Corona virus

[Fantaztic7]

About 99.999% of fully vaccinated Americans have not had a deadly COVID-19 breakthrough case: CDC

https://abc7chicago.com/covid-breakthrough-cdc-data/10923757/

Do you seriously believe "passive and voluntary" reporting provides credible evidence of the 99.9% claim and to change mask guidance?

[Peerless]

Do you seriously believe "passive and voluntary" reporting provides credible evidence of the 99.9% claim and to change mask guidance?

I mean - that's how VAERS data has been collected over the years with vaccinations (not just the COVID vaccination). And also, a report to VAERS doesn't prove that the identified vaccine caused the adverse reactions - it only confirms that the reported event occurred sometime after vaccine was given.

There could be issues with underreporting of course, as the degree of underreporting is widely variable.

I could get a vaccine and develop a sore arm. Would I report that? Doubt it.

You could get a vaccine and develop SOB, chest pain, etc. Would you report that? Hopefully.

[CanDB]

Based on observations/personal assessment, I am concerned about a 4th wave, primarily due to the "energetic" Delta variant, which is clearly more successful at sickening the unvaccinated. The fear (for me) is that it will not only stay active among those without vaccination, but also cause illness to children, who are unable to be vaccinated. And with another school year fast approaching, it could be quite troublesome and yes, worrisome.

And even a small wave will likely cause many more business owners to close down, for good, given how they've had to manage for the last year and a half. Many are hanging by a string, and a lot of hope. I feel for them. And if you read any of my posts, I worry about the hospitals and their staff, and the patients who are put on hold.

And the longer this pandemic stays active, is it possible that other variants will evolve? I don't know, but lets keep our fingers crossed.

Lets snuff this thing out the best way possible. The way that is proving to work. And yes, also by being wise about diet and exercise.

[CanDB]

Notice how the media and public health officials have moved to “cases” because deaths are so low?

Remember when Sweden was demonized for their approach to Covid. Their 7 day average deaths is 1 with zero deaths July 30. Sweden has one of the lowest vaccination rates in the developed world at ~39%. Sweden also has the least restrictions with masks and they kept schools open.

If you were keeping track, last year there were a number of negative views on how Sweden approached the pandemic. Too many lives lost.

Lets compare Sweden to Canada, just in terms of covid deaths.

Sweden - 14.6k deaths / population 10 million / rate of death 0.14%
Canada - 26.6k deaths / population 38 million / rate of death 0.07%

In the end, Sweden had twice as many deaths per capita. Call them elderly or whatever, it is always a good idea to protect your people, young or old. And not saying Canada was a perfect model of covid strategy. But it was pretty good overall, and as we now witness, Canada's vaccine rate in general is also quite good...and getting better as we speak. So one can argue the benefits of what Sweden attempted, but in terms of lives lost alone they were not as successful as some want to believe.

UPDATE: after doing my own calculations I see a column in the covid site:

Covid deaths per million:

Sweden - 1,437 Canada - 698

Therefore, as noted above, more than double per capita.

(FTR....it states that The US has 1,889 deaths per million)

[Peanut]

Does anyone still doubt that the origin of the SARS-CoV-2 virus is Wuhan, China - specifically, the Wuhan Institute of Virology, CAS?

That wasn't the purpose of my post. If you want to discuss it, please PM me.

[Fantaztic7]

If you were keeping track, last year there were a number of negative views on how Sweden approached the pandemic. Too many lives lost.

Lets compare Sweden to Canada, just in terms of covid deaths.

Sweden - 14.6k deaths / population 10 million / rate of death 0.14%
Canada - 26.6k deaths / population 38 million / rate of death 0.07%

In the end, Sweden had twice as many deaths per capita. Call them elderly or whatever, it is always a good idea to protect your people, young or old. And not saying Canada was a perfect model of covid strategy. But it was pretty good overall, and as we now witness, Canada's vaccine rate in general is also quite good...and getting better as we speak. So one can argue the benefits of what Sweden attempted, but in terms of lives lost alone they were not as successful as some want to believe.

UPDATE: after doing my own calculations I see a column in the covid site:

Covid deaths per million:

Sweden - 1,437 Canada - 698

Therefore, as noted above, more than double per capita.

(FTR....it states that The US has 1,889 deaths per million)

Pandemic response can't be effectively measured with one metric. Many other considerations such as mental health, drug overdoses, economic, impact on education, freedoms and community/herd immunity. The impact of pandemic response will take years to understand - the impact on childhood education alone through school closures could have far reaching consequences for decades to come.

