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  • Originally posted by Saucy View Post
    Well, I've explained many times before, but I think we are a much better team than last year. Having a different defensive scheme without having to change it in the middle will be a huge help. Getting some DTs and faster OLB and a tough MLB has instantly helped our run D which allows the greatest CB duo in the league to do their job. Offensively, our o-line is not only back from injury, but has improved. So, Jay has extra time and the running game improves. Henry will be healthy and finally has his head on straight. I believe he will prove all of his critics wrong. BMarsh will come back strong from his injury. Jay improves from last season even just from the fact he won't be so tired and will have more energy to focus. ST will be much better improved with Royal taking the PR and KR. We will have better field position.

    @ Oakland (W-Oakland didn't really improve...McFadden a bust, no QB)win
    San Diego (W-get revenge for last season, we're at home, they're still down)lost
    New Orleans (W - Saints can't get it together)close game with the edge to us
    @ Kansas City (W - we beat them twice...we got better, they really didn't. no QB)win
    Tampa Bay (W - not very good. No run game or QB)win
    Jacksonville (L - all star defense)lost
    @ New England (W-lost a lot of good players-start to decline-we always beat them)lost
    Miami (W - no explanation needed)win
    @ Cleveland (W-cleveland still growing)real close edge going to cleveland
    @ Atlanta (W - it's Atlanta)win
    Oakland (W - we're at home against team suck)win
    @ New York (W-most teams suck the season after winning superbowl)another close game edge going to superbowl champions
    Kansas City (W - sweep them this season)win
    @ Carolina (W - they aren't the team they used to be)close game but we get the win younger better offense
    Buffalo (W-Buffalo still sucks...we improved from last season)
    @ San Diego (L - The only reason we don't win is they play for Home Field Adv)sorry guys as much as I hate it we probally will get swept this year. They got a complete team we dont YET

    15-2. We have a lot going for us this season. We play a bunch of crappy teams and I think we're the most improved team out of everyone. There are a few wildcards that I could be wrong about. New York might not suck. Oakland might have gotten things together. New England may not diminish after all. Hopefully I'm right.
    so realisticly I see a 10-6 season witch is an improvement. I also see us contending for the AFC West championships in about two years if we can continue to draft well and be smart in free aagency like we were this year.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by japfaff View Post
      Ok if you thought that Nalen played better than Myers you weren't watching. As for Hamilton I definatly think that it hurt, but two things. 1) it didn't hurt that much because our guards did an ok job in his place. 2) He is never going to be healthy. One hit to the head he is gone agian. So be prepared for him to miss a lot of time this season also.

      I dont think that our offense is better with Cutler than with Plummer. Look at the stats we avg 17 point per last year. With Jake we were at like 25. Int's we are about the same. Plummer was really bad his last year as a starter, but if you remember in 05 he went like 6 straight game w/o a pick. The problem is our line is still built for Jakes style. he is more mobil, he rolls out a lot, our line was able to hide a lot of flaws for a lot of years with smoke and mirrors if you will. Now with a more conventional QB our line just gets steam rolled. That is why of late he is getting bigger linemen. No more 280 lbT&G, or 270 lb C's

      Dum got tired...Ok..you get the gold star for that one...You are right our DE's were terrible last year (cept Dumm). Yet these same guys who sucked last year (Moss, Crowder, ect,ect) are the guys that you are all building up as up and coming players. There is nothing that says that you improve in year two...remember that

      The pass Defence did a fairly nice job last year considering Champ injury, and the lack of pass rush. I think Lynch's age is going to be a huge problem this year cause he just cant run with anyone. So who is he going to cover?

      Depth at WR.... what depth do we have? DJ he is an improvement. Parker isn't, Kolbert is largely unproven, Royal will be lucky to grab 10 balls this year. I dont see this tremendious depth that you speak of.

