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Shannahan Holding Grudges and Holding The Team Back.

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  • #16
    Originally posted by TheRealMoose View Post
    I have news for you, horseyhead: invading every positive thread on the board with your repeated criticisms isn't any different than what anyone has done on this thread. Wake up.

    Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken. Saying you're above arguing and calling names while simultaneously doing just that is completely absurd.
    Dear thefakemoose, your obsession with me and any other poster you have chosen to concentrate your immature juvenile observations on are getting bored with you, you are NOT interested in actually talking sense, just making trouble. Your constant editorializing and adding your juvenile extras on to try to make yourself feel justified is actually proving my and others points about your posts. Be civil, and others will be civil back to you, this is something that you learn through life experience.. of which you seem to have very little of.. grow up.

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by horsehead41 View Post
      Dear thefakemoose, your obsession with me and any other poster you have chosen to concentrate your immature juvenile observations on are getting bored with you, you are NOT interested in actually talking sense, just making trouble. Your constant editorializing and adding your juvenile extras on to try to make yourself feel justified is actually proving my and others points about your posts. Be civil, and others will be civil back to you, this is something that you learn through life experience.. of which you seem to have very little of.. grow up.
      Thank you for proving my point.
      In Manning I trust.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by horsehead41 View Post
        I have news for you and bronco_hyde, people like aija are ALLOWED their opinions even if you guys with your own giant unchecked egos don't like them... but to call other legitimate posters here "morons" is uncalled for....
        Hey, horseyboy, Guess what, I am ALLOWED my opinion too. And my opinion is that anyone who keeps whining about firing Shannahan is a MORON!! I didn't necessarily call the OP a moron, I specifically referred to a generalized group (i.e. - The other Morons who have a grudge against Shannahan). If you or the OP choose to include yourselves in that group, that's not my fault.

        I suppose I could be more correct by saying that the opinion of such people is Moronic.

        FYI here's the dictionary definition.
        MORON –noun
        1. a person who is notably stupid or lacking in good judgment.
        2. Psychology. a person of borderline intelligence in a former classification of mental retardation, having an intelligence quotient of 50 to 69.
        Compare feeble-minded.

        Origin:
        1905–10, Americanism; < Gk mōrón, neut. of mōrós foolish, dull
        I choose definition number 1 and again say that any opinion of people that continually drone on and on about Shannahan needing to be fired is notably stupid or lacking in good judgment.

        You want to disagree? Fine, but I'm sure there are more people SICK and TIRED of hearing about it than there are who agree with you.

        Comment


        • #19
          I like pie!!!

          Pumpkin Pie!!!!

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Bronco_Hyde View Post
            Hey, horseyboy, Guess what, I am ALLOWED my opinion too. And my opinion is that anyone who keeps whining about firing Shannahan is a MORON!! I didn't necessarily call the OP a moron, I specifically referred to a generalized group (i.e. - The other Morons who have a grudge against Shannahan). If you or the OP choose to include yourselves in that group, that's not my fault.

            I suppose I could be more correct by saying that the opinion of such people is Moronic.

            FYI here's the dictionary definition.


            I choose definition number 1 and again say that any opinion of people that continually drone on and on about Shannahan needing to be fired is notably stupid or lacking in good judgment.

            You want to disagree? Fine, but I'm sure there are more people SICK and TIRED of hearing about it than there are who agree with you.
            I am not a moron, nor do I have a grudge against Shannahan. Having a grudge would imply that I personally know him and resent or feel ill will toward him.

            I do however feel that Shanahhans time in Denver has run it's course. Many people (read the million threads) make poor arguments as to Mike being dismissed, yet others (not morons) make very valid points as to why he should go.

            If you have a particular problem with a poster please keep your comments directed at that poster because the generalizations that you have tossed around are ignorant and incorrect.
            Individual commitment to a group effort - that is what makes a team work, a company work, a society work, a civilization work.

            It's easy to have faith in yourself and have discipline when you're a winner, when you're number one. What you got to have is faith and discipline when you're not a winner.

