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  • CanDB
    replied
    Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
    Everyone is responsible for themselves. It’s not my place to tell people how to protect themselves. Eating better regardless of how you decide that, getting exercise, efficient sleep, and vitamin D is a much better plan than wearing a mask and socially distancing.

    The research, led by the Murdoch Children's Research Institute (MCRI) and The University of Queensland and published in Diabetes Care, found obese or overweight patients are at high risk for having worse COVID-19 outcomes. They are also more likely to require oxygen and invasive mechanical ventilation compared to those with a healthy weight.




    So 58, you are saying that "healthy" folks might as well be given the freedom to not social distance, or wear masks, or follow recommended pandemic related guidelines...because they have a better plan? I think that a smart, "healthy" person would be wise to take this thing very seriously, wear a mask when in public places, social distance, etc....because one mistake could be detrimental to all those years of smart living. Maybe they think they are "healthy' and then find out the hard way that they have a condition of some sort. or like folks who often get braver and braver in certain situations, maybe they start minimizing the steps they take to keep themselves safe. Or maybe in light of their "healthiness" they forget that they are too close to others who may be vulnerable, and spread the virus, thinking all is well in their world.

    Sorry buddy, but solving a pandemic does not come from overnight "healthy" measures. There is a better way, for quicker results. And vaccines are now likely the best solution, along with continued safe practices.

    No one is going to argue about being "healthy". But even at that, lets be cognizant of the fact that a relatively high % of folks try and try to be healthier, and sometimes have difficulties in achieving what some do. And you certainly can not expect folks in a pandemic, who have issues to deal with, possibly stress that they have trouble managing, to suddenly become nutrition/exercise experts.

    But if they get vaccinated, wear masks when required, keep their distance, wash up and be respectful of others....in my books they are doing pretty good.
    Last edited by CanDB; 04-15-2021, 12:00 PM.

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  • 58Miller
    replied
    Originally posted by jazzbodog View Post

    Based on my post #2610 that you responded to, going back in time to ask yourself if you thought we would be in this horrible virus problem today is worthless. What's your point other than we are what we eat so all human beings should eat only healthy food and life will be pretty much PERFECT in the future. There's a better chance that the sun won't rise tomorrow than 7+ billion humans immediately eating healthy food forever.

    Most people know that quality exercise and quality food creates good health and reduces the chance of unnecessary sickness and early death. Very common knowledge.

    So, all society has to do is eliminate 99.999% of horrible unhealthy food that is 360 degrees around us 24/7/365 and so many problems would vanish. Should we start with removing all unhealthy food from grocery stores, fast food chains, all convenience stores, food trucks, sports stadiums, state fairs, etc.? I'll wager heavily that you don't practice what you preach. Are brocoli, apples, oranges, spinach, brussel sprouts, tofu, carrots, tomatoes, bananas, green beans, wild rice and all the other numerous foods that provide good health are always well stocked in your house? How about junk foods, sugar filled items, greasy potato / corn chips in your house? Are you vegan or on a total plant based diet? If so, good for you but don't expect the 7+ billion people to adopt it. It will never happen as long as slaughterhouses, McDonald's and 7-11's exist. We are creatures of very bad habits and that will never change.

    You can list all the statistics regarding Covid 19 which have some true value, but never forget the words of Mark Twain that I truly believe:

    "There are lies, damn lies, and then there's STATISTICS".

    I interpret that to mean many times in life factual statistics don't always PROVE valid meaning and EXPECTED results, both positive and negative.
    Everyone is responsible for themselves. It’s not my place to tell people how to protect themselves. Eating better regardless of how you decide that, getting exercise, efficient sleep, and vitamin D is a much better plan than wearing a mask and socially distancing.

    The research, led by the Murdoch Children's Research Institute (MCRI) and The University of Queensland and published in Diabetes Care, found obese or overweight patients are at high risk for having worse COVID-19 outcomes. They are also more likely to require oxygen and invasive mechanical ventilation compared to those with a healthy weight.





