Nuggets and Karl Part Ways

[Matymaddog]

I would have to disagree on that one. Hometown Mr. Big shot Billups, who I played against when he was at GW and I was at South, was a star in the NBA. He was the Finals MVP in '04 against Shaq/Kobe lakers. He made multiple all-star games as well.

Billups was not a superstar. If he was then Ben Wallace was 110% a superstar with that criteria.

[Matymaddog]

Mixed feelings. Positives and negatives. Right now though I would say our team, with our personnel and without Karl is not a very good one. Looking at the talent on the roster and the talent on it you cannot say that you think it is a 57 win team. Karl got so much out of this playing group and so much more then they were worth.

He seemed to really get Ty Lawson going. He was always on his case and the new coach has to be the same. Because we have seen when Ty Lawson hides this team is no where near being as good as it can be. So the new coach must be great at motivating his players, as all coaches should be.

I think this will mean good things for our half court offense. For years I have been banging on about it and wondering if it is even coached. Given the players we have are not great for it however I hope this area of basketball improves. Also I want to see some fundamentals being shown by our players. Whether it is taught or not I don't know. However things like boxing out and setting good screens has been something which this team hasn't been good at for a while.

I would love to see Hollins in here. He seems like a no non-sense guy and a guy who would bring a much more physical mentality here. He probably doesn't have the roster he would like however that is what the off-season is for. Making the team better and the new General Manager better not stick with this group and hope for changes. The players we have are not good enough.

I am excited for a potential rebuild. I see some of you are not however I am. This playing group we have is not good enough. No big man who can score in the post, no 3 point ace and no consistant jump shooters . First order of business should be to get a big man who can score. Then get a big man who can defend. I see everyone on the roster as expendable except for Ty Lawson. Free agent options I love are Al Jefferson, Nikola Pekovic and JJ Reddick. Also Seth Curry in the draft would be awesome.

I am curious to know who is making this decision right now, along with the next coaching hire because I don't think Josh Kronke should be doing that. The way I think it works best in all sports teams is to get the General Manager first, I am glad the last one is gone. Then let him make the decision on the coach and the players. I just hope Kronke doesn't hire the coach before the General Manager because that coach has to have the same philosophy as the new general manager.

I've been reading that Nothing has happened the last few years without Josh having the final say. That he pushed hard for the loot we got from the Knicks and other such moves. I'm hearing Pete D'Alessandro (Masai's "best kept secret") will likely be promoted. Kings just asked to speak with him about their GM job

[Spice 1]

I would have to disagree on that one. Hometown Mr. Big shot Billups, who I played against when he was at GW and I was at South, was a star in the NBA. He was the Finals MVP in '04 against Shaq/Kobe lakers. He made multiple all-star games as well.

I tend to agree. I think Billups was a fringe all time great. You wouldn't put him up there with JKidd or Nash, but you could say that he was one of the top 5 points in the league for anywhere between five and ten years. And he did get star treatment when he was in Detroit. In '06 Billups finished 5th in MVP voting, and he had no business even being in the discussion.

On topic though. Denver fans would know better than I would, but I think he got a lot out of this team. I know all about Karl's history of post season failures (was a HUGE Kemp and GP fan as a kid), but I really don't think this was an example of that. Losing to Deke and the Nuggs back in the day, that was a post season failure. This year the Warriors gave the Spurs some trouble in the second round. Look at what the Spurs then did to Hollins' Grizzlies in the conference finals. And are trying to do to the Heat right now. Maybe it was time to move on, but I don't see how a coaching change is going to enhance the Nuggets current situation.

[BroncosDivision]

No word from John or BroncosDivision. They were both pro Karl, even more than myself. Sure they aren't too happy.

I've been trying to put together my emotions on this since the news broke but honestly, I'm very disappointed and even shocked. I don't see the benefits in parting ways now. In a year? Maybe.. and even then I'm not sure. It would depend on how the season played out.

Look at the roster and the type of players we have. Karl was the perfect coach and really maximized the potential. Anything short of a rebuild and this move makes ZERO sense.

Ugh... another bonehead move by the Kroenke family.

[Matymaddog]

The Denver Nuggets took a bold step in the right direction toward an NBA championship on Thursday, when 33-year-old franchise president Josh Kroenke finally stood up to all the garbage spewed by George Karl and kicked the league's coach of the year to the curb.

Karl fired? Anybody who was paying attention could not be surprised.

Why is Karl gone?

When Karl let his name be linked to the coaching vacancy with the Los Angeles Clippers this week, the 62-year-old coach either: A) knew exactly what he was doing, or B) is the dumbest man in the NBA.

And Karl is far from stupid. Anybody who thinks Karl is the innocent victim to the whimsy of a young NBA executive is being played for a fool by the coach.

