Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Given Rumors and The State Of The Team, Whats The Best Direction?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Given Rumors and The State Of The Team, Whats The Best Direction?

    A new QB is badly needed but Cousins could bring cap hell. Rumors of Talib, DT, and Sanders getting cut; other notables possibly getting cut (ex: CJ). The window has basically closed for the Defense. The OL slightly better but still needs work. The #5 draft pick and 7 total picks (pre possible trades)

    What direction do you think is best to go overall?
    47
    QB Change Only: Playoff team & possible SB contender w/ Cousins. VJ on hot seat
    4.26%
    2
    Minor Rebuild: Sign Cousins, Improve OL, Cut Big Cap Hits, Retool D. WC possible. VJ on hot seat.
    48.94%
    23
    Major Rebuild: Draft QB, Sign Vet QB, Overhaul O, Retool D. No playoffs til '19. VJ safe short term
    42.55%
    20
    Complete Rebuild: Draft QB/start day 1. Overhaul O & D. No playoffs til '20. VJ safe long term.
    4.26%
    2

    The poll is expired.

    Denver Broncos
    New York Yankees
    New York Knicks
    Colorado Avalanche


    sigpic

  • #2
    I'd go with major rebuild.

    1) Draft a QB. We're in a special position with the #5 pick in a draft that's top-heavy at QB. If we get a QB at #5, the money saved with the rookie contract can be spent on several reinforcements and this team has a lot of needs. Sign a veteran backup to serve as a mentor, but the rookie QB starts from day one.

    I don't think Elway can convince Kirk Cousins to come to Denver with this offensive line, this group of WRs that might not include D. Thomas and/or Sanders, no proven TE, no impact RB and a defense that might lose Talib, Wolfe (injury/cap casualty) and other pieces as the team makes moves to fit Cousins' salary into the cap.

    2) Overhaul the offense. D. Thomas is not worth his salary and Sanders has become a distraction, one or both of them will be gone. The team needs an impact TE and we haven't seen Jake Butt yet. RT is a major need. There's no impact RB on the roster, only plodders and the unknown Henderson. The offense needs a lot of work besides QB, it will take a bunch of draft picks and salary cap to fix this.

    3) Retool the defense. Talib is gone. We have to find a quality CB that can either play nickel or beat Roby for a starting job. Langley is a joke. a practice-squad project. Wolfe is constantly injured and might retire or become a cap casualty. There is a major need for inside pass rush. The LBs are gone in free agency and we need coverage LBs badly. We also need another edge rusher to stop wasting DeMarcus Walker at OLB.

    4) But no, Vance Joseph is not safe, not even short term. He will be on the hot seat, coaching for his job this next season. If we start a rookie QB, the expectations will be lower, but Elway will pay attention to Joseph's decisions and how he's preparing this team. Another season with a bunch of blowout losses and the impression of an unprepared team will mean the end for Vance Joseph.
    sigpic

    Comment


    • #3
      #3 - Major Rebuild with Vance Joseph having no job security at all, he hasn't earned it

      1: This coaching staff is inept, and I can't see any reason why they were kept on for another season, I believe it will only compound the issues which were presented last season and it shows that mediocrity is acceptable to the playing group. After the Washington game and the way that Joe Woods and Vance Joseph played right into the game plan of Washington's offense, and failed to adjust their defensive game plan as the game went along, I have been done with them. They should not be here, nor be safe short-term or long-term, and I can't believe Elway stuck with this group of coaches.

      2: We have a bunch of bad contracts on the books on both offense and defense, and we need to clear some money, not for Kirk Cousins, just to hopefully bring in some fresh faces and change things up. Right now we have Von Miller, Demaryius Thomas, Derek Wolfe, Emmanuel Sanders, Aqib Talib, Menelik Watson, CJ Anderson, and Brandon Marshall all making too much money. I would say outside of Von Miller, the rest are overrated and expendable. Dead money will come into play at some point, but we need to clear some bad contracts.

      3: We have no young talent on this team who are playing major roles on offense or defense. When John Elway first took over in 2011, he said he wanted 3 starters from the draft, and he got that out of Von Miller, Rahim Moore, and Orlando Franklin. He needs to have that same mentality in this draft because we need some players who make an impact on rookie contracts for a few years, because overpaying veterans who are not doing enough is hurting this team. We have high picks in the first 3 rounds of the draft, and we can add 3 impact players from these spots, this draft is very important for the future of this team.

