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  • Can Orton Close out games?

    This is a question that really hasn't been discussed all too much.

    A good amount of discussion has been generated about his ability to come back. When his team is behind he has a QB rating of 65.3. However, what is worse is his QB rating in the 4th quarter of a close game (within 7). His QB rating was 62.2

    The game that many point to when you ask if Kyle can come back... is the game against the Falcons where he threw a 17 yard strike in the corner of the endzone with like 18 seconds left in the game. It was a great play and all for nothing.

    The bigger question is... if you have the lead can he close that game out? What you saw a lot with the Bears is that the Bears would go into the 4th quarter with the lead and the defense would be on the field almost the entire time. The offense would, time and time again, produce a 3 and out at the end of the games. Often, the Bears o would see the field with 4 minutes or less to go. Rarely would they pick up those first downs and just take a knee to end the game.

    Some of that can be attributed to a conservative game plan at the end of games. Try to close out the game running with 9 guys in the box... then try to throw for that first down on 3rd and 5. The problem is... most teams will do that exact same thing. If your team sees a loss throwing 3 times with the lead late in the game the press jumps all over them for not trying to run out the clock. I believe the Broncos would try to execute this same game plan.

    As high as some people here may be on Moreno... even the greats struggle against 9 man fronts at the end of games.

    So the question becomes this... can Orton execute on 3rd and 5 with the lead and a few minutes left? I think he has shown that in the opposite scenario... trying to come back late in the game throwing... he can do a decent job. It's closing out that becomes the question.

    Further... if the Broncos D is on the field for 9 minutes to close out the game... can you rely on them to hold?
    Understand that I am a Bears fan but also that I have followed Orton's career. His ability to improve himself makes him a very easy guy to cheer for. I am here because I will continue to cheer for Orton unless his success interferes with the success of the Bears.


  • #2
    You know I really wish all the freaking chicago fans would just go back to their own board and stop posting endless dribble to try and keep things stirred up.



    Nobody knows how this team will proform until the season starts, this is a new team, with new players, a new scheme, new coaches....You have no more idea than I do what we're capable of and if we suck. There is always next year, rome wasn't built in a day.
    Last edited by Freyaka; 05-16-2009, 08:09 AM. Reason: missed a word.
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    • #3
      Originally posted by Freyaka View Post
      You know I really wish all the freaking chicago fans would just go back to their own board and stop posting endless dribble to try and keep things stirred up.



      Nobody knows how this team will proform until the season starts, this is a new team, with new players, a new scheme, new coaches....You no more idea than I do what we're capable of and if we suck. There is always next year, rome wasn't built in a day.
      Ya know countless other threads similar to this one have been started by Bronco fans right?

      It's an interesting offseason to follow in Denver. As you pointed out... there are a lot of questions right now. That's what makes it so interesting. After the season we'll have a better idea of where things stand.

      I'm an Orton fan... which is why I am here. My allegiance is to the Bears... but I have followed Orton's whole career. If you want to sum up Orton's entire career with 1 statement here it is. Kyle Orton overcomes adversity. It makes him a great guy to root for.

      This is one of the things he would have to overcome in my opinion. I think it makes for interesting discussion.
      Understand that I am a Bears fan but also that I have followed Orton's career. His ability to improve himself makes him a very easy guy to cheer for. I am here because I will continue to cheer for Orton unless his success interferes with the success of the Bears.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Freyaka View Post
        Nobody knows how this team will proform until the season starts, this is a new team, with new players, a new scheme, new coaches....You no more idea than I do what we're capable of and if we suck. There is always next year, rome wasn't built in a day.
        Ya everyone has heard that and we all know we gotta wait to see what happens. If thats the case then this message booard should be closed from the last game of the season until the first Pre-Season game of the following season because we dont know whats gonna happen. Nobody should have an opinion until we get all the facts, right? Message boards are for speculation, opinions and all kinds of other fun things.
        My friends over at Sports Radio Interviews sent me a link to an interview Pat Bowlen did with a Chicago-area radio station. While there is nothing earth-shattering here. Below is a segment of the transcript -

        What are the Bears getting in Jay Cutler?

        “They’re getting an extremely talented young quarterback.”


        Some one Please name me the last successful NFL QB that had to be taught how to throw the ball correctly.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by psychobear View Post
          Ya know countless other threads similar to this one have been started by Bronco fans right?

