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  • #91
    Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
    If I were Brock I wouldn't want to play for a coach who pulled me after a RB just handed a ball away.

    just my two cents.

    And before anyone says that's being emotional, it's really not. Do you think Brock is ever going to forget it? I sure don't. IMO Kubiak has already cracked the foundation by his actions. Why would a talented young QB stick around for a stale offensive system and a coach that yanks you when the entire team is falling apart around you? Just doesn't make any sense.
    Including college games, brock has like 20 Starts. And we aren't talking about a QB with that arrogant, confident swagger. Like we saw from Cincy's A J McCarron.

    "Change" is the last thing that brock wants. It's scary for a young, inexperienced kid who lacks confidence, AND playing time. And I'm guessing the Broncos could take advantage of that state of mind by low-balling osweiler. Personally, I'd just as soon see him go with the hopes that Elway comes up with another Blockbuster move to bring in a quality veteran. But, I'm not worried about it either way. I just hope that Elway sticks with letting osweiler test the waters, and doesn't overpay him. We may find out that teams would only want him as a "Backup".

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    • #92
      Originally posted by gtown53 View Post
      Including college games, brock has like 20 Starts. And we aren't talking about a QB with that arrogant, confident swagger. Like we saw from Cincy's A J McCarron.

      "Change" is the last thing that brock wants. It's scary for a young, inexperienced kid who lacks confidence, AND playing time. And I'm guessing the Broncos could take advantage of that state of mind by low-balling osweiler. Personally, I'd just as soon see him go with the hopes that Elway comes up with another Blockbuster move to bring in a quality veteran. But, I'm not worried about it either way. I just hope that Elway sticks with letting osweiler test the waters, and doesn't overpay him. We may find out that teams would only want him as a "Backup".
      Funny enough after hearing an interview with Mccarran today I came away thinking he sounded pretty mature and thinking that maybe the Broncos should make a run at getting him if they can't re-sign Osweiler.

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      • #93
        Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
        If I were Brock I wouldn't want to play for a coach who pulled me after a RB just handed a ball away.

        just my two cents.

        And before anyone says that's being emotional, it's really not. Do you think Brock is ever going to forget it? I sure don't. IMO Kubiak has already cracked the foundation by his actions. Why would a talented young QB stick around for a stale offensive system and a coach that yanks you when the entire team is falling apart around you? Just doesn't make any sense.
        Sounds a lot like the Jay Cutler situation. At the end of the day that's where a good agent will step in and tell Osweiler (or any client) to not be emotional about it and that he needs to look at the best situation for him for playing time, development and playing time, and if that's Denver he needs to put on his big boy pants, swallow his pride a little bit, and go to work, where he will be compensated with a 7 or 8 figure salary yearly.

        I wonder how things would have been different if Bus Cook has done that with Jay Cutler back in 2009? But ultimately Denver is where it is now because he didn't.

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        • #94
          Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
          If you can show me something that says that was the plan, then I could see that, but those that saw him on the sideline at the game and his body language in speaking with the media tell a different story than that. Dude was visibly, and understandably pissed. Brock blaming himself for the turnovers is coach speak, something he's very fluent in.

          I don't believe there was a plan, but if their was, were I him, I'd still say see ya later. You're still showing a vote of no confidence in me either way, and having a head coach that isn't confident in me isn't how I want to start my career as a starting QB.
          You could be right about him wanting to leave based on being benched but I think he needs Denver as much as we need him I don't see him going anywhere and being handed the job without a chance of being benched again. I doubt Kubiak would bench him next year he would be in year two under this offense and have a full training camp.
          As far as him being pissed, I think that's simple he started at Qb and the offense failed to score under his leadership, who in their right mind wouldn't be pissed? We won but any competitor is going to be mad they weren't able to get the job done, especially when things out of his power assisted in the process.
          sigpic

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          • #95
            Originally posted by Butler By'Note View Post
            Funny enough after hearing an interview with Mccarran today I came away thinking he sounded pretty mature and thinking that maybe the Broncos should make a run at getting him if they can't re-sign Osweiler.
            I'd love it. He dropped to the 5th Round because of his Combine interviews where he was seen as too "cocky". After what he did for one of the toughest and most successful college programs, I'd have a problem if he wasn't supremely confident.

