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Pre-snap deception, lack of sportsmanship

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  • Pre-snap deception, lack of sportsmanship

    I just saw the Patsies employ a deceptive pre-snap tactic that has always bugged me and I wanted to get other opinions. I've seen several offenses do things like this that you wouldn't think need to do it, like the Colts and Pats.
    • In hurry-up situation, fake spiking the ball in order to get the defense to not play the down.

    • I remember Manning and crew at the end of a half where the teams started walking into the locker room and then the Colts' offense runs back into formation hoping to get a free play with no set defense.

    • Less deceptive but still annoying, also in hurry-up offenses but not 2-minute, snap the ball if the defense tries to swap players.


    I understand deception is a part of the game. But this kind of stuff smacks a poor sportsmanship. Trying to get the defense to not even defend is not the same as pump-faking a pass or running a reverse. Once the ball is snapped, all deception is great because the defense is trying to defend. But this other stuff is intended to not even let the defense give an effort.

    What do you think? Do you think it's just dandy to try to trick the defense into not playing? Is it okay to not let them switch players when obviously time isn't an issue? Doesn't this all violate basic sportsmanship?

    For what it's worth, I don't remember the Broncos ever lowering themselves to such depths, although I could have forgotten. Why do supposed classy organizations employ such dodgy tactics? (Oh, I guess the Pats showed they're not above a lack of sportsmanship but why do the Colts do it?)
    Last edited by Javalon; 10-28-2007, 04:17 PM.
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  • #2
    Thats a old trick. I remember when Dan Marino did a few years back with the dolphins and it work. I dont see nothing wrong with doing it. Thats why coaches say play from whistle to whistle. Alot of teams attempted the play with no success. All teams should be prepared for that by now. I seen chad pennington do it a few times also.
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    • #3
      If they allow it in Madden football, it's legit imo. =p


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      • #4
        I have no problem with it at all.....It's no different than all that BS Manning does before the snap....

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        • #5
          I see your point, Jav....

          With these, it's the sort of thing I would probably laugh my butt off if we'd done it to the Chiefs or Raiders... but I would be peeved beyond belief if someone did it to the Broncos.

          And technically, a fake spike DOES happen after the snap.
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          • #6
            Originally posted by Javalon View Post
            I just saw the Patsies employ a deceptive pre-snap tactic that has always bugged me and I wanted to get other opinions. I've seen several offenses do things like this that you wouldn't think need to do it, like the Colts and Pats.
            • In hurry-up situation, fake spiking the ball in order to get the defense to not play the down.

            • I remember Manning and crew at the end of a half where the teams started walking into the locker room and then the Colts' offense runs back into formation hoping to get a free play with no set defense.

            • Less deceptive but still annoying, also in hurry-up offenses but not 2-minute, snap the ball if the defense tries to swap players.


            I understand deception is a part of the game. But this kind of stuff smacks a poor sportsmanship. Trying to get the defense to not even defend is not the same as pump-faking a pass or running a reverse. Once the ball is snapped, all deception is great because the defense is trying to defend. But this other stuff is intended to not even let the defense give an effort.

            What do you think? Do you think it's just dandy to try to trick the defense into not playing? Is it okay to not let them switch players when obviously time isn't an issue? Doesn't this all violate basic sportsmanship?

            For what it's worth, I don't remember the Broncos ever lowering themselves to such depths, although I could have forgotten. Why do supposed classy organizations employ such dodgy tactics? (Oh, I guess the Pats showed they're not above a lack of sportsmanship but why do the Colts do it?)
            These guys are professional athletes..The defense should always be ready for anything..They should all know that, most of them have been playing for a better part of there lives.. I dont think theres anything wrong with the things you mentioned, if there was something wrong with them, they would be illegal.. All players, on both sides of the ball should always be trying at all times when they are on the field and like I said be ready for anything.. You cant say its unsportsmanlike for one team to take advantage of another team because they arent paying attention..

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            • #7
              patriots are classless losers. I hope tom brady breaks his leg.
              Let's draft her....

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              • #8
                Originally posted by jumpslash View Post
                patriots are classless losers. I hope tom brady breaks his leg.
                C'mon now, your saying the Pats are classless then saying you want Brady to break his legs.... Tom Brady is just doing what hes being told too..

