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I Like Tebow....But It's A Passer's League

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  • roperdoug
    replied
    Time is a changing

    I have asked the question before, where do pro-football players come from. Sometimes you guys make is sound like the come from a pro-football factory. I don't know what the percentage rate is but most if not alll come from the college ranks. Now if you are also a college fanatic, you will see that the way football is played in the colleges are changing. You are seeing fewer and fewer pocket passers. Most now are option type pump and run scrambling quarterbacks. Another example I can think of off the top of my head is Cam Newton.
    So what are we going to do? Of course, put them through training camp and change their style to fit the archaic pro-style behind the center pocket passers. Things are changing. Just as auto service garages are having to change because cars do not use distributors but they use computer to run, pro-football is going to have to adapt.
    Like I said Tim Tebow and Cam Newton are only two that I can put names on, I know there are others playing in college now who will soon be jumping into pro-football that play option style football.
    Defensive linesmen are getting bigger and blitz packages are more common. In order to counteract that, more colleges are going to the options format on offense.
    You'll also see more coaches coming up from the college ranks. In the next few years the NFL will change. It has to.

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  • Remedy
    replied
    Originally posted by kona bronco View Post
    its hard to have an intellegent conversation without being labeld a "hater" because you can't see eye to eye with a "fanatic"! That being said CanDB I 100% agree with your post. If the QB could be 1/4 the man he is were set, but he hasn't showed it yet!
    it's getting a bit better as far as being able to objectively criticize tebow. the insane zealously has died down

    Leave a comment:


  • kona bronco
    replied
    its hard to have an intellegent conversation without being labeld a "hater" because you can't see eye to eye with a "fanatic"! That being said CanDB I 100% agree with your post. If the QB could be 1/4 the man he is were set, but he hasn't showed it yet!

    Leave a comment:


  • HARDHIT27
    replied
    Originally posted by Houdini View Post
    The question is will Fox allow to add more balance to the offense for the next season. I think we should. I believe we need to add more passing to this offense. We need to see if Tim can pass the test. If not, time to go find one that can play in a balanced offense.

    Let's put it bluntly, as long as Fox is the HC, we will never be a pass-centric team.

    Edit: I just looked at the pass attempts we had this year compared to other teams. Quite a difference in the numbers.
    E-X-A-C-T-L-Y! Just a little unfair to blame the QB for not being a light-it-up passer--or learning how to be one--when 99.9% (seems like it sometimes, any way) of the plays called are runs up the middle.

    I hope if McCoy is capable of developing--and playcalling--such an offense, then I hope Fox gives him the latitude to do so. If McCoy isn't up to the task, then I hope they replace him with one that is, and Fox also puts the offense in his hands.

    Old fashioned run the ball, keep the score low, and win it with defense doesn't get it done in the modern NFL. Fox needs to "get modern" with the offense.

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  • kentucky bronc
    replied
    With all the intelligent minds that are in the nfl today and in the past, there is a reason why the read option is not an offense that teams run much less try and build around. I think that is what Tebow is, thats what he is good at, damn good at. I think Tim is the type of qb who can keep us 6-10 or 7-9 for years. I hate to go into another season with no real chance at being a true contender or feel like we are headed in that direction.......hope i am wrong but i think what we seen this year is what you are gonna get from Tebow......

    Leave a comment:


  • CanDB
    replied
    Originally posted by Remedy View Post
    aye I think everyone I know is going to cuba/mexico/dom repub in the next month.

    and yes... the cold out west is ridiculous. sigh. I just had to make sure my truck would start after being 'plugged in' all day.
    we haven't plugged in once yet this year........BUT, probably tomorrow night.....lucky so far!

    Leave a comment:


  • Remedy
    replied
    Originally posted by CanDB View Post
    Ha ha........sad to say but for the week or so it's back to the good ole freezer weather I grew up with....man it was cruel growing up, walking ten miles barefoot to school.....after we set our traps!!!!

