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  • Originally posted by nea View Post
    Yes I did answer your question a few posts ago. And yes exactly, it is subjective, everyone has different views on what it means, that is why I never mentioned mine superior, ok I probably could have used a different word for those that like to nit-pik these things.And actually An optimist is a person with a positive outlook on life, hence the ones that view these changes with a positive outlook. Me i am neither positive or negative, I am neutral. there you go i am a neutralist!
    Elway was a gunslinger, seen his arm? (well not lately) pure power. Won two Superbowl's. His stats from what I know were lower than Cutlers in his early years, yet he learned and grew. Cutler had TWO full seasons, give me a break with the he couldn't be consistent or reliable, what? his career is what it is and he will never learn? You all talk like he is a vet, career winding down. He has just started, has a lot to learn, with the right teacher, which McDaniels is suppose to be, he will go to the SB probably multiple times. Maybe McDaniels can only work with the weaker ones? Got scared that he couldnt really teach a potentially amazing QB? Brady was good before McDaniels and I think Cassell may be a one trick pony.
    It was when Elway stopped being a gunslinger and started handing the ball off to TD that Elway started winning championships. Elway picked his spots in the passing game, but relied more on his running game to get the job done. What made it great is that Elway did this after carrying his team for so long. He let the team support him.

    When Elway put up his career stats, what was the Broncos record? When Elway averaged 3,256 yards 25 TDs and 12 INTs per season what was the Broncos record? So with the decrease in yards, the increase in TDs and the decrease in INTs, he didn't seem to take nearly as many risks over his last few years. He trusted Shanahan, TD, and the system. That meant championships.

    I'm not saying Cutler can't do the same thing. But, the question is, does Cutler want to do the same thing? At this point? Probably not. Look how long it took Elway to change. Favre never changed.

    You yourself said that McD is supposed to be a "the right teacher". Why? Because McD knows QBs, maybe? But it's easier to think McD doesn't know what he's doing for you. Then you go on to speculate that McD is lesser of a coach because he didn't want Cutler. Well I have a "maybe" for ya. Maybe Cutler isn't smart enough to handle the system. Maybe Cutler doesn't understand what he's supposed to do when he sees zone coverage. Maybe Cutler locks onto his primary receiver and is lazy going to his 2nd and 3rd reads. Maybe Cutler makes too many mistakes.
    Last edited by Crazy8; 06-02-2009, 09:17 AM.

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    • Originally posted by nea View Post
      I think he miscalculated the others team defense too often, maybe over trusting what Marshall and others can do or what he could do in certain situations. I don't blame him for all the interceptions, some were on the mark the receivers just didn't deliver. I think sometimes he needed better control of the arm, and how hard he threw it. I will say I loved watching him, that strength, and how good he is out of the pocket. I didn't like that sometimes he would risk himself by running the ball, like Elway did, but I guess sometimes you have to take matters into your own hands. I think with more work (yes some on offense, but that does not include giving up our QB) we would have gone all the way. But it wasn't givin a chance, not even a season.
      You did answer this. OK.

      By miscalculated other team's defenses, you mean he didn't read the defense right, right? I agree with that.

      I also think Shanahan ran him out of the pocket so often so he could cut the field in half giving Cutler less to read.

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      • Originally posted by Crazy8 View Post
        You did answer this. OK.

        By miscalculated other team's defenses, you mean he didn't read the defense right, right? I agree with that.

        I also think Shanahan ran him out of the pocket so often so he could cut the field in half giving Cutler less to read.
        What Cutler could read were the "tea leaves" and he didn't like what he read or what they told him. BTW, he does still look good in orange and blue!!
        As the great divide in America continues we are causing harm to our future generations by avoiding what needs to be done.

        More people recognize Britney Spears than Dick Cheney.

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        • Originally posted by Crazy8 View Post
          It was when Elway stopped being a gunslinger and started handing the ball off to TD that Elway started winning championships. Elway picked his spots in the passing game, but relied more on his running game to get the job done. What made it great is that Elway did this after carrying his team for so long. He let the team support him.

          When Elway put up his career stats, what was the Broncos record? When Elway averaged 3,256 yards 25 TDs and 12 INTs per season what was the Broncos record? So with the decrease in yards, the increase in TDs and the decrease in INTs, he didn't seem to take nearly as many risks over his last few years. He trusted Shanahan, TD, and the system. That meant championships.

          I'm not saying Cutler can't do the same thing. But, the question is, does Cutler want to do the same thing? At this point? Probably not. Look how long it took Elway to change. Favre never changed.

