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  • Problems with us Denver fans

    Note: this post is about Denver fans in general, There are some exceptions. I use "we" in this note as a synecdoche for the type of fans I'm talking about representing the whole fan base.

    Now I was born and raised in Denver. I was even lucky enough to grow up during the Elway year. I am and always will be a Broncos fan no matter what, but I've noticed a couple of problems we Bronco fans have, and I would like to point them out. If you agree with them that's great. If you don't, that's cool to.

    The first and biggest problem in my mind is that we live in the past to much. We compare every QB to Elway and all out RB to Davis. We get angry at Bowlen for firing Shanahan. Yes he did win us two back-to-back Super Bowls, but since then he hasn't done anything. This is the same kind of thinking that stops musicians from being considered great and unique, cause no matter what they do they get compared to The Beatles, or The Stones, or Zeppelin. But I digress, We need to stop holding onto the past and look hopefully into the future.

    The second problem I've noticed recently is that we are ****s. I didn't recognize this as being a bad thing until recently cause before we were only doing it to our rivals, like The Raiders and Chiefs. Teams that I had been brought up to despise. But since the whole Cutler saga it has become apparent to me that we don't care who it is. We'll turn on our own team if we get upset over something. Has anyone else noticed that all of the posts by Bears fans talk about how good of a guy Orton is and how they're gonna miss him. And at the same time they accept Cutler with open arms and give him their faith. And how they wish The Broncos the best and can't wait to face us in the pre-season and hope that it's a good game?
    Then look at our posts. We either talk about how much we hate Cutler, or how much we hate Bowlen/McDaniels/Orton. We either talk about how bad of a place Chicago is and condemn them cause Cutler ended up their, or we talk about how Orton is gonna suck and McDaniels is trying to destroy our team and we should fire McDaniels and get rid of Pat Bowlen.
    I am shocked at how easily we were divided. Invesco Field has always been known as a bad place to play an away game because Denver fans have so much passion and loyalty that they create a huge home team advantage. But since the end of last season I have seen people claiming to be life long Bronco fans turn their back on the team. Is it really that easy to tear us apart? There's no problem with disagreeing with some of the decisions that have been made, but the amount of uproar between fans of the same team is ridiculous.

    "A house divided cannot stand" -Abraham Lincoln

    We need to come together as fans, and unite for a better future. There will be disagreements and mistakes made in the future, but we should learn from this and become the fans we're meant to be. A team is nothing without it's fan, yes. But a fan is useless without a team as well.

    Heroes live forever, but legends never die.

  • #2
    Nice post.

    Comment


    • #3
      Very true.

      Maybe this can be attributed to "growing pains"....

      I don't believe that anyone really likes change, so when it happens it's always difficult. Especially the way it has all happened in Denver recently. Too much, too quickly.

      I know I'll get slammed by my fellow Bolt fans for this, but the Broncos do have great fans. They are passionate. That's why they are reacting as they are. They are also committed, so no matter what, everyone will be back cheering the team on come game day.

      With the news you all have had to digest lately, I'm surprised that everyone isn't out kicking the neighbors cat or something. It has to be frustrating. But it will pass. :salute!:

      Comment


      • #4
        While I agree with you about supporting our team? I do retain the right to form an opinion about its leadership or any given player based on what I perceive as their ability. I was not a Wade Phillips fan. I was not particularly a Dre Bly fan either. I'm definitely not a Nate Webster fan. That doesn't mean I don't wish any player well on my team. It also doesn't mean that I won't support my team if they decide that Nate Webster is the best option we have at MLB.

        I do agree that the hostility level has risen to inordinate and uncalled for heights, but it just shows that same passion you speak of. When people feel passionately about something and they have an opportunity to voice their opinion there is always going to be disagreements because of the differing viewpoints involved. I think most fans will remain loyal to the Bronco's organization and regardless of who the coach, QB, RB, TE, WR, or MLB is they will still be cheering for the "team" on any given day that they take the field.

        To ask that they remain silent or that they restrain themselves in their commentary about their beliefs is futile though. The amount of venom and anger displayed in most posts is a direct reflection of the amount of passion these people feel towards their chosen team. If they were less emotionally connected to their team, they would be less committed to it as well.

        Comment


        • #5
          Very Nice Post !!

