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  • #31
    Originally posted by jcdavey View Post
    i don't think mcdaniels will be stupid enough to make orton throw the ball as much and as needlessly as shanny did with cutler
    I agree ........ANY qb throwing 600+ times is a sign of an unballanced team.

    Orton will supprise people, and so will this team as a whole.

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by ursamajor View Post
      Enjoy the jabs now. The Broncos actual season (reality-not this make believe, hope against hope crud) is not going to be even remotely enjoyable for Bronco fans.

      The Offense has went waaaaaaayyyy backwards-Orton is a huge downgrade. Knowshon isn't much of an upgrade. McDaniels isn't a defensive minded coach-and Nolan isn't even respectable as a D coordinator. Dawkins isnt the answer-Champ is fading big time. Tillman with a bad shoulder last season was better a corner (also causes more receivers to drop the ball, because he is one of the hardest hitting corners in the league).

      So lets see:

      Kyle is moving into a downgraded offense, with the same horrible D and ST then was in Denver last season.

      Cutler is moving into an upgraded offense, upgraded defense, and one of the best ST units in football.

      Have fun with sharing the AFC Basement with the Raiders (Chiefs really are > you) at least you guys can talk about Romo.
      How is this not trolling?

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by Pura Vida View Post
        You Orton lovers are really waaay out there. Do you ever stop and think why it is that every single nfl scout, gm and coach thinks Cutler is head and shoulders better than Orton?

        You twist stats to support your claim and actually convince yourselves of this incredible nonsense.

        But nobody who evaluates players for a living agrees with you. Nobody.

        Shouldn't that give you pause before you spout off?

        I think Orton is an average qb and if MCd isnt fired this year, he may develop as a pretty decent system qb with a year's experience under his belt.

        However to actually believe that he is better than Cutler....that's just insane.
        Really? You have access to all of the scouting reports of all of the NFL teams? You've spoken with coaching staffs and asked them to compare Orton and Cutler head-to-head?

        It must be really awesome to have that sort of access. Because I've never seen anyone more qualified than a beat writer claim that Cutler is better than Orton or vice-versa.

        You're basing your own personal claim that Cutler is better on his stats. Which look amazing (4,500 yds) simply because Jay was given about 150 more pass attempts than the norm for a starting QB. His completion percentage is about what is expected out of a decent starter. So is his yards per attempt and passer rating. Nothing elite or amazing there. Just solid, not exceptional.

        Kyle - while playing on a far worse Offense - was matching those numbers last season before he was hurt. He was among the best passers 4 of the first 7 weeks. His ankle injury was the only reason he didn't post far better numbers for the entire season.

        Kyle has not always been a good QB. But he has developed into one NOW and is at least on the same level as Jay Cutler. And he's still improving, now with Josh McD - who has a resume as a very good QB coach & OC with one of the best teams the NFL has ever seen. Meanwhile, Jay has been saddled with Ron "run-run-pass-punt" Turner and Pep "Let's-pretend-to-focus-on-the-basics-because-I-don't-really-have-a-clue" Hamilton. I wonder which of the two will show more improvement this season...

        :orton:
        Don't hate on the 8!
        "That's a crap question."
        - Kyle Orton

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by Orton_Backer81 View Post
          Has any1 thought of this, Kyle Orton put up good numbers in the “Windy City” and now he comes to the place with what is known as the “Thin Air Phenomenon”. I project Kyle orton to put up the numbers in Denver that Jay Cutler did. I also project Jay Cutler to have a complete meltdown in The Windy City. Jay Cutler is not a leader, Chicago has a third string wide receiver core and coach Smith has done the least in the NFL with the most talent. Kyle Orton is a LEADER first and foremost - the FIELD GENERAL that will lead the troops to victory! Jay Cutler is a spoiled, ivy league pre maddonna! Which would you rather have?!? I want the leader everytime
          I just threw up in my mouth. We traded a probowl QB for a complete turd.
          sigpic
          RomperRoom McD was an abortion of a hire - Ahead of the curve since 1/12/09

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by neckbeard View Post
            Really? You have access to all of the scouting reports of all of the NFL teams? You've spoken with coaching staffs and asked them to compare Orton and Cutler head-to-head?