            Vince Lombardi

            Comment


            • #21
              Originally posted by pikman View Post
              I am not a moron, nor do I have a grudge against Shannahan. Having a grudge would imply that I personally know him and resent or feel ill will toward him.

              I do however feel that Shanahhans time in Denver has run it's course. Many people (read the million threads) make poor arguments as to Mike being dismissed, yet others (not morons) make very valid points as to why he should go.

              If you have a particular problem with a poster please keep your comments directed at that poster because the generalizations that you have tossed around are ignorant and incorrect.
              Would you please read my post again. Here, I'll quote it.

              I specifically referred to a generalized group (i.e. - The other Morons who have a grudge against Shannahan). If you or the OP choose to include yourselves in that group, that's not my fault.
              Now, if you say you don't have a grudge, then you aren't part of this group now are you? Thanks for butting in though . . . always nice to meet another self-proclaimed internet policeman



              As for your opinion . . . if you insist that you're judgment of coaching ability is superior to everyone who is actually in a position to know what they're talking about, and are hell bent on ignoring the fact that Pat Bowlen WILL NEVER FIRE SHANNAHAN. . . . . well, what can I say?

              Comment


              • #22
                i like mike!
                and morons are fun to watch..
                i'm a BRONCO'S fan !:go:

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Bronco_Hyde View Post
                  Would you please read my post again. Here, I'll quote it.



                  Now, if you say you don't have a grudge, then you aren't part of this group now are you? Thanks for butting in though . . . always nice to meet another self-proclaimed internet policeman



                  As for your opinion . . . if you insist that you're judgment of coaching ability is superior to everyone who is actually in a position to know what they're talking about, and are hell bent on ignoring the fact that Pat Bowlen WILL NEVER FIRE SHANNAHAN. . . . . well, what can I say?
                  Internet policeman, that's funny. Butting in? It's a message board, open forum and all that? Just thought I'd point out that you should be more specific, as I'm sure an intelligent fellow like you knows it is more effective in getting your point across.

                  As for my judgement of coaching ability, at this point it appears that Bowlen may be the one lacking judgement. Whether or not I believe that Bowlen will ever fire Shannahan is irrelevant to the discussion. People are not debating whether or not Bowlen will Shanny, they're debating whether or not he should be fired at all.

                  :salute!:
                  Individual commitment to a group effort - that is what makes a team work, a company work, a society work, a civilization work.

                  It's easy to have faith in yourself and have discipline when you're a winner, when you're number one. What you got to have is faith and discipline when you're not a winner.

                  Vince Lombardi

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    this is obsurd you actually think that Shanahan is the complete problem??


                    sigpic


                    FA Targets: DT Jason Jones, DT Pat Simms, S Reggie Smith, LB Dan Connor



                    :cool:

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by getlynched47 View Post
                      this is obsurd you actually think that Shanahan is the complete problem??
                      Nope, never said that. He is but one component of the problem. However he is the HEAD coach and as such is responsible for the overall performance of the team. If you know my history on these boards I have for many years been a proponent of Shannahans however I think it may be time to cut the head off of the snake.

                      I know, he won 2 SB's, and I know he is an offensive genius, but every dog has his day. Do you think Cowboy fans were happy when Tom Landry was fired? It is commonly spoken that a coach will lose his players attention, they won't play for him, won't hear him. When that time comes it is time to replace them.

                      The alternative that Shanny give up some of his other duties has been proposed. I do also see this as a viable alternative. It is very possible he is stretched too thin and he is not spending enough time on what really matters, the teams play on the field.

                      Bottom line, can't fire coordinators year after year, can't fire all of the players (nice thought sometimes though). That leaves one alternative.
                      Individual commitment to a group effort - that is what makes a team work, a company work, a society work, a civilization work.

                      It's easy to have faith in yourself and have discipline when you're a winner, when you're number one. What you got to have is faith and discipline when you're not a winner.

                      Vince Lombardi

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        It amazes me how little comprehension some of you on these boards seem to have. A 10 year old of average mental capacity would understand what it was that I was saying: "Mike Shannahan has held the progress of the team back by putting his personal agenda in front of the greater good of the team."