      4: We need to be willing to give young players chances to make an impact. I can't believe that despite the losing season that we stuck with veteran guys who were playing poorly, it was the perfect time to blood new talent, but we wasted it. And the thing which hurts even more, every time one of the young guys got a chance, they looked like improvements. Connor McGovern, Cyrus Kouandijo, DeAngelo Henderson, and DeMarcus Walker all had some good plays down the stretch when they finally got some opportunities. Austin Traylor and Shelby Harris seen snaps consistently throughout the back half of the season and looked like upgrades to the guys who were playing ahead of them. John Fox was always criticised for not playing young guys, but I think that was a little unfair because early on when he got to Denver, and took on a bad roster left from the McDaniels era, he played a lot of the new young guys brought in under him and Elway. Quinton Carter, Rahim Moore, Chris Harris, Orlando Franklin, Von Miller, Virgil Green, Danny Trevathan, Malik Jackson, Ronnie Hillman, and Derek Wolfe. We need Elway to add some quality draft picks, and Joseph to play them.

      Comment


      • #4
        Great posts and spot on. One of the major things that baffled me this year was to keep playing players who just stunk. Yet we had folks like Shelby Harris & Cody Latimer sitting on the sidelines. I hope Joseph got the message & it seems he did that YOU are the coach and your job is on the line. This is the year to step up and act like you care. Stop trying to defer to the other coaches and trust what you see. I mean it must be frustrating for guys like Peko & Von playing their hearts out just to watch the offense keep laying eggs. Blow it up & get young talent that is hungry. Not only the big names, but there are tons of players that may not get the media but are far more talented that what we put out there. I mean Theilen from the Vikes was undrafted.
        Bronco Bob

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by -Rod- View Post
          I'd go with major rebuild.

          1) Draft a QB. We're in a special position with the #5 pick in a draft that's top-heavy at QB. If we get a QB at #5, the money saved with the rookie contract can be spent on several reinforcements and this team has a lot of needs. Sign a veteran backup to serve as a mentor, but the rookie QB starts from day one.

          I don't think Elway can convince Kirk Cousins to come to Denver with this offensive line, this group of WRs that might not include D. Thomas and/or Sanders, no proven TE, no impact RB and a defense that might lose Talib, Wolfe (injury/cap casualty) and other pieces as the team makes moves to fit Cousins' salary into the cap.

          2) Overhaul the offense. D. Thomas is not worth his salary and Sanders has become a distraction, one or both of them will be gone. The team needs an impact TE and we haven't seen Jake Butt yet. RT is a major need. There's no impact RB on the roster, only plodders and the unknown Henderson. The offense needs a lot of work besides QB, it will take a bunch of draft picks and salary cap to fix this.

          3) Retool the defense. Talib is gone. We have to find a quality CB that can either play nickel or beat Roby for a starting job. Langley is a joke. a practice-squad project. Wolfe is constantly injured and might retire or become a cap casualty. There is a major need for inside pass rush. The LBs are gone in free agency and we need coverage LBs badly. We also need another edge rusher to stop wasting DeMarcus Walker at OLB.

          4) But no, Vance Joseph is not safe, not even short term. He will be on the hot seat, coaching for his job this next season. If we start a rookie QB, the expectations will be lower, but Elway will pay attention to Joseph's decisions and how he's preparing this team. Another season with a bunch of blowout losses and the impression of an unprepared team will mean the end for Vance Joseph.
          Pretty much sumarizes what I am feeling.
          sigpic
          "I'm scared if I stop all at once, the cumulative hangover will literally kill me."

          Comment


          • #6
            I can see the appeal of a total rebuild, draft a QB, start him day 1, drop some of the veterans, save some cap space, roll it into next year.

            On the opposite end, are we overreacting to one bad season? This has been one of the most successful teams since the 80's, they never had an all out rebuild, do we change that strategy now? The team committed 34 turnovers (a horrible -17 turnover differential), most of those by the QBs, get a better QB and RT, cut the turnovers in half and we likely see a much better team next year.

            By keeping VJ there's no way they're thinking total rebuild, they desperately want him to succeed, and will give him all the pieces he needs in 2018 to succeed. VJ will not survive a rebuild, he liklely wouldn't make it past week 8 on rebuilding team. If they wanted a total rebuild, they needed to start with a new coach.

            They'll likely drop a couple veterans (Talib, Sanders), try their hardest to get Kirk Cousins and a new RT, then probably draft somebody like Barkley. It'll be a reboot (or whatever VJ called it), not a rebuild

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by -Rod- View Post
              I'd go with major rebuild.

              1) Draft a QB. We're in a special position with the #5 pick in a draft that's top-heavy at QB. If we get a QB at #5, the money saved with the rookie contract can be spent on several reinforcements and this team has a lot of needs. Sign a veteran backup to serve as a mentor, but the rookie QB starts from day one.