[Fantaztic7]

Based on observations/personal assessment, I am concerned about a 4th wave, primarily due to the "energetic" Delta variant, which is clearly more successful at sickening the unvaccinated. The fear (for me) is that it will not only stay active among those without vaccination, but also cause illness to children, who are unable to be vaccinated. And with another school year fast approaching, it could be quite troublesome and yes, worrisome.

And even a small wave will likely cause many more business owners to close down, for good, given how they've had to manage for the last year and a half. Many are hanging by a string, and a lot of hope. I feel for them. And if you read any of my posts, I worry about the hospitals and their staff, and the patients who are put on hold.

And the longer this pandemic stays active, is it possible that other variants will evolve? I don't know, but lets keep our fingers crossed.

Lets snuff this thing out the best way possible. The way that is proving to work. And yes, also by being wise about diet and exercise.

What conclusive evidence shows the SARS-CoV2 Delta variant is *clearly* more successful at sickening the unvaccinated?

Where are those sick people getting tested to show that they have the Delta variant? Which hospitals are testing for the Delta variant when those sick people arrive at the hospital?

[johnlimburg]

Pandemic response can't be effectively measured with one metric. Many other considerations such as mental health, drug overdoses, economic, impact on education, freedoms and community/herd immunity. The impact of pandemic response will take years to understand - the impact on childhood education alone through school closures could have far reaching consequences for decades to come.

This continues to be the most overlooked talking point throughout this whole lockdown madness that continues to occur all around the world. I understand the concern for the health care system if things are opened back up and the new less deadly Delta strain runs rampart, but we are better prepared now globally for what we are facing, and ignoring all other functions of society and allowing them to fall to the wayside, because we are locking down, that is a lazy response from government in my opinion at this point of time. I understood the initial lockdowns probably had to happen, everyone needed to gain some understanding of what was happening, but we are 18 months removed from that, we are much better prepared now, so it's time to put in place exit strategies that are built not just solely around vaccination in my opinion, their needs to be a plan b, and this tendency from governments to lockdown needs to end.

In Australia we literally have soldiers being deployed to walk the streets to enforce stay at home orders. We have helicopters flying over suburbs making sure those who are out and about are chased down and fined. It is actually quite scary to see the news so willing to pass these scenes onto viewers at home with the message that this is all acceptable, and if you don't follow these extremely strict rules, you will be on the receiving end of the law. I get it, the governments don't want to be doing this, there is definitely a reason for concern, but I think enough is enough and government intervention has gone far beyond what anyone in the western world should consider acceptable.

[Hadez]

I think this may reinforce the fact that a booster of some sorts (which I would imagine people probably believed would eventually happen) is probably required for certain individuals (age 50-60).

Maybe Merck will come out with the "new and improved" Ivermectin that everyone can make lots of money on. The Federal Government gave them 356 mil to make the next Ivermectin a few weeks after the Ivermectin data was given to the Senate who then gave the data to the Establishment Health System. It must be going well because Merck just got a 1.2 billion deal with the federal government.

[Fantaztic7]

Based on observations/personal assessment, I am concerned about a 4th wave, primarily due to the "energetic" Delta variant, which is clearly more successful at sickening the unvaccinated. The fear (for me) is that it will not only stay active among those without vaccination, but also cause illness to children, who are unable to be vaccinated. And with another school year fast approaching, it could be quite troublesome and yes, worrisome.

And even a small wave will likely cause many more business owners to close down, for good, given how they've had to manage for the last year and a half. Many are hanging by a string, and a lot of hope. I feel for them. And if you read any of my posts, I worry about the hospitals and their staff, and the patients who are put on hold.

And the longer this pandemic stays active, is it possible that other variants will evolve? I don't know, but lets keep our fingers crossed.

Lets snuff this thing out the best way possible. The way that is proving to work. And yes, also by being wise about diet and exercise.

"Quite troublesome for children with school approaching". We know children have incredibly low risk of mortality from Covid - less than the seasonal flu and that's with children having access to flu vaccines. This isn’t even debatable.

[Fantaztic7]

NIH Director talking today about getting businesses to use a version of passports to reduce vaccine reluctance. Something like, “Anything to reduce reluctance to vaccines and end this pandemic…”

LOL! This is the guy who’s agency funded grants to the Wuhan Institute of Virology, CAS.

These are the health experts who told everyone they wouldn’t have to wear masks if they got the vaccine. CDC flip flopped less than two months later and the masks recommended indoors even if vaccinated. But people are supposed to buy, “If you get vaccinated instead of being subjected to weekly testing things will get back to normal. (Shhhh - forget that we JUST lied about masks going away if you got the vaccine)”.

Who takes these *experts* seriously? Anyone?

[Fantaztic7]

Delta variant will soon be talked about as a “tsunami” or “super wave”.

