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Cutler's gets a bad rap on interceptions!

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  • Coldbrew
    replied
    Originally posted by acpell671 View Post
    Eddie Mac was one of my FAVORITE ALL TIME receivers (my homerism, too). There were some things you could just count on and his hands were amazing. My close friends are Raider fans and they hated him as much, if not more, than Elway. Don't get me wrong, Rod Smith is way up there for me, but Eddie Mac sometimes goes unappreciated.

    He also took some of the biggest hits I've ever seen, and surprisingly almost never let go of the ball when these big hits were delivered. And ALSO makes some mighty tasty horseradish sauce

    Leave a comment:


  • arapaho
    replied
    Originally posted by broncos1997 View Post
    i agree, whatever excuses fans want to make for cutler you can't deny that cutler has the best recievers and blockers that ANY broncos QB has had....maybe ever. but then again a running game wouldn't help....

    btw, on your sig, marshall looks REALLY furious maybe you could try flipping the picture?
    you obviously dont know the broncos at all

    cutler with marshall and a rookie has the best wrs that any bronco qb?

    does mark jackson, vance johnson RING A BELL? THREE AMIGOS?

    rod smith, ed maccaffery, shannon sharpe..gary zimmermon, tom nalan, lepsis, schreleth sound familier?

    then a running game wouldnt help?...wow thats about as clueless as it comes

    Leave a comment:


  • Breezer
    replied
    Originally posted by dragster69 View Post
    In my opinion, had Elwayhad Shanahan as his offensive coordinator from the beginning his career would've been something out of this world. I believe Dan Reeves put a lot of strain on Elway because he was a control freak
    It wasn't until Shanaha came in as the OC that Elway's numbers improved but the great relationship he had with Shanny was something Reeves felt "inappropiate". Reeves thought they were devicing plays behind his back without his approval. Remember, Reeves was an old-school coach. At the time, Shanahan's offensive prowess was ahead of its time, having learned it from Bill Walsh HC of the 49ers. Yet, it's safe to ssume that Elway willed his way to SB's. He didn't have a great defense or superstars on offense, but the guy always found a way to win
    He did have his share of interceptions, but those weren't the game killer variety, and as long as Elway had the ball in the 4th qtr, we were always in the game with a chance to pull a win...
    While Elway was usually great in the clutch, you are wrong about him not throwing game killing interceptions! The one that still haunts me to this day is the AFC Divisional Playoff Game against Pittsburgh at Mile High in 1984. Tied 17 to 17 with less than 3 minutes left in the game, Elway threw a pass over the middle (on second down) that was intercepted by Steelers' safety Eric Williams, who then ran the ball down to the 2-yard-line. After a short run and an incomplete pass, Pollard scored the go-ahead touchdown with a 1-yard run. Denver was 13-3 that year. The Steelers were 9-7. I was so frustrated. That game hurt.

    Leave a comment:


  • acpell671
    replied
    Originally posted by floridabroncos View Post
    Yeah, as much as I love our current OL and our set of WR, it was nothing like what we had in 97-99. Seriously, when you'd watch the OL in action, they seemed to just move as one unit rather than 5 guys. I still think it's one of the best 3-4 OL units EVER. And I would take that OL against any defense even playing today and think they'd win more games than they'd lose. And Rod and Eddy Mac in their prime were the best tandem in the league, period. Better than Michael (Irvin) and Alvin Harper were together, better than Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne in their prime together, better than almost any tandem I can think of in modern history.

    Eddy had the best hands of any guy that tall I've ever seen, he could catch passes that I don't even think Randy Moss could handle, and Rod Smith was the best pure route runner that the modern game has seen, mostly because of his football IQ and his work ethic, which IMO is second only to Jerry Rice's. I know I'm biased as a Denver fan, but those few years, we had the best offense in football, period. Our defense was just above average, which was the reason that some of the playoff games were close. But during the regular season, we were beating the tar outta teams and the only games we lost were once we pretty much had our playoff spot set. I believe in both years we didn't lose games until very late in the season.
    Eddie Mac was one of my FAVORITE ALL TIME receivers (my homerism, too). There were some things you could just count on and his hands were amazing. My close friends are Raider fans and they hated him as much, if not more, than Elway. Don't get me wrong, Rod Smith is way up there for me, but Eddie Mac sometimes goes unappreciated.

    Leave a comment:


  • IHSD
    replied
    Jay Cutler is talented, but he makes bad decisions and it may or may not change. We don't know if it will or not. Did John Elway improve his INT rate as his career went on? Sure. How about a gunslinger similiar to Jay like Brett Favre? Not so much. The point is, its too soon to tell.

    Regardless, Jay Cutler will be a talented quarterback. To say whether or not his interceptions will improve over time would be a guess. I think a lot of it had to do with all the freedom he was given under Mike Shanahan. Mike basically said, "go make a play." Josh McDaniels and his "system" if you will, is more precise and won't leave Jay as much freedom to make his own plays happen.

    Whether or not Jay throws 10 INT's or 18 in a season, he will still be successful. It will always be paired with a boat-load of yards and TD's.

