comment


    • Originally posted by jazzbodog View Post
      I don't believe I'm "splitting hairs" and my post is not directed at any one member but I struggle when the word theory is used versus opinion.

      Agree....disagree?

      Theory
      NOUN
      1. a supposition or a system of ideas intended to explain something, especially one based on general principles independent of the thing to be explained.
      • a set of principles on which the practice of an activity is based.
      • an idea used to account for a situation or justify a course of action.

      Opinion
      NOUN
      1. a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.
      • beliefs or views of a large number or majority of people about a particular thing.
      • an estimation of the quality or worth of someone or something.
      • a formal statement of advice by an expert on a professional matter.
      • a formal statement of reasons for a judgment given.
      Well there are details involved not captured in a dictionary defining.

      Essentially any theory can be called an opinion if someone wants to go that far with it. There are details about what is intended.

      In terms of scientist...and the leaders without agendas....imo they using the term theory as a set of observations made but when they use the word theory I think they are admitting more data needs to be gathered.

      When someone puts forth their opinion...they are kind of saying in their mind they have enough data to try and form a conclusion.
      Time to build on the win and grow the team from some solid play higher level of play

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Butler By'Note View Post

        You've finally got a reason to be concerned, unlike last year when the 15 cases a day your province had was nothing compared to states that were dealing with 5000 to 10,000 cases per day. With that being said I do hope your province gets over the hump soon. We were in a very similar situation 3 weeks ago, and our citizens listened, we followed the guidelines, got our vaccinations (we should pass 60% with one dose tomorrow or Saturday) and now have a clearly laid out plan to complete reopening, IF we continue to do what we need to do (the dates thrown around out there as actual dates aren't true, they were dates we could see things happen based on current trends, but aren't set in stone, or even written in pencil). Hopefully Manitobans start following the rules at some point.

        Question for you about New Zealand and Australia and their "wisdom" they locked everyone down, harshly, and closed their borders to get to 0 cases. Now anytime cases even blip it leads to immediate shutdowns of large populations. Melbourne, a city of 5 million, in facing a 4th strict lockdown (their second lockdown was 111 days) because of 26 cases. They have very little vaccination going on in either country (New Zealand at 7.5% with one dose, Australia at 13.1%) so now their only answer is lockdowns and closed borders.

        Do you really think isolation is great (as you said) when it's led to massive lockdowns (way stricter than anything we've seen in Canada) when they get even a small number of cases and they're likely to remain dealing with a pandemic, and following this cycle long after many other countries are open for business? The praised "success" of New Zealand and Australia will be looked at with scorn in coming years because the only thing they've done is lengthened things.
        First statement.....no idea what you mean. Sounds like someone who knows everything to me. Maybe that needs reflection. After our initial success, we became a hot spot during the 2nd wave.. So when we are not so "cautious", we seem to get into a bit of trouble. BTW, I could ask about Alberta, because I do not pretend to know more than you.

        And I am not going to debate success stories, like NZ, as reported by many well researched folks. Easy to poke holes in anything. Especially when one does not have to make the hard decisions.

        You know that I disagree with your opinions on this subject, stemming from comments you have made in past. Like we are overreacting. Like my family is being ridiculous not having a Thanksgiving get together. Spoke volumes. Most people I know have followed the rules very tightly since day one. None of us that I know of has caught the virus. I know, that's too basic.

        So dude, with all your insight and connections, who is kickin it deservedly on this planet? South Korea? Japan? Who gets your vote of approval?



        Comment


        • Originally posted by CanDB View Post


          who is kickin it deservedly on this planet? South Korea? Japan? Who gets your vote of approval?


          IMO there are so many different moving parts this is a hard question to answer in terms of comparing one region to another.

          1. How good is the data the region is working with?
          2. What kind of resources is the region working with?
          3. What is the population density?
          4. How difficult/smooth is the rollout of policy to the public?

          This is not even touching some of the more arguable things like "how good is the leadership doing?"

          I still think lessons can be learned looking at how one region is doing compared to another region but I am not sure I would start making judgements about one region compared to another region. It may not be apples to apples.

          Time to build on the win and grow the team from some solid play higher level of play

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Hadez View Post

            IMO there are so many different moving parts this is a hard question to answer in terms of comparing one region to another.

            1. How good is the data the region is working with?
            2. What kind of resources is the region working with?
            3. What is the population density?
            4. How difficult/smooth is the rollout of policy to the public?

            This is not even touching some of the more arguable things like "how good is the leadership doing?"