    Leave a comment:


  • jazzbodog
    replied
    Originally posted by 58Miller View Post

    If you told me 2 years ago that their would be a virus that 90 percent of people who get it won’t even know they have it with out a test and a very small percent of the population the elderly, those with underlying conditions and the obese would be hospitalized and die and that we would shutdown the entire country, schools, businesses, and arrest people for going outside and Playing catch in an empty parking lot with their child or arrest a man in the Pacific Ocean on a stand up paddle board by himself. I would have said that will never happen. But it has and continues despite the statistics being very similar in states that shutdown and states that opened up after the initial surge.

    Truth is being healthy is up to all of us, the government can’t make us get in shape but they can provide resources and information to help people realize they are killing them selves. Seems like nobody cares unless you attach the word Covid.

    People don’t want to hear me say eat better, sleep better, and exercise too bad!!!! I don’t want to hear “wear your mask” ( when I have been wearing one since this began), social distance ( been doing it since day one!
    done everything that’s been asked, cases continue to rise and will for the foreseeable future. Peoples immune systems will fight it off in most cases and in some people who are not healthy will sadly be hospitalized and or die.

    Average age of death in America 78.7 years old.
    Average age of death from Covid, between 76-80 depending on the state.

    We all will die at some point, WE are responsible for ourselves.

    CDC data also show that Americans, regardless of age group, are far more likely to die of something other than COVID-19. Even among those in the most heavily impacted age group (85 and older), only 13.3percent of all deaths since February 2020 were due to COVID-19.
    Based on my post #2610 that you responded to, going back in time to ask yourself if you thought we would be in this horrible virus problem today is worthless. What's your point other than we are what we eat so all human beings should eat only healthy food and life will be pretty much PERFECT in the future. There's a better chance that the sun won't rise tomorrow than 7+ billion humans immediately eating healthy food forever.

    Most people know that quality exercise and quality food creates good health and reduces the chance of unnecessary sickness and early death. Very common knowledge.

    So, all society has to do is eliminate 99.999% of horrible unhealthy food that is 360 degrees around us 24/7/365 and so many problems would vanish. Should we start with removing all unhealthy food from grocery stores, fast food chains, all convenience stores, food trucks, sports stadiums, state fairs, etc.? I'll wager heavily that you don't practice what you preach. Are brocoli, apples, oranges, spinach, brussel sprouts, tofu, carrots, tomatoes, bananas, green beans, wild rice and all the other numerous foods that provide good health are always well stocked in your house? How about junk foods, sugar filled items, greasy potato / corn chips in your house? Are you vegan or on a total plant based diet? If so, good for you but don't expect the 7+ billion people to adopt it. It will never happen as long as slaughterhouses, McDonald's and 7-11's exist. We are creatures of very bad habits and that will never change.

    You can list all the statistics regarding Covid 19 which have some true value, but never forget the words of Mark Twain that I truly believe:

    "There are lies, damn lies, and then there's STATISTICS".

    I interpret that to mean many times in life factual statistics don't always PROVE valid meaning and EXPECTED results, both positive and negative.
    Last edited by jazzbodog; 04-15-2021, 10:43 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • 58Miller
    replied
    Originally posted by jazzbodog View Post

    I get what you are saying but your "solution" will never happen. Do you expect the millions of people in the USA and the world to suddenly get extremely healthy in one day? That's what would need to happen at this point in time to as you say "the only solution to fighting Covid". I think that's exactly the same as saying "if ALL people stopped speeding and using cell phones in their car and ALL criminal activity stopped and ALL aspects of pollution ended and ALL people helped poor people to end poverty".....then the world wouldn't have so many problems that ended in DEATH.

    There has never been a "perfect" world and there never will be. The 7.5 billion humans on this planet will never behave perfectly to create a perfect world. We are all dumb animals who will continue to fail for billions of reasons. Our successes will always be challenged and harder to achieve due to our inevitable stupid and ignorant behavior.

