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  • CoryWinget81
    replied
    Originally posted by LynchMobster View Post
    Okay, if you were Brock and you were on the inside loop of what's going on with the brass over there, and you knew that the plan all along was to bring Manning back ASAP hopefully before the playoffs, and you had stated that you were just the back-up repeatedly to the press (which he has), and your coach had stated that Manning starts as soon as he's healthy a few times too (which he has), and you blamed yourself for all the turnovers (which he did, to the press), how would you feel or see it then?
    If you can show me something that says that was the plan, then I could see that, but those that saw him on the sideline at the game and his body language in speaking with the media tell a different story than that. Dude was visibly, and understandably pissed. Brock blaming himself for the turnovers is coach speak, something he's very fluent in.

    I don't believe there was a plan, but if their was, were I him, I'd still say see ya later. You're still showing a vote of no confidence in me either way, and having a head coach that isn't confident in me isn't how I want to start my career as a starting QB.

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  • 58Miller
    replied
    Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
    If I were Brock I wouldn't want to play for a coach who pulled me after a RB just handed a ball away.

    just my two cents.

    And before anyone says that's being emotional, it's really not. Do you think Brock is ever going to forget it? I sure don't. IMO Kubiak has already cracked the foundation by his actions. Why would a talented young QB stick around for a stale offensive system and a coach that yanks you when the entire team is falling apart around you? Just doesn't make any sense.
    What if Brock starts next week and wins you still think he is going to still hold a grudge? If Brock is our future Qb he aint gonna make his decision based on being benched. Remember when we didn't score a point in 3 second halfs in a row costing us two games? He should remember that coach didnt bench himthen and next year he wont have a HOF on the bench behind him. Also that coach that benched him coached Steve Young (Qb Coach 94 ring) Elway (2 rings) and Flacco ( best statistical season 2014, he may know a thing or two about Qbs Brock should just listen leave the emotions for the real housewives.

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  • L.M.
    replied
    Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
    If I were Brock I wouldn't want to play for a coach who pulled me after a RB just handed a ball away.

    just my two cents.

    And before anyone says that's being emotional, it's really not. Do you think Brock is ever going to forget it? I sure don't. IMO Kubiak has already cracked the foundation by his actions. Why would a talented young QB stick around for a stale offensive system and a coach that yanks you when the entire team is falling apart around you? Just doesn't make any sense.
    Okay, if you were Brock and you were on the inside loop of what's going on with the brass over there, and you knew that the plan all along was to bring Manning back ASAP hopefully before the playoffs, and you had stated that you were just the back-up repeatedly to the press (which he has), and your coach had stated that Manning starts as soon as he's healthy a few times too (which he has), and you blamed yourself for all the turnovers (which he did, to the press), how would you feel or see it then?

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  • broncos SB2010
    replied
    Originally posted by MHSalute View Post
    We are obviously looking at different sources:

    Tannehill 21mm guaranteed (11mm signing bonus, 1st two years guaranteed)
    Flacco 29M total guaranteed
    Dalton 17MM total guaranteed

    http://overthecap.com/position/quarterback

    But regardless,it will all work itself out. I just do not see the resume there, but winning a SB will definitely get that contract up to a Dalton type deal. Pointless to debate when what he gets paid is very dependent on what he does in the post season.
    what????? Pointless to debate FA and the future of our players????? BLASPHEMY!!!!!


    I have to say the numbers you posted look wrong to me because it says Flacco only has $29M guaranteed but that alone was his signing bonus. Here is a breakdown of his contract for whatever it is worth:

    In 2013, Flacco gets a fully guaranteed base salary of $1 million for a total first-year compensation of $30 million and a salary-cap figure of $6.8 million.

    In 2014, Flacco has a $6 million base salary that's guaranteed for injury only, but that voids once the first option is paid. His salary-cap figure is $14.8 million in the second year of the deal.

    In 2015, Flacco gets a $4 million base salary that's guaranteed for injury only, which voids when the first option is paid. His salary-cap figure is $14.55 million.

    In 2016, the salary cap figure inflates to $28.55 million, primarily due to an $18 million base salary with $12 million of that guaranteed for injury only, although that guaranteed portion reduces to $3 million when the first option of $15 million is exercised, and voids when the second option of $7 million is exercised.

    The deal effectively operates as a three-year, $62 million agreement since the contract is likely to be restructured after three years.

    Here's the remainder of the deal, which is expected to be adjusted.

    In 2017, Flacco has a $20.6 million base salary and a $31.15 million salary-cap figure.

    In 2018, Flacco has a $20 million base salary and a $24.75 million salary-cap figure.

    There are injury guarantees for the $6 million in 2014, $4 million in 2015 and the $12 million, but oncethe option for 2017 is exercised or the non-exercise fee is paid in 2014

    The contract was negotiated by Ravens vice president of football administration Pat Moriarty and Joe Linta, Flacco's agent.
    Last edited by broncos SB2010; 01-06-2016, 07:34 PM.