            It must be really awesome to have that sort of access. Because I've never seen anyone more qualified than a beat writer claim that Cutler is better than Orton or vice-versa.

            You're basing your own personal claim that Cutler is better on his stats. Which look amazing (4,500 yds) simply because Jay was given about 150 more pass attempts than the norm for a starting QB. His completion percentage is about what is expected out of a decent starter. So is his yards per attempt and passer rating. Nothing elite or amazing there. Just solid, not exceptional.

            Kyle - while playing on a far worse Offense - was matching those numbers last season before he was hurt. He was among the best passers 4 of the first 7 weeks. His ankle injury was the only reason he didn't post far better numbers for the entire season.

            Kyle has not always been a good QB. But he has developed into one NOW and is at least on the same level as Jay Cutler. And he's still improving, now with Josh McD - who has a resume as a very good QB coach & OC with one of the best teams the NFL has ever seen. Meanwhile, Jay has been saddled with Ron "run-run-pass-punt" Turner and Pep "Let's-pretend-to-focus-on-the-basics-because-I-don't-really-have-a-clue" Hamilton. I wonder which of the two will show more improvement this season...

            :orton:
            Don't hate on the 8!
            This is one of the posts that really reveals no matter how insane a stance is some people will never abandon it, ever.
            The Broncos think Cutler is the better QB by expecting 2 #1's as well as Orton for compensation, the Bears think Cutler is better by paying that price. The Redskins, Jets, Bucs, Vikings, and Lions all believed that Cutler was worth that price, but none of them were banging down the Bears door for their 25 yr old QB. You make me lose a little more faith in humanity when you make posts like yours.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by neckbeard View Post
              Really? You have access to all of the scouting reports of all of the NFL teams? You've spoken with coaching staffs and asked them to compare Orton and Cutler head-to-head?

              It must be really awesome to have that sort of access. Because I've never seen anyone more qualified than a beat writer claim that Cutler is better than Orton or vice-versa.
              :orton:
              Don't hate on the 8!
              are you that thick? Multiple teams lined up to give two 1st rounders to denver for cutler. Nobody would give more than a 4th for orton.

              Even Mcd wouldnt say orton is better than Culter.

              You need professional help.
              sigpic


              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by username1 View Post
                This is one of the posts that really reveals no matter how insane a stance is some people will never abandon it, ever.
                The Broncos think Cutler is the better QB by expecting 2 #1's as well as Orton for compensation, the Bears think Cutler is better by paying that price. The Redskins, Jets, Bucs, Vikings, and Lions all believed that Cutler was worth that price, but none of them were banging down the Bears door for their 25 yr old QB. You make me lose a little more faith in humanity when you make posts like yours.
                The Vikings DROPPED OUT OF THE BIDDING once they researched Jay a bit. Even though a decent QB is virtually the only missing piece in their otherwise very complete team. That's why they're prostituting themselves for the chance to get Brett Favre. But they certainly didn't want Jay.

                That left Chicago, Detroit, Tampa, and Washington as interested in Jay. 4 desperate teams out of 32. That's not exactly showing a universal agreement that Jay is an elite QB.

                To claim that other teams weren't breaking down the down to get Orton is asinine at best. THE BEARS DIDN'T "SHOP" ORTON. Both Lovie and Ron Turner repeatedly stated that Kyle was to be the starter next season. Other teams didn't even see Kyle as available, so why would they publicly display interest in acquiring him? I mean, there weren't teams talking about trading for Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Drew Brees, or Philip Rivers either. Does it logically follow that they must all suck?
                "That's a crap question."
                - Kyle Orton

                Comment


                • #38
                  Well according to McD teams were calling inquiring about Jay, whom at that time supposedly was not available. Why would they call if they didn't want him?
                  Were teams calling about Orton? Haven't heard that.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by neckbeard View Post
                    The Vikings DROPPED OUT OF THE BIDDING once they researched Jay a bit. Even though a decent QB is virtually the only missing piece in their otherwise very complete team. That's why they're prostituting themselves for the chance to get Brett Favre. But they certainly didn't want Jay.

