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T.C. Primer, Part II: Defense

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  • #46
    Originally posted by stnzed View Post
    Yeah, I know, I sure wish people would stop using that analogy to describe how people mistake stats for anything worth a sht.

    Tell us how you really feel, str8, stop sugar coating it......
    Explain to me what makes a tackle legit? The dude was a machine last year.

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    • #47
      Originally posted by str8jacket View Post
      Explain to me what makes a tackle legit? The dude was a machine last year.
      How about one that is made at or behind the line of scrimmage, and not six yards plus down the field? That was the case with Williams most of the time last year.

      That tells you he was late arriving on the scene most of the time, and only his athletic ability allowed him to make plays at all.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by rogue719 View Post
        I personally disagree with you strongly on DJ. He came to the Broncos as a weak-side linebacker and his rookie season came in second for Defensive Rookie of the year, losing out only to Jonathan Vilma. At the weakside, he is a prize and should have stayed there all along, IMO.

        As for Lynch, he's going to be a Hall of Famer, but he's no longer fast enough to fall into coverage other than deep zone coverage where he can get behind the receiver and try to get anything that goes overhead. Otherwise, he's an extra linebacker to stop the run, and a very fine one yet. You will likely find him coming out more and more in coverage packages for obvious passing downs and teams running hurry-up offenses, such as Manning, would target him by not letting him off the field.
        Well said. DJ Williams has been a trouper through all of this and he has kept his mouth shut and just simpy played ball. Leave him where he should be and let's see what he can do. He will have a great year.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by MindField View Post
          How about one that is made at or behind the line of scrimmage, and not six yards plus down the field? That was the case with Williams most of the time last year.

          That tells you he was late arriving on the scene most of the time, and only his athletic ability allowed him to make plays at all.
          He was OUR BEST linebacker. Plain and simple. Easy to give up 6 yard runs when your D-Line flat out SUCKS.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by str8jacket View Post
            He was OUR BEST linebacker. Plain and simple. Easy to give up 6 yard runs when your D-Line flat out SUCKS.


            the point is that this finally is the year DJ needs to take a position by the balls and just flat out dominate, we need sacks, FF, FR, INT and tackles, not just tackles from him. he can play no doubt about it, but it is finally time for him to prove he is a elite LB for us and not just some LB that is good at tackling but cant make plays that change the game.

            Great LB's make plays that change the game on a reg basis, he hasnt reached that level yet. We need him to

            this needs to be the year he does it. people are getting a little but hurt about the criticism of DJ for no apparent reason other than there own bias, when most people are simply saying DJ needs to come into his own this year.


            thats not a criticism of Dj as much as it is a statement of fact

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            • #51
              Originally posted by elevation INC View Post
              the point is that this finally is the year DJ needs to take a position by the balls and just flat out dominate, we need sacks, FF, FR, INT and tackles, not just tackles from him. he can play no doubt about it, but it is finally time for him to prove he is a elite LB for us and not just some LB that is good at tackling but cant make plays that change the game.

              Great LB's make plays that change the game on a reg basis, he hasnt reached that level yet. We need him to

              this needs to be the year he does it. people are getting a little but hurt about the criticism of DJ for no apparent reason other than there own bias, when most people are simply saying DJ needs to come into his own this year.


              thats not a criticism of Dj as much as it is a statement of fact
              For some reason I can't see DJ as that kind of linebacker to be honest with you. He just doesn't have that Ray Lewis like attitude or anything he just goes out there and plays like any other linebacker in the league.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by xX-Bronco-Xx View Post
                For some reason I can't see DJ as that kind of linebacker to be honest with you. He just doesn't have that Ray Lewis like attitude or anything he just goes out there and plays like any other linebacker in the league.

                and most of us dont see that yet either, which is why if ever there was a year to become that kind of player now is that year( A contract year). As a result some of us are a little skeptical of his move to WLB and some of us think he is a little overated on these boards, because he really isnt a top tier LB yet. there are plenty of Lb's in the league that are far better than him. they may not have the tackles he does but they make the game changing plays he doesnt....

                We really need an identiy for our LB core, and i dont see it yet, thats why i myself am very hesitant about DJ

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                • #53
                  DJ would be a great MIKE with quality DTs in front of him. Its a shame that we finally trade for a quality DT and then deny him his opportunity to continue to grow at the position.

                  He's an excellent tackler, he has excellent measureables, and he's great at blitzing up the middle. He'll probably never be better then average in pass defense, but he could be an exceptional run-stuffing 3-down MIKE. Diagnosing plays in a new position takes some time and he did appear to come on strong towards the end of the season despite having the NFL's worst DT rotation in front of him.


                  Anyway, at WILL this season I see about 90 tackles, 2 sacks, 2 forced fumbles, 4 stuffs, and 1 int.

                  If he would have played MIKE again, I would have forecasted about 140 tackles, 3 sacks, 5 forced fumbles, 15 stuffs, and 1 int.