    Dang!!!..........I sure miss cool........any wonder Canadians love to travel in January/February.....to nice warm beaches!!!
    aye I think everyone I know is going to cuba/mexico/dom repub in the next month.

    and yes... the cold out west is ridiculous. sigh. I just had to make sure my truck would start after being 'plugged in' all day.

    Leave a comment:


  • CanDB
    replied
    Originally posted by Remedy View Post
    Up until yesterday that wasn't very 'cool' haha
    Global warming 1 cold winters 0
    Originally posted by Crazy8 View Post
    Well, darn. Thanks for the scoop. :thumb:

    CanDB, in that case, we're cooler than January in Canada.
    Ha ha........sad to say but for the week or so it's back to the good ole freezer weather I grew up with....man it was cruel growing up, walking ten miles barefoot to school.....after we set our traps!!!!

    Dang!!!..........I sure miss cool........any wonder Canadians love to travel in January/February.....to nice warm beaches!!!
    Last edited by CanDB; 01-16-2012, 04:20 PM.

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  • CanDB
    replied
    Originally posted by samparnell View Post
    It's OK for Option to be a component of the rushing attack because it makes direct snap/shotgun formations viable for the run.

    The main part of the run game should be the power rushing attack.

    The Broncos need a series oriented rushing attack with three lists of plays:
    • 1. Core plays which require defensive adjustments;
      2. Complementary run plays which attack the adjustments;
      2. PAPs off the core play look.


    During the offseason, the offensive coaches should revisit the unbalanced line and explore possibilities all its form present.
    As always, Sam brings the Xs and Os to the forum.......thx bud! Always educating right!!!:thumb:

    Leave a comment:


  • samparnell
    replied
    It's OK for Option to be a component of the rushing attack because it makes direct snap/shotgun formations viable for the run.

    The main part of the run game should be the power rushing attack.

    The Broncos need a series oriented rushing attack with three lists of plays:
    • 1. Core plays which require defensive adjustments;
      2. Complementary run plays which attack the adjustments;
      2. PAPs off the core play look.


    During the offseason, the offensive coaches should revisit the unbalanced line and explore possibilities all its form present.

    Leave a comment:


  • mojo0730
    replied
    It's difficult to ascertain how much of Tebow's struggles this season were on him and how much were on the coaching staff.

    I think it's obvious and fair to say that the Miami and Detroit games spooked the coaching staff and thus they completely changed course with the offense. While it worked in masking Tebow's flaws and helping us with the running game, it's not a good system for developing quarterbacks into elite NFL passers.

    Further, we couldn't score points, couldn't convert on third down, and you can't willingly run your quarterback 7-10 times a game and expect him to make it the entire season. In other words, they have to scratch the option next season and work on getting Tebow accustomed to a regular NFL offense over the next 8 months.

    I also disagree with the poster who said Tebow can make "all the throws". He still can't make the anticipatory throw (i.e. throwing the ball and trusting the receiver to be there open). He still stares down the field and refuses to make a throw unless he feels a receiver is completely open. This is the throw that separates the Brees, Mannings, and Bradys from the Cassels, Sanchezes, and yes even Tebows.

    Having said that...there's no question that Tebow has so many intangibles and other skills. You will give him an offseason WITH McCoy to work on the offense and to develop his passing abilities further. He deserves that much.

    I think if by the end of next year he's still more or less the same as he was this year, then yeah it's probably best to move a different direction. Next year will tell us everything, and there will be no more excuses from either side.

    Leave a comment:


  • tacmale
    replied
    Originally posted by Crazy8 View Post
    Everyone knows that. I'm going to ask you a few things.

    1. Can Tebow make all of the throws? In my opinion, he showed he could.
    2. Is Tebow a good athlete? I believe he's a great athlete for playing the QB position.

    The reason I point to those 2 things is because those, to me anyway, are the things that can't be taught. You can't teach athleticism (quick feet, etc.). You can't teach talent. He's got the talent to really drive that football down the field and even to take some off and drop it in the bucket.