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  • Lange
    replied
    Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
    If I were Brock I wouldn't want to play for a coach who pulled me after a RB just handed a ball away.

    just my two cents.

    And before anyone says that's being emotional, it's really not. Do you think Brock is ever going to forget it? I sure don't. IMO Kubiak has already cracked the foundation by his actions. Why would a talented young QB stick around for a stale offensive system and a coach that yanks you when the entire team is falling apart around you? Just doesn't make any sense.
    You have a good point. It was more about Manning being a hall of fame and vet that Brock had a short leash once Manning finally could play. Basically showed that Kubiak didn't have the trust in Brock and you can't get dismiss that. However, Manning had to throw 4 interceptions in the KC game to get pulled. Anyone else would of likely been benched earlier on in the season for poor play, but it's just because it was Manning. Obviously OZ wasn't given near the chance Manning was in that respect. His legacy and career give him extra privileges and respect no matter how he plays. That much is clear.

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  • MHSalute
    replied
    Originally posted by broncos SB2010 View Post
    I don't think your numbers are entirely accurate:

    Flacco's contract:

    3/1/2013: Signed a six-year, $120.6 million contract. The deal contains $52 million guaranteed, including a $29 million signing bonus. 2015: $4 million (+ $7 million option bonus), 2016: $18 million, 2017: $20.6 million, 2018: $20 million, 2019: Free Agent

    Tannehill's contract

    5/18/2015: Signed a six-year, $95.272 million contract. The deal contains $45 million guaranteed -- an $11.5 million signing bonus and each of Tannehill's first four base salaries. 2015: $745,000, 2016: $9.34 million, 2017: $17.975 million, 2018: $17.47 million, 2019: $18.725 million, 2020: $19.497 million, 2021: Free Agent


    I'm not debating what I think Os is worth. That's what I think he will get if he stays here in Denver. He may not stay, but if he does, it is going to be as a starting QB because I don't think he would sign another contract here as a backup and starting QBs get $12M+/year. If he hits FA and signs somewhere else, the numbers might be closer to what you posted but not if he stays here, imo.
    We are obviously looking at different sources:

    Tannehill 21mm guaranteed (11mm signing bonus, 1st two years guaranteed)
    Flacco 29M total guaranteed
    Dalton 17MM total guaranteed

    http://overthecap.com/position/quarterback

    But regardless,it will all work itself out. I just do not see the resume there, but winning a SB will definitely get that contract up to a Dalton type deal. Pointless to debate when what he gets paid is very dependent on what he does in the post season.
    Last edited by MHSalute; 01-06-2016, 07:25 PM.

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  • Jim Mora
    replied
    Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
    If I were Brock I wouldn't want to play for a coach who pulled me after a RB just handed a ball away.

    just my two cents.

    And before anyone says that's being emotional, it's really not. Do you think Brock is ever going to forget it? I sure don't. IMO Kubiak has already cracked the foundation by his actions. Why would a talented young QB stick around for a stale offensive system and a coach that yanks you when the entire team is falling apart around you? Just doesn't make any sense.
    I think I would go elsewhere. Granted I don't know all the details, but I'd feel like what you just said.

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  • Lange
    replied
    I can't see Elway not wanting to keep Oz, they've invested so much in him in Denver for three years it would make no sense for him to go. Obviously they wanted to groom him with the intention of being able to take over the team when the time came Manning was done. Who else could they really have otherwise? People mention Trevor Semien or the draft but those aren't safe bets, if Trevor was to outdo OZ for the starting job it would likely be a offseason evaluation process. They wouldn't let oz go for Trevor, with all the investment makes no sense plus the time in system etc.

    Also mentioning what Elway said about Tebow this is a whole nother situation. They had the chance to acquire PFM at that time, and really it was a no brainier. If Peyton didn't come likely Tebow would of had a chance at least. Uncommon scenario to have a chance to have a hall of fame quarterback come on the market and be acquired.

    Is there another Peyton type quarterback to push out OZ no. It just is a factor what happens with Peyton. If Peyton stays oz could be gone because of conflict of interest, Otherwise just can't see it happening

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  • CoryWinget81
    replied
    If I were Brock I wouldn't want to play for a coach who pulled me after a RB just handed a ball away.

    just my two cents.

    And before anyone says that's being emotional, it's really not. Do you think Brock is ever going to forget it? I sure don't. IMO Kubiak has already cracked the foundation by his actions. Why would a talented young QB stick around for a stale offensive system and a coach that yanks you when the entire team is falling apart around you? Just doesn't make any sense.

    Leave a comment:


  • broncos SB2010
    replied
    Originally posted by MHSalute View Post
    Flacco

    1st year 6.8MM (1MM base)
    2nd Year 14.8M (6M base)
    3rd year 14.5M (4M base)

    10-15 a year is Joe Flacco Money.