      As for our RB situation. As it stands right now. With the players that we have who are we better than in the AFC? think about it and be honest with yourself. I am not talking about production i am saying if you were to rank them look how low we would be

      I only see two teams that we are better than... Ten, and Hou

      Three teams that we are about equal with Jets, Cle, Cin

      How have we fallen so far??
      If I think Myers did better im wrong. LMAFO. You are nuts. When Cutler took over, the offense scored more points with less weapons and a hurt Oline. When Plummer was playing he had a healthier Rod smith, Javon Walker, and Brandon Marshal ( witch wasn't a big factor at the time.) A better running game and a better D, witch does impact the Offense but if you want to argue on that point give it your best shot. I haven't seen a single argument from you yet that I agree with.

      While we are on that I want to put out some stats on Jay vs. Jake that FIRST year when Jay was just a rookie and Plummer was in his 9th season. Jake started 11 games, Jay started 5 games. Jake had 11TD's and 13 INTS. Jay had 9TD's and 5 INTS. Jay scored 2 touchdowns per games started, Jake scored 1 touchdown per game started. Jay finished with 1000 yards for the season, Jake finished with just under 2000 yards. Jake finished with a QB rating of 68, while Cutler finished with a QB rating of 88. How do you figure we are not better with Cutler?! Jay threw more, made more yards, more touchdowns and less INTS. Check your facts bud.

      That's his first season, not even a full season and barely introduced in to the offense. As for Jake being a better mobile QB, that's just not correct at all. Jay is faster, has a better throw on the run. Pocket awareness probably needs some improvement but I think you forget where Jay came from. He's always had to make decisions on the run.

      Do you really know how fast Lynch is, or do you just assume he's really slow and old because that's what you read. I know he isn't AS fast but he isn't as slow as you make him out too be.

      Dum got tired, the others were in their FIRST year and got hurt, thus their was NOOO rotation on the Dline, that and the incredible weak DT's. The DT's are not as strong as I'd like but I see a improvement over what we had.

      Depth at WR, what do you expect, to have 3 Javon walkers and 3 Brandon Marshals, Seriously we have B.Marsh, Jackson, B.Stoke, Behind them we have Glenn ( IM not impressed with him, at all) ,Colbert, Eddie, and a few others.

      More important on WR, with BM and DJ as the 1 and 2 WR, that leaves Stokley in the slot and he should remain healthy. witch is a great 1 2, AND 3 punch. With a injured Walker their and not a lot of depth last year it killed us, thank god for B.Marsh.

      Be honest with your self on the Running game. With TH and a healthy , better Oline. We should be great as we were good even with the injuries there. As far as Hamilton getting hurt right off the bat, That's a pessimistic point of view that holds some merit, but we will see, If we do have a chance at a good season it does anchor on the hopes that we will be HEALTHY!
      Last edited by SlyBronco; 05-15-2008, 07:40 PM.


      :salute!: !!Get well soon!!:salute!:

      Comment


      • Originally posted by SlyBronco View Post
        If I think Myers did better im wrong. LMAFO. You are nuts. When Cutler took over, the offense scored more points with less weapons and a hurt Oline. When Plummer was playing he had a healthier Rod smith, Javon Walker, and Brandon Marshal ( witch wasn't a big factor at the time.) A better running game and a better D, witch does impact the Offense but if you want to argue on that point give it your best shot. I haven't seen a single argument from you yet that I agree with.

        While we are on that I want to put out some stats on Jay vs. Jake that FIRST year when Jay was just a rookie and Plummer was in his 9th season. Jake started 11 games, Jay started 5 games. Jake had 11TD's and 13 INTS. Jay had 9TD's and 5 INTS. Jay scored 2 touchdowns per games started, Jake scored 1 touchdown per game started. Jay finished with 1000 yards for the season, Jake finished with just under 2000 yards. Jake finished with a QB rating of 68, while Cutler finished with a QB rating of 88. How do you figure we are not better with Cutler?! Jay threw more, made more yards, more touchdowns and less INTS. Check your facts bud.