                    That left Chicago, Detroit, Tampa, and Washington as interested in Jay. 4 desperate teams out of 32. That's not exactly showing a universal agreement that Jay is an elite QB.

                    To claim that other teams weren't breaking down the down to get Orton is asinine at best. THE BEARS DIDN'T "SHOP" ORTON. Both Lovie and Ron Turner repeatedly stated that Kyle was to be the starter next season. Other teams didn't even see Kyle as available, so why would they publicly display interest in acquiring him? I mean, there weren't teams talking about trading for Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Drew Brees, or Philip Rivers either. Does it logically follow that they must all suck?
                    More faith in humanity has been lost... I am debating whether continuing this conversation is worth my time, or if it will just bring me down to your level. What the hey, I'll go for it at least this time.
                    You really just compared Orton to Manning, Brees, Brady, and Rivers? Don't you see any flaws with this line of thinking? Angelo publicly came out and stated that he expected more from Orton, and that his job wasn't necessarily safe. How does this compare to any of the previous mentioned QB's compare to that?

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      And the assertion that the Vikes would drop out of the running for Cutler due to dislike for his style of play or personality and then go after Favre is absolutely ridiculous! To make that comparison reveals some real gaps in your logical thought processes. If I have to spell it out for you, the Vikes dropped after giving up the majority of their draft the previous season for Jared Allen, and they didn't think giving up three straight first rounders was a good idea. That on top of the fourth rounder they had already given up for Rosenfels would have left them 1 second round pick in the first four rounds, which they probably would have had to throw in because they didn't have a QB McD wanted in exchange.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by neckbeard View Post
                        The Vikings DROPPED OUT OF THE BIDDING once they researched Jay a bit. Even though a decent QB is virtually the only missing piece in their otherwise very complete team. That's why they're prostituting themselves for the chance to get Brett Favre. But they certainly didn't want Jay.

                        That left Chicago, Detroit, Tampa, and Washington as interested in Jay. 4 desperate teams out of 32. That's not exactly showing a universal agreement that Jay is an elite QB.

                        To claim that other teams weren't breaking down the down to get Orton is asinine at best. THE BEARS DIDN'T "SHOP" ORTON. Both Lovie and Ron Turner repeatedly stated that Kyle was to be the starter next season. Other teams didn't even see Kyle as available, so why would they publicly display interest in acquiring him? I mean, there weren't teams talking about trading for Peyton Manning, Tom Brady, Drew Brees, or Philip Rivers either. Does it logically follow that they must all suck?
                        C'mon! There were A LOT of teams interested in Cutler. Not everyone could afford the price tag. The Bronco's got a lot because Cutler is worth a lot. The Vikings didn't drop out because "they researched him". I guarantee you the Vikings would have loved to get Cutler, but it obviously wasn't possible. Though I'm sure this great research that turned them off Cutler must have gone out the window when drafting Percy Harvin, or trying to sign Favre.

                        You realize last offseason that Orton could have been a free agent this year. Instead last offseason, with 2008 being his contract year, he added a 1 year extension for almost nothing. Why would he do this if teams wanted him? Wouldn't he be licking his chops to get out on the open market and get set for life? Of course he would, but what would teams really offer for Orton? You act like he was on the Bears untouchable list.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Da Swerski View Post

                          You realize last offseason that Orton could have been a free agent this year. Instead last offseason, with 2008 being his contract year, he added a 1 year extension for almost nothing. Why would he do this if teams wanted him? Wouldn't he be licking his chops to get out on the open market and get set for life? Of course he would, but what would teams really offer for Orton? You act like he was on the Bears untouchable list.
                          AMEN. Not too mention 90% of bears fans HATED him....Hated him.

