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EVEN McDaniels realized Moreno was a bust

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  • samparnell
    replied
    Okay, ...

    Originally posted by Mel B. View Post
    Well someone more technically sound can explain it better but I'm talking about the running system/scheme we ran for 14 successful years under Shanahan.

    Even during Shanny's last pass happy year and with all the injuries at RB we still ran the ball well with whomever we put back there when we did run it.

    Running the ball was never a Broncos problem until JMcD arrived...he's the bust not Moreno!
    ... here is what I'm driving at. Zone is a type of block where the line takes a zone (lateral) step in unison, locks up on one defender and starts moving them in that direction.

    Zone is one of many kinds of blocks O-Linemen learn from HS on up. They include: base, base away, drive, down, double, double down, double chip, reach, scoop, pull to trap, pull to escort, pull to lead, pull to seal, pull to kickout and pass pro.

    What Shanahan ran was zone stretch cutback with boot as PAP. After Alex Gibbs went to the Falcons, they once shut that whole zone series down when they visited Mile High. I'm sure Gibbs told them to just put a defender like a Backer or a Safety in the cutback lane, and if it was boot to put pressure on the QB.

    So, when I hear "zone blocking system" and someone tells me Shanahan, all I can remember is that series.

    Recently John Fox said the Broncos will have the most sophisticated running attack in the NFL. I'd be real curious to find out what that is.
    Last edited by samparnell; 07-20-2011, 03:42 PM.

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  • MaloCS
    replied
    Originally posted by Mel B. View Post
    Running the ball was never a Broncos problem until JMcD arrived...he's the bust not Moreno!
    You have a point. McD's lack of insight and stubbornness ultimately put the OL in a position to fail instead of succeed.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mel B.
    replied
    Originally posted by samparnell View Post
    ... I noticed some serious flaws in the pass blocking schemes and some in run blocking, too.

    I think McDaniels' dictatorial approach and abuse toward his assistants made any collegial approach to fixing problems impossible.

    By the way, I have harped on term definition in this thread. Anyone care to define what they mean by "zone blocking system"?
    Well someone more technically sound can explain it better but I'm talking about the running system/scheme we ran for 14 successful years under Shanahan.

    Even during Shanny's last pass happy year and with all the injuries at RB we still ran the ball well with whomever we put back there when we did run it.

    Running the ball was never a Broncos problem until JMcD arrived...he's the bust not Moreno!

    Leave a comment:


  • LightningRodBob
    replied
    Originally posted by Papa-pwn View Post
    Olsen? Eric olsen didn't play at all last year as a rookie I'm pretty sure.
    I think he probably meant to say Walton

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  • nickmeyer
    replied
    Originally posted by BlueOrange7 View Post
    Worst OLine, woh woh woh woh

    I think our line is one of our strong points as a team and one of best building blocks we have as a organization
    Worst Oline no worst coached Oline last year yes

    Leave a comment:


  • Papa-pwn
    replied
    Originally posted by BlueOrange7 View Post
    We are also talking about the top 7 Rbs or so right there in the entire NFL. We understand we are now comparing someone who Many claim a bust, to the top 7 out of 32....

    Thats fair?


    Worst OLine, woh woh woh woh

    I think our line is one of our strong points as a team and one of best building blocks we have as a organization

    Clady is solid of course, I hope we sign him back when the time comes or else we are complete idiots

    Beadles showed last season he has great potential and got better each game

    Olsen played fantastic last year as a rookie and proved he could be a pro bowler in the years to come

    Kuper is a little over paid but is a pretty decent lineman

    Harris is a solid player as well who is looking to get paid, whic is why i think we picked up franklin who I think is going to come in and do well

    don't diss our line man
    Olsen? Eric olsen didn't play at all last year as a rookie I'm pretty sure.

    Leave a comment:


  • BlueOrange7
    replied
    Originally posted by underrated29 View Post
    And are the other guys on the 2nd worst team in the league, with the worst OL, worst rush attack, worst rush attempts and formerly the worst coach/playcaller?


    yes, I see that he had more carries, I also see that he had WAAAAYYYYYY more TDs......Those guys can have the yards at the end of the game. I want the points, you know, the things that actually win the game. I could care less if knowshon ran for 15-20 more yards a game- (thats about what it would equal out to)
    We are also talking about the top 7 Rbs or so right there in the entire NFL. We understand we are now comparing someone who Many claim a bust, to the top 7 out of 32....

    Thats fair?


    Worst OLine, woh woh woh woh

    I think our line is one of our strong points as a team and one of best building blocks we have as a organization

    Clady is solid of course, I hope we sign him back when the time comes or else we are complete idiots

    Beadles showed last season he has great potential and got better each game

    Olsen played fantastic last year as a rookie and proved he could be a pro bowler in the years to come

    Kuper is a little over paid but is a pretty decent lineman

    Harris is a solid player as well who is looking to get paid, whic is why i think we picked up franklin who I think is going to come in and do well

    don't diss our line man

    Leave a comment:


  • samparnell
    replied
    During the 2010 Season ...

    Originally posted by Mel B. View Post
    Josh McDaniel's was the biggest bust to ever get signed by the Denver Broncos!


    Hell every top RB in this league would've been a 'bust' in the McDBS (McDaniel's Blocking Scheme/System).

