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  • #16
    Did nobody watch the first half of the season?????? Our dline stopped the run, we snuffed the jets the jaguars the titans we stopped them, the reason why we couldn't stop teams late is 1. We couldn't stay on the field on 3rd down, we couldn't sustain long drives to rest our defense and 2. We couldn't get pressure on third down, now both of these problems have probably been solved with the return of doom and the drafting of miller(plus I think we are gonna bring in Charles Johnson to add some more pressure) our dline was holding up they just couldn't get a break and we've brought back the ZBS and the drafting of Franklin and the possible signing of other dominate run blocking lineman like clabo will allow this offense to stay on the field longer
    A healthy Kenneth Dixon is a top 5 NFL RB.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by crash123go View Post
      Did nobody watch the first half of the season?????? Our dline stopped the run, we snuffed the jets the jaguars the titans we stopped them, the reason why we couldn't stop teams late is 1. We couldn't stay on the field on 3rd down, we couldn't sustain long drives to rest our defense and 2. We couldn't get pressure on third down, now both of these problems have probably been solved with the return of doom and the drafting of miller(plus I think we are gonna bring in Charles Johnson to add some more pressure) our dline was holding up they just couldn't get a break and we've brought back the ZBS and the drafting of Franklin and the possible signing of other dominate run blocking lineman like clabo will allow this offense to stay on the field longer
      We lost the Jets game, because LT ran through us at the end of the game like a knife through hot butter.
      What's the difference between ignorance and apathy?
      I don't know and I don't care

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      • #18
        To be fair, I think Bannan and J-Wall would be much better with one gap responsibility.

        I really don't see a problem with having a rotation of Vickerson, J-Wall at at the DT position...and rotating Bannan and Thomas (if we resign him) at UT.

        That being said, even if we resigned all three of these guys, there would probably still be room to sign another good DT, a decent RB to backup Moreno and split time with Buck/White (depending on health and overall performance), and a FB.

        Thoughts? Does nobody else see the difference in these guys role in a 3-4 role with no pass rush, and a 4-3 where Fox's DT's have never played a huge role anyway?

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        • #19
          I'd have absolutely no problem bringing Bannan back. His salary was way to high for what he would be doing.

          We need some DT's on a 4 man line, they both might be better suited to that role than on a 3 man line.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by the0rangecrush View Post
            We lost the Jets game, because LT ran through us at the end of the game like a knife through hot butter.
            1 run.... and we lost the game because of a BS pass interference call
            A healthy Kenneth Dixon is a top 5 NFL RB.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by crash123go View Post
              Did nobody watch the first half of the season?????? Our dline stopped the run, we snuffed the jets the jaguars the titans we stopped them, the reason why we couldn't stop teams late is 1. We couldn't stay on the field on 3rd down, we couldn't sustain long drives to rest our defense and 2. We couldn't get pressure on third down, now both of these problems have probably been solved with the return of doom and the drafting of miller(plus I think we are gonna bring in Charles Johnson to add some more pressure) our dline was holding up they just couldn't get a break and we've brought back the ZBS and the drafting of Franklin and the possible signing of other dominate run blocking lineman like clabo will allow this offense to stay on the field longer
              Jags: 134 yards rushing
              Hawks: 106 yards rushing
              Colts: 40 yards rushing
              Titans: 121 yards rushing (numbers lie here though, we were good against the run)
              Ravens: 233 yards rushing (lololol)
              Jets: 130 yards rushing
              Raiders: 328 yards rushing (LOLOLOLOL)
              49ers: 144 yards rushing
              Chiefs: 51 yards rushing
              Chargers: 147 yards rushing
              Rams: 124 yards rushing (we were pretty good this game)
              Chiefs: 185 yards rushing
              Cardinals: 211 yards rushing (lololol)
              Raiders: 264 yards rushing (lololol)
              Texans: 91 yards rushing
              Chargers: 164 yards rushing

              We were just straight up bad allllll season long, first half, middle half, second half, third eighth, seventh nineteenth, we just sucked.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by Hoserman117 View Post
                Jags: 134 yards rushing
                Hawks: 106 yards rushing
                Colts: 40 yards rushing
                Titans: 121 yards rushing (numbers lie here though, we were good against the run)
                Ravens: 233 yards rushing (lololol)
                Jets: 130 yards rushing
                Raiders: 328 yards rushing (LOLOLOLOL)
                49ers: 144 yards rushing
                Chiefs: 51 yards rushing
                Chargers: 147 yards rushing
                Rams: 124 yards rushing (we were pretty good this game)
                Chiefs: 185 yards rushing
                Cardinals: 211 yards rushing (lololol)
                Raiders: 264 yards rushing (lololol)
                Texans: 91 yards rushing
                Chargers: 164 yards rushing