            I still think lessons can be learned looking at how one region is doing compared to another region but I am not sure I would start making judgements about one region compared to another region. It may not be apples to apples.
            Yes, I was asking Butler for more specific reasons. But anyone else can chime in of course.

            I think what you say is very relevant. I for one can not argue with the commentary. I would say though, that when multiple well researched reports point to some countries doing very well, and some doing very poorly, I start leaning towards the results, given the effort, knowledge, methodology, and thorough approach taken, combined with the similarity of results. So if 9 of 10 extensive studies choose some countries as leaders, who am I to differ with them?

            Not saying it's 100% conclusive, given the many variables involved, but as long as these are independent bodies coming up with similar ratings, it's a pretty good start.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Butler By'Note View Post

              You've finally got a reason to be concerned, unlike last year when the 15 cases a day your province had was nothing compared to states that were dealing with 5000 to 10,000 cases per day. With that being said I do hope your province gets over the hump soon. We were in a very similar situation 3 weeks ago, and our citizens listened, we followed the guidelines, got our vaccinations (we should pass 60% with one dose tomorrow or Saturday) and now have a clearly laid out plan to complete reopening, IF we continue to do what we need to do (the dates thrown around out there as actual dates aren't true, they were dates we could see things happen based on current trends, but aren't set in stone, or even written in pencil). Hopefully Manitobans start following the rules at some point.

              Question for you about New Zealand and Australia and their "wisdom" they locked everyone down, harshly, and closed their borders to get to 0 cases. Now anytime cases even blip it leads to immediate shutdowns of large populations. Melbourne, a city of 5 million, in facing a 4th strict lockdown (their second lockdown was 111 days) because of 26 cases. They have very little vaccination going on in either country (New Zealand at 7.5% with one dose, Australia at 13.1%) so now their only answer is lockdowns and closed borders.

              Do you really think isolation is great (as you said) when it's led to massive lockdowns (way stricter than anything we've seen in Canada) when they get even a small number of cases and they're likely to remain dealing with a pandemic, and following this cycle long after many other countries are open for business? The praised "success" of New Zealand and Australia will be looked at with scorn in coming years because the only thing they've done is lengthened things.
              I live in Australia, what do you mean by "lengthened things" in reference to being met with 'scorn" ? Our economy is well on the road to recovery and we were quickly out of the technical recession that people feared would be a long-term reality, all without the traditional driver of population growth. We are way ahead of where governments and economists predicted we would be, somewhere to the tune of almost 100 billion less in debt actually based on the recent budget. I think certain governments particularly the left-leaning Victorian state government you mentioned will continue to make poor decisions on snap lockdowns like they have, but as a resident of a different state, what you are saying is not our reality at all.

              In terms of vaccination here, there is no urgency, and you can understand why. We as everyday residents have not had to concern ourselves for almost 6 months now, actually probably more like 9 or 10, with the peak covid-19 hysteria that seems to still exist in the US. Life has honestly been pretty normal outside of the random restrictions which would pop up for 3 days here, or 5 days there. We had 50K plus people at sporting events back in October last year and the restrictions when they pop up have been like, "no dancing at a nightclub for the next 5 days".

              But with so few cases and next to no deaths at all for an extended period, people just don't feel like it's a pressing issue and are not rushing out to get vaccinated, I have not yet and don't plan to honestly. Also this concern you mention in regards to lengthening things, our economy is growing without population growth, and borders are expected to be opened by late next year according to a federal government who wants to turn that economic driver on sooner if possible. So the lengthening things comment I just see as one made from only looking at the broad view of things without having an understanding of the behaviors and dynamics of the population.

              Also, our vaccination program will pick up extreme heat when the government tells the population you will need the jab to go to Bali, mass vaccination will occur at a rapid rate. Behavioural economics you could only understand when you know the way the people of the country think, I will be included in that stereotype.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Hadez View Post

                Well there are details involved not captured in a dictionary defining.

                Essentially any theory can be called an opinion if someone wants to go that far with it. There are details about what is intended.

                In terms of scientist...and the leaders without agendas....imo they using the term theory as a set of observations made but when they use the word theory I think they are admitting more data needs to be gathered.

                When someone puts forth their opinion...they are kind of saying in their mind they have enough data to try and form a conclusion.
                I get what you're saying. Words in the english language can be interpreted differently at times. I guess that's why we have so many synonyms.

                I still struggle with "affect" and "effect".