          You yourself said that McD is supposed to be a "the right teacher". Why? Because McD knows QBs, maybe? But it's easier to think McD doesn't know what he's doing for you. Then you go on to speculate that McD is lesser of a coach because he didn't want Cutler. Well I have a "maybe" for ya. Maybe Cutler isn't smart enough to handle the system. Maybe Cutler doesn't understand what he's supposed to do when he sees zone coverage. Maybe Cutler locks onto his primary receiver and is lazy going to his 2nd and 3rd reads. Maybe Cutler makes too many mistakes.
          No I didnt say he was the right teacher, I mean, many on here brag on him as being the right teacher for the QB. And you know what they mean by you shouldnt assume? Why should anyone McD included ASSUME Cutler cant or wont, Cutler himself said he was excited by what he saw with McDaniels, he was eager to get to work, he was not given the opportunity to fail or improve with the Broncos. Elway was a gunslinger to the end, he just learned how and when to use it. What if we gave up on Elway early? Again to think that Cutler should know all after two full seasons, is just dumb. I dont know if McDaniels is lessor of a coach, thats why I had question marks. I certainly think he jumped to conclusions about Cutler, and I believe it was his thinking from the beginning.

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          • Originally posted by Crazy8 View Post
            You did answer this. OK.

            By miscalculated other team's defenses, you mean he didn't read the defense right, right? I agree with that.

            I also think Shanahan ran him out of the pocket so often so he could cut the field in half giving Cutler less to read.
            Yes, something that will be learned after more time and the right coaching. Again OPPORTUNITY, he should have been given one, with McD.

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            • 31 freaking pages???





              Really???


              sigpic

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              • Originally posted by moneymayweather View Post
                31 freaking pages???





                Really???



                I know we are pathetic, but it's fun!!!!!!!!!

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                • Originally posted by McSmashie View Post
                  Hey, you asked for them and I gave them to you!

                  Listen, I have a simple statement here. Joe Montana. Was not the most athletic. Did not have the strongest arm. Was not the fastest.

                  But he was the smartest guy on the field. He did make good decisions. He did have good accuracy in the mid passing range.

                  He had a coach that knew how to play to his strengths. He had a GM that knew how to draft guys to compliment him.

                  Joe Montana was not the most physically gifted QB out there. BUT, with the right TEAM surrounding him and him knowing what his strengths were, he was able to elevate himself and those around him.

                  It isnt always about physical gifts. This is why we dont talk about Ryan Leaf or Jeff George anymore.

                  It is about a team and a system that fits what your QB can do.
                  I hope you're not comparing Orton and Joe Montana.

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                  • Originally posted by nea View Post
                    No I didnt say he was the right teacher, I mean, many on here brag on him as being the right teacher for the QB. And you know what they mean by you shouldnt assume? Why should anyone McD included ASSUME Cutler cant or wont, Cutler himself said he was excited by what he saw with McDaniels, he was eager to get to work, he was not given the opportunity to fail or improve with the Broncos. Elway was a gunslinger to the end, he just learned how and when to use it. What if we gave up on Elway early? Again to think that Cutler should know all after two full seasons, is just dumb. I dont know if McDaniels is lessor of a coach, thats why I had question marks. I certainly think he jumped to conclusions about Cutler, and I believe it was his thinking from the beginning.
                    Because McD KNOWS what he's looking for in a QB. He KNOWS what he wants as far as the mental make-up of a QB. He also worked with Cutler and I'm sure they had their share of conversations about the offense, and about Cutler's thoughts on playing the game. That should be a given. McD also saw how quickly Cutler picked things up.

                    When it came to the rumor about Cutler's drinking and McD being put off by it, it should also be noted that the same speculation said that Cutler's football knowledge, or lack thereof, scared the heck out of McDaniels. I don't know if that's true, but it seriously fits with the actions that took place after.

                    You obviously don't know much about QBs except maybe what's on a stat sheet. That's okay. Just don't try to pass it off like you do.

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                    • Originally posted by nea View Post
                      Yes, something that will be learned after more time and the right coaching. Again OPPORTUNITY, he should have been given one, with McD.
                      You're ASSUMING that McD wouldn't have given him an opportunity. Maybe Cutler's actions talked McD out of it.

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                      • Originally posted by Crazy8 View Post
                        Because McD KNOWS what he's looking for in a QB. He KNOWS what he wants as far as the mental make-up of a QB. He also worked with Cutler and I'm sure they had their share of conversations about the offense, and about Cutler's thoughts on playing the game. That should be a given. McD also saw how quickly Cutler picked things up.