        That's his first season, not even a full season and barely introduced in to the offense. As for Jake being a better mobile QB, that's just not correct at all. Jay is faster, has a better throw on the run. Pocket awareness probably needs some improvement but I think you forget where Jay came from. He's always had to make decisions on the run.

        Do you really know how fast Lynch is, or do you just assume he's really slow and old because that's what you read. I know he isn't AS fast but he isn't as slow as you make him out too be.

        Dum got tired, the others were in their FIRST year and got hurt, thus their was NOOO rotation on the Dline, that and the incredible weak DT's. The DT's are not as strong as I'd like but I see a improvement over what we had.

        Depth at WR, what do you expect, to have 3 Javon walkers and 3 Brandon Marshals, Seriously we have B.Marsh, Jackson, B.Stoke, Behind them we have Glenn ( IM not impressed with him, at all) ,Colbert, Eddie, and a few others.

        More important on WR, with BM and DJ as the 1 and 2 WR, that leaves Stokley in the slot and he should remain healthy. witch is a great 1 2, AND 3 punch. With a injured Walker their and not a lot of depth last year it killed us, thank god for B.Marsh.

        Be honest with your self on the Running game. With TH and a healthy , better Oline. We should be great as we were good even with the injuries there. As far as Hamilton getting hurt right off the bat, That's a pessimistic point of view that holds some merit, but we will see, If we do have a chance at a good season it does anchor on the hopes that we will be HEALTHY!
        You missed the point about Cutler and Jake. I dont in a million years think that Jake is a better player. I said that we avg more points with Jake. As for his recievers. He had Javon and Smith for one season together. Javon was a beast but Smith really gave nothing. I will agree that in 05 he had a real nice compliment of recievers with Lelie and Smith. But he had the same line for the most part. So if they are worse now, then our line is old and have eroding skills. Which is the arguement that I am making. But there is one stat that you forgot. Jake won ballgames. He made the playoffs in all three years as a starter, who knows what would have happened in year four. So with that ask yourself what is more important to you winning games or stats, cause with what you are throwing up i feel you are more into stats than wins..
        As for the RB's...really you would rather have Mike Anderson over Travis Henry. I am in an odd place here cause I love Anderson for the kind of player that he is. But being completely objectional on this.... What has Anderson done away from our system? What has Henry done away from our system? If you take personal feeling away Henry is definatly the better back

        My defination of depth is... If you lose a starter for a couple games..who is going to step up?? Say game 2 marshal sprains his knee, and needs a few weeks rest. Who do you feel comfortable in the #1 spot? Stoke...he sucked at it last year + is to small. DJ...He was such a good #1 that san fran cut him. Colbert, Parker...Yeah not even worth discussing them. So who is going to step up? Fact is that with Javon he would have steped up.

        I am not going to talk about Lynch's speeb. I dont really know what it is. I assume that it is slow (I would say 4.8). I think it is slow cause the guy cant cover, I know he is one of the smartest players...so I assume it is speed cause I would hate to think that these second rate WR's can eat him up the way they do if he still had wheels
        Thanx Blondie79 for the sweet Sig....Love it and I will rock it with pridesigpic

        Comment


        • Originally posted by japfaff View Post
          Yeah I stand by that statement which injury really hurt us? Which one would have made us win games? Walkers was the only injury that truly hurt us...and he is gone now. i would actually say the EK injury helped us cause it got Dummervill on the field more. Same with Nalen, he was outplayed by Myers
          Myers outplayed Nalen? Maybe d___ sure didn't outthink Him! the line calls s___ed after Nalen went down, we were naer the top of league in rushing at that time! After Nalen got hurt the whole line, except for lepsis had to shift. Then Lepsis got dinged and couldn't get outside to block the speed guys like Merriman etc. Then Henry got hurt Injuries Hurt us?? How about those ??