                Thanks for your feedback.
                Utah Bronco Freak

                Comment


                • Originally posted by johnlimburg View Post

                  I live in Australia, what do you mean by "lengthened things" in reference to being met with 'scorn" ? Our economy is well on the road to recovery and we were quickly out of the technical recession that people feared would be a long-term reality, all without the traditional driver of population growth. We are way ahead of where governments and economists predicted we would be, somewhere to the tune of almost 100 billion less in debt actually based on the recent budget. I think certain governments particularly the left-leaning Victorian state government you mentioned will continue to make poor decisions on snap lockdowns like they have, but as a resident of a different state, what you are saying is not our reality at all.

                  In terms of vaccination here, there is no urgency, and you can understand why. We as everyday residents have not had to concern ourselves for almost 6 months now, actually probably more like 9 or 10, with the peak covid-19 hysteria that seems to still exist in the US. Life has honestly been pretty normal outside of the random restrictions which would pop up for 3 days here, or 5 days there. We had 50K plus people at sporting events back in October last year and the restrictions when they pop up have been like, "no dancing at a nightclub for the next 5 days".

                  But with so few cases and next to no deaths at all for an extended period, people just don't feel like it's a pressing issue and are not rushing out to get vaccinated, I have not yet and don't plan to honestly. Also this concern you mention in regards to lengthening things, our economy is growing without population growth, and borders are expected to be opened by late next year according to a federal government who wants to turn that economic driver on sooner if possible. So the lengthening things comment I just see as one made from only looking at the broad view of things without having an understanding of the behaviors and dynamics of the population.

                  Also, our vaccination program will pick up extreme heat when the government tells the population you will need the jab to go to Bali, mass vaccination will occur at a rapid rate. Behavioural economics you could only understand when you know the way the people of the country think, I will be included in that stereotype.
                  You live there, that's what makes your assessment more relevant. And based on what I have read, you are doing quite well indeed. Congrats!

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by jazzbodog View Post

                    I get what you're saying. Words in the english language can be interpreted differently at times. I guess that's why we have so many synonyms.

                    I still struggle with "affect" and "effect".

                    Thanks for your feedback.
                    You say things that are often part of my take. I have worked hard to use "affect" and "effect" properly. I safely can say that I think I get them right. But I still have little rules that guide me.

                    Comment


                    • The good news, my wife and I will be getting our 2nd vaccinations in 2 weeks and change.

                      Lets roll baby!!

                      Comment


                      • Does anyone have the stats on deaths related to vaccines?

                        I would think their would be an accurate count of those hospitalized and how many have died.

                        We all understand that all people with Covid 19 regardless of age and underlying conditions was counted as hospitalized and/or death was a Covid death.

                        Is that how those who have been affected by the vaccine are being counted?

                        Something I think most people who are considering being vaccinated would want to know.
                        sigpic

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
                          Does anyone have the stats on deaths related to vaccines?

                          I would think their would be an accurate count of those hospitalized and how many have died.

                          We all understand that all people with Covid 19 regardless of age and underlying conditions was counted as hospitalized and/or death was a Covid death.

                          Is that how those who have been affected by the vaccine are being counted?

                          Something I think most people who are considering being vaccinated would want to know.
                          Do you really think they would give a factual number?

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by JvDub95 View Post

                            Do you really think they would give a factual number?
                            Based on how they counted Covid deaths, no!

                            According to the CDC 9683 died in the United States with only having COVID-19 listed on their death certificate. The CDC also states almost 600k have died from Covid-19.

                            It appears now with the vaccine if you die only from side effects from vaccine that is a death.

                            Instead of offering prizes to take it I would love to see an on going count like they did with Covid, so people can see how safe it really is.



                            sigpic

                            Comment


                            • I am not sure if I read things correctly, but how many of you are against this vaccine? It's clearly working, no matter how concerned folks are about how the deaths were counted, or how honest the "administrators". I'd recommend getting the shots, based on trust in the medical folks, my positive history with shots, and the fact that the numbers are declining quickly in most countries who have passed the 3rd wave.

                              Based on what I see, events are happening, especially in The US, with loads of fans and participants. It may be for many reasons, but vaccines are clearly a major factor.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by CanDB View Post
                                I am not sure if I read things correctly, but how many of you are against this vaccine? It's clearly working, no matter how concerned folks are about how the deaths were counted, or how honest the "administrators". I'd recommend getting the shots, based on trust in the medical folks, my positive history with shots, and the fact that the numbers are declining quickly in most countries who have passed the 3rd wave.

                                Based on what I see, events are happening, especially in The US, with loads of fans and participants. It may be for many reasons, but vaccines are clearly a major factor.
                                Asking about the deaths and hospitalizations is not anti vaccine. It’s a question that should be answered. If someone has a 99.7% chance of surviving Covid is injecting a synthetic acid in your body wise?
                                sigpic

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X