    Trial and error has been mankind's most effective way to learn yet we often refuse to learn from past mistakes due to selfishness, greed, ignorance, not engaging common sense, etc. and that is why we will continue to endure and struggle with this pandemic and all the numerous negative aspects that come with it. Very sad.
    If you told me 2 years ago that their would be a virus that 90 percent of people who get it won’t even know they have it with out a test and a very small percent of the population the elderly, those with underlying conditions and the obese would be hospitalized and die and that we would shutdown the entire country, schools, businesses, and arrest people for going outside and Playing catch in an empty parking lot with their child or arrest a man in the Pacific Ocean on a stand up paddle board by himself. I would have said that will never happen. But it has and continues despite the statistics being very similar in states that shutdown and states that opened up after the initial surge.

    Truth is being healthy is up to all of us, the government can’t make us get in shape but they can provide resources and information to help people realize they are killing them selves. Seems like nobody cares unless you attach the word Covid.

    People don’t want to hear me say eat better, sleep better, and exercise too bad!!!! I don’t want to hear “wear your mask” ( when I have been wearing one since this began), social distance ( been doing it since day one!
    done everything that’s been asked, cases continue to rise and will for the foreseeable future. Peoples immune systems will fight it off in most cases and in some people who are not healthy will sadly be hospitalized and or die.

    Average age of death in America 78.7 years old.
    Average age of death from Covid, between 76-80 depending on the state.

    We all will die at some point, WE are responsible for ourselves.

    CDC data also show that Americans, regardless of age group, are far more likely to die of something other than COVID-19. Even among those in the most heavily impacted age group (85 and older), only 13.3percent of all deaths since February 2020 were due to COVID-19.

    Last edited by 58Miller; 04-15-2021, 09:30 AM.

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  • CanDB
    replied
    Originally posted by jazzbodog View Post

    I get what you are saying but your "solution" will never happen. Do you expect the millions of people in the USA and the world to suddenly get extremely healthy in one day? That's what would need to happen at this point in time to as you say "the only solution to fighting Covid". I think that's exactly the same as saying "if ALL people stopped speeding and using cell phones in their car and ALL criminal activity stopped and ALL aspects of pollution ended and ALL people helped poor people to end poverty".....then the world wouldn't have so many problems that ended in DEATH.

    There has never been a "perfect" world and there never will be. The 7.5 billion humans on this planet will never behave perfectly to create a perfect world. We are all dumb animals who will continue to fail for billions of reasons. Our successes will always be challenged and harder to achieve due to our inevitable stupid and ignorant behavior.

    Trial and error has been mankind's most effective way to learn yet we often refuse to learn from past mistakes due to selfishness, greed, ignorance, not engaging common sense, etc. and that is why we will continue to endure and struggle with this pandemic and all the numerous negative aspects that come with it. Very sad.
    Well said. IF ONLY does not work well with billions of people. Vaccines and proper social adherence including masks, is much faster and can be legislated. And in fairness, a lot of folks have extreme difficulty suddenly becoming healthier, in diet and exercise. Chastise them if you will, but as I understand human behaviour, many of us have our demons, or at very least, problems dealing with life whether it be mental, physical or deeper. So as you point out, to expect millions and millions to flick a health switch is unreasonable. They can try harder, but they will not be in much better shape within a month or two. Similarly, there are a lot people with issues related to mental health, which can also be a severe health factor, and can also be the reason folks are not eating properly and exercising they way they should. So it is nice to talk about a sudden shift to better health, and to point our fingers at those folks...but first I'd look in the mirror and make sure I am doing my part, and in this case, following the rules at play.

    If we think healthcare is easy for everyone, it is not. If we think that it will stop this pandemic as we know it, in its tracks, versus vaccines and social awareness, I believe we are expecting a miracle when in fact, a quicker, more reasonable solution is awaiting us now.