          It's an interesting offseason to follow in Denver. As you pointed out... there are a lot of questions right now. That's what makes it so interesting. After the season we'll have a better idea of where things stand.

          I'm an Orton fan... which is why I am here. My allegiance is to the Bears... but I have followed Orton's whole career. If you want to sum up Orton's entire career with 1 statement here it is. Kyle Orton overcomes adversity. It makes him a great guy to root for.

          This is one of the things he would have to overcome in my opinion. I think it makes for interesting discussion.

          To be honest I think this season will breath a new life into orton. People can post all they want what he did or didn't do in chicago but the kid is essentially going to be a 3rd year starter (I realize he's been in the league longer than this but this will be his 3rd year starting for a team) I honestly think there is an environment in denver that a QB could thrive in. Will Orton? Who knows but I think it's a real possibility.

          You mention his problems 3rd and 5 well, he has way more options now on where to go on 3rd and 5.

          He could hand off to the RB, pass to the RB/FB go to marshall, sheffler, royal, gaffney, stokley, quinn. That's a lot of targets and honestly he's going to have a lot of time to checkdown those targets until he finds one that is open and get the first down. This isn't chicago where you had forte, olsen and maybe if your lucky and he can get open AND actually catch the ball hester. I think Orton has a lot of potential and could succeed here and well if he doesn't we can always draft a qb first round next year in a much more deep draft.
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          • #6
            Originally posted by Sunbiz1
            Hey, this guy's a good poster. I realize there have been many Bear fans here being a pain, but psych isn't one of them.
            it is kind of ironic though

            a bears fan asking if orton can close out games, when their current qb is the first (and only) qb in the history of the nfl to blow a 3 game division lead with 3 to go
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            • #7
              I have no issue with the Bear Fans being on here and under ther title of the thread it shows who posted it...There are a lot more of our Fans that I stay away from their threads..

              We should be wanting to show the World Just How Great The Bronco Fans are and Invite New Life Long People To Jump A Board..

              Now to the Thread...

              Haven't a Freakin Clue Whats Gonna Happen and If He Can Close Games Out and We a Great D, He might Not Need To
              We are the Organization that " EVERYONE " wants to be a part of


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              • #8
                Originally posted by it'sjustagame View Post
                Ya everyone has heard that and we all know we gotta wait to see what happens. If thats the case then this message booard should be closed from the last game of the season until the first Pre-Season game of the following season because we dont know whats gonna happen. Nobody should have an opinion until we get all the facts, right? Message boards are for speculation, opinions and all kinds of other fun things.
                Well it's felt all off season like this board is all about posting the same thing 10 different times in 10 different threads and rehashing the same worthless crap that's already been rehashed 10 times. I have no problem with discussion and speculation but a change in topic every now and again would be flippin wonderful.
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                • #9
                  Cutler couldn't close out the game against Miami, Buffalo at home, and was lucky to get the help of the officials in week 2, after he had fumbled the ball. Well just stating facts, Pycho bear, just stating facts.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Freyaka View Post



                    Nobody knows how this team will proform until the season starts, this is a new team, with new players, a new scheme, new coaches....You no more idea than I do what we're capable of and if we suck. There is always next year, rome wasn't built in a day.
                    Well said, sir! +1
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                    I adopt andrewmlb.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Freyaka View Post
                      Well it's felt all off season like this board is all about posting the same thing 10 different times in 10 different threads and rehashing the same worthless crap that's already been rehashed 10 times. I have no problem with discussion and speculation but a change in topic every now and again would be flippin wonderful.
                      but even then, they seem to find there way back to those subjects. I've given up on thinking it will all stop. Well, it sure has been a word wind off season.:go:
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                      • #12
                        The Bronco D gave up 112 points over the final 3 games, Cutler didn't lose them. Denver did very little defensive personnel changes during FA/Draft. Perhaps McD feels that the system was the issue rather than the talent. I don't know the answer, but Orton isn't going to bail out a poor defense that requires a QB to put up 30 points in the second half. He shouldn't have to, if he does then it's going to be a long year in Denver.

                        Originally posted by jcdavey View Post
                        it is kind of ironic though

                        a bears fan asking if orton can close out games, when their current qb is the first (and only) qb in the history of the nfl to blow a 3 game division lead with 3 to go

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by psychobear View Post
                          This is a question that really hasn't been discussed all too much.

