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  • Value

    There are various forms of value. Typically we talk about market value, because in a true entrepreneurial state, supply and demand are the foundations for the market, almost any market. In its purest form, supply and demand and the marketplace are pretty much the simplest and most perfect way to conduct business. And if you look at The US and Canada (and so many other countries), those markets generally flourish, and if anything, have grown in dimension with the likes of online trading....where we all can be actively involved, with the only real drawback being the potential for skeptical buyers/sellers. But that too can be managed with some basic smarts.

    But there are other forms of value. The one form that I often think about relate to one's personal preferences, and how things make you feel. For example, what one person will pay for a house or car, or pretty much anything, may vary a little or even a lot, pending the way that product/service makes them feel. Emotional value can be quite significant, and the range of price may be quite large pending who is involved, and yes, how attached they are. There are many questions I could ask, but here are just a few:
    1) How much extra would you pay for a residence to know you will have good neighbours?
    2) How much do you want high quality customer service?
    3) Do you price in sentimental value, like the fact you love your house and all the memories, even though they have little if anything to do with what a buyer will pay for?

    There are a load of variations of what personal value might add up to. I think more about our condo because we haven't been here that long. But because it checks off most of the boxes (so far), maybe the price we paid was even a better deal. Design - check, size - check, good neighbours - check, lots of natural light - check, 2 side by side underground parking spots - check. Overall feeling about the place - check! I'll stop there!

    The thing about emotional/personal preference value is that it sometimes is not fully understood til long after the purchase. And it usually comes down to a feeling. A feeling that often takes time to gauge. Of course I am not talking about buying a cheeseburger or anything that has a pretty instant outcome, in terms of the like scale. I guess the best way I can explain it is my immediate thought about a product/service I have. How does it make me feel (yes, not necessarily on day one). When I think about our most recent vehicle purchase, do I feel great? Do I feel good? Do I have some regret? And it goes on. But the bottom line, how I feel translates to value, whether I paid the true market value or not. In fact, in many cases I will spend more than market price if I am confident in the way it will make me feel afterward. That is sometimes the hard part, but the more research we do and the more hands on involvement, the better the chances.

    And it evolves....like my daughter and her guy recently buying a house that they had to bid for monetarily but also through a letter, as to why they wanted that house. The previous owners in that case had a personal attachment, and part of the negotiation came down to their perception of who would be the better fit for their place. In that case, the letter had a value that may have translated to $10k, or even more. Their prized possession needed the proper owner.

    Anyway...do you buy and sell strictly in terms of market value, or do you have some "personal attachment" pricing to be negotiated in the price? Whether or not it makes a deal happen. My assumption is that most of us believe in the market value system, but do have exceptions that are influenced by basic gut feel, and sentiment.




    Last edited by CanDB; 09-23-2021, 02:29 PM.

  • #2
    OK.....I see....this thread has little value to the readership.

    *jots down in notebook.."today I learned more about the value system...yeah, that's cool"

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by CanDB View Post
      OK.....I see....this thread has little value to the readership.

      *jots down in notebook.."today I learned more about the value system...yeah, that's cool"
      But you are invaluable

      Comment


      • #4
        lol.

        So about 4 years back, my wife and I bought our first house.

        At the time, we thought we were getting a decent deal. We wanted to buy the house we were living in... it was small and cheap, but it worked for us, and we were very happy there. We were renting from an old High School friend of the wife's. She wasn't ready to sell. So we decided we had to get a place... the search was difficult... especially as first time buyers.

        The place was in a nice neighborhood... the lady who owned it wasn't taking great care of it, but it was fairly new and in fine shape. Just cluttered and all sorts of interesting color choices. Most importantly though, there was nothing but fields behind it. There was some development that was going to extend that way, but not directly behind us, so we were good with that.

        We thought we'd found a diamond in the rough for the price.

        It changed quickly. Within weeks of moving in, we found out that they were in fact going to build directly behind us. We were pretty convinced at that point we'd have to move, but it was worse than we thought. My wife in particular grew to hate the place over the next two years. Aside from the loss of the view, we had neighbors across the way whose garage was a bar for them and their friends. They blasted music pretty much every night. The second we hit the two year mark we were back to looking.

        Looking the second time around was even harder. But after a few months, we found a place we thought was perfect. We wrote a letter to the owner to go along with our offer, and we feel it really helped us not only get our offer accepted at the price... but also she was very patient as she waited for us to find a buyer for our house.

        Things went sideways and we didn't get a buyer for our house. The nice lady who we were trying to buy from hung on as long as she could for us, I think, but eventually moved on.

        But the letter helped.

        We moved on from our agent at that point, took a break, then a few months later got another agent and got back to looking.

        We eventually found the house we're in now. It's perfect.

        I can't put a value on what the change has meant for us... particularly since we have spent 99% of our time since we got it stuck in the house.