    Leave a comment:


  • jazzbodog
    replied
    Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
    Yes that is what I mean.

    Strengthening our immune systems and health is the best defense and the only solution to fighting Covid, and many other health problems.
    I get what you are saying but your "solution" will never happen. Do you expect the millions of obese, unhealthy people in the USA and the world to suddenly get extremely healthy in one day? That's what would need to happen at this point in time to as you say "the only solution to fighting Covid". I think that's exactly the same as saying "if ALL people stopped speeding and using cell phones in their car and ALL criminal activity stopped and ALL aspects of pollution ended and ALL people helped poor people to end poverty".....then the world wouldn't have so many problems that ended in DEATH.

    There has never been a "perfect" world and there never will be. The 7.5 billion humans on this planet will never behave perfectly to create a perfect world. We are all dumb animals who will continue to fail for billions of reasons. Our successes will always be challenged and harder to achieve due to our inevitable stupid and ignorant behavior.

    Trial and error has been mankind's most effective way to learn yet we often refuse to learn from past mistakes due to selfishness, greed, ignorance, not engaging common sense, etc. and that is why we will continue to endure and struggle with this pandemic and all the numerous negative aspects that come with it. Very sad.
    Last edited by jazzbodog; 04-15-2021, 09:29 AM.

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  • 58Miller
    replied
    Originally posted by CanDB View Post

    I'll be brief, because again, this is very repetitive conversation. There are multiple solutions to fighting covid, including good health. Basically none of them are guarantees.
    I agree no guarantees with what our leaders have pushed.

    Wearing masks, social distancing, and locking down states has still resulted in 500k plus deaths, states like Michigan haven’t lifted restrictions and our being hit hard. States that have opened and lifted mask mandates like Texas have had cases drop.

    Vaccines are an option, but no guarantee that injecting a synthetic nucleic acid with Zero idea how they will effect someone long term. No idea if they can stop variants or if they will cause cancer. No guarantee they won’t.

    About 5,800 people who have been vaccinated against coronavirus have become infected anyway, the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention tells CNN.

    Some became seriously ill and 74 people died, the CDC said. It said 396 — 7% — of those who got infected after they were vaccinated required hospitalization.

    I will take my chances working on strengthening my immune system and getting in better health.

    Eating better, exercising, losing weight when overweight or obese, and getting efficient sleep and vitamin d guarantee you will have a better quality of life and have a much better chance to beat Covid-19.



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  • CanDB
    replied
    Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
    Yes that is what I mean.

    Strengthening our immune systems and health is the best defense and the only solution to fighting Covid, and many other health problems.
    I'll be brief, because again, this is very repetitive conversation. There are multiple solutions to fighting covid, including good health. Basically none of them are guarantees.

    Leave a comment:


  • 58Miller
    replied
    Originally posted by jazzbodog View Post


    You stated: If health is the biggest issue in fighting Covid then why is the solution resulting in an even more unhealthy country?

    I know what the definition of solution is. Are you using the word solution to mean lockdown?
    Yes that is what I mean.

    Strengthening our immune systems and health is the best defense and the only solution to fighting Covid, and many other health problems.

    Leave a comment:


  • jazzbodog
    replied
    Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
    Definition solution: a means of solving a problem or dealing with a difficult situation.

    Many states solution to fighting Covid is to have everyone lockdown, stay home, making it most likely that the majority eat unhealthy fast foods, with gyms closed more likely to not workout, and staying home less likely to get needed vitamin D. Eating unhealthy food, not exercising lead to weight gain and a worse chance against Covid. Vitamin D deficiency is a huge issue in Covid related hospitalizations and deaths.

    Right cases are rising in states like Michigan that was a strict lockdown and mask mandate state. Texas has opened up and lifted restrictions and Texas didn’t see an explosion in COVID cases. Instead, the Lone Star state saw cases reach a record low. Indeed, in the month since Franken mocked the announcement, daily cases in Texas fell from 6,834 to 2,078. That’s a 70 percent drop.