          Very nice post sir. While fans of the same team should stick together through adversity, sticking together with a complete change in principles is a different story. I'll give you an analogy. If I were a German pre-wwII, I would love my country. But given the complete regime change to Hitler, could I support Hitler. NO !! Doesn't make me love my country any less, NO!! Now the Bronocos. Fan for over 25 years and I love the Broncos (even though many now tell me to leave because of my opinions). The complete managerial team in place now though, I have zero support for (same amount I support the Patriots). Could Josh have changed my mind? Yes. He could have showed up, said I don't like Jay for this system and I want somebody else. That I could respect. But to do it Billichek style, from I never tried to trade him, to I only listened, to we told Jay about it? He's just plain sneaky, dishonest and deceptive, just like his Mentor. I do not support this kind of system or his (Josh's) kind of ethics. As far as Bowlen is concerned, I have always considered him to be one of the best owners in professional sports. I still do. I honestly believe he never saw all of this coming and just had to make a choice and go left or right. I believe if he knew all this was coming, he would have never hired Josh. I also believe that after all the aggravation this situation has caused, Josh's allowed time for success (from Bowlen) has been greatly shortened. But regardless of whether he wins or loses (Josh), I will not endorse or support him on priniciple (and I believe this to be the opinion of many older fans like myself from what I have read in the last few months).

          Best Regards,

          Bert428

          Comment


          • #6
            I have seen Denver compete in 5 superbowls over the years (the 78 bowl was a couple of years before I started watching. The Broncos were awful when I started watching them.

            Bowlen changed the philosophy of the Broncos. He proved he was willing to spend money to bring in coaches and good players, and to keep the good young talent.

            Now people are willing to forget all of that over a tumultuous offseason? I will not be named amongst that crowd. I believe Denver will be in the playoffs in two years. If they can get some help with their front seven in the draft we might even see them in the playoffs this year. It could happen, and we should all be hoping that it does!
            sigpic
            Thank you to my grandfather jetrazor for being a veteran of the armed forces!

            Comment


            • #7
              Very true. The only other fans I see rip on their own team more are Eagles fans. They are always pissed at every part of their team and nothing is ever good enough. This whole situation has reminded me a lot of the Philly/Mcnabb situation over the years, except the Broncos actually changed coaches and traded their QB.


              Hell, at this point things are probably worse here than in Philly. Although Philly fans cry and moan about their team constantly underachieving, they are fans through it all. People here abandon the team because they trade their 3rd year QB.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by bert428 View Post
                Very nice post sir. While fans of the same team should stick together through adversity, sticking together with a complete change in principles is a different story. I'll give you an analogy. If I were a German pre-wwII, I would love my country. But given the complete regime change to Hitler, could I support Hitler. NO !! Doesn't make me love my country any less, NO!! Now the Bronocos. Fan for over 25 years and I love the Broncos (even though many now tell me to leave because of my opinions). The complete managerial team in place now though, I have zero support for (same amount I support the Patriots). Could Josh have changed my mind? Yes. He could have showed up, said I don't like Jay for this system and I want somebody else. That I could respect. But to do it Billichek style, from I never tried to trade him, to I only listened, to we told Jay about it? He's just plain sneaky, dishonest and deceptive, just like his Mentor. I do not support this kind of system or his (Josh's) kind of ethics. As far as Bowlen is concerned, I have always considered him to be one of the best owners in professional sports. I still do. I honestly believe he never saw all of this coming and just had to make a choice and go left or right. I believe if he knew all this was coming, he would have never hired Josh. I also believe that after all the aggravation this situation has caused, Josh's allowed time for success (from Bowlen) has been greatly shortened. But regardless of whether he wins or loses (Josh), I will not endorse or support him on priniciple (and I believe this to be the opinion of many older fans like myself from what I have read in the last few months).

                Best Regards,

                Bert428


                I agree that asking them to change their principles is crazy, but were all of the posts like yours I wouldn't have seens a problem. like I said disagreeing isn't wrong. It's the fact that is was so full of hate. You on the other hand were able to calmy assert your position without relying on name calling or using ridiculous exageration.


                Also, did you just compare this offseasons changes to Hitler and the Nazi's? Cause I'm no expert, but I don't think firing Shanahan, hiring McDaniels, and trading Cutler is the same as killing six million jews, trying to take over Europe and the reast of the world, and ruining your countries economy for years to come.