    The only time our running game looked decent was when they would run the ZBS then of course McD would stop using it...because it worked.

    I think Moreno will do just fine now that we're back in the ZBS.
    ... I noticed some serious flaws in the pass blocking schemes and some in run blocking, too.

    I think McDaniels' dictatorial approach and abuse toward his assistants made any collegial approach to fixing problems impossible.

    By the way, I have harped on term definition in this thread. Anyone care to define what they mean by "zone blocking system"?

    Leave a comment:


  • SoundsOfSuccess
    replied
    Originally posted by Morningplastic View Post
    Anyone drafted in the first two rounds that we don`t like.
    Or more specifically, Josh McDaniels draftees...

    Leave a comment:


  • Morningplastic
    replied
    Originally posted by samparnell View Post
    Do we have a hard and fast definition of "bust" yet besides sculpture or a bosom?
    Anyone drafted in the first two rounds that we don`t like.

    Leave a comment:


  • underrated29
    replied
    Originally posted by samparnell View Post
    Do we have a hard and fast definition of "bust" yet besides sculpture or a bosom?
    .....

    Negatory.

    Leave a comment:


  • Mel B.
    replied
    Josh McDaniel's was the biggest bust to ever get signed by the Denver Broncos!


    Hell every top RB in this league would've been a 'bust' in the McDBS (McDaniel's Blocking Scheme/System).

    The only time our running game looked decent was when they would run the ZBS then of course McD would stop using it...because it worked.

    I think Moreno will do just fine now that we're back in the ZBS.

    Leave a comment:


  • samparnell
    replied
    Originally posted by underrated29 View Post
    1- he is caught from behind because he never gets to break through a hole a max speed. Go back at all the games and look. The times that he does, no one catches him....Ex- cheifs game, 4th down runs for 25+ for a td...Seattle game- runs for 30 yards tackled by S. Chargers game, 20+ run tackled by S weddle. But no, he is not overly fast, quick acceleration but no 5th gear.

    2. Why he trips over his own feet I have no clue. I hate that part!! No denying it. the other part- he eludes defenders exceptionally well. Giants game, pats game- two prime examples.

    3. Knowshon in his rookie year was the LEADER in Yards after Contact. The LEADER- with something like 683 or so. He breaks tackles just fine- Its just common because the haters like to say it but its actually not true at all!!!

    4. yeah i do and have and have the games. Tell us, what are some examples of holes that he has missed. Now obviously not every RB is going to hit every hole like he should, but for the most part, I can not think of daylight we opened for him, and the times we did i seem to remember him getting through and doing well. Evidence to support this claim please- like specific plays and what not so we can go back and look.



    Moreno is good at everything, but a master of none. Not elite speed, Not elite strength, Not elite scat back moves....But he is above average in all those areas.

    If he wasnt, then why did every other runner on this team suck compared to him?
    Do we have a hard and fast definition of "bust" yet besides sculpture or a bosom?

    Leave a comment:


  • underrated29
    replied
    Originally posted by Syvari View Post
    Yes Moreno did not have alot going for him because all the factors like having bad oline etc. However look at the few times he did make it into the open field. This is where a rb should excel because the nature of his position.

    He isn't fast. He is constantly getting caught from behind

    He isn't quick enough to elude defenders. He trips over his own two feet. (who does that)

    He isn't tough enough to break tackles. Moreno is constantly arm tackled!

    Moreno has poor vision. Watch tape. The the guy runs into a crowd of defenders instead of running for daylight.

    Can you answer me this one question? Okay. What is Moreno good at?
    1- he is caught from behind because he never gets to break through a hole a max speed. Go back at all the games and look. The times that he does, no one catches him....Ex- cheifs game, 4th down runs for 25+ for a td...Seattle game- runs for 30 yards tackled by S. Chargers game, 20+ run tackled by S weddle. But no, he is not overly fast, quick acceleration but no 5th gear.

    2. Why he trips over his own feet I have no clue. I hate that part!! No denying it. the other part- he eludes defenders exceptionally well. Giants game, pats game- two prime examples.

    3. Knowshon in his rookie year was the LEADER in Yards after Contact. The LEADER- with something like 683 or so. He breaks tackles just fine- Its just common because the haters like to say it but its actually not true at all!!!

    4. yeah i do and have and have the games. Tell us, what are some examples of holes that he has missed. Now obviously not every RB is going to hit every hole like he should, but for the most part, I can not think of daylight we opened for him, and the times we did i seem to remember him getting through and doing well. Evidence to support this claim please- like specific plays and what not so we can go back and look.



    Moreno is good at everything, but a master of none. Not elite speed, Not elite strength, Not elite scat back moves....But he is above average in all those areas.

    If he wasnt, then why did every other runner on this team suck compared to him?

    Leave a comment:


  • nickmeyer
    replied
    Originally posted by Syvari View Post
    I wouldnt exactly call his break tackle ability a strength. Like I said he often gets arm tackled. Rb should run through those

    Guys give draft grades make mistakes. J. Russel was given a first rnd grade and look how that turned out. He isn't even in the league anymore! Guys underachieve.
    Those arm tackles you are talking about are after he has already been touched 3 or 4 times because of the craptastic blocking.

    Leave a comment:

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