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  • Leadership Lacking

    Can't finance leadership (Cap ... Smap)

    One of the biggest mistakes made this offseason was to remove leadership in the locker room (Ware, Ward, etc) and have a new coaching staff at the same time. The "we got this" attitude after two weeks off, reflects the lack of focus and the lack of leadership. Von needs to bring his life back to the team as well. His presser was ridiculous. Trevor's pressor was ridiculous. Take ownership, have passion get a mental clue.
    Talent is not lacking by any means. Basically it the same team as last year, somewhat improved. Mental toughness is not what it should be for a team to stay on top.

    Did any coach do there homework? Motivate their players? What is up with McManus / team.

    McCoy + Manning = Audible to a better play. Trever is no Payton. McCoy had two weeks to prepare. What did he do? What did Woods do - no pressure on Giants receivers off the line, no double team on Engram? Where is the defensive pressure and looks that were keystone to the D?

    Mr. Elway, "Attitude reflect leadership CAPTAIN!" (Remember the Titans)

    https://www.google.com/search?q=atti...wYsD-wYr_qx6M:
    Last edited by JED Bronco; 10-16-2017, 12:32 PM. Reason: add clip
    This is the NFL!!

    Don't sing it... Bring It!!!!!



    Go Broncos!!!!!!!

  • #2
    Not really sure how Ware retiring counts as removing leadership and an offseason mistake?
    sigpic

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    • #3
      True leadership is a rare trait but it takes time to develop. VJ is a young coach and hasn't gone through the growing pains of being the head coach of an organization. Trevor too.

      The unfortunate trend I've noticed within the last few years is the fickleness of the fans. The expectation of instant satisfaction doesn't reflect the reality of the sport and what it takes to be successful. Patience. Patience. Patience. Patience.
      I believe.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by XterraRob View Post
        True leadership is a rare trait but it takes time to develop. VJ is a young coach and hasn't gone through the growing pains of being the head coach of an organization. Trevor too.

        The unfortunate trend I've noticed within the last few years is the fickleness of the fans. The expectation of instant satisfaction doesn't reflect the reality of the sport and what it takes to be successful. Patience. Patience. Patience. Patience.
        The fans expect greatness and championship football because that is the culture and tradition of the Denver Broncos. They have a history of winning and Elway said so at his hiring presser. He had a 3 year plan to win a SB which took 5 but not complaining. But he and Pat Bowlen have instilled greatness and a championship culture in Denver. The minute you settle for less is when you achieve less.

        Sure.we get spoiled sometimes. But it’s because this organization has give us more than enough reason to.
        sigpic

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        • #5
          I gotta agree with this. Especially losing Ware and Ward. We've learned this in the past with this team and football in general, that there has to be a core of leadership.

          Unfortunately we had some debacles in the past with very talented teams but no true leaders. So, Elway went out and brought in talented leadership. It's effects were profound and got us over the hump. Then, we decided to remove that leadership. And last night is once again the profound change of lacking accountability demanded from leaders.

          Now Ware probably wasn't going to stay. However, Ward should have then become the priority. Coaching football, I get what impact guys like Ward have on a team. Their attitude is infectious and has a way of sparking up the team in moments like last night.

          It is what it is. Nothing is going to change the predicament but hopefully someone on this team can step up in the same role Ward did.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by // / yardo View Post
            I gotta agree with this. Especially losing Ware and Ward. We've learned this in the past with this team and football in general, that there has to be a core of leadership.

            Unfortunately we had some debacles in the past with very talented teams but no true leaders. So, Elway went out and brought in talented leadership. It's effects were profound and got us over the hump. Then, we decided to remove that leadership. And last night is once again the profound change of lacking accountability demanded from leaders.

            Now Ware probably wasn't going to stay. However, Ward should have then become the priority. Coaching football, I get what impact guys like Ward have on a team. Their attitude is infectious and has a way of sparking up the team in moments like last night.

            It is what it is. Nothing is going to change the predicament but hopefully someone on this team can step up in the same role Ward did.
            The problem with Ward being a leader is that it's tough to be a vocal leader when you're a backup or even deactivated on game day, and that's what was going to happen because Simmons won the job.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by DenverBlood View Post
              The fans expect greatness and championship football because that is the culture and tradition of the Denver Broncos. They have a history of winning and Elway said so at his hiring presser. He had a 3 year plan to win a SB which took 5 but not complaining. But he and Pat Bowlen have instilled greatness and a championship culture in Denver. The minute you settle for less is when you achieve less.

              Sure.we get spoiled sometimes. But it’s because this organization has give us more than enough reason to.
              Well, kinda.. Bronco fans have come to expect championships because of 1 position - QB. We had a great QB in Elway for many years and won. Then we picked up a great QB in Manning due to an injury situation and draft situation Indy was in. Outside of the years when we've had those great QBs our winning tradition was, uh, kind of weak. We had some good years with the Orange Crush D but even that was spotty. It's not a criticism as all teams need great QBs to win consistently but casual fans don't really understand how blessed we were with those 2 hall of fame QBs. You don't win championships without a great QB or some very fortunate bounces.
              And, no, Trevor is not going to get it done.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by XterraRob View Post
                True leadership is a rare trait but it takes time to develop. VJ is a young coach and hasn't gone through the growing pains of being the head coach of an organization. Trevor too.

                The unfortunate trend I've noticed within the last few years is the fickleness of the fans. The expectation of instant satisfaction doesn't reflect the reality of the sport and what it takes to be successful. Patience. Patience. Patience. Patience.
                I understand your point, but VJ seems to be too similar in nature to Fox. He does this rah, rah thing in the locker room after a loss that rings like Fox going "aw shucks guys, we almost won!" I don't feel that VJ can develop. He's too much of a players coach and not an authoritative figure that demands results on the field.
                To be clear, I'm not saying we should fire VJ, just stating that he appears to a Fox clone and we all know what Fox did for this team (bupkis)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by // / yardo View Post
                  I gotta agree with this. Especially losing Ware and Ward. We've learned this in the past with this team and football in general, that there has to be a core of leadership.