    Minnesota and Michigan haven’t lifted restrictions, numbers should be lower right?

    Despite these restrictions, Minnesota is seeing a surge in coronavirus cases. On March 2, the day Texas announced it was lifting all pandemic restrictions, Minnesota’s daily case count was at 425. A month later, on April 2, that number had swelled to more than 2,500.

    Several other states with restrictions are seeing similar rises in cases to varying degrees, including Massachusetts (mild increase) and Michigan (a sharp increase).

    In Michigan, CNN reports that state statics show its case count hit 9,350 on Saturday, the highest since December 7. Its 3-day rolling average on April 4 was 6,995.

    In Texas, it was 1,646.

    The solution should be to get the majority of the population who already has 95+% against Covid to lose weight ( if overweight or obese), by eating good food, exercise, and get efficient amount of vitamin d.

    The group of people in this country most likely to be hospitalized should be protected. If that means quarantine, lockdown, vaccine whatever they choose to protect themselves from catching this virus, that is where the government should put their attention and resources. Hep those who need help, not lockdown the majority and have cases still rising like in Minnesota, Michigan, and Massachusetts.

    You stated: If health is the biggest issue in fighting Covid then why is the solution resulting in an even more unhealthy country?

    I know what the definition of solution is. Are you using the word solution to mean lockdown?

    Leave a comment:


  • 58Miller
    replied
    Originally posted by jazzbodog View Post

    Define "solution" please.
    Definition solution: a means of solving a problem or dealing with a difficult situation.

    Many states solution to fighting Covid is to have everyone lockdown, stay home, making it most likely that the majority eat unhealthy fast foods, with gyms closed more likely to not workout, and staying home less likely to get needed vitamin D. Eating unhealthy food, not exercising lead to weight gain and a worse chance against Covid. Vitamin D deficiency is a huge issue in Covid related hospitalizations and deaths.

    Right cases are rising in states like Michigan that was a strict lockdown and mask mandate state. Texas has opened up and lifted restrictions and Texas didn’t see an explosion in COVID cases. Instead, the Lone Star state saw cases reach a record low. Indeed, in the month since Franken mocked the announcement, daily cases in Texas fell from 6,834 to 2,078. That’s a 70 percent drop.

    Minnesota and Michigan haven’t lifted restrictions, numbers should be lower right?

    Despite these restrictions, Minnesota is seeing a surge in coronavirus cases. On March 2, the day Texas announced it was lifting all pandemic restrictions, Minnesota’s daily case count was at 425. A month later, on April 2, that number had swelled to more than 2,500.

    Several other states with restrictions are seeing similar rises in cases to varying degrees, including Massachusetts (mild increase) and Michigan (a sharp increase).

    In Michigan, CNN reports that state statics show its case count hit 9,350 on Saturday, the highest since December 7. Its 3-day rolling average on April 4 was 6,995.

    In Texas, it was 1,646.

    The solution should be to get the majority of the population who already has 95+% against Covid to lose weight ( if overweight or obese), by eating good food, exercise, and get efficient amount of vitamin d.

    The group of people in this country most likely to be hospitalized should be protected. If that means quarantine, lockdown, vaccine whatever they choose to protect themselves from catching this virus, that is where the government should put their attention and resources. Hep those who need help, not lockdown the majority and have cases still rising like in Minnesota, Michigan, and Massachusetts.








    Last edited by 58Miller; 04-14-2021, 09:30 AM.

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  • jazzbodog
    replied
    Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
    In the past year has the majority of the country locked down gotten healthier or less healthy?

    Has obesity gotten better or worse during lockdowns?1

    How bout mental health? Better or worse?

    If health is the biggest issue in fighting Covid then why is the solution resulting in an even more unhealthy country?
    Define "solution" please.