Entering the final year of his contract with Denver, Karl sought a contract extension. That's understandable. Basketball is a business, and as Karl often has stressed, a long-term deal gives a coach the hammer with players.

So, Karl tried to leverage his 57-win season and his coach of the year trophy into a new contract. Guess what? The Kroenke family does not succumb to leverage. Ask former general manager Kiki Vandeweghe what happened when he threatened to bolt.

As one NBA executive told me: The Kroenkes don't do leverage. They blow up the bridge of negotiations. "Then," the NBA exec added, "Stan Kroenke comes and blows up your house."

Boom.

Karl is gone.

After a 57-win regular season, the opening-round playoff loss to Golden State was devastating. But getting beat by the Warriors wasn't as upsetting as how Denver lost. During the playoff series, center JaVale McGee averaged 18.5 minutes per game, mirroring his meager playing time of the regular season. His first starting assignment of the season did not arrive until the Nuggets trailed 3-1 in the best-of-seven series.

Denver's front office did not pay McGee $10 million per season to eat popcorn on the bench. Karl stubbornly refused to develop McGee, insisting to me that a coach's focus is winning the next game on the schedule. That's not only ego-driven and short-sighted, it was a source of friction between Karl and his superiors long before trouble arrived against the Warriors, when McGee forlornly told me after a practice in San Francisco the playoff series didn't work for him, offensively or defensively.

OK, I get frustrated with McGee's amazing lack of hoops instinct and wavering focus, too. But Karl got paid handsomely to coach up the big man. As has been the case too often in the past, rather than be a player's ally, Karl pointed a finger of blame at McGee. The coach has done it to players more talented than McGee (see Ray Allen). Karl has done it to people worse than McGee (see J.R. Smith). In the NBA of 2013, a coach who thinks he's the star would be better served working a gym on a college campus.

The beauty of basketball is the scoreboard. The scoreboard never lies. But Karl constantly acted as if the final score was a negotiable item. Sure, he would take responsibility for defeat, as the driver of the bus, but not until he ran the bus over everybody else along for the ride.

One example: During a recent golf junket to California with folks who love the Nuggets, Karl wanted it known Danilo Gallinari's recovery from a gruesome knee injury was proceeding far slower than anybody desired, pushing back the timetable for the forward's return to active duty next season.

Hey, it was Karl's pity party and he would cry if he wanted.

Karl guided the Nuggets to nine consecutive playoff berths and 423 regular-season victories. But his real genius was selling reasons why Denver couldn't win in the playoffs, whether it was Melo's fault or a bad matchup with a hot Warriors team that somehow stumbled into a stronger lineup when all-star David Lee got hurt.

It all sounded like bunk.

Karl is a brilliant strategist, an engaging speaker and a brave winner versus cancer. He's also an incredibly high maintenance coach in a sport with too many prima donnas. As Karl admitted during the playoffs, he was a hot dog as a player. And nothing much has changed after all these years.

It was always something with Karl.

Well, Kroenke finally removed a big excuse for those who believe the NBA conspires against Denver ever winning a championship.

He fired Karl, the master of excuses.

http://m.denverpost.com/denverpost/d...tguid=wdo8jsJY

[Broncoholic JS]

Phil Jackson can have both the GM and HC position as far as I am concerned!

[Broncoholic3233]

Phil Jackson can have both the GM and HC position as far as I am concerned!

He's not in the mix doesn't sound like. Probably wouldn't come here anyways.

[Houshmazode]

http://m.denverpost.com/denverpost/d...tguid=wdo8jsJY

Great article. He always brought the conspiracy theories up right before the POs started.

It's difficult to watch him go because he's a pretty good coach and a good guy, but there's good reasons he was let go. He made some pretty questionable decisions with his lineups.

[BroncNuggsRocks]

Apparently we'll be promoting Pete D'Alessandro as Executive VP of Basketball Operations. Anybody hear this? just a rumor i read on reddit.

[Matymaddog]

Apparently we'll be promoting Pete D'Alessandro as Executive VP of Basketball Operations. Anybody hear this? just a rumor i read on reddit.

Yea. He deserves it

[Broncoholic JS]

Hollins is now available.

[Matymaddog]

I've been hearing we may likely promote Melvin Hunt before the 76ers attempt to take him off our hands. They have not only gunned for D'Allessandro but now they are going after Hunt. Both of their attempts at snatching a coach and assistant of ours are forcing the Nuggets hands into promoting them.

[Houshmazode]

I'd like D'Alessandro. Wouldn't mind Hunt at all but I''d rather have Hollins.

[InElwayWeTrust]

If we fire Karl to just promote Hunt then SMH....