        Two weeks ago was the two year anniversary of us finding this place. A month from now is the two year anniversary of us closing on it (on my wife's bday!).

        I have a lot of stories about value and all from our experiences in house shopping.

        We have to put numbers on things, but it's not always fair. We nearly got screwed by the appraiser of our house when we were moving to this place. Cost us in the five figures range. Sucked... and financially, we were already stretching to get this place.

        It'd probably take me a million dollar home to be convinced to move out of this one. The previous owners here were just here 2 years working for a corporation, and it meant nothing to them. They weren't interested in a bidding war or anything, and we were lucky enough to catch it immediately when it came on the market and got accepted before the market could put it out of reach.

        We have a view behind us that won't go anywhere.

        We love our neighbors. It's a small but beautiful neighborhood with NO HOA, and only one family we've found that we dislike thus far. They're right across the way and we haven't had any issues with them yet, but I think I've heard them badmouthing our dog under their breath or something, and we've heard from multiple neighbors that they are the black sheep.

        But that doesn't take enough away from what we have, which is quite possibly a forever home. Can't put a price on it. Well, we can. We hope never to have to.

        So there you go. There's my semi-related rant.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Jaws View Post

          But you are invaluable
          CanDB knows that some of his threads will get little to no attention... ABF isn't what it used to be... but he still goes out of his way to create quality content for all of us.

          There's a lot of value in that.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Jaws View Post

            But you are invaluable
            Originally posted by LordTrychon View Post

            CanDB knows that some of his threads will get little to no attention... ABF isn't what it used to be... but he still goes out of his way to create quality content for all of us.

            There's a lot of value in that.
            What's bigger than "likes" cuz I want to send those to you two!!



            Jawsie....we got to invite LT for coffee when we make it to The Aazores!!

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by CanDB View Post



              What's bigger than "likes" cuz I want to send those to you two!!



              Jawsie....we got to invite LT for coffee when we make it to The Aazores!!
              And he can make himself extra valuable and bring cake!

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by LordTrychon View Post
                lol.

                So about 4 years back, my wife and I bought our first house.

                At the time, we thought we were getting a decent deal. We wanted to buy the house we were living in... it was small and cheap, but it worked for us, and we were very happy there. We were renting from an old High School friend of the wife's. She wasn't ready to sell. So we decided we had to get a place... the search was difficult... especially as first time buyers.

                The place was in a nice neighborhood... the lady who owned it wasn't taking great care of it, but it was fairly new and in fine shape. Just cluttered and all sorts of interesting color choices. Most importantly though, there was nothing but fields behind it. There was some development that was going to extend that way, but not directly behind us, so we were good with that.

                We thought we'd found a diamond in the rough for the price.

                It changed quickly. Within weeks of moving in, we found out that they were in fact going to build directly behind us. We were pretty convinced at that point we'd have to move, but it was worse than we thought. My wife in particular grew to hate the place over the next two years. Aside from the loss of the view, we had neighbors across the way whose garage was a bar for them and their friends. They blasted music pretty much every night. The second we hit the two year mark we were back to looking.

                Looking the second time around was even harder. But after a few months, we found a place we thought was perfect. We wrote a letter to the owner to go along with our offer, and we feel it really helped us not only get our offer accepted at the price... but also she was very patient as she waited for us to find a buyer for our house.

                Things went sideways and we didn't get a buyer for our house. The nice lady who we were trying to buy from hung on as long as she could for us, I think, but eventually moved on.

                But the letter helped.

                We moved on from our agent at that point, took a break, then a few months later got another agent and got back to looking.

                We eventually found the house we're in now. It's perfect.

                I can't put a value on what the change has meant for us... particularly since we have spent 99% of our time since we got it stuck in the house.

                Two weeks ago was the two year anniversary of us finding this place. A month from now is the two year anniversary of us closing on it (on my wife's bday!).

                I have a lot of stories about value and all from our experiences in house shopping.

                We have to put numbers on things, but it's not always fair. We nearly got screwed by the appraiser of our house when we were moving to this place. Cost us in the five figures range. Sucked... and financially, we were already stretching to get this place.

                It'd probably take me a million dollar home to be convinced to move out of this one. The previous owners here were just here 2 years working for a corporation, and it meant nothing to them. They weren't interested in a bidding war or anything, and we were lucky enough to catch it immediately when it came on the market and got accepted before the market could put it out of reach.

                We have a view behind us that won't go anywhere.

                We love our neighbors. It's a small but beautiful neighborhood with NO HOA, and only one family we've found that we dislike thus far. They're right across the way and we haven't had any issues with them yet, but I think I've heard them badmouthing our dog under their breath or something, and we've heard from multiple neighbors that they are the black sheep.

                But that doesn't take enough away from what we have, which is quite possibly a forever home. Can't put a price on it. Well, we can. We hope never to have to.