                        I gave two confirmed instances in which shannahan made decisions based on emotion. The trading away of Foxworth for what is effectively a 5th round pick and the releasing of Hamza Abdullah one year removed from winning a starting job at the safety position whilst replacign him with a player who had never been successufl in his NFL career.

                        Third I made mention of his ongoing fued with AL Davis which though understandable impedes his ability to make sound decisions. This third point was speculation but credence is added by his own actions and published stories of his actions: Eg: Asking a young Gary Kubiak to throw a ball at the head of a then active, one the side line Al Davis.

                        For all the backlash agaisnt Foxworth he has in a matter of 3 weeks climbed the depth charts to the role of a starter, was an NFL player representative, active in the community and a respected leader on the team who deserved better. Hamzah was more than a serviceable NFL calibre player. He made plays, something that is lacking in our secondary.

                        Sometimes you guys need to read more than the first two lines of a post before making what seem to be random, uninformed rants.
                        Only a fool allows another's opinion to anger him to the point of hurling insults.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Aija View Post
                          It amazes me how little comprehension some of you on these boards seem to have. A 10 year old of average mental capacity would understand what it was that I was saying: "Mike Shannahan has held the progress of the team back by putting his personal agenda in front of the greater good of the team."
                          I disagree that Mike Shanahan has held the team back but that is immaterial. What other posters have said and you have seemingly failed to notice is that you may have assumptions as to what Shanahan thinks but you don't nor does any of the rest of us.

                          I gave two confirmed instances in which shannahan made decisions based on emotion. The trading away of Foxworth for what is effectively a 5th round pick and the releasing of Hamza Abdullah one year removed from winning a starting job at the safety position whilst replacign him with a player who had never been successufl in his NFL career.
                          How in the world do you interpret Shanahn doing as Foxworth wanted as a decission based wholely in emotion? He had worked his way down the depth chart until he was the fourth corner and on his way to fifth. His statement left the impression that he was moving on to another team next spring since he would be a free agent. IMO Mike chose getting something for a player who didn't appear at the time that he would get much playing time for a late round pick. He was not listed as a safety but rather a cornerback this year. He was replace by our rookie pick.

                          Third I made mention of his ongoing fued with AL Davis which though understandable impedes his ability to make sound decisions. This third point was speculation but credence is added by his own actions and published stories of his actions: Eg: Asking a young Gary Kubiak to throw a ball at the head of a then active, one the side line Al Davis.
                          . . . and this is supposed to be a serious black mark against Mike? Look up Shanahan' records against the Raiders. I wish the Broncos were that impeded against every team in the league.

                          For all the backlash agaisnt Foxworth he has in a matter of 3 weeks climbed the depth charts to the role of a starter, was an NFL player representative, active in the community and a respected leader on the team who deserved better. Hamzah was more than a serviceable NFL calibre player. He made plays, something that is lacking in our secondary.
                          Good for him. I only wish he had shown the ability to beat out Bailey and Bly. He didn't.

                          Sometimes you guys need to read more than the first two lines of a post before making what seem to be random, uninformed rants.
                          It appears to me that their reading was acceptable and I read no ranting (neither extravagrant, wild, vehement, nor violent). They just disagree with your assumptions and assessments- nothing more; nothing less.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Aija View Post
                            In at least two instances Shanny has let his personal agenda get in the way of the team's success. To examine this let's step back to Shanny's firing as the Raiders head coach. Now I am not in any shape or form saying that he should just forget about his money and let it go. But Shanny's need to "stick it to the raiders" came between us and a win on Sunday.

                            Shanny holds a grudge whether it be with players, coaches or owners. I am of the opinion that Shanny went out last Sunday with the sole desire of blowing the Raiders out. Nothing is wrong with that but when it impedes your ability to make good coaching decisions it is a problem.

                            I think like in the first game Shanny expected to run up the score. For said reason he continually went back to the down field throws when the run had been working successfully. Not content to just win and propell his team toward the playoffs, he stuck with a game plan that clearly was not working.