    Its almost irrelevant as long as he is making the plays when it it matters. We have seen him fail at times, but we have seen him do incredible things more often. Jay will be a great QB either way.

    Leave a comment:


  • floridabroncos
    replied
    Originally posted by TheJackal View Post
    Teams win championships. All players are part of a team. Thus anything less than an NFL team cannot win a Super Bowl. Elway along with numerous other players helped us win those two Lombardi's, but no one player can take credit for a Super Bowl win. They can simply note that they were part of it, nothing more.
    CP, excellent point. Teams win championships in football, individuals win championships in Singles Tennis, Golf, and Math Competitions.

    Leave a comment:


  • TheJackal
    replied
    Originally posted by chazoe60 View Post
    Semantics fella, semantics. TD won two SBs. Mark Schlereth won three SBs. Mike Lodish won two SBs and played in six. You see how that works. Dan Fouts won zero SBs. LT won zero SBs. You get the picture.
    Teams win championships. All players are part of a team. Thus anything less than an NFL team cannot win a Super Bowl. Elway along with numerous other players helped us win those two Lombardi's, but no one player can take credit for a Super Bowl win. They can simply note that they were part of it, nothing more.

    Leave a comment:


  • floridabroncos
    replied
    Originally posted by Ravage!!! View Post
    Really? you think our OL and WRs are better than what we had during the SB years with Schlereth, Zimmerman, and a healthy Nalen????

    You think our WRs were better than a top Rod Smith and top Ed McCaffrey along with Shannon Sharpe???

    I think you are showing your young age.
    Yeah, as much as I love our current OL and our set of WR, it was nothing like what we had in 97-99. Seriously, when you'd watch the OL in action, they seemed to just move as one unit rather than 5 guys. I still think it's one of the best 3-4 OL units EVER. And I would take that OL against any defense even playing today and think they'd win more games than they'd lose. And Rod and Eddy Mac in their prime were the best tandem in the league, period. Better than Michael (Irvin) and Alvin Harper were together, better than Marvin Harrison and Reggie Wayne in their prime together, better than almost any tandem I can think of in modern history.

    Eddy had the best hands of any guy that tall I've ever seen, he could catch passes that I don't even think Randy Moss could handle, and Rod Smith was the best pure route runner that the modern game has seen, mostly because of his football IQ and his work ethic, which IMO is second only to Jerry Rice's. I know I'm biased as a Denver fan, but those few years, we had the best offense in football, period. Our defense was just above average, which was the reason that some of the playoff games were close. But during the regular season, we were beating the tar outta teams and the only games we lost were once we pretty much had our playoff spot set. I believe in both years we didn't lose games until very late in the season.

    Leave a comment:


  • Coldbrew
    replied
    Originally posted by Ravage!!! View Post
    yeah.. but something to remember as well. ALL QBs that throw that many times, throw nearly if not more INTs. Rookie throws or not. There is no difference btween a rookie INT and a veteran one. Both must have been either bad throws, or bad reads.

    Also.. remember that our offense couldn't afford to simply "throw the ball away".. and to throw a series away. I mean, Rothlesburger could throw the ball away and know that the defense would do their job and they would try again later. Our offense didn't have that benefit.

    I'm not taking ALL his bad throws away from him.. not at all. I know Jay has things to work on, obviously. But when you know your team is giving up 30+ points on an average of every other game, you know you MUST score and try your DAMNEST to score on each and every drive. Not feeling as though you could afford to punt and try again next drive.

    That kind of mentality, takes a toll on a team... on the players. EVERY series is a "must" score for them. As a result, our team actually had more 10+ play drives than anyone else in the NFL.. was VERY high on 3rd down conversions, and ranked amongst the top in yrds. But.. we had to throw the ball 600+ times to do that. The defense had SUCH A HUGE advantage against us.. knowing we couldn't/wouldn't run. Its hard to convert long 3rd downs.. because the defense KNOWS what you are going to do. Thats how it was for us each and every down. Thats a pretty hard thing (for EVERYONE) to overcome.

    So yeah... Jay made some 'forced' throws... absolutely. But at the same time, I think thats how our entire offense looked at their job on the team... FORCED to try and make big plays all the time. THey NEEDED to make big plays, hold long drives, and not have the benefit of simply playing field position.

    All good points.

    Leave a comment:


  • floridabroncos
    replied
    Originally posted by Justblaze2729 View Post
    Plummer and griese dont even count because they had nowhere the talent that jay does so expectations werent high for those 2 bums

    Elway won 2 superbowls

    And jay cutler well yeah ..
    And how many years did it take before Elway won those 2 superbowls? I think it's a little harsh to expect that out of Cutler by year 3. Also, to the point that Elway averaged 0.97 interceptions per game, that was after his career was said and done. He improved drastically in the last third of his career in the INT category. If you look at Elway's first three years versus Cutler's first three years, Cutler played 37 games his first three years, and had 37 INTs, or as the OP said, 1.0 INTs per game. Elway's first three seasons, he played 42 games (started 40 games) and threw for 52 INTs. So he averaged 1.24 INTs per games played, and 1.3 INTs per game started. Chew on that.