                We were just straight up bad allllll season long, first half, middle half, second half, third eighth, seventh nineteenth, we just sucked.
                Go back and watch those games I have them on tape and I've seen them a bunch early on our defense would play good just no pressure, couldn't get ANY pressure to get the offense off the field. Too many times I saw 3rd and 6 or 3rd and 8 and the QB gets 10 seconds and they complete it for a first down, why do you think fox took a pass rushers over the Dtackle???? We could stop teams we just couldn't rush the passer
                A healthy Kenneth Dixon is a top 5 NFL RB.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by crash123go View Post
                  1 run.... and we lost the game because of a BS pass interference call
                  It was 4th down and it was to big runs back to back, that kept them in the game
                  What's the difference between ignorance and apathy?
                  I don't know and I don't care

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by crash123go View Post
                    Go back and watch those games I have them on tape and I've seen them a bunch early on our defense would play good just no pressure, couldn't get ANY pressure to get the offense off the field. Too many times I saw 3rd and 6 or 3rd and 8 and the QB gets 10 seconds and they complete it for a first down, why do you think fox took a pass rushers over the Dtackle???? We could stop teams we just couldn't rush the passer
                    I've re-watched our first 6 games so far, and yeah, we couldn't rush the passer to save our own life, but we also couldn't stop the run. It's not like they were getting 3.0 YPC and just kept pounding it, we just couldn't stop them.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by andrewmlb View Post
                      From how this offseason has gone, it's obvious that the DT is not a position of need in EFX's mind. We might add depth, but it doesn't sound like they will pursue the big-named DT's. But before we crucify them for not doing what we want or what we think we need, let's see what happens.

                      Maybe we trade Orton for a stout DT, or maybe we dont sign anyone big-named. But lets see what they do on the field before we cast judgement. Mike Nolan did a heck of a job with mediocre players, lets see what the current regime can do.
                      I'm not going to wait because EVERY single 4-3 defense in the NFL that is any good has GOOD young DTs!

                      All the decision to re-sign Bannan and Thomas and Williams means is that the Broncos are entering the 2011 season with the same piece of CRAP set of DTs who stunk up the joint last season!

                      THAT is why fans and writers and sports commentators have been critical of the Broncos for passing on a DT in the draft when they had multiple chances to get a great one.

                      And it IS going to bite them in the ass. And NO. The "we can't do everything in one off-season" line doesn't cut it.

                      When you have the #2 draft pick you start with the HARDEST position to fill -- and that's DT and NOT strong-side LB (which they announced in the Post today that Miller will play -- no surprise there).

                      Wait till the season starts and you see teams running wild on the Broncos!

                      THEN maybe all the homers will be singing a different tune! ("Gee. Maybe they should have drafted a DT so he could start learning THIS season instead of waiting until next year which means it will be 2013 before he's any good!")
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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by BlueOrange7 View Post
                        his contract was 5yr 22mill
                        what they prolly would want to re-work with him is the TOTAL amount paid over the duration of the contract, what sounds cheaper to you paying 22mill or paying the guarenteed 5 mill after the signing bonus, keep up? If a new contract is handed out you can expect his signing bonus/guarenteed money to be lower and his contract length to be a 3 yr amount worth 8-12 mill

                        so again what sounds cheaper 22 mill or all together about 15 mill?

                        keep up
                        The contracts figures you talk about here are about the same either way. $6.2M if his $22M was a signing bonus which has already been paid and $7M total was paid bringing it down to 4 years for $15M or 3.75/season. 3 years at $12M is $4M/year. That's what he was on the books for already. Even at $8M for 3 years that's $2.7M/year. He was only due $3.5M plus a $500K bonus this season so at your predicted figures they cut him to save $1.3M and now want to resign him? Does that really make sense to you? Risk losing a player they want over $$1.3M? They are taking a $5M cap hit on him anyway already.

                        If they are going to save much money on him they will have to sign him for about the league minimum which is $1M/season. Maybe I am misinterpreting what you mean by a 3 year $12M contract. Do you mean an additional 3 years or 3 years total? If it's 3 years total then $7M of the $8-12M has already been paid and he would only be owed another $1-5M for the next 2 years. That would make some sense to me but he has already turned down an offer to rework his contract for lower pay.

                        Here is Bannan's previous contract details:

                        The dollars are in on Bannan’s five-year deal. It’s worth $22 million, $11 million of which is guaranteed. Bannan received an eye-popping $6.245 million signing bonus and $755,000 salary in 2010 for an even $7 million. He then has a $3.5 million salary and $500,000 roster bonus guaranteed against injury in 2011. Bannan is also scheduled to make $4 million in salary and bonus in 2012; $3.5 million in 2013 and $3.5 million in 2014.

                        According to this he has $11M guaranteed, $7M of which was already paid which means another $4M is guaranteed. This is the part that makes me say it didn't make sense. If they have to pay him $4M this season whether he plays or not, then why cut him and try to resign him? They would have to pay that $4M + his new salary, which at your estimation is about $3M/season bringing his 20011 salary up to $7M. Do you see why this makes no sense from that perspective?