              I don't think Elway can convince Kirk Cousins to come to Denver with this offensive line, this group of WRs that might not include D. Thomas and/or Sanders, no proven TE, no impact RB and a defense that might lose Talib, Wolfe (injury/cap casualty) and other pieces as the team makes moves to fit Cousins' salary into the cap.

              2) Overhaul the offense. D. Thomas is not worth his salary and Sanders has become a distraction, one or both of them will be gone. The team needs an impact TE and we haven't seen Jake Butt yet. RT is a major need. There's no impact RB on the roster, only plodders and the unknown Henderson. The offense needs a lot of work besides QB, it will take a bunch of draft picks and salary cap to fix this.

              3) Retool the defense. Talib is gone. We have to find a quality CB that can either play nickel or beat Roby for a starting job. Langley is a joke. a practice-squad project. Wolfe is constantly injured and might retire or become a cap casualty. There is a major need for inside pass rush. The LBs are gone in free agency and we need coverage LBs badly. We also need another edge rusher to stop wasting DeMarcus Walker at OLB.

              4) But no, Vance Joseph is not safe, not even short term. He will be on the hot seat, coaching for his job this next season. If we start a rookie QB, the expectations will be lower, but Elway will pay attention to Joseph's decisions and how he's preparing this team. Another season with a bunch of blowout losses and the impression of an unprepared team will mean the end for Vance Joseph.
              I truly do not understand the dismissal of C.J. Anderson on these boards. He just had his best season ever and was by far the best player on offense. No impact? Who had the huge run against N.E. two years ago in the snow? Who was the best offensive player in the SB with 90 yards rushing and the game sealing td?
              Last edited by gerontion; 01-24-2018, 04:51 AM.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by gerontion View Post
                I truly do not understand the dismissal of C.J. Anderson on these boards. He just had his best season ever and was by far the best player on offense. No impact? Who had the huge run against N.E. two years ago in the snow? Who was the best offensive player in the SB with 90 yards rushing and the game sealing td?
                I disagree he just had his best season ever. I would take his 1,173 total yards and 10 touchdowns in 2014 over his 1,231 total yards and 4 touchdowns this season. He had 147 less touches last season and scored 1 more touchdown. Run blocking was pretty decent this season and I did not see Anderson have many impressive runs.

                Anderson finally had his first 1,000-yard season as a runner after not leaving the field so much with injuries. I like that he is a complete RB, but he's constantly banged up and does not offer breakaway speed. Obviously, after 5 seasons in the NFL, he's had his moments and big plays, but Anderson is mostly a grinder that fights for tough yards. He will carry defenders for a couple yards rather than make shifty moves and show some burst to find daylight.

                We need a big-time RB that can go all the way on the open field, a special RB like Alvin Kamara and Kareem Hunt. I don't think Anderson is that kind of RB. It feels like Anderson and Booker are interchangeable plodders, a combination that does not offer a change of pace. I doubt defensive coordinators think they really have to prepare for Anderson, he's an 'okay' 3-down RB.

                Then there is the salary issue. Anderson will make $4.5 million in 2018, without guaranteed money. Considering the current search for a QB and the potential need for cap space, Elway will probably take a good look at Anderson and that $4.5 million salary. We can move on from that salary, perhaps even get a draft pick, let Booker play Anderson's role and draft a cheaper, more explosive RB in a strong class.

                I appreciate Anderson as a 3-down RB, but I don't think we can count on his durability and he's not the homerun hitter this offense needs.
                sigpic

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by gerontion View Post
                  I truly do not understand the dismissal of C.J. Anderson on these boards. He just had his best season ever and was by far the best player on offense. No impact? Who had the huge run against N.E. two years ago in the snow? Who was the best offensive player in the SB with 90 yards rushing and the game sealing td?
                  Because he’s boring. He doesn’t make weekly highlight reels. That’s what I’ve come to make of it. I’ve asked that same question for 3 seasons now. He is part of the solution, not part of the problem. Major mistake trying to replace him instead of making him the feature of the offense. Goal should be 20-25 carries/game and keeping our best offensive player here in Denver.
                  #swapping

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The Broncos are at a fork in the road as I see it:

                    If they go with a FA Vet QB, then they can get away with a 'minor rebuild' and likely field a playoff level team next season assuming they keep the skilled Vets, like Talib, Sanders, Anderson, etc. and draft for the holes, i.e. RT, LG, ILB, etc.

                    If they draft a QB, then making the playoffs is not a realistic expectation and they should consider a 3-year major rebuild and jettison all the skilled vets.

                    In theory, both seem like viable and realistic options. However, what scares me is Elway sucks at drafting and the jury is still out on Vance Joseph so I am not confident in the front office's ability to do anything.