                Heroes live forever, but legends never die.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Divided We Fail.



                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Jaqhammer View Post
                    I agree that asking them to change their principles is crazy, but were all of the posts like yours I wouldn't have seens a problem. like I said disagreeing isn't wrong. It's the fact that is was so full of hate. You on the other hand were able to calmy assert your position without relying on name calling or using ridiculous exageration.


                    Also, did you just compare this offseasons changes to Hitler and the Nazi's? Cause I'm no expert, but I don't think firing Shanahan, hiring McDaniels, and trading Cutler is the same as killing six million jews, trying to take over Europe and the reast of the world, and ruining your countries economy for years to come.
                    It's not a comparison. It's just to prove a point. I cannot support someone who I believe has bad ethics, even though I still love the Broncos and think very highly of Pat Bowlen. I'd have to say the best times Bowlen brought me were the Kosar/Elway (Dan/Marty) battles (I'm originally from Miami Bob Griese/Marino/Kosar/Marty). Even though we didn't win the big one, wow did we fight. It was classic. Winning at the cost of compromising your principles, in my opinion, is just wrong.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      CP. That's all I gotta say.

                      sigpic

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by bert428 View Post
                        It's not a comparison. It's just to prove a point. I cannot support someone who I believe has bad ethics, even though I still love the Broncos and think very highly of Pat Bowlen. I'd have to say the best times Bowlen brought me were the Kosar/Elway (Dan/Marty) battles (I'm originally from Miami Bob Griese/Marino/Kosar/Marty). Even though we didn't win the big one, wow did we fight. It was classic. Winning at the cost of compromising your principles, in my opinion, is just wrong.
                        With all the misinformation, innuendo and outright BS I think it is hard to really decipher who's ethics are in question. That being said I will support the team an it's current direction and will be rooting as always on game day. The only situation I can presently think of that would make me strongly consider not being a fan would be Vick being brought in, that would be very difficult for me.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I too was surprised by the fall out. The fan hate parties and burning of Cutler jerseys. All took what the new Coach had to say as the absolute truth. We don't know what happened and we don't know what Josh said to Jay oh excuse me "the player". SOMETHING happened that turned Jay. He played a year sick( before he knew what was wrong) and became involved in the community, he loved Denver, he also showed up for two weeks to go over things with the new coach. SOMETHING happened.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Jaqhammer View Post
                            Note: this post is about Denver fans in general, There are some exceptions. I use "we" in this note as a synecdoche for the type of fans I'm talking about representing the whole fan base.

                            Now I was born and raised in Denver. I was even lucky enough to grow up during the Elway year. I am and always will be a Broncos fan no matter what, but I've noticed a couple of problems we Bronco fans have, and I would like to point them out. If you agree with them that's great. If you don't, that's cool to.

                            The first and biggest problem in my mind is that we live in the past to much. We compare every QB to Elway and all out RB to Davis. We get angry at Bowlen for firing Shanahan. Yes he did win us two back-to-back Super Bowls, but since then he hasn't done anything. This is the same kind of thinking that stops musicians from being considered great and unique, cause no matter what they do they get compared to The Beatles, or The Stones, or Zeppelin. But I digress, We need to stop holding onto the past and look hopefully into the future.

                            The second problem I've noticed recently is that we are ****s. I didn't recognize this as being a bad thing until recently cause before we were only doing it to our rivals, like The Raiders and Chiefs. Teams that I had been brought up to despise. But since the whole Cutler saga it has become apparent to me that we don't care who it is. We'll turn on our own team if we get upset over something. Has anyone else noticed that all of the posts by Bears fans talk about how good of a guy Orton is and how they're gonna miss him. And at the same time they accept Cutler with open arms and give him their faith. And how they wish The Broncos the best and can't wait to face us in the pre-season and hope that it's a good game?
                            Then look at our posts. We either talk about how much we hate Cutler, or how much we hate Bowlen/McDaniels/Orton. We either talk about how bad of a place Chicago is and condemn them cause Cutler ended up their, or we talk about how Orton is gonna suck and McDaniels is trying to destroy our team and we should fire McDaniels and get rid of Pat Bowlen.
                            I am shocked at how easily we were divided. Invesco Field has always been known as a bad place to play an away game because Denver fans have so much passion and loyalty that they create a huge home team advantage. But since the end of last season I have seen people claiming to be life long Bronco fans turn their back on the team. Is it really that easy to tear us apart? There's no problem with disagreeing with some of the decisions that have been made, but the amount of uproar between fans of the same team is ridiculous.