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                • #9
                  I DO believe its time for a rule change on this, and thought they would change it after Marino first did it.

                  This is why. The Spike rule, is a SPECIAL play specifically designed and ALLOWED by the NFL to give a team a way to stop the clock.... when in REALITY.... it should be a "illegal grounding" call. The QB doesn't leave the pocket, and the pass doesn't pass the LoS.

                  That being said, the fact that the offense is ALLOWED to execute an illegal play without being penalized should make it where the other team (the defense) should have a 'reasonable expectation' that that rule to allow this "illegal" grounding rule shouldn't be used even MORE against them.

                  This is just like when QBs USED to be able to "fake the slide" then rush for more yardage (I thought THAT was the biggest unsportsmanlike thing to do). But they made it illegal for QBs to do that, and now its time this rule be changed as well.

                  That being said, I think the Patriots have absolutely Made themselves out to be the lowest, and cheapest, of organizations in the NFL. They are showing absolutely NO class whatsoever.

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                  • #10
                    Just a matter of opinion.

                    We've had complaints this year about all the teams tryin to call the last second timeout on kickers at the end of games.

                    I've seen it employed several times this year always with negative commentary afterwards. So is it icing the kicker, or playing dirty?
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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by jumpslash View Post
                      patriots are classless losers. I hope tom brady breaks his leg.

                      What were you saying about class? I was distracted by your hypocrisy....

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Elway View Post
                        Just a matter of opinion.

                        We've had complaints this year about all the teams tryin to call the last second timeout on kickers at the end of games.

                        I've seen it employed several times this year always with negative commentary afterwards. So is it icing the kicker, or playing dirty?
                        That's kind of different because the team calling time out risks the kicker missing the first kick and then making the second one. Then they would look stupid. It's only because it mostly worked this year that people are complaining.

                        It's also different because the other team is going full speed. The plays I mentioned are designed to trick the defense into thinking the play isn't occuring.
                        "You can't take the sky from me..."
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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Elway View Post
                          Just a matter of opinion.

                          We've had complaints this year about all the teams tryin to call the last second timeout on kickers at the end of games.

                          I've seen it employed several times this year always with negative commentary afterwards. So is it icing the kicker, or playing dirty?
                          I have to agree with Jav here. Thats not the same thing at all.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by dandaman23 View Post
                            These guys are professional athletes..The defense should always be ready for anything..They should all know that, most of them have been playing for a better part of there lives.. I dont think theres anything wrong with the things you mentioned, if there was something wrong with them, they would be illegal.. All players, on both sides of the ball should always be trying at all times when they are on the field and like I said be ready for anything.. You cant say its unsportsmanlike for one team to take advantage of another team because they arent paying attention..
                            While I understand your point, I still believe it's poor form to try to trick them into not paying attention.

                            It would be kind of like in baseball if the catcher screamed at the top of his lungs and when the batter looked at him the pitcher threw the ball. As far as I know, that isn't allowed for a reason, probably sportsmanship. Let the batter have his full attention on the pitch when it's thrown and don't try to trick him into not watching the ball.

                            Similarly, let the defense be going full speed when the ball is snapped and don't try to trick them into thinking not reacting to the snap.
                            "You can't take the sky from me..."
                            ------
                            "You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding"

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Javalon View Post
                              While I understand your point, I still believe it's poor form to try to trick them into not paying attention.

                              It would be kind of like in baseball if the catcher screamed at the top of his lungs and when the batter looked at him the pitcher threw the ball. As far as I know, that isn't allowed for a reason, probably sportsmanship. Let the batter have his full attention on the pitch when it's thrown and don't try to trick him into not watching the ball.

                              Similarly, let the defense be going full speed when the ball is snapped and don't try to trick them into thinking not reacting to the snap.
                              I know what you are saying. Its not so much the 'tricking' the defense, because I know you enjoy a good 'trick' play as much as the next guy. But this rule, the spike rule... is a 'gift' to the offense.

                              Its actually an illegal play that has been 'gifted' to the offense to let them stop the clock without getting out of bounds or using a TO. I don't think they should be allowed to use this 'specific' play in order to trick the defense, when the play is already one that is actually against the rule book to begin with.

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