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The Beauty of the Scrambling QB

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  • The Beauty of the Scrambling QB

    I feel the need to remind, if not educate, Broncos fans on the gift of the scrambling QB. Are some of you too young to remember Elway? He was known for his scrambling, so much so that opposing teams admitted he was giving their defenders fits. They had a hell of a time adjusting to him. They would appoint a "spy" (ie a linebacker) who was assigned to keep an eye on Elway's activities and try to curtail them.

    Times have not "changed," an elusive, scrambling QB is a blessing to possess. There is no expiration on the value of someone that defenses have difficulty containing, someone that can escape the rush and turn collapsed pockets and broken plays into gains or touchdowns.

    If you think a "pure pocket passer" is so damned important, please, keep your Kyle Orton. The rest of us will take the gift of Tim Tebow whose elusiveness reminds so many of us of the great John Elway.

    It's no accident that the best QB in Broncos history was a scrambler. It's part of what made Elway so great.

    Remember?



    See the contrast with Tebow?

    Last edited by nyuk nyuk; 10-10-2011, 12:59 PM.

  • #2
    Growing up in Kansas City as a Chiefs fan I remember all too well what Elway could do and did to the Chiefs!!

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    • #3
      Agreed. Elway was even recently quoted saying that it's getting harder and harder to play the position without mobility.
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      @BlueNOrangeFTW

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      • #4
        Elway had a great many other gifts as well as his ability to scramble.

        Scrambling in and of itself is not enough. Just ask Vince Young, Randall Cunnigham, Steve Young, Warren Moon or Michael Vick - or even Elway himself.

        It's a nice bonus. It's not as big of a factor as other things however. Strong line, strong arm, command of the playbook, knowledge of defenses, ability to read defenses, a good running game so that the defense can't key in...

        It's a nice perk if your quarterback has good wheels. It's nice in the same way a car works with good wheels. But it better have an engine and a few other parts too, or else the wheels don't matter.

        That said, I'm excited to see where Tebow's at in a full game. He's had over a year in the NFL now and he's played off and on quite a bit. He started three full games (plus a couple in preseason) and he finished half of the last one.

        It'll be interesting to see how he's grown.

        And yeah, I do like watching him run; not because it's productive or because I like seeing our quarterback run - quite the opposite. It's pretty exciting to watch though, and he can definitely run.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by BluenOrnge4Life View Post
          Agreed. Elway was even recently quoted saying that it's getting harder and harder to play the position without mobility.
          Strictly pocket QBs are shark bait, as we've seen with Orton. Yes, you need the pocket ability and the accurate passing... BUT, mobility in a pocket collapse and the elusiveness to shake defenders... Those things are priceless and they bump up the game another notch and make it tougher on the defenders.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by nyuk nyuk View Post
            Strictly pocket QBs are shark bait, as we've seen with Orton. Yes, you need the pocket ability and the accurate passing... BUT, mobility in a pocket collapse and the elusiveness to shake defenders... Those things are priceless and they bump up the game another notch and make it tougher on the defenders.
            Not necessarily, Peyton Manning is fine being a pocket QB because he gets the ball out fast enough. If you want a pocket QB he needs to have a quick release (which Orton doesn't have)
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            • #7
              Originally posted by nyuk nyuk View Post
              Strictly pocket QBs are shark bait, as we've seen with Orton.
              Originally posted by Skywalker View Post
              Not necessarily, Peyton Manning is fine being a pocket QB because he gets the ball out fast enough. If you want a pocket QB he needs to have a quick release (which Orton doesn't have)
              This was what I was going to say.

              Add to the list Joe Montana, Joe Theismann, Tom Brady, Phillip Rivers, and many others.

              I'd disagree that Orton doesn't have a quick release. On the contrary actually. Last year he had one of the very fastest releases in the NFL. The reason he doesn't have one this season is because as we saw in the game last night, the receivers weren't open.