    The thing, to me, that made him inconsistent is that he doesn't know what he's doing. He looks at a defense and is like .

    That's something that you can learn. Now the "x-factor" for me comes with how quickly he recognizes the D and how quickly he knows where to go with the football. A lot of QBs know right where to go with the football if you draw a play and say "against a cover 2". But when the bullets are flying, they don't recognize it very quickly and by the time they do recognize it, it's too late.

    The thing is, Tebow does okay (not good, but okay) not knowing how to do this. By comparison, you've got Brady Quinn who can make all the throws and is a good athlete too. He has more of an idea what he's doing than Tim. I think we can agree on that. But Brady Quinn's never been able to top a 70 QB rating for a season...ever. Why is that? To me, it's the recognition and the doing part. There's a bit of a pause there that he can't afford. To me, that's what separates great QBs from everyone else. It's not arm, it's not athleticism, it's not even accuracy. It's the ability to see and diagnose instantaneously. It's like being able to hit the curve ball. Some can, some can't. You don't know why, it just is.

    I think it's having a 4.6 second body with a 5.5 second mind myself. But that's just me. But that's the thing we need to find out about Tebow. But like I said, he's able to get a QB rating above 80 and above 70 without having the slightest idea of what he's doing. I imagine knowing what the defenses are will make things easier.
    I get exactly what you are saying Dan Marino was probably the best at this when he recognized something bam that ball was out of there. John Madden said it best when he said "I don't what it is, but when a QB sees something with his eyes and throws the ball, Dan Marino is quicker at that than anyone I have ever seen."

    The brain sees something analyzes it sends a message to your muscles what to do. I guess a good term for it is reaction time some folks have it some don't. Some it is the brain recognizing what it sees just works a fraction of a second slower, some it is the signal from the brain to the muscles that is a fraction of a second slower.

    If you have a person that can see and react quickly that time is greatly reduced. The one thing that speeds that up is familiarity with what a person is seeing.

    I don't think Tim has a problem his reaction time once he is comfortable with what his eyes and brain are telling him, that ball come out fast.

    Just like you point out I don't think he has seen enough to trust what his eyes are telling him yet, but that should come with time.
    Last edited by tacmale; 01-16-2012, 03:10 PM. Reason: fix error

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  • Jdub55
    replied
    Tebow certainly can throw the ball. He still has all the Florida prep passing records as well as something like 20 SEC passing records. Won championships at every level.

    He's a young QB that was thrust into a situation not set up for efficient passing numbers, but played well enough to get us to the playoffs for the first time in 6 years and won a playoff game.

    Brady, Manning, Brees none of these guys were world beaters their first year starting. Brees had qb ratings in the 60s-70s his first couple years. Same for Peyton manning, a qb rating in the low 70s won only 3 games and threw 28 ints his rookie year. Brady was a game manager with a mid 80s qb rating. Eli Manning had 4 seasons in the low 70 qb rating territory or lower before he put it together. Alex Smith is a 6th year qb just now coming into his own. Elway had some terrible years. Yet people expect Tebow to be lighting the world on fire when he's throwing it 10-20 times a game. A good chunk of those in bad passing situations like 3rd and long hardly any in good passing situations like first and 10 or second ans short.

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  • Crazy8
    replied
    Originally posted by Remedy View Post
    Up until yesterday that wasn't very 'cool' haha
    Global warming 1 cold winters 0
    Well, darn. Thanks for the scoop. :thumb:

    CanDB, in that case, we're cooler than January in Canada.

    Leave a comment:


  • Remedy
    replied
    Originally posted by Crazy8 View Post
    No doubt! I understand exactly where you're coming from. It seems like a lot of people are coming out of the woodwork lately and it's taken it's toll on the message board.

    We're cool as Canada in January!
    Up until yesterday that wasn't very 'cool' haha
    Global warming 1 cold winters 0

    Leave a comment:

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