                  Unfortunately we had some debacles in the past with very talented teams but no true leaders. So, Elway went out and brought in talented leadership. It's effects were profound and got us over the hump. Then, we decided to remove that leadership. And last night is once again the profound change of lacking accountability demanded from leaders.

                  Now Ware probably wasn't going to stay. However, Ward should have then become the priority. Coaching football, I get what impact guys like Ward have on a team. Their attitude is infectious and has a way of sparking up the team in moments like last night.

                  It is what it is. Nothing is going to change the predicament but hopefully someone on this team can step up in the same role Ward did.
                  Ward has only started 1 game so far with Tampa, pretty hard to lead when you're on the bench.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by XterraRob View Post
                    True leadership is a rare trait but it takes time to develop. VJ is a young coach and hasn't gone through the growing pains of being the head coach of an organization. Trevor too.

                    The unfortunate trend I've noticed within the last few years is the fickleness of the fans. The expectation of instant satisfaction doesn't reflect the reality of the sport and what it takes to be successful. Patience. Patience. Patience. Patience.
                    Good thing your not running the team, we'd be like the jets and browns, just waiting waiting waiting.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      QB with Leadership

                      Originally posted by Chop_Block View Post
                      Well, kinda.. Bronco fans have come to expect championships because of 1 position - QB. We had a great QB in Elway for many years and won. Then we picked up a great QB in Manning due to an injury situation and draft situation Indy was in. Outside of the years when we've had those great QBs our winning tradition was, uh, kind of weak. We had some good years with the Orange Crush D but even that was spotty. It's not a criticism as all teams need great QBs to win consistently but casual fans don't really understand how blessed we were with those 2 hall of fame QBs. You don't win championships without a great QB or some very fortunate bounces.
                      And, no, Trevor is not going to get it done.
                      A QB with Leadership is a positive for sure. Even Tebow was a leader but did not have the skill required. The whole team was infected, as with Manning.
                      Every year the draft comes and talent is forefront, leadership is optional. I was all about Watson and he is flourishing in Houston. Look at Alex Smith, confident, gamer, and his team believes in him even though his talent was not considered real good.
                      I like Trever but cool under pressure is not enough. Until he really motivates and demands from his players he is not going to make it in the NFL.

                      A leader demands from his teammates and sets the example. That is the kind of players we need to draft...even in the sixth round.
                      This is the NFL!!

                      Don't sing it... Bring It!!!!!



                      Go Broncos!!!!!!!

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                      • #12
                        I'd have to disagree. Simmons may have talent, but he is not the on field presence and motivator as T.J. was.

                        Elway saw it as a opportunity to manage the cap. It was about money. Teams like Pittsburg kept there edge year after year through on field leadership. I'd say that teams like New England are willing to develop talent as long as leadership is established in the locker room. Finding both in one is not easy, but it is important to look for it and keep it once you find it.
                        This is the NFL!!

                        Don't sing it... Bring It!!!!!



                        Go Broncos!!!!!!!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by JED Bronco View Post
                          I'd have to disagree. Simmons may have talent, but he is not the on field presence and motivator as T.J. was.

                          Elway saw it as a opportunity to manage the cap. It was about money. Teams like Pittsburg kept there edge year after year through on field leadership. I'd say that teams like New England are willing to develop talent as long as leadership is established in the locker room. Finding both in one is not easy, but it is important to look for it and keep it once you find it.
                          He lost the position in camp because he couldn't get on the field and Simmons was on the field and played well. Being a vocal leader doesn't work well when you're either on the bench or deactivated. If Ward were a starter and playing it's a different story, but as a guy on the sidelines, it wouldn't have worked. Leadership is a little overrated, teams that win never seem to have leadership voids, it's teams that lose that do. The 85 Bears had two coaches who hated each other and one coach who fostered a hate between the O and D, they worked out fine. Same with the 2002 Bucs and 2003 Bucs. There wasn't much of a difference in roster, but the team that won had great leadership, the next year they didn't.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Butler By'Note View Post
                            He lost the position in camp because he couldn't get on the field and Simmons was on the field and played well. Being a vocal leader doesn't work well when you're either on the bench or deactivated. If Ward were a starter and playing it's a different story, but as a guy on the sidelines, it wouldn't have worked. Leadership is a little overrated, teams that win never seem to have leadership voids, it's teams that lose that do. The 85 Bears had two coaches who hated each other and one coach who fostered a hate between the O and D, they worked out fine. Same with the 2002 Bucs and 2003 Bucs. There wasn't much of a difference in roster, but the team that won had great leadership, the next year they didn't.
                            He was scheduled to play at he beginning of the season. He lost nothing and gained a good contract. Overconfidence in Simmons in my opinion since Simmons is not all that. He hasn't shown me much yet. Our pass D is not what it was and He is the only difference - except the coach.

                            Elway and company looked at talent and they got what they got.
                            This is the NFL!!

                            Don't sing it... Bring It!!!!!



                            Go Broncos!!!!!!!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I guess I see a lack of offensive leadership more so than defense. Offensive leadership doesn't always have to come from the QB either. Our defense has leaders, now they have to be encouraging too, but they have played hard and emotionally led us.

                              It may not go over well but maybe our defensive guys need to motivate our offensive guys more too. Not in a brash way but like Von Miller and Garrett Bollles challenging the best from each other.

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