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            • #96
              Originally posted by gtown53 View Post
              Including college games, brock has like 20 Starts. And we aren't talking about a QB with that arrogant, confident swagger. Like we saw from Cincy's A J McCarron.

              "Change" is the last thing that brock wants. It's scary for a young, inexperienced kid who lacks confidence, AND playing time. And I'm guessing the Broncos could take advantage of that state of mind by low-balling osweiler. Personally, I'd just as soon see him go with the hopes that Elway comes up with another Blockbuster move to bring in a quality veteran. But, I'm not worried about it either way. I just hope that Elway sticks with letting osweiler test the waters, and doesn't overpay him. We may find out that teams would only want him as a "Backup".
              good points and good discussion
              sigpic

              Hooray, beer!

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              • #97
                Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
                If I were Brock I wouldn't want to play for a coach who pulled me after a RB just handed a ball away.

                just my two cents.

                And before anyone says that's being emotional, it's really not. Do you think Brock is ever going to forget it? I sure don't. IMO Kubiak has already cracked the foundation by his actions. Why would a talented young QB stick around for a stale offensive system and a coach that yanks you when the entire team is falling apart around you? Just doesn't make any sense.
                Brock was a key cog in that problem, though. He displayed absolutely no ability to read a defense before the snap, making the blocking adjustments necessary to avoid DB blitz sack fumbles (which was 100% his fault), or check into a right match up exploit when needed.

                He instead tried to autopilot the playbook - which is good at times, but terrible when the crunch is on.

                The run game didn't work because the backs felt like trying harder for Peyton. He saw what the defense was up to, made blocking rearrangements, and audibled correctly every time. He also spots DB blitzes coming a mile away. Not to mention how quick his release is.

                We can blame the rest of the offense a we want - some of which is deserved - but Brock was the one the Chargers had figured out, and Brock was the one failing to adjust again and again.

                That's what experience gets you over youth. Brock is athletic, yet gets sacked far more than Peyton ever did. That's what pre-snap reads get you. Brock would hold the ball until it was too late, while Manning hit the routes accurately and on time. That's what long tenured feel and repetition gets you over arm strength.

                Brock will be a starting QB for the Broncos going forward. He's not Denver's best option in these playoffs, however. The playoffs aren't a time to give a guy a shot to learn, or to try out a guy to see what he gives you in the future.

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                • #98
                  Originally posted by Butler By'Note View Post
                  Sounds a lot like the Jay Cutler situation. At the end of the day that's where a good agent will step in and tell Osweiler (or any client) to not be emotional about it and that he needs to look at the best situation for him for playing time, development and playing time, and if that's Denver he needs to put on his big boy pants, swallow his pride a little bit, and go to work, where he will be compensated with a 7 or 8 figure salary yearly.

                  I wonder how things would have been different if Bus Cook has done that with Jay Cutler back in 2009? But ultimately Denver is where it is now because he didn't.
                  all around good points
                  sigpic

                  Hooray, beer!

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                  • #99
                    Originally posted by CoryWinget81 View Post
                    If you can show me something that says that was the plan, then I could see that, but those that saw him on the sideline at the game and his body language in speaking with the media tell a different story than that. Dude was visibly, and understandably pissed. Brock blaming himself for the turnovers is coach speak, something he's very fluent in.

                    I don't believe there was a plan, but if their was, were I him, I'd still say see ya later. You're still showing a vote of no confidence in me either way, and having a head coach that isn't confident in me isn't how I want to start my career as a starting QB.
                    I've been listening to Kubiak pressers or reading quotes from Kubiak that declare this intention (the "plan", if you will) since Manning went down. Didn't you see those too, or do you want me to find them for you?

                    As for what Brock actually said, you don't know that he doesn't hold himself accountable. One shouldn't assume that everything is fake and political.