                          I can't wait until this is all over.
                          sigpic
                          RomperRoom McD was an abortion of a hire - Ahead of the curve since 1/12/09

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by neckbeard View Post
                            Really? You have access to all of the scouting reports of all of the NFL teams? You've spoken with coaching staffs and asked them to compare Orton and Cutler head-to-head?
                            You couldn't find a single defensive coordinator who would tell you Orton is Cutler's equal.

                            Originally posted by neckbeard View Post
                            It must be really awesome to have that sort of access. Because I've never seen anyone more qualified than a beat writer claim that Cutler is better than Orton or vice-versa.
                            When analyst/coaches/players talk about the NFL. I think certain things are assumed. That you know what a 1st down is, you know what scoring a touchdown means, and that Jay Cutler is a better quarterback then Kyle Orton. It's not talked about a lot because it's not a debate at this point. If Kyle raises his performance to a Pro Bow level. Then we'll talk.

                            Originally posted by neckbeard View Post
                            Kyle - while playing on a far worse Offense - was matching those numbers last season before he was hurt. He was among the best passers 4 of the first 7 weeks. His ankle injury was the only reason he didn't post far better numbers for the entire season.
                            At one point of his career Rex Grossman looked like the 2006 MVP for two months. You can't take a sample size of 7 games and go "He's great". Because Orton has had all of his 33 starts in the NFL to prove that.

                            Originally posted by neckbeard View Post
                            Kyle has not always been a good QB. But he has developed into one NOW and is at least on the same level as Jay Cutler.
                            Do you understand what level Cutler is on? If you were to ask a GM to start a franchise next week, and they have can have any QB in the NFL they want. They're all going to pick between Ryan, Rivers, Cutler, and Rodgers.

                            Originally posted by neckbeard View Post
                            Meanwhile, Jay has been saddled with Ron "run-run-pass-punt" Turner and Pep "Let's-pretend-to-focus-on-the-basics-because-I-don't-really-have-a-clue" Hamilton. I wonder which of the two will show more improvement this season...
                            They obviously are doing something. They groomed Kyle Orton and helped him put together those great games against the Lions x2 and Falcons.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              LOL... Again with this stuff?

                              Not that I care, I will jump into the debate.

                              I can't believe people are actually convincing themselves that Orton is better than Cutler. That is really funny to me. I laugh a lot when reading these threads. Noone in the world that gets to break down game film believes this. Who exactly becomes a bandwagon fan because Orton left their team anyways? I think that speaks a lot about what kind of "fan" you guys are. You are just as much of bandwagon fans as those that went to Chicago because of Cutler. Your arguments reflect as much.

                              Cutler outperformed Orton no matter how much you try twisting the stats. This is while CUtler was expected to do it all and Orton had a team to help him. Before you come crying that Chicago had such a horrible defense, I will tell you how to figure this out. Look at the QB ratings during wins and losses. Orton has a TON of wins when he had HORRIBLE performances. Cutler doesn't have a single win that he played bad. If he had a bad game, or even an average game, this team lost. Facts are facts. Orton had it easy compared to Cutler(as in pressure to make stuff happen) and still was outperformed.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by jakeisthefuture View Post
                                AMEN. Not too mention 90% of bears fans HATED him....Hated him.

                                I can't wait until this is all over.
                                As a Bears fan, this is simply not true at all.
                                To A Certain Former Bronco's QB...
                                I've realized something.

                                The last thing the Bears need is a petulant primadonna who turns his back on the team who drafts him in order to play for someone else. We don't need a selfish jerk who would stoop to maneuvering his way from one team to play for another. Screw John Elway.

                                Oh, wait...

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