Power: Fear, love, or respect?

[Big Buck 1981]

Fear is but one of many reasons that people may choose to follow any religion. But that's not within the scope of this discussion.

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I agree with your assessment of respect being the most essential tool that an effective leader can have, but I do take issue with your assessment of the Roman Empire. While it's true that it certainly expanded through the use of brute force, those who had been conquered by the Romans and accepted their place within the Roman society found that it had many benefits. Roads, aqueducts, sanitation, and advanced technology were boons to peoples that had lived without such things for eons. The Romans did rule through fear at first, but the people ruled by the empire came to respect the Romans. The reason for the fall of the Roman empire can be ultimately blamed on the last emperors, who spread their armies too thin and too often acted in their own self-interest as opposed to the interest of those they governed. Further proof that hereditary monarchy didn't work in the long term.

I guess we'll agree to disagree on the first point, I already stated that I do not worship God out of fear, if you don't want to believe me, that's fine.

As for the Romans, I agree that over time, they gained respect, but they only gained respect AFTER doing all the things to bring the conquered societies up to date. If they had merely conquered and kept their minions 'down', which would be ruling SOLELY out of fear...their reign would not have lasted nearly as long. However, as you said, they built roads, aqueducts, and so on...which earned the respect of the conquered societies. Even they knew that using fear as a source of power was not sustainable, so they took the necessary steps to gain respect...and perhaps, just a little love.

[WhoDeyBengals]

I guess we'll agree to disagree on the first point, I already stated that I do not worship God out of fear, if you don't want to believe me, that's fine.

Oh, no no no. You misunderstand me - I believe that you, specifically, do not worship out of fear. I'm just saying that there are other people that choose to pursue religion, at least in part, because of fear. Not you specifically.

As for the Romans, I agree that over time, they gained respect, but they only gained respect AFTER doing all the things to bring the conquered societies up to date. If they had merely conquered and kept their minions 'down', which would be ruling SOLELY out of fear...their reign would not have lasted nearly as long. However, as you said, they built roads, aqueducts, and so on...which earned the respect of the conquered societies. Even they knew that using fear as a source of power was not sustainable, so they took the necessary steps to gain respect...and perhaps, just a little love.

Definitely. I'm certain that people weren't very enthusiastic about wearing togas after having worn animal pelts for so long.

[Buff_bronc_fan]

It's all about perception... You can have a complete absence of fear, love or respect and still yield great power. It's all about how you are perceived by others.

They can hate you, disrespect you, and have no fear of you, but if you are the president of the united states, then you have power because people perceive you to be powerful- for better or for worse...

I agree, I'd rather be respected and attain power that way- but that's not always the case.

[Big Buck 1981]

Oh, no no no. You misunderstand me - I believe that you, specifically, do not worship out of fear. I'm just saying that there are other people that choose to pursue religion, at least in part, because of fear. Not you specifically.

Ah, cool...everything is copacetic then!

[WhoDeyBengals]

It's all about perception... You can have a complete absence of fear, love or respect and still yield great power. It's all about how you are perceived by others.

They can hate you, disrespect you, and have no fear of you, but if you are the president of the united states, then you have power because people perceive you to be powerful- for better or for worse...

I agree, I'd rather be respected and attain power that way- but that's not always the case.

But isn't that a form of respect? Not necessarily for the man or woman who holds the position, but rather respect for the institution that supports that person's power? In a democracy, elected officials need one of the three to be able to get people to vote for them.

1. Love: A beloved public figure can run for office sans respect. We've had actors and professional athletes elected to office because of this.
2. Respect: This should be obvious, but a successful business person or someone who does a good job of conveying a message can earn the respect, and thus, the vote, of the consitutuency.
3. Fear: A politician can create bugbears, and use them to make voters believe that if they don't vote for the politician, they may in some way become imperiled. We've seen a lot of this in recent years.

I still believe that you gotta have at least one to gain political power.

Ah, cool...everything is copacetic then!

We gotta stop running into one another like this, man.