                            "A house divided cannot stand" -Abraham Lincoln

                            We need to come together as fans, and unite for a better future. There will be disagreements and mistakes made in the future, but we should learn from this and become the fans we're meant to be. A team is nothing without it's fan, yes. But a fan is useless without a team as well.

                            I under stand where your coming from and agree with a lot of what you wrote but I have to much invested in this Team to just sit back and act like I am Happy just because I am a Broncos Fan.

                            I could've invested that time into any other Team just as well as I did the Broncos, The only thing that makes the Broncos Special is US FANS.

                            With that being said, Bowlen open our doors and is letting this guy rip through OUR TEAM and make Huge Changes with not 1% of Head Coaching experience.

                            Thats my problem ?????
                            We are the Organization that " EVERYONE " wants to be a part of


                            sigpic

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Jaqhammer View Post
                              Note: this post is about Denver fans in general, There are some exceptions. I use "we" in this note as a synecdoche for the type of fans I'm talking about representing the whole fan base.

                              Now I was born and raised in Denver. I was even lucky enough to grow up during the Elway year. I am and always will be a Broncos fan no matter what, but I've noticed a couple of problems we Bronco fans have, and I would like to point them out. If you agree with them that's great. If you don't, that's cool to.

                              The first and biggest problem in my mind is that we live in the past to much. We compare every QB to Elway and all out RB to Davis. We get angry at Bowlen for firing Shanahan. Yes he did win us two back-to-back Super Bowls, but since then he hasn't done anything. This is the same kind of thinking that stops musicians from being considered great and unique, cause no matter what they do they get compared to The Beatles, or The Stones, or Zeppelin. But I digress, We need to stop holding onto the past and look hopefully into the future.

                              The second problem I've noticed recently is that we are ****s. I didn't recognize this as being a bad thing until recently cause before we were only doing it to our rivals, like The Raiders and Chiefs. Teams that I had been brought up to despise. But since the whole Cutler saga it has become apparent to me that we don't care who it is. We'll turn on our own team if we get upset over something. Has anyone else noticed that all of the posts by Bears fans talk about how good of a guy Orton is and how they're gonna miss him. And at the same time they accept Cutler with open arms and give him their faith. And how they wish The Broncos the best and can't wait to face us in the pre-season and hope that it's a good game?
                              Then look at our posts. We either talk about how much we hate Cutler, or how much we hate Bowlen/McDaniels/Orton. We either talk about how bad of a place Chicago is and condemn them cause Cutler ended up their, or we talk about how Orton is gonna suck and McDaniels is trying to destroy our team and we should fire McDaniels and get rid of Pat Bowlen.
                              I am shocked at how easily we were divided. Invesco Field has always been known as a bad place to play an away game because Denver fans have so much passion and loyalty that they create a huge home team advantage. But since the end of last season I have seen people claiming to be life long Bronco fans turn their back on the team. Is it really that easy to tear us apart? There's no problem with disagreeing with some of the decisions that have been made, but the amount of uproar between fans of the same team is ridiculous.

                              "A house divided cannot stand" -Abraham Lincoln

                              We need to come together as fans, and unite for a better future. There will be disagreements and mistakes made in the future, but we should learn from this and become the fans we're meant to be. A team is nothing without it's fan, yes. But a fan is useless without a team as well.
                              I agree with your post. I wasn't surprised at the anger and hostility towards the new regime and thier tactics, I was more surprised at how quick at the drop of a hat certain fans were quick to abandon this team.
                              It was upsetting to me that people would up and leave over this instead of sticking through this like every other rough time this team has had.

                              i understood most people distrust for Josh and nonexistance of Xanders through out this whole ordeal but all i was trying to do was encourage patience.
                              none of us knows the future so lets give them a little time to see this play out before we chase Josh out with torches and pitchforks.

                              again no one is saying that one has to keep thier feelings bottled up but it does get out of hand and over done. I have a big anticipation for the draft this year and that's what will give me a little glimpse of our future.
                              Bronco fan 33 years and counting, GO BRONCOS!

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