Also, there should be a speech coming about new restrictions or version of lock downs.

[Fantaztic7]

PSA: Lollapalooza is over and the pause on the pandemic has been lifted in Chicago.

[Peerless]

Delta variant will soon be talked about as a “tsunami” or “super wave”.

Also, there should be a speech coming about new restrictions or version of lock downs.

Well, yesterday (Monday 8/3) there were 10,389 Covid hospitalizations in Florida. That is the most statewide during any point in the pandemic, and about 95% of those hospitalized are the unvaccinated.

What pretty little term would you like to use to describe that?

[Peerless]

Maybe Merck will come out with the "new and improved" Ivermectin that everyone can make lots of money on. The Federal Government gave them 356 mil to make the next Ivermectin a few weeks after the Ivermectin data was given to the Senate who then gave the data to the Establishment Health System. It must be going well because Merck just got a 1.2 billion deal with the federal government.

Who knows. But it still sounds like Ivermectin is lacking in the 'treats COVID' support train.

The available scientific evidence does not support the use of ivermectin, an antiparastic drug, for the treatment or prevention of COVID-19 outside the context of clinical trials, according to a new report from Cochrane, an international organization that reviews medical research and provides guidance about clinical practice.

Ivermectin has been the subject of much misinformation during the pandemic, prompting multiple health organizations and one of the drug’s manufacturers to issue warnings throughout the past year that there is not sufficient evidence to recommend its use for COVID-19 beyond a trial setting. In the new report, researchers in Germany and the UK sifted through the literature on ivermectin and came to broadly the same conclusion.

“Based on the current very low- to low-certainty evidence, we are uncertain about the efficacy and safety of ivermectin used to treat or prevent COVID-19,” the authors write in their report, posted last week (July 28). “The completed studies are small and few are considered high quality. . . . Overall, the reliable evidence available does not support the use ivermectin for treatment or prevention of COVID-19 outside of well-designed randomized trials.”

“The hype around ivermectin is driven by some studies where the effect size for ivermectin is frankly not credible,” Paul Garner, the coordinating editor of the Cochrane Infectious Diseases Group, says in a statement. “Careful appraisal is the cornerstone of Cochrane’s work, and with such extreme public demands for a drug to work during the pandemic, it remains vital that we hold onto our scientific principles to guide care.”

The Cochrane review notes an “urgent need” for good quality randomized controlled trials of the drug.

The team’s final analysis included 14 randomized controlled trials with a total of 1,678 adults. Six of the studies were double-blinded and placebo-controlled—factors considered to improve the quality of evidence in drug trials. Nine of the 14 studies focused on moderate COVID-19 cases in hospital settings, four on mild cases in outpatients, and one on the use of ivermectin as a preventive medicine.

The team identified an additional 38 studies that failed to meet the review’s inclusion criteria, mainly because they contained problematic comparisons or data, or otherwise didn’t meet scientific standards for strong evidence. For example, nearly a third of the studies evaluated ivermectin alongside other treatments that varied between different groups of patients, making it difficult to extract the effect of ivermectin, specifically, from the data. Several studies classified people as COVID-19 patients without testing to make sure they had the disease with a PCR or antigen test.

One of the excluded studies, a widely cited paper first posted late last year on the preprint server Research Square, was withdrawn a couple weeks ago following allegations of data manipulation. The study, led by researchers in Egypt, claimed to have found a dramatic effect of ivermectin treatment on COVID-19 outcomes. However, researchers identified multiple inconsistencies in the data, The Guardian reported in July, particularly regarding the numbers of patients and their dates of hospital admission.

One patient was even reported to have left the hospital on the “non-existent date of 31/06/2020,” Jack Lawrence, a medical student in London who identified problems in the paper, tells The Guardian.

Another study that was not included in the Cochrane review, this one carried out in Argentina, has come under increased scrutiny from scientists in the last few days after epidemiologist and blogger Gideon Meyerowitz-Katz documented multiple inconsistencies—including numbers of patients that don’t add up and implausible effect sizes—on Twitter. “As far as interventional observational trials go, this is probably the worst one I’ve ever seen,” he writes.

The Cochrane review notes an “urgent need” for good quality randomized controlled trials of the drug, and identifies more than 30 ongoing studies. They include the PRINCIPLE trial run by the University of Oxford and the National Institutes of Health ACTIV-6 study.

“The findings from these studies may help to answer more clearly the question of ivermectin and its effects in treating and preventing COVID-19 in the future,” the authors write.

https://www.the-scientist.com/news-opinion/ivermectin-still-lacks-scientific-support-as-a-covid-19-drug-69049

Studies are still being done of course at Oxford.