                    I don't see why people wish to ignore what Kubiak and Osweiler say and read deeply into the matter to come up with a speculative scenario which has no factual basis, and then draw more conclusions off of this speculation. Kubiak benched Os after five turnovers so this must mean that Kubes has no confidence in him and never will again (despite Brock's excellent performances in games past) so Brock must hate Kubes for that and now he'd rather play for the Browns!

                    All from facial expressions which could also mean: Brock was really frustrated with all the mistakes -his and others, with not seeing the blitz coming, and yes likely for being benched too on top of all of it -who wouldn't be? It's not the first time a coach has pulled a QB who was just off his game or the momentum was swinging against him, yet started him later because he still believes in him. Kubes is a QB's guy, who even stood by Schaub.

                    There's communication between Os and Kubes that we don't get to see, lot's of it at Dove Valley, where the team's best interests are upheld and explained if necessary. And I would guess there's an understanding there between these two, because the move when looked at objectively by everyone -including Brock- was effective and reasonable, and in accord with statements and intentions for Manning's eventual return anyway.

                    Superbowl 50 MVP Von Miller on February 7th, 2016

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                    • Originally posted by Butler By'Note View Post
                      Sounds a lot like the Jay Cutler situation. At the end of the day that's where a good agent will step in and tell Osweiler (or any client) to not be emotional about it and that he needs to look at the best situation for him for playing time, development and playing time, and if that's Denver he needs to put on his big boy pants, swallow his pride a little bit, and go to work, where he will be compensated with a 7 or 8 figure salary yearly.

                      I wonder how things would have been different if Bus Cook has done that with Jay Cutler back in 2009? But ultimately Denver is where it is now because he didn't.
                      That's exactly right.

                      As Tom told Sonny in the Godfather, "It's not personal, Sonny, it's strictly business."

                      And if what happened to brock last week causes him to have a huge problem with the Franchise that has paid him to do nothing (no Starts) for 3 1/2 years, do we really want somebody like that on our team?

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                      • The bigger question is if Brock is retained, will Peyton retire? And if Brock becomes the #1 QB, will the Broncos find a free agent veteran backup QB on the market over the winter/ spring or will they seek one out in the draft? Anyone care to comment?

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                        • Originally posted by gtown53 View Post
                          That's exactly right.

                          As Tom told Sonny in the Godfather, "It's not personal, Sonny, it's strictly business."

                          And if what happened to brock last week causes him to have a huge problem with the Franchise that has paid him to do nothing (no Starts) for 3 1/2 years, do we really want somebody like that on our team?
                          lol I'm confused..where is it said by Brock that hes mad because Peyton went in. I saw the guy applauding when they kept scoring.. I'm not Os crazy by any means.. I think there is better 1st and 2nd year starters out there better then Brock but GEEZ give the kid a break..if anything he may have been frustrated cause he wanted to do better for the team..

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                          • Originally posted by bd18packer View Post
                            The bigger question is if Brock is retained, will Peyton retire? And if Brock becomes the #1 QB, will the Broncos find a free agent veteran backup QB on the market over the winter/ spring or will they seek one out in the draft? Anyone care to comment?
                            May have to ask again, posters are shy about giving their opinions around here
                            Ravens GM 2016 - Ravens are looking to trade down 4-8 spots

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                            • Originally posted by Chrissy View Post
                              lol I'm confused..where is it said by Brock that hes mad because Peyton went in. I saw the guy applauding when they kept scoring.. I'm not Os crazy by any means.. I think there is better 1st and 2nd year starters out there better then Brock but GEEZ give the kid a break..if anything he may have been frustrated cause he wanted to do better for the team..
                              I don't agree with some of the stuff you say but I do agree that Oz was clapping and showing sportsman . And yes he was frustrated that the wheels fell off

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                              • Originally posted by bd18packer View Post
                                The bigger question is if Brock is retained, will Peyton retire? And if Brock becomes the #1 QB, will the Broncos find a free agent veteran backup QB on the market over the winter/ spring or will they seek one out in the draft? Anyone care to comment?
                                I think Peyton retires, if he doesn't it will depend on what happens in this years playoffs. I cant see a scenario where Elway would want Manning back
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