          Comment


          • Originally posted by SlyBronco View Post
            If I think Myers did better im wrong. LMAFO. You are nuts. When Cutler took over, the offense scored more points with less weapons and a hurt Oline. When Plummer was playing he had a healthier Rod smith, Javon Walker, and Brandon Marshal ( witch wasn't a big factor at the time.) A better running game and a better D, witch does impact the Offense but if you want to argue on that point give it your best shot. I haven't seen a single argument from you yet that I agree with.
            Holy Jebus, are we back on the Plummer Wars? The man's no longer a Bronco, get over it. And you are both wrong.

            Plummer's last year we averaged 17 points a game with him QB, but we had no running game, Rod Smith was playing with a bad/no hip and Javon was the only thing the Broncos had for a receiver. Marshall was no factor at all and Smith had less than half the number of catches and yards he normally has. When Cutler came in, we went up to 25 points a game, but even Tony Sheffler, his primary target the last five games, admitted that he didn't finally catch on to what was happening and what his role was until the very end of the season. Even so, it could be argued that had Plummer been starting we would have won both games that Cutler won and also won one of the two squeakers we had at the end. Winning just one of those squeakers would have put us in the playoffs. Shanny chose to start breaking in the rookie.

            The following year, our offense averaged 17 points a game WITH a running attack and WITH two good receivers (Marshall and Stokely) and Jay at QB. The issue with our offense during the last two seasons, IMO, wasn't the QB, it was the VP in charge of offense and Shanny's good former college roommate, Heimerdinger. You want to talk about the reason we consistently averaged 17 points a game, look there first. We lost Kubiak and our offensive output suffered. We had a man in charge of the passing game who didn't understand it, IMO.

            Now, this year we will see what happens, if we can stay healthy, if Cutler can be consistent and if our receiving corps improves (and we do not yet know if Marshall will be able to come back and play at a high level, so please spare me any homerisms regarding him).

            While we are on that I want to put out some stats on Jay vs. Jake that FIRST year when Jay was just a rookie and Plummer was in his 9th season. Jake started 11 games, Jay started 5 games. Jake had 11TD's and 13 INTS. Jay had 9TD's and 5 INTS. Jay scored 2 touchdowns per games started, Jake scored 1 touchdown per game started. Jay finished with 1000 yards for the season, Jake finished with just under 2000 yards. Jake finished with a QB rating of 68, while Cutler finished with a QB rating of 88. How do you figure we are not better with Cutler?! Jay threw more, made more yards, more touchdowns and less INTS. Check your facts bud.
            It's been said that there are lies, damned lies and statistics. Here's the only stat that counts. As a starter that season, Plummer was 7-4. Cutler was 2-3. And Plummer played nearly all the tough opponents.

            As a Bronco starter, Plummer was, what, 40-18? Cutler so far is 9-12.

            All Plummer did was win, baby. A lot more than we have seen from Jay so far.

            That's his first season, not even a full season and barely introduced in to the offense. As for Jake being a better mobile QB, that's just not correct at all. Jay is faster, has a better throw on the run. Pocket awareness probably needs some improvement but I think you forget where Jay came from. He's always had to make decisions on the run.
            Plummer's awareness in the pocket kept him from being sacked often and his mobility made the rollout work as a regular part of our offense. He was capable but not nearly as good in the pocket. Jay, on the other hand, is more comfortable in the pocket but doesn't roll out and throw on the run overall as well. Plummer was actually more accurate throwing on the run than he was from the pocket. Cutler less so, but throwing rockets on the end of a string can make it look easier. As for "barely introduced to the offense," Cutler was in his second full season as a Bronco quarterback. He didn't have a lot of NFL game experience under his belt yet, but you can't fault his grasp of the playbook, especially by the middle of the season. The best you can do to excuse his sometimes shoddy play was that he was still a "virtual rookie," on his decision-making and his undiagnosed diabetes. Hopefully he will not be hampered as much by either problem this season.