              They weren't any more open for Tebow once he came in either, and he gave them all damned day to get free of their coverages.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Alastor View Post
                I'd disagree that Orton doesn't have a quick release. On the contrary actually. Last year he had one of the very fastest releases in the NFL. The reason he doesn't have one this season is because as we saw in the game last night, the receivers weren't open.

                They weren't any more open for Tebow once he came in either, and he gave them all damned day to get free of their coverages.
                I certainly don't put all the blame on Orton. I think Orton's limitations are part of the problem, plus he seems to be having a worse season as time goes on. Again, though, Tebow has the intangibles that Orton lacks which can extend plays and pull defenders out of position and sometimes helping free up recievers. There were times when Elway's scrambling did just that.

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                • #9
                  Quick release doesn't have everything to do with being able to avoid sacks in the pocket.

                  Orton has a quick release, what he absolutely has not a single ounce of is pocket presence. The ability to sense a rusher and step up in the pocket just a foot or two to make the defender eat dust.

                  I honestly don't know how some guys know they're about to get absolutely blindsided, but Orton doesn't have that sense.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Hoserman117 View Post
                    I honestly don't know how some guys know they're about to get absolutely blindsided, but Orton doesn't have that sense.
                    I disagree. I think he has good pocket awareness. Not the best, but good. Better than most NFL quarterbacks. I rarely see him get absolutely lambasted from behind.

                    I think it could be better, but he's good.

                    The problem I think is that our line (though it does seem to be improving as the season goes forward) is kind of bad, and one can only dodge so many pellets from the shotgun.

                    Even Tebow got hit a few times and he was running around like a kitten on PCP.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Alastor View Post
                      I disagree. I think he has good pocket awareness. Not the best, but good. Better than most NFL quarterbacks. I rarely see him get absolutely lambasted from behind.

                      I think it could be better, but he's good.

                      The problem I think is that our line (though it does seem to be improving as the season goes forward) is kind of bad, and one can only dodge so many pellets from the shotgun.

                      Even Tebow got hit a few times and he was running around like a kitten on PCP.
                      i agree, orton knows its coming, he just cant seem to get out of his own way

                      tebow was pretty great avoiding pressure yesterday, but ill take a QB who can pass consistently over one who can run
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                      • #12
                        You forgot a QB video.

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                        Adopted Broncos:
                        EmmanuelSanders

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by SBboundBRONCOS View Post
                          i agree, orton knows its coming, he just cant seem to get out of his own way
                          Until 8 days ago, he had the longest run from scrimmage for the entire team.

                          He's not overly mobile, but he can move when he wants to. The pocket collapses on our offense. It did it a lot last season too.

                          No, I'm not saying Orton is some great scrambling QB. He's not, but he ain't a statue either.

                          tebow was pretty great avoiding pressure yesterday
                          True. He did a good job. Then again he pretty much ran almost constantly from the start of the play until the end of it - he was all over the place.

                          That worries me, because if he ever does get caught he's going to get caught bad.

                          but ill take a QB who can pass consistently over one who can run
                          I'd really like both, but there are very few of those to be had.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by InsaneBlaze23 View Post
                            You forgot a QB video.

                            It's not fair to hold Tebow to those kind of expectations. Tebow could go on to become a very good QB and still not be half the player Jake was.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Alastor View Post
                              Until 8 days ago, he had the longest run from scrimmage for the entire team.

                              He's not overly mobile, but he can move when he wants to. The pocket collapses on our offense. It did it a lot last season too.

                              No, I'm not saying Orton is some great scrambling QB. He's not, but he ain't a statue either.



                              True. He did a good job. Then again he pretty much ran almost constantly from the start of the play until the end of it - he was all over the place.

                              That worries me, because if he ever does get caught he's going to get caught bad.



                              I'd really like both, but there are very few of those to be had.
                              orton is pretty bad running, he could have had a first down and was going to try for it but then dumped it off instead i found that funny

                              but yes tebow runs FAR too much when something isnt there right away
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