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  • #16
    Originally posted by elwayfanatic07 View Post
    man it seemed like more than that. maybe they just came in key situations so it seemed that way.

    im hoping they let Ronnie return punts in preseason. who knows maybe we have another Hester on our hands
    It doesn't help that that 7 of his 8 career fumbles have been recovered by the opposing team

    Hadez, I believe your research (which came after his rookie year in which he had a career high in touches). Fumbling is a part of the game though. Arian Foster had 5, Maurice Jones Drew had 6, backs with 200+ carries not uncommonly have around 5 fumbles a season. Ball security can always be improved (look at AP and Tiki Barber), and Moreno has shown steady improvement in that area.

    Like I said earlier, his health is a far greater concern than his turnovers.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Den615 View Post
      It doesn't help that that 7 of his 8 career fumbles have been recovered by the opposing team

      Hadez, I believe your research (which came after his rookie year in which he had a career high in touches). Fumbling is a part of the game though. Arian Foster had 5, Maurice Jones Drew had 6, backs with 200+ carries not uncommonly have around 5 fumbles a season. Ball security can always be improved (look at AP and Tiki Barber), and Moreno has shown steady improvement in that area.

      Like I said earlier, his health is a far greater concern than his turnovers.
      Your looking at total fumbles and comparing it against other backs who get allot of touches. Try doing a ratio of fumbles per touches. Moreno does not get the touches other backs do, even if you consider the pass catches, so looking at total fumbles is not a clear indicator. I did the research towards the end of the 2010 season or maybe it was even at the end. At that time only AP had more fumbles per touches then Moreno.

      Also that stat about most of his fumbles being recovered by opposing teams must not be 100% accurate. I remember two fumbles alone that went out of bounds. One in 2009 and one in 2010. There was also a time in 2009 when he was careless with the ball at the goaline it fumbled but the refs ruled it a TD so it would not even show up in the stats. Thing is either no one coached him not to do it again or he did not listen because he did the same thing again later in the year and it was ruled a fumble on the goalline...iirc that was the SD game in Denver.

      I do not know if it his lack of coaching or his unwillingness to learn but Moreno does not seem to "get it" when it comes to ball security.
      Last edited by Hadez; 07-21-2012, 10:39 AM.
      Time to build on the win and grow the team from some solid play higher level of play

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      • #18
        Originally posted by elwayfanatic07 View Post
        i hear u...hes fast as hell. morenos fumbles r gonna do him in. i see hillman having a kickass preseason, movin to #2 on the chart, and moreno on the trade block
        What depth chart????? Until he learns to block he will ride the pine! It sounds silly to say anyone has moved up the depth chart before they have even had pads on.
        We have another week or so until camp, then we will start seeing what people can do with equipment on! lol

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Hadez View Post
          Your looking at total fumbles and comparing it against other backs who get allot of touches. Try doing a ratio of fumbles per touches. Moreno does not get the touches other backs do, even if you consider the pass catches, so looking at total fumbles is not a clear indicator. I did the research towards the end of the 2010 season or maybe it was even at the end. At that time only AP had more fumbles per touches then Moreno.

          Also that stat about most of his fumbles being recovered by opposing teams must not be 100% accurate. I remember two fumbles alone that went out of bounds. One in 2009 and one in 2010. There was also a time in 2009 when he was careless with the ball at the goaline it fumbled but the refs ruled it a TD so it would not even show up in the stats. Thing is either no one coached him not to do it again or he did not listen because he did the same thing again later in the year and it was ruled a fumble on the goalline...iirc that was the SD game in Denver.

          I do not know if it his lack of coaching or his unwillingness to learn but Moreno does not seem to "get it" when it comes to ball security.
          I acknowledge that he does not get the amount of carries that Foster and Jones Drew receive, but he also has less fumbles. The ratios aren't exactly the same, but they are not as far off as you indicate. And ESPN, NFL.com, Yahoo, CBS Sports, and Rotoworld list Moreno with 8 career fumbles with 7 resulting in turnovers. I'll take their research over yours. Maybe his fumble at the goal line or out of bounds were not ruled as fumbles on the field, in which case they obviously would not be listed as a fumble in his stat column.

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          • #20
            as its been said hes always dinged up. id say if he ends up that way again in early-mid season its time to part ways.

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            • #21
              Anyway, sorry to derail the thread.

              Like many of you I am very excited to see what Hillman can do for our offense.

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              • #22
                HOLY HELL is he fast...yowza! im beyond jacked to see what this kid can do!!!!

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by elwayfanatic07 View Post
                  am i the only one jacked about this kids potential??? im thinking he will push Moreno out at some point. thoughts??
                  I was just in the process of writing about a handful of players I am really excited about this season. Might still post it. But certainly, Hillman is in my top 5 Broncos going into the season in terms of what he might add to our team.

                  My take is this......he will bring a totally new dynamic to our O......an electric player, one who can break a few. It's been a while since we have had someone who has "deep" run potential. These are the guys that can change games....instantly! And when you complement a legend like Manning, with various weapons, it's all good!!!

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                  • #24
                    It's nice to have a a true 'home run' threat in the back field again.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Remedy View Post
                      It's nice to have a a true 'home run' threat in the back field again.
                      fo sho! his highlite vid speaks volumes

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                      • #26
                        I like the dimension that he adds to the O. But I seriously question what he is going to be able to do... The guy plays at 185 lbs. I just don't see him ever being a 20 touch a game type guy. Little guys like him need that unbelievable speed, and hillman just doesn't have that. SO we need to just see. But a prediction.... I think that McGhee is going to falter (see second half of last season), Moreno is going to step up and Hillman will work his way to 3rd or maybe 2nd.....But either way just a change of pace type guy
                        Thanx Blondie79 for the sweet Sig....Love it and I will rock it with pridesigpic

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                        • #27
                          they will add weight (muscle) and he has a wicked stiff arm. i have little to zero faith in NoShow...hes done little to impress in his overall body of work. Hillman may be exactly what we say..we ll see..i hope yer wrong bro...no offense

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by elwayfanatic07 View Post
                            they will add weight (muscle) and he has a wicked stiff arm. i have little to zero faith in NoShow...hes done little to impress in his overall body of work. Hillman may be exactly what we say..we ll see..i hope yer wrong bro...no offense

                            I agree with what you are saying about Moreno up to now.....Remember I was the one that told everyone on here the kinda player that he is.... But this is the O that he is made for. He is a better receiver that Hillman, he is a better blitz pick up guy (guessing since Hillman never has done it and moreno is actually good at it), and he runs the dive better than Hillman (a staple of the PM running game). But with Hillman playing second fiddle and doing most of the outside stuff that can be very effective. But this is the O that Moreno should have been in from the get go. If he can stay healthy and he gets a fair shot I have no doubts that he will be the most effective back that we have had in a while
                            Thanx Blondie79 for the sweet Sig....Love it and I will rock it with pridesigpic

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                            • #29
                              i hope they let him loose to do returns. if he makes it thru the pack no one will touch him!

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by elwayfanatic07 View Post
                                i hope they let him loose to do returns. if he makes it thru the pack no one will touch him!
                                Now in the return game that is a place I would like to see him...But I am not sure that he has any experience with it
                                Thanx Blondie79 for the sweet Sig....Love it and I will rock it with pridesigpic

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