                  In my mind, WILL is probably the worst possible LB position for him this year. We finally have a decent DT rotation, so whomever plays MIKE will benefit greatly from that. The SAM LB has two capable run stuffing DEs that will hold their linemen, so the SAM LB should have lots of room to make plays. However, at WILL, its a different story....

                  Playing behind Dumervil means our WILL is going to have to deal with pulling OGs , FB, or TEs, on sweeps and offtackle runs because Dumervil can't occupy multiple blockers. And with an injured Ekuban behind him, there's no help on the horizon. Whomever plays WILL will have to sift through a ton of trash to make plays this year, and alot of them will be 3-5 yards down the field.

                  I feel bad for DJ, I really do. He's been put in no-win situations last year and now this year.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Mat'hir Uth Gan View Post
                    DJ would be a great MIKE with quality DTs in front of him. Its a shame that we finally trade for a quality DT and then deny him his opportunity to continue to grow at the position.

                    He's an excellent tackler, he has excellent measureables, and he's great at blitzing up the middle. He'll probably never be better then average in pass defense, but he could be an exceptional run-stuffing 3-down MIKE. Diagnosing plays in a new position takes some time and he did appear to come on strong towards the end of the season despite having the NFL's worst DT rotation in front of him.


                    Anyway, at WILL this season I see about 90 tackles, 2 sacks, 2 forced fumbles, 4 stuffs, and 1 int.

                    If he would have played MIKE again, I would have forecasted about 140 tackles, 3 sacks, 5 forced fumbles, 15 stuffs, and 1 int.



                    In my mind, WILL is probably the worst possible LB position for him this year. We finally have a decent DT rotation, so whomever plays MIKE will benefit greatly from that. The SAM LB has two capable run stuffing DEs that will hold their linemen, so the SAM LB should have lots of room to make plays. However, at WILL, its a different story....

                    Playing behind Dumervil means our WILL is going to have to deal with pulling OGs , FB, or TEs, on sweeps and offtackle runs because Dumervil can't occupy multiple blockers. And with an injured Ekuban behind him, there's no help on the horizon. Whomever plays WILL will have to sift through a ton of trash to make plays this year, and alot of them will be 3-5 yards down the field.

                    I feel bad for DJ, I really do. He's been put in no-win situations last year and now this year.


                    good post MUG, lets pray that DJ proves us wrong. on a side not would you prefer webster or niko at MLB? i actually would go with webster but thats just me....

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by elevation INC View Post
                      good post MUG, lets pray that DJ proves us wrong. on a side not would you prefer webster or niko at MLB? i actually would go with webster but thats just me....

                      Doesn't really matter to me. Whoever it is, will just be a two down run plugger with a decent DT rotation keeping blockers off them. I think anyone of our potential MIKEs can fill that roll fine, including Larson.

                      None of the three excite me as a potential star.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Mat'hir Uth Gan View Post
                        None of the three excite me as a potential star.
                        Thats for sure...the good news is next years draft is loaded with talent on D

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                        • #57
                          I saw a clip on a couple of WNBA girls that seem to have the right stuff. Maybe we could bring them in as motivational speakers.
                          Those Indians could prove troublesome...General George Armstrong Custer

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by MindField View Post
                            Q. The bottom line on DJ Williams is this....if he was so good at any ONE position he has played, why is this the fourth move he has made in five years?

                            A: Because he has not been as good as advertised.
                            Nonsense! His rookie season at Will he placed second in rookie defensive player of the year balloting and lost out to former teammate Jonathan Vilma.

                            The next year they brought Ian Gold back from Tampa, looking to get the best group of LB's on the field at a time. Gold and Williams both played Will and Gold had hated playing Sam at Tampa and part of his agreement to come back was that he would play Will. DJ moved to Sam to fill the slot there, which was Al Wilson's last year at Mike. The Broncos figured that best group could be had with DJ on the field along with Gold and Wilson, so DJ moved to Sam even though he hated it, as the Broncos took Sam off the field in nickel packages to put another D-back on the field for coverage. He preferred to stay on the field as Will.

                            The next year he moved to Mike as the biggest hole the Broncos had in the LB corps was trying to find a replacement for Wilson. He was told he could stay on the field in nickel packages as Mike and would be back in a position to make lots of stops.

                            This was probably the ONLY position he played in the past three that he struggled at, as Mike under Bates two-gap system left lots to be desired for someone learning Mike in the first place, particularly when you don't have the line personnel for the scheme and the people you have on the line are confused by the scheme. He improved over time, partly because he was figuring out Mike and partly because Bate's scheme was abandoned after the fifth game and DJ went back to learning a one gap system. He made lots of tackles but the Broncos continued to struggle stopping the run.

                            This year, rather than moving DJ around the field trying to plug the biggest hole, they went out and got a regular SAM and MIKE and moved DJ back "home" to his WILL position.

                            The reason, in other words, for DJ being moved around wasn't that he was bad, but because he was so good they figured they need to put him where the need was greatest.
                            You Tell 'em Justice is coming. You tell 'em I'M coming!sigpic

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