                        However, according to this article it says his 2011 salary and bonus is guaranteed against injury, not guaranteed overall. I am not sure if the injury guarantee is for the roster bonus or the salary overall. If it's just the roster bonus than his $3.5M is due to him no matter where he plays and any money he makes, even if it is with the Broncos again, will be on top of that $3.5M. If both the roster bounus and his salary are guaranteed against injury and guaranteed overall then the cutting makes much more sense but there is still the $5M cap hit to consider due to the signing bonus. I am really unsure of what the exact details of his original contract are but they won't sign him for league minimum, I think $2M/season would his minimum and maybe not even that low.
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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Hoserman117 View Post
                          Jags: 134 yards rushing
                          Hawks: 106 yards rushing
                          Colts: 40 yards rushing
                          Titans: 121 yards rushing (numbers lie here though, we were good against the run)
                          Ravens: 233 yards rushing (lololol)
                          Jets: 130 yards rushing
                          Raiders: 328 yards rushing (LOLOLOLOL)
                          49ers: 144 yards rushing
                          Chiefs: 51 yards rushing
                          Chargers: 147 yards rushing
                          Rams: 124 yards rushing (we were pretty good this game)
                          Chiefs: 185 yards rushing
                          Cardinals: 211 yards rushing (lololol)
                          Raiders: 264 yards rushing (lololol)
                          Texans: 91 yards rushing
                          Chargers: 164 yards rushing

                          We were just straight up bad allllll season long, first half, middle half, second half, third eighth, seventh nineteenth, we just sucked.
                          I don't know what the argument is. The Broncos were DEAD LAST in the NFL in giving up rushing TDs in 2011. 32nd.

                          That's pretty much all you need to know about the run defense. To change that you need GOOD DTs, and right now they don't have any.

                          I AM more hopeful that they might actually be forced to sign some decent free-agents because I don't see Bannan coming back. He wants to return to Baltimore and is angry at the Broncos. Thomas already rejected the Broncos contract offer and wants to "test the FA waters." He's young enough that he'll get some other offers, so he's probably gone.

                          And Jamal Williams is 100 and washed up. He is to 2011 what Sam Adams was his last year here. A player who's played 1 or 2 years longer in the league than they should and may well be cut during the season. If not, this will be his last year. He'll be cut after the season and probably nobody will want him and he'll retire.
                          sigpic

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by jonathanrivers View Post
                            To be fair, I think Bannan and J-Wall would be much better with one gap responsibility.

                            I really don't see a problem with having a rotation of Vickerson, J-Wall at at the DT position...and rotating Bannan and Thomas (if we resign him) at UT.
                            Switch Bannan and Vickerson. Vickerson has lost a lot of weight in an effort to play the 3-tech. Bannan and Williams are better suited for NT.

                            If we miss out on Mebane and Cofield I really hope we can get either Ray McDonald or Alan Branch. Brining back Bannan, Thomas, and Williams won't be enough.

                            My realistic scenario would be something like this.

                            Re-Sign:
                            Marcus Thomas
                            Justin Bannan

                            Sign:
                            Ray McDonald
                            Derek Landri
                            Ian Williams (UDFA)

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Cugel View Post
                              I'm not going to wait because EVERY single 4-3 defense in the NFL that is any good has GOOD young DTs!

                              All the decision to re-sign Bannan and Thomas and Williams means is that the Broncos are entering the 2011 season with the same piece of CRAP set of DTs who stunk up the joint last season!

                              THAT is why fans and writers and sports commentators have been critical of the Broncos for passing on a DT in the draft when they had multiple chances to get a great one.

                              And it IS going to bite them in the ass. And NO. The "we can't do everything in one off-season" line doesn't cut it.

                              When you have the #2 draft pick you start with the HARDEST position to fill -- and that's DT and NOT strong-side LB (which they announced in the Post today that Miller will play -- no surprise there).

                              Wait till the season starts and you see teams running wild on the Broncos!

                              THEN maybe all the homers will be singing a different tune! ("Gee. Maybe they should have drafted a DT so he could start learning THIS season instead of waiting until next year which means it will be 2013 before he's any good!")
                              In time, the only way the Miller pick will be justified is if he turns out to be great against the run and averages 8 sacks/season and Fairley/Dareus bust or are just average. If Buffalo sticks in a 3-4 it will be hard to judge Dareus and how effective he might have been in a 4-3. I agree that DT trumps SOLB every time but if Miller produces like Derrick Thomas it will all be worth it though. That's a big IF though.
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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by broncos SB2010 View Post


                                According to this he has $11M guaranteed, $7M of which was already paid which means another $4M is guaranteed. This is the part that makes me say it didn't make sense.
                                The 4MM was guaranteed against injury, it was not guaranteed salary for 2011.
                                Ravens GM 2016 - Ravens are looking to trade down 4-8 spots

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