    Tannehill

    1st year 4.8MM (660K base)
    2nd Year 11.6M (9.3M base)
    3rd year 120M (17M base)

    Both contracts show 15-20MM cost over the 1st two years, both contracts have an out after the first couple years. 12M guarantee with an out after 2 years is a good contract for Brock. It is about what Flynn got from Seattle in an open market.
    I don't think your numbers are entirely accurate:

    Flacco's contract:

    3/1/2013: Signed a six-year, $120.6 million contract. The deal contains $52 million guaranteed, including a $29 million signing bonus. 2015: $4 million (+ $7 million option bonus), 2016: $18 million, 2017: $20.6 million, 2018: $20 million, 2019: Free Agent

    Tannehill's contract

    5/18/2015: Signed a six-year, $95.272 million contract. The deal contains $45 million guaranteed -- an $11.5 million signing bonus and each of Tannehill's first four base salaries. 2015: $745,000, 2016: $9.34 million, 2017: $17.975 million, 2018: $17.47 million, 2019: $18.725 million, 2020: $19.497 million, 2021: Free Agent


    I'm not debating what I think Os is worth. That's what I think he will get if he stays here in Denver. He may not stay, but if he does, it is going to be as a starting QB because I don't think he would sign another contract here as a backup and starting QBs get $12M+/year. If he hits FA and signs somewhere else, the numbers might be closer to what you posted but not if he stays here, imo.
    Last edited by broncos SB2010; 01-06-2016, 06:37 PM.

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  • gtown53
    replied
    Manning's cap hit is $17.5 million for this season. And people are talking numbers for brock in the $15 - $20 million range? God help us if Elway comes anywhere near that. The whole idea of Manning's retirement is to free up money that we can use to sign FAs. How the hell is signing osweiler to a $15-20 million dollar contract going to do that?

    And that isn't even addressing what the guy is really worth.

    $15 - $20 million? From what I've seen, I wouldn't pay him half of that. I'd rather go with Siemian at $500,000, and a rookie Draft choice.

    And keep in mind that John Elway gave Tim Tebow the same "Dreaded Vote of Confidence" when he said that Tebow would be the starting QB going into 2012 Training Camp.

    Read it for yourself: https://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-s...221258523.html

    Elway will keep osweiler if he can get him for the right price, but I can't believe that John Elway doesn't have some "Blockbuster" deal for a quality Veteran in mind versus paying the kind of money being discussed on this Thread.
    Last edited by gtown53; 01-06-2016, 07:02 PM.

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  • Fantaztic7
    replied
    Originally posted by ELWAY421 View Post
    I really hope Brock stays in Denver, but I hope he don't get crazy in asking price. I don't think he should make as much as like a Andy Dalton contact, Dalton is a decent QB, he was playing pretty good this year, obviously he needs to win in the playoffs, but how could we justify Brock making that much on 5/6 games?
    Agree with challenge of having only 6 1/2 games. Four years of practice, camps, film study, learning from PM, pre-season games and everything else the coaches and Elway have observed.

    Consider the magnitude of the 6 full games - team built for a SB run, issues with the O line, wins in big games that went to OT - Patriots and Bengals.

    Even a #1 pick is an unknown - #1 picks have zero NFL games to evaluate.

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  • ELWAY421
    replied
    I really hope Brock stays in Denver, but I hope he don't get crazy in asking price. I don't think he should make as much as like a Andy Dalton contact, Dalton is a decent QB, he was playing pretty good this year, obviously he needs to win in the playoffs, but how could we justify Brock making that much on 5/6 games?

    I mean Andy played a couple of years before he earned his money.
    Last edited by ELWAY421; 01-06-2016, 04:17 PM.

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  • MHSalute
    replied
    Flacco

    1st year 6.8MM (1MM base)
    2nd Year 14.8M (6M base)
    3rd year 14.5M (4M base)

    10-15 a year is Joe Flacco Money.

    Tannehill

    1st year 4.8MM (660K base)
    2nd Year 11.6M (9.3M base)
    3rd year 120M (17M base)

    Both contracts show 15-20MM cost over the 1st two years, both contracts have an out after the first couple years. 12M guarantee with an out after 2 years is a good contract for Brock. It is about what Flynn got from Seattle in an open market.

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  • broncos SB2010
    replied
    Originally posted by MHSalute View Post
    Would be a top 7 contract if that is true. You must think he is going to get a Joe Flacco contract.
    Not even close to top 7. It would be in #20 range with most of the next 10 or so still on their first contracts. The top 9 QBs are all making $20M+ Including Flacco). No starting QB in the league except guys on their first contract, Hoyer, McCown and Brady make less than $12M. If he stays in Denver, he won't do it for backup pay.
    Last edited by broncos SB2010; 01-06-2016, 04:08 PM.

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