                        When it came to the rumor about Cutler's drinking and McD being put off by it, it should also be noted that the same speculation said that Cutler's football knowledge, or lack thereof, scared the heck out of McDaniels. I don't know if that's true, but it seriously fits with the actions that took place after.

                        You obviously don't know much about QBs except maybe what's on a stat sheet. That's okay. Just don't try to pass it off like you do.




                        Nice! needing to throw insults make you feel like a big man!!Me the little woman cowering, hardly. Your opinions of me mean NADA so save the insults. I am not the stat lover here!!!!! I dont give two sh*** about the stats. You think you know alot about a QB because you have spent so much time with him! Or is just watching the games that make you an EXPERT? When can we see you call a game in the NFL oh mighty one? McD Couldn't handle one with real talent, he has to try to dig it out of them. How the hell could he KNOW Cutler, what a week or two and he KNOWS him, yet no time with Orton just watching some film and he KNOWS Orton.So he wants a so so QB, that's all you needed to say! Now go eat a ding dong and lighten up!!!!
                        Last edited by nea; 06-02-2009, 02:22 PM.

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                        • Originally posted by Crazy8 View Post
                          You're ASSUMING that McD wouldn't have given him an opportunity. Maybe Cutler's actions talked McD out of it.
                          Well he didnt! And what actions? Showing up and trying to work with the man? No it wasmore like McD not liking Bowlens " Jay is the man around here now" comment and having to show him who was boss.

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                          • Originally posted by nea View Post
                            [/B]

                            Nice! needing to throw insults make you feel like a big man!!Me the little woman cowering, hardly. Your opinions of me mean NADA so save the insults. I am not the stat lover here!!!!! I dont give two sh*** about the stats. You think you know alot about a QB because you have spent so much time with him! Or is just watching the games that make you an EXPERT? When can we see you call a game in the NFL oh mighty one? McD Couldn't handle one with real talent, he has to try to dig it out of them. How the hell could he KNOW Cutler, what a week or two and he KNOWS him, yet no time with Orton just watching some film and he KNOWS Orton.So he wants a so so QB, that's all you needed to say! Now go eat a ding dong and lighten up!!!!
                            Wow, did I hit a nerve?

                            It's not an insult. It's a fact. Your assessment of Cutler wasn't even good enough to be remedial if I'm being perfectly honest. There's no shame in it. It's like you saying to me, "You don't know the first thing about how to engineer a bridge." I'd say you're right.

                            It's not important how I know QBs and the game of football. I just do. I've put the work in to know what I know. I've played the game as long as anyone without semi-pro or pro experience.

                            I'm not Josh McDaniels. The only thing I do know is what I've seen from the Patriots. The Patriots got rid of Drew Bledsoe. Why? Bledsoe had a great arm, he had some Pro Bowl seasons. Belichick couldn't make Bledsoe work? Maybe Bledsoe was too talented for Belichick? Was Bernie Kosar too talented for Belichick? That's absurd.

                            And yes, McDaniels can even know Cutler as a football player by watching him on film. You can tell an incredible amount about a QB by watching film. You can tell his work ethic. How good are his mechanics? Good mechanics takes a lot of work to develop. It takes a lot of attention to detail as well. How good is his understanding of defenses? What's the first thing he's looking at as far as pre-snap? Does he make adjustments based on defensive alignments? How well does he know his own offense? Does he linger on his primary receiver? How fast does he go to a secondary read? Does he go to a third read? A fourth? How quickly does he make decisions? It's one thing to understand defenses, but it's a completely other to process that information quickly enough to make decisions at the right time. How much courage does he have? Does he stand in there and take the shot to deliver the ball? Is he a leader? Does he elevate the play of the other players around him? Does he alienate them? How mentally tough is he? Does he get a little jittery in the pocket after taking a shot? Or does he stand in there again? Does he get intimidated? Does he trash talk back to people who trash talk him? The list goes on and on. There are so many intangible things that you can tell about a player. You might not know the guy on a personal level, but you know things about the guy that even people who do know him on a personal level don't know.

                            The Patriots also knew Cutler. Wasn't that obvious when the Patriots played against Cutler last season? Does 17 of 26 for 168 yards 1 TD and 2 INTs ring a bell? Yep, they knew Cutler too.
                            Last edited by Crazy8; 06-02-2009, 04:13 PM.

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                            • nea, did you really just tell someone to "go eat a ding dong?"

                              I mean.. srsly? rly?

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                              • Originally posted by Tarquin View Post
                                nea, did you really just tell someone to "go eat a ding dong?"

                                I mean.. srsly? rly?
                                yes. Throwing insults because you do not agree with someone is childish, kids like ding dongs.

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