                            This grudge holdign is also evidenced in Shanny's personnell decision making process. Currently our biggest need is at the Safety positions. Foxworth was said to have complained about a starting position. I specifically remember one game in partuicular where Foxy filled in at safety and recorded 12 tackles and passed out from dehydration in the locker room after the game. What I am saying is that Shanny did not make an effort to accomodate Foxy, knowing quite well the needs that we had at the safety positions. Forworth should in the LEAST have been given an opportunity to secure a starting spot at that position. In many interviews Foxy had stated that he did not mind playing the Safety position.

                            Finally news comes of the reason for releasing Hamzah. Our most capable safety, a playmaker and hard worker. Shanny needs to adopt a cooler attitude and make decisions in the best interest of the TEAM and not his ego. I understand that he has won superbowls, but that was more than a decade ago. this world works on a what have you done for me lately basis and people are quick to forget. Learn to let go Shanny.
                            So, just exactly where have you come to the conclusion that Shanahan is holding these grudges against the Raiders and players? Inside info? Hard eveidence? Hell Mike has OWNED the Raiders ever since he has been here, if anyone has a grudge it should be Al Davis.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Aija View Post
                              It amazes me how little comprehension some of you on these boards seem to have. A 10 year old of average mental capacity would understand what it was that I was saying: "Mike Shannahan has held the progress of the team back by putting his personal agenda in front of the greater good of the team."

                              I gave two confirmed instances in which shannahan made decisions based on emotion. The trading away of Foxworth for what is effectively a 5th round pick and the releasing of Hamza Abdullah one year removed from winning a starting job at the safety position whilst replacign him with a player who had never been successufl in his NFL career.

                              Third I made mention of his ongoing fued with AL Davis which though understandable impedes his ability to make sound decisions. This third point was speculation but credence is added by his own actions and published stories of his actions: Eg: Asking a young Gary Kubiak to throw a ball at the head of a then active, one the side line Al Davis.

                              For all the backlash agaisnt Foxworth he has in a matter of 3 weeks climbed the depth charts to the role of a starter, was an NFL player representative, active in the community and a respected leader on the team who deserved better. Hamzah was more than a serviceable NFL calibre player. He made plays, something that is lacking in our secondary.

                              Sometimes you guys need to read more than the first two lines of a post before making what seem to be random, uninformed rants.
                              May I ask where in the HELL are you getting this stuff? He asked a young GAry Kubiak to throw a FOOTBALL at Al Davis?? WHAT? When? Why did it not make the news? Why were charges not pressed against them? Published stories? Can you provide me a link please?

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by pikman View Post
                                Internet policeman, that's funny. Butting in? It's a message board, open forum and all that? Just thought I'd point out that you should be more specific, as I'm sure an intelligent fellow like you knows it is more effective in getting your point across.

                                As for my judgement of coaching ability, at this point it appears that Bowlen may be the one lacking judgement. Whether or not I believe that Bowlen will ever fire Shannahan is irrelevant to the discussion. People are not debating whether or not Bowlen will Shanny, they're debating whether or not he should be fired at all.

                                :salute!:
                                That's actually one of the better responses I've ever had. Glad to see you stick to the topic (unlike some people). Earlier when I wrote my post to you I was in a really lousy mood, so it wasn't exactly nice. Anyway . . . .

                                My whole point to the OP and all the others who keep bringing up the Shanahan thing as if they're proving a point is that it is completely pointless. Even if they had tangible, credible, indisputable evidence that proved Shanny has lost it (Which proof they've never had, nor will have) it's a completely pointless argument because it will never cause him to be fired. Bowlen will never fire him, so why waste time and effort debating whether he should or shouldn't be?

                                Even if they just stuck to the one thread "*the official fire Shanahan thread*", then we could at least ignore them, but they re-hash these same stupid arguments every time we lose a game.

                                There seriously needs to be a new forum for Complaints. GD is becoming nothing but a sewage collection facility.



                                by the way, no comment on the "being blind" demotivation poster? I thought it was funny

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