                    My gut tells me that yet again Elway makes poor decisions and within 3-years Mr. Bowlen's successor is named and Elway finishes out his 5-year contract as a team Ambassador and Kubiak or some other person (maybe Manning or John Lynch) is brought in to run the team. I just don't think the current cast of characters gets it done.
                    sigpic

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I’m not in favor of anything involving Kirk Cousins as the solution at quarterback.
                      My Opinion isn’t determined by what the Popular Opinion is. Sometimes I agree with the Majority, Sometimes I Don’t. If My Opinion is Different than Yours, I have to Ask One Question:
                      You Mad Bro?
                      Don’t Be A Mean Girl

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by flosstein View Post
                        He is part of the solution, not part of the problem. Major mistake trying to replace him instead of making him the feature of the offense. Goal should be 20-25 carries/game and keeping our best offensive player here in Denver.
                        I agree that, since he's on the roster getting paid like a starting RB, he should carry the load and that's how our offense worked best: with the #1 RB, Anderson, getting plenty of carries. I even have posts asking for that instead of a 3-RB rotation. However, with a $4.5 salary, he might become a cap casualty because we can get a more explosive runner with better big-play ability in this strong draft class and let Booker grind it out on inside runs. We can upgrade at RB and save some money to build the roster and that's what Elway might do.
                        sigpic

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Surprised to see so many comments to “rebuild around a rookie QB”. I don’t see the majority of fans being patient enough to accept the realities of a rebuild.

                          If the rookie does not come out of the gates looking spectacular or makes the ineviable mistakes I think the social media mobs would be out in force demanding Elway’ head and complaining that Kelly or whichever 7th rounder “looked good in camp” should obviously be starting.

                          I prefer they overpay the price for a legitimate starter like Cousins if at all possible. No more QB competitions. No more sub par mediocrity being called acceptable. I prefer going into OTAs with a clear cut leader and stability.

                          I like Anderson. He gives the Broncos a stable leader. But can Booker provide similar for less? Can Henderson provide some explosiveness? I would love to see the threat of a big play every time they hand off the ball.

                          That is not Anderson. If it costs cutting him to get it I can live with that.

                          Broncos can effectively “reload” instead of rebuild.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by FR Tim View Post
                            Surprised to see so many comments to “rebuild around a rookie QB”. I don’t see the majority of fans being patient enough to accept the realities of a rebuild.

                            If the rookie does not come out of the gates looking spectacular or makes the ineviable mistakes I think the social media mobs would be out in force demanding Elway’ head and complaining that Kelly or whichever 7th rounder “looked good in camp” should obviously be starting.

                            I prefer they overpay the price for a legitimate starter like Cousins if at all possible. No more QB competitions. No more sub par mediocrity being called acceptable. I prefer going into OTAs with a clear cut leader and stability.

                            I like Anderson. He gives the Broncos a stable leader. But can Booker provide similar for less? Can Henderson provide some explosiveness? I would love to see the threat of a big play every time they hand off the ball.

                            That is not Anderson. If it costs cutting him to get it I can live with that.

                            Broncos can effectively “reload” instead of rebuild.
                            I don't know... fans had patience with Cutler, most were mad when McDaniels did that idiotic trade. The majority even had patience with Siemian for awhile, until it was obvious he couldn't do it.

                            After 3 years with probably the worst QB play in the league, I think most fans would give a rookie (high 1st round pick) QB a couple years as long as the team shows improvement over that time.

                            For the majority to get behind him though, he has to be the starter from day 1, and he has to show flashes, something to get excited about. The problem is Lynch showed absolutely nothing, then you add on the rumors about work ethic, teammates not liking him etc.

                            If we start off training camp with another QB competition, everybody will pick their favorite, and entire fanbase will never get behind the new guy. If we draft a rookie he has to be the unquestioned starter, we also need a backup who knows he's a backup, not somebody who will be waiting for his chance to take over the starting spot.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Maybe that is true. Maybe a rookie can earn that respect and patience. I am skeptical.

                              But I am not opposed to a rookie. If expectations can be tempered. Because all the top have significant flaws and will need time to develop.

                              Also the Broncos fanbase will “take sides” no matter who is on the roster. Cousins will be “overpaid” , the rookies all “busts” or “not the right pick” and the invariable “ late rounder should get his shot “ mantra .

                              Cousins is really the only FA QB I have much enthusiasm for. He stabalizes the position for the next five years. Even if overpaid.

                              None of the other FAs or possible vet trades have that cache or my interest If not him then fine with drafting a rookie as the day one starter. Going to trust the scouts and coaches make the right choice and give him the best system to succeed

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X