            Having said that, I think Cutler has the potential to be a great quarterback. But then, Ryan Leaf had the potential to be a great quarterback. And, I don't think that all the blame and credit should go to the QB for the record. Either quarterback. Teams win games and teams lose games. Had the defense been better, had some of Plummer's passes been caught instead of batted up into the air, had the special teams given us decent field position, had we had a running game or a better offensive guru in charge of our offense (put Shanny back calling plays) and had we managed to stay relatively injury-free the past couple of seasons, we might have done better. But we didn't.

            Water under the bridge. I prefer to get excited about this year's Bronco team and quit fighting the Plummer wars. They are done. Let the historians worry about them 50 years hence.

            Just my two cents
            You Tell 'em Justice is coming. You tell 'em I'M coming!sigpic

            Comment


            • Originally posted by japfaff View Post
              You missed the point about Cutler and Jake. I dont in a million years think that Jake is a better player. I said that we avg more points with Jake. As for his recievers. He had Javon and Smith for one season together. Javon was a beast but Smith really gave nothing. I will agree that in 05 he had a real nice compliment of recievers with Lelie and Smith. But he had the same line for the most part. So if they are worse now, then our line is old and have eroding skills. Which is the arguement that I am making. But there is one stat that you forgot. Jake won ballgames. He made the playoffs in all three years as a starter, who knows what would have happened in year four. So with that ask yourself what is more important to you winning games or stats, cause with what you are throwing up i feel you are more into stats than wins..
              As for the RB's...really you would rather have Mike Anderson over Travis Henry. I am in an odd place here cause I love Anderson for the kind of player that he is. But being completely objectional on this.... What has Anderson done away from our system? What has Henry done away from our system? If you take personal feeling away Henry is definatly the better back

              My defination of depth is... If you lose a starter for a couple games..who is going to step up?? Say game 2 marshal sprains his knee, and needs a few weeks rest. Who do you feel comfortable in the #1 spot? Stoke...he sucked at it last year + is to small. DJ...He was such a good #1 that san fran cut him. Colbert, Parker...Yeah not even worth discussing them. So who is going to step up? Fact is that with Javon he would have steped up.

              I am not going to talk about Lynch's speeb. I dont really know what it is. I assume that it is slow (I would say 4.8). I think it is slow cause the guy cant cover, I know he is one of the smartest players...so I assume it is speed cause I would hate to think that these second rate WR's can eat him up the way they do if he still had wheels
              I like having TH on the field more then MA, not sure if I said something to make you think otherwise?.

              If marshal gets hurt I think DJ will be our 1, Colbert, Parker ,Royle or Tony S. Will be 2 and Stoke will be 3( I hope stokley dominates in the slot and we need to try and keep him there but given his skill they might put him on the outside). Tony and Graham can also put in more time as TEs. We may not be a sick threat but it will do. I think our Oline will play good and if Henry stays healthy we should have a good running game, witch can produce bootlegs and free our WR's.

              Lynch isn't fast, Im not arguing that. But I just think he suffered from the same things Champ and Dre did. Last year with injuries on the Dline cut good rotation out of the Dline, witch meant games that had a lot of 3rd down conversions ( something we were bad at) we could get no pressure, our Time of possession suffered and our Corners and Safety's suffered. Plus with Lynch hurt a lot Fox just couldn't seem to nail the Safety position, even with all that speed. Now we have depth so even if Lynch cannot cut it we have other options. But I think Lynch will start for us and should have a better year.

              I think Boss B. Will be in coverage more, the guy ran a 4.3 or 4.4 at the combine and is fast. Not to mention huge. That should help lynch avoid coverage situations.

              As far as Plummer getting us in the playoffs, I don't think he would have. Sure 05 he was great. Other then that he wasn't good. I didn't double check the average points per game for the team, but the average points per game for the QB increased with Cutler, He threw for more yards per game and had less INT's. So it was more important to get Cutler in there and start learning then to keep someone who wasn't going to take us far enough. With that said, at the time I wanted to keep Plummer in. But now I'm glad we did not.