    Leave a comment:


  • mozzerpete
    replied
    My understanding is each vaccine is specific to its clinical trial's
    window, location, and variant.

    Although the efficacy rate for each vaccine varies,
    Pfizer's 95%, Moderna's 94%, J&J's 66%,
    they all prevent death and hospitalization.

    The efficacy rates simply imply one's chances of becoming
    less likely to get sick compared to those unvaccinated.

    J&J's 66% efficacy rate seems rather unappealing,
    but that's because its clinical trial window occurred later,
    mostly in Brazil and South Africa, with their variants.

    The real question for me is, are these vaccines retroactive,
    and will more inoculations be needed for future variants?

    Leave a comment:


  • Peanut
    replied
    Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
    I would call people who died from cigarettes before people were aware of the side effects victims, today with it very clear that cigarettes kill 400k a year in the us ( 40k from second hand smoke) that group is no longer victims.

    Covid kills elderly and unhealthy ( 50% obese) nothing can be done to prevent a persons age, obesity can be cured for the majority. But you won’t hear that from our leaders, you will hear “ don’t wear mask”, then “wear masks”, then “wear 2 or 3 mask”. You will also see our leaders close gyms, parks, arrest a man in the ocean by himself on a Stand up paddle board, arrest a man playing catch in an empty parking lot with his child. But if you want to eat 10,000 calories a day and sit on your couch ordering groceries and not going outside, your doing the right thing and helping fight the spread.
    Sorry that is not a victim, that is a person who chooses to not take care of themselves. And now that we know the data, their should be a war on obesity, help people lose weight! I’m not talking about being cover models I’m talking about mixing in daily exercise, get vitamin d and quit eating a diet full of carbohydrates, sugar and seed oils. They are killing way more than Covid ever has or will and people are addicted.



    (CNN)The risk of death from Covid-19 is about 10 times higher in countries where most of the population is overweight, according to a report released Wednesday by the World Obesity Federation.

    Researchers found that by the end of 2020, global Covid-19 death rates were more than 10 times higher in countries where more than half the adults are overweight, compared to countries where fewer than half are overweight.

    If something makes your chance of death 10 times higher , society needs to be doing everything it can to reduce it.
    I feel that maybe you missed my main point.

    Originally posted by CanDB View Post

    Thank you. And yes, a lot of what I have been stating is related to what you point out. Many of us are victims, and copers. I am absolutely 100% sure you did not want to have lupus! But you do...and you live your best in spite of it. And though I do not know you really well, I feel for you. You did not deserve any part of it.

    Many of us do not even realize the issues we have, whether we caused them or not. We do what we can within the parameters of the lives we lead. And most of the folks I know (because I can not speak for everyone) have done a really good job of being safe, for their lives and the lives of others. Over the past year, some conversations we've had have even involved, "I would not recommend doing that" comments. Not because we like to judge others, but because we care about others. And when more than one person agreed, it was more of a validation, rather than one person being a know it all. We've had those conversations many a time, and typically a common ground was found, because of common sense and because of how well read/observant we became, as a group.
    Thank you. No, I did not stand out in the middle of the street and yell, "Lupus! Here I am!". I did not even know what it was until after being diagnosed and educated myself.

    Originally posted by Bronco51 View Post

    Protecting those people requires that majority to follow simple procedures. And it has been shown that surviving, doesn't mean you always go back to normal.
    I've mentioned elsewhere in this thread that I do what I can to protect myself. My family takes all the precautions that they can. But there's always that chance that it comes in our home. So when I see people with masks and social distancing, I really appreciate them.

    Leave a comment:


  • CanDB
    replied
    Originally posted by 58Miller View Post

    I’m hopeful for the future too Can, hopefully we get through this and we can debate what turned our Broncos around into winners again!

    I always appreciate your opinions Can, Stay healthy my friend
    Yes pal....we may not always agree on everything, but you always leave me with something good, and I respect that!!

    Leave a comment:

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