                          A good amount of discussion has been generated about his ability to come back. When his team is behind he has a QB rating of 65.3. However, what is worse is his QB rating in the 4th quarter of a close game (within 7). His QB rating was 62.2

                          The game that many point to when you ask if Kyle can come back... is the game against the Falcons where he threw a 17 yard strike in the corner of the endzone with like 18 seconds left in the game. It was a great play and all for nothing.

                          The bigger question is... if you have the lead can he close that game out? What you saw a lot with the Bears is that the Bears would go into the 4th quarter with the lead and the defense would be on the field almost the entire time. The offense would, time and time again, produce a 3 and out at the end of the games. Often, the Bears o would see the field with 4 minutes or less to go. Rarely would they pick up those first downs and just take a knee to end the game.

                          Some of that can be attributed to a conservative game plan at the end of games. Try to close out the game running with 9 guys in the box... then try to throw for that first down on 3rd and 5. The problem is... most teams will do that exact same thing. If your team sees a loss throwing 3 times with the lead late in the game the press jumps all over them for not trying to run out the clock. I believe the Broncos would try to execute this same game plan.

                          As high as some people here may be on Moreno... even the greats struggle against 9 man fronts at the end of games.

                          So the question becomes this... can Orton execute on 3rd and 5 with the lead and a few minutes left? I think he has shown that in the opposite scenario... trying to come back late in the game throwing... he can do a decent job. It's closing out that becomes the question.

                          Further... if the Broncos D is on the field for 9 minutes to close out the game... can you rely on them to hold?
                          Unlike when he was in Chicago Orton won't be subject to those conservative plays. I watch the Bears games seeing I live very close to Chicago, it's always on Sundays. Your guy's play calling was so bland and predictable it's no wonder people just stacked up the box. Run, run, miracle pass. lob, run, run etc.

                          As a matter of fact Denver has had problems with the same thing due to the fact that the offense who was very pass happy couldn't convert on third downs either. People could blame the running game but honestly that wasn't always the case.

                          Do I think we're going to see a lot of 9 men in the box? I doubt it because unlike in Chicago who has Greg Olsen and Hester we have a plethora of weapons around Orton.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by xX-Bronco-Xx View Post
                            Unlike when he was in Chicago Orton won't be subject to those conservative plays. I watch the Bears games seeing I live very close to Chicago, it's always on Sundays. Your guy's play calling was so bland and predictable it's no wonder people just stacked up the box. Run, run, miracle pass. lob, run, run etc.

                            As a matter of fact Denver has had problems with the same thing due to the fact that the offense who was very pass happy couldn't convert on third downs either. People could blame the running game but honestly that wasn't always the case.

                            Do I think we're going to see a lot of 9 men in the box? I doubt it because unlike in Chicago who has Greg Olsen and Hester we have a plethora of weapons around Orton.
                            I think 1 difference is. In Chicago, late in the game with the lead, going to 3rd down was pretty much a given. 1st and 2nd down weren't passing plays... if they were they were screens. Why? Because a lot of times Forte would actually do fairly well against those 9 man fronts. Note I said 3rd and 5... noth 3rd and 12. It's just that when he got us in good position we wouldn't capitalize (and yes the playcalling was just brutal late in the game in these situations). In Denver late in the game with the lead... you didn't see that. They couldn't run late in the games to run out the clock so why try?

                            It drove us Bears fans crazy though... here Forte does a great job gaining yards against 9 man fronts and then we can't convert 3rd and 2 or 3rd and 5... back out goes the D who had been on the field for 10 out of the last 14 minutes.
                            Understand that I am a Bears fan but also that I have followed Orton's career. His ability to improve himself makes him a very easy guy to cheer for. I am here because I will continue to cheer for Orton unless his success interferes with the success of the Bears.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by xX-Bronco-Xx View Post
                              Unlike when he was in Chicago Orton won't be subject to those conservative plays. I watch the Bears games seeing I live very close to Chicago, it's always on Sundays. Your guy's play calling was so bland and predictable it's no wonder people just stacked up the box. Run, run, miracle pass. lob, run, run etc.

                              As a matter of fact Denver has had problems with the same thing due to the fact that the offense who was very pass happy couldn't convert on third downs either. People could blame the running game but honestly that wasn't always the case.

                              Do I think we're going to see a lot of 9 men in the box? I doubt it because unlike in Chicago who has Greg Olsen and Hester we have a plethora of weapons around Orton.
                              My point exactly. Plus he has a great line that will buy him time to look at each of his targets, find the one that works and go with it.
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