                So there you go. There's my semi-related rant.
                Great stuff LT! BTW, I now think the "L" in LT stands for Louisville.

                Seriously, your story is all about life's trials and errors, and hopes and even dreams. And unfortunately with houses, there is a very large cost to not getting it right, or as in your case, not getting as much honesty as you would expect. I can add some not so pleasant memories, especially about home buying. We thought we had some kind of foundation problem at one place, and though it did not cost us much, it definitely caused some exasperation over a significant period. Luckily my wife handles things much better than I. When I bought my first home, as a single dude, I had a panic attack when I wondered if the house had Urea Formaldehyde insulation, for some reason. It was a government approved insulation but then it became a health hazard. I guess it had just become a nightmare for some, and I did not know about it til just after the purchase. I panic real good!!

                But there are so many nightmares involved with large purchases. Financials can drive some folks crazy, including big market losses. I guess I can say I wish I knew then what I know now, but the truer statement, "I wish I knew now what I will know in 10 years!!" Or more of course.

                But this all reminds me of why we should respect others, and that includes the buying/selling aspect of life. Just simple things, like when you buy/sell, leave your place in as good shape as you can, including doing a great clean up before you hand over the keys. And give the buyers instructions where necessary, multiple keys that are labelled, and so forth. In our last place we spent some extra money to improve the electrical outlets even though we did not have to. Anyway, we got a great condo, but the sellers did not do a good job of preparing for us. They were selling their parents' place. They left a pile of keys on the counter, few that worked! We had to get a door opener remote, a fob to enter, and were welcomed by some things that were theirs. Pathetic!

                All in all I could name a load of stories where I got more value or less than expected. I have a rule or two that I "try" to follow, though it all comes easier for my wife. And it's related to the not so good outcomes. Goes like this....I believe that we actually learn more from the mistakes or the bad luck than when we are free sailing thru life. Unless it is a bigger problem of course, which I do not want to wish on anyone. But for small/medium problems, easy to say, but if we work our way through them, and we look back, we usually will have gained something positive as a result. For some it may be a new and wonderful partnership. For another, it may be a new career that blossoms. And possibly for some, a loss of money - even a fairly large amount, which turned into the starting point for them to become more educated in the ways of financials, and possibly significant long term gains. Just a small list for now.

                Anyway....life isn't always fair, but I think that's true for all of us. But for all of us, as long as the issue is small/medium sized at worst, I believe we can not only fix it, but eventually look back and realize that it made us better in one or more ways. Yes, we learned. We grew a little. We knew what to avoid later. Don't get me wrong, I love steady positives, even if I take some for granted (which I shouldn't). But when challenged to reassess unpleasant times/situations, I can find good things that would not have happened had I not experienced those negative experiences.

                Not a perfect model, and again, this does not align with more serious hardship/misfortune, though some folks amaze me to no end. I bid folks great strength in those situations.

                Comment


                • #9
                  One more (as I was thinking more about LT's post), sometimes we actually gain value from something we thought might be an issue. We once moved just outside the city to a nice 2 acre plot of land. It did have a railroad track beyond the property, and our kids were pretty young, so in spite of our assurances, we worried a bit that it might be noisy or a safety concern. But as we had understood, it was a small train that seldom travelled. And it would actually serve as a fun trip for customers to travel north of the city towards the beaches.

                  I always remember one Saturday afternoon when we were at the back yard, and the train slowly passed by....with passengers waving at the kids and the kids waving back. It was perfect!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I so appreciate the offer that I would be willing to even bake the cake.... but I fear that would have little value.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Jaws View Post

                      And he can make himself extra valuable and bring cake!
                      Originally posted by LordTrychon View Post
                      I so appreciate the offer that I would be willing to even bake the cake.... but I fear that would have little value.

                      I don't want your wife to be stuck with the cake, so bring her too! She has membership privileges.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Would that be Coffee Cake Can?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Jaws View Post
                          Would that be Coffee Cake Can?
                          That's about right!!

                          Maybe we can mix in some breakfasty goodies for coffee as well....call me Crempog Can!


                          Heck, that ticks off most of my boxes when it comes to coffee and dessert/sweets and good Welsh company!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by CanDB View Post

                            That's about right!!

                            Maybe we can mix in some breakfasty goodies for coffee as well....call me Crempog Can!


                            Heck, that ticks off most of my boxes when it comes to coffee and dessert/sweets and good Welsh company!
                            Crempog Can sounds tasty!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Have you ever tried to price a great partnership/friendship? Quite possibly not, but I think we can all agree that the price tag would be extremely high!!! Sadly though, some folks have lost all that personal value because they are foolish. They throw away quite possibly the most valuable thing they will ever have because they did not think it out. Most of us know better....and consider the consequences before acting/speaking. Some of us are just flat out lucky in that regard.

                              Comment

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