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Why is the talk about who is better more dependent on Super Bowls than MVPs?

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  • Why is the talk about who is better more dependent on Super Bowls than MVPs?

    It just hit me that the arguments put forth by Brady fans and the media that he is better than Manning because of the Super Bowl disparity makes no sense in light of the fact Manning has way more MVPs. In all seriousness, which "award" or result is more dependent on the overall team versus a single player's skills? Winning a Super Bowl or winning an MVP? I can't imagine ANYONE saying that winning a Super Bowl more accurately reflects an individual player's greatness than the MVPs because MVPs are defined as the Most Valuable (Individual) Player. I guess that is why they try to distinguish Manning as the greatest regular season QB of all time, however, again, isn't it disingenuous to say that Brady deserves the post-season title over Manning when their post-season stats are very similar, except for the most team-dependent stat, wins?
    I wonder if this is a carry-over because of Jordan, and how everyone said he was the greatest ever because of the championships. Of course there is a huge difference in this argument, because basketball is a lot different of a sport than football, AND Jordan won his own share of MVPs, along with championships.

  • #2
    Neither, its a team game.

    Brady and Manning dont play against each other.

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    • #3
      I'm with you. It's all ridiculous.

      Dan Marino never won a Super Bowl. That shouldn't reflect poorly upon his own skills. I'd say most people wouldn't put Brady above Marino if they ranked players. I definitely wouldn't.

      John Elway didn't win any Super Bowls until his final two years. Even if he had retired before getting his rings, I don't believe Brady is a better player than Elway was.

      The list goes on and on. On the other hand, one would have to conclude that Terry Bradshaw and Joe Montana are tied for greatest quarterback of all time, if indeed rings are what it's all about.
      Last edited by Conner13; 12-05-2013, 01:18 PM.

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      • #4
        It's gotta be a combination of factors and championships are part of it. But yes, it's an overvalued part of it.

        Terry Bradshaw has four Super Bowl championships. Does this make him better than Dan Marino, Tom Brady, Fran Tarkenton, Drew Brees, Steve Young, Warren Moon, John Unitas, Peyton Manning, Aaron Rodgers, Roger Staubach, etc? Is he the equal of Joe Montana?

        I doubt many would say so.

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        • #5
          Way more? Manning's advantage in MVP awards (two) equals Brady's advantage in SB rings (two.) And the MVP award isn't usually given to the "most valuable player." It's usually given to the player with the most impressive stats. These two aren't mutually exclusive, but they also don't have to coincide. And since Manning has had a better supporting cast on offense, it makes sense that he would have more MVPs.

          Why would regular season MVP mean more than SB MVP though? Brady has more SB MVP awards than Peyton.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by RandomVariable View Post
            Way more? Manning's advantage in MVP awards (two) equals Brady's advantage in SB rings (two.) And the MVP award isn't usually given to the "most valuable player." It's usually given to the player with the most impressive stats. These two aren't mutually exclusive, but they also don't have to coincide. And since Manning has had a better supporting cast on offense, it makes sense that he would have more MVPs.

            Why would regular season MVP mean more than SB MVP though? Brady has more SB MVP awards than Peyton.
            Lol ^^^^^^

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            • #7
              Originally posted by RandomVariable View Post
              Way more? Manning's advantage in MVP awards (two) equals Brady's advantage in SB rings (two.) And the MVP award isn't usually given to the "most valuable player." It's usually given to the player with the most impressive stats. These two aren't mutually exclusive, but they also don't have to coincide. And since Manning has had a better supporting cast on offense, it makes sense that he would have more MVPs.
              Why would regular season MVP mean more than SB MVP though? Brady has more SB MVP awards than Peyton.
              And Brady had a far better supporting cast in his Superbowl wins. By your logic this negates the ring arguements.

              I guess that just puts it down to numbers and the "eyeball test"
              sigpic

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              • #8
                Originally posted by RandomVariable View Post
                Way more? Manning's advantage in MVP awards (two) equals Brady's advantage in SB rings (two.) And the MVP award isn't usually given to the "most valuable player." It's usually given to the player with the most impressive stats. These two aren't mutually exclusive, but they also don't have to coincide. And since Manning has had a better supporting cast on offense, it makes sense that he would have more MVPs.

                Why would regular season MVP mean more than SB MVP though? Brady has more SB MVP awards than Peyton.
                Eli beat Brady twice in the SB, so Eli > Brady?

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by PFM2013 View Post
                  Lol ^^^^^^
                  My thoughts exactly.
                  :lombardi:2019 Adopt-A-Bronco: Dr. Dre'Mont Jones
                  sigpic

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by ERoyal248 View Post
                    Eli beat Brady twice in the SB, so Eli > Brady?
                    Notice I never said anything about head to head record? Eli still has fewer rings and is nowhere near as consistent as Brady is. He has two rings and his other playoff appearances are one-and-done. He's like Peyton one year, and Brady the next.

                    Tom Brady is the only QB in the league that gives his team a chance to win a SB each and every single year. This is evident by the amount of times he has taken us to the AFCCG and to the SB.

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                    • #11
                      I honestly dont think i've seen RV say one positive thing about Manning.

                      And the weapons argument is a load of crap given Brady has had just as good if not better weapons over the years, so thats a bunch of crap.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by RandomVariable View Post
                        Notice I never said anything about head to head record? Eli still has fewer rings and is nowhere near as consistent as Brady is. He has two rings and his other playoff appearances are one-and-done. He's like Peyton one year, and Brady the next.

                        Tom Brady is the only QB in the league that gives his team a chance to win a SB each and every single year. This is evident by the amount of times he has taken us to the AFCCG and to the SB.
                        Peyton doesnt give his team a shot at one, or Rodgers/Brees?

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                        • #13
                          To me, this speaks volumes. I could never imagine Brady praying and begging God on the sideline to let him win.

                          The Colts took a 38-34 lead late in the fourth quarter of the AFC Championship Game. With one minute remaining on the clock and the ball in the hands of Patriots quarterback Tom Brady, Manning looked for assistance from above. "I've never done this before in my life. I've never prayed during a game. I'm watching the scoreboard and my hands come together. I'm in prayer position. I just said,˜Dear Lord, one time can you just not let Tom make this comeback? Allow us to win this game and get to the Super Bowl. I probably added in there that Tom already has three Super Bowl rings and he doesn't really need another at this point. I tried to make it a fair prayer."

                          http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d...ednesday-night

                          Obviously Manning and Brady are never on the field at the same time and thus don't play against one another. But to deny that Brady doesn't get into Peyton's head is silly. Peyton dies a little inside every time Tom beats him.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by ERoyal248 View Post
                            Peyton doesnt give his team a shot at one, or Rodgers/Brees?
                            I said a shot every single year.

                            Their track record in the playoffs is clear on the matter, and the answer is no.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by RandomVariable View Post
                              Their track record in the playoffs is clear on the matter, and the answer is no.
                              Rodgers lost a game where HE put up 48 points, yet got a L.

                              Dumb argument, again, shocking, not.

                              If only Brees/Rodgers/Peyton could have bad games in the playoffs and still win like Brady does.

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