              As far as 06, I couldn't really watch the games, I had to rely on stats and didn't really see who was on our Oline or not. But over last year, witch they did OK but couldn't really punch it in. Now with Nalen back and Hamilton back I do believe they will do better, I was not in any way convinced my Myers play and nor were the coaches. I hope our Rookie can perform, I hope Ryan comes in to his own. Remember last year he was just a rookie, he might actually contribute this year.

              We wont be running a Defensive scheme that we are not built for, We wont have lost 2 players in the offseason. God forbid we wont have the injuries we did last year. But being optimistic im going to believe that we wont have those injuries and going off of that. That's why I say we are much better then people will give us credit for. If we stay healthy we will be a good team.


              :salute!: !!Get well soon!!:salute!:

              Comment


              • I think you may just be underestimating our team. I believe we could go anywhere between 10-6 and 13-3. Jay Cutler's illness will not affect him and he will continue to play solidly. Marshall will still be a beast at reciever. I think our O-line and running game will be decent. So all in all, I think our offense will play well. On defense, our maturing D-line I think will become almost average and our linebackers will be pretty good too, especially with D.J. As our defensive backs our concerned, because Bailey won't be playing on an injured quad, I think he will step up his game compared to last year and will team up with Bly to create the greatest cornerback tandem in the league. And with Royal as our return man, our special teams will be much better than they have been recently too. All in all, I expect our team to be very good and end up in the playoffs.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by tante_vasquez View Post
                  no superbowl or undefeated responses. Realistically where do you see the broncos finishing. Granted they appear to have gotten better on paper in my mind, but they are ranked 23rd in the newest power ranking, which means they in the "experts" eyes, we have gotten 2 spots worse after our offseason. If we play out the season as they predict then we finish with a top 10 draft pick (number 9 pick) for the first time in over a decade.

                  Now looking at our schedule:

                  @ Oakland (L - I think we start out shaky with a bad day from our o-line)
                  San Diego (L - too much talent)
                  New Orleans (W - only reason we win is because we are at home)
                  @ Kansas City (W - Kansas City isn't the team they used to be at home)
                  Tampa Bay (W - Tampa is still growing as a team)
                  Jacksonville (L - all star defense)
                  @ New England (L - We have their number, but not this time)
                  Miami (W - no explanation needed)
                  @ Cleveland (L - Anderson has another big year)
                  @ Atlanta (W - it's Atlanta)
                  Oakland (W - we win at home this time and have payback from opening day)
                  @ New York (L - on the road against that D-line)
                  Kansas City (W - sweep them this season)
                  @ Carolina (W - they aren't the team they used to be)
                  Buffalo (L - payback from last season)
                  @ San Diego (L - The only reason we don't win is they play for Home Field Adv)

                  so looking at my predictions we finish 8-8, we should be good but not nearly enough for the playoffs and looking at somewhere around 15 - 18th best in the NFL. My big worry is an early season loss at Kansas City and we might be looking at a 1-3 start of the season and then all bets are off.

                  Looking at the offense, we have so many ????

                  ? - Will Cutler respond to treatment
                  ? - Does our RBs stay healthy
                  ? - Does the new o-line gel together
                  ? - Does Marshall's arm get better

                  On defense

                  ? - Is Robertson healthy enough to play
                  ? - who starts at MLB
                  ? - Can the safeties perform at a high level

                  ST

                  ? - can the unit block & cover as a team
                  ? - do we finally have an explosive returner

                  I think some of these questions were addressed during the draft and free agency, but we have a lot of unproven talent on this team that is going to really need to work in order for us to become successful. What does everyone else see our record as?
                  The Denver Broncos will either go 10-6 or 11-5 in 2008. They always lose a game or two they shouldn't, but the schedule works to their advantage. They will be a Wild Card team in the AFC and finish 2nd in the AFC West.
                  Denver Broncos All-Time Team
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