    Leave a comment:


  • dragster69
    replied
    In my opinion, had Elwayhad Shanahan as his offensive coordinator from the beginning his career would've been something out of this world. I believe Dan Reeves put a lot of strain on Elway because he was a control freak
    It wasn't until Shanaha came in as the OC that Elway's numbers improved but the great relationship he had with Shanny was something Reeves felt "inappropiate". Reeves thought they were devicing plays behind his back without his approval. Remember, Reeves was an old-school coach. At the time, Shanahan's offensive prowess was ahead of its time, having learned it from Bill Walsh HC of the 49ers. Yet, it's safe to ssume that Elway willed his way to SB's. He didn't have a great defense or superstars on offense, but the guy always found a way to win
    He did have his share of interceptions, but those weren't the game killer variety, and as long as Elway had the ball in the 4th qtr, we were always in the game with a chance to pull a win...

    Leave a comment:


  • Ravage!!!
    replied
    Originally posted by Coldbrew View Post
    I agree with most people's reasoning, that if you throw the ball over 600 times, 18 interceptions isn't bad as far as averages. But in all honesty, it should have been lower. Cutler made way too many "rookie" throws, most of his interceptions weren't great defensive plays, more like Cutler was throwing to them. I left last year thinking that it's getting too late to call it rookie mistakes, it's time for the guy to realize when to throw it out of bounds instead of throwing into heavy defense. Sure I'll give it to Cutler, he's a great QB and a huge benefit to the team, but to say that his interceptions were typical and average, I will not. I'm gonna look past the numbers and say that he should have thrown less picks, even given the fact that he threw so damn much.
    yeah.. but something to remember as well. ALL QBs that throw that many times, throw nearly if not more INTs. Rookie throws or not. There is no difference btween a rookie INT and a veteran one. Both must have been either bad throws, or bad reads.

    Also.. remember that our offense couldn't afford to simply "throw the ball away".. and to throw a series away. I mean, Rothlesburger could throw the ball away and know that the defense would do their job and they would try again later. Our offense didn't have that benefit.

    I'm not taking ALL his bad throws away from him.. not at all. I know Jay has things to work on, obviously. But when you know your team is giving up 30+ points on an average of every other game, you know you MUST score and try your DAMNEST to score on each and every drive. Not feeling as though you could afford to punt and try again next drive.

    That kind of mentality, takes a toll on a team... on the players. EVERY series is a "must" score for them. As a result, our team actually had more 10+ play drives than anyone else in the NFL.. was VERY high on 3rd down conversions, and ranked amongst the top in yrds. But.. we had to throw the ball 600+ times to do that. The defense had SUCH A HUGE advantage against us.. knowing we couldn't/wouldn't run. Its hard to convert long 3rd downs.. because the defense KNOWS what you are going to do. Thats how it was for us each and every down. Thats a pretty hard thing (for EVERYONE) to overcome.

    So yeah... Jay made some 'forced' throws... absolutely. But at the same time, I think thats how our entire offense looked at their job on the team... FORCED to try and make big plays all the time. THey NEEDED to make big plays, hold long drives, and not have the benefit of simply playing field position.

    Leave a comment:


  • mx_stiles13
    replied
    Originally posted by Ravage!!! View Post
    Thats not accurate. The problem is, you haven't shown you know what a QB should do, nor show any knowledge in how a QB should "distribute" the ball.
    Well, you give no evidence of what being "accurate" is when it comes to QBs, so I have no reason to think I made any mistake in what I said.

    Cutler does not distribute the ball enough. He locks onto Marshall much too often when their are other receivers open. Jay will throw into multiple coverage in critical situations when he has no pressure in the pocket, while there are RBs who might not make a huge gain but will get the 1st down.

    Now why don't you back up your statement rather than bluntly tell me that I'm wrong?

    Leave a comment:


  • Coldbrew
    replied
    I agree with most people's reasoning, that if you throw the ball over 600 times, 18 interceptions isn't bad as far as averages. But in all honesty, it should have been lower. Cutler made way too many "rookie" throws, most of his interceptions weren't great defensive plays, more like Cutler was throwing to them. I left last year thinking that it's getting too late to call it rookie mistakes, it's time for the guy to realize when to throw it out of bounds instead of throwing into heavy defense. Sure I'll give it to Cutler, he's a great QB and a huge benefit to the team, but to say that his interceptions were typical and average, I will not. I'm gonna look past the numbers and say that he should have thrown less picks, even given the fact that he threw so damn much.

    Leave a comment:


  • Patent_Pending
    replied
    Originally posted by Ravage!!! View Post
    I hate to say this, PP.. but.. none of these statements are true whatsoever. he didn't play in an option system, and he most certainly can read defenses.

    If he couldn't read defenses, how is it that he only threw 18 INTs with that many pass attempts?
    I see your point, can we agree that it was a spread/option hybrid?

    But, if you look at a bulk of his interceptions last year he was throwing into double, and even sometimes, triple coverage with Marshall being a prime target.

    Leave a comment:

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