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  • Originally posted by BeelzeBob View Post
    I stand by what I said. Our OL is average. Our QB is below average.
    No, you haven’t stood by what you said. You said Flacco holds the ball too long. If you can provide some examples broken down in detail as I have, then you can stand by what you say. That would take real effort, something you haven’t done.

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    • Originally posted by atwaterandstir View Post
      I see many calling for Lock but I am yet to see one thing from the team that leads me to believe he is even in consideration to be the Broncos starting QB.

      The questionable I.R. designation was one of many situations including more recently the Flacco restructure. However, more alarming was the 9 draft day picks that were traded between our picks 20 and 41. Despite having picks 41 and 57 (at that point) we didn't make a move to secure Lock. Seemingly having no fear of these 9 other teams jumping them for Lock. When he was still available after we picked Risner at 41 then we made a move at 42.....even ensuring a (slightly) lower contract for Lock.

      Truth be told the team has handled Drew Lock like they view him as a backup QB.
      They're treating him like he is a rookie that needed time to develop.....

      Of course he isn't being considered for the starting gig, he's on IR?!?!? We have no idea who was targeting Lock, there were rumors that GB was interested as a grooming project behind Rogers. NY was so worried that other teams were going to Target Jones if they passed and panicked and took him at 6.

      The main reason (from what I've heard) they put him on IR was so there wouldn't be any fan backlash and calling for the backup when/if Flacco sucked. I guarantee that would be happening already and will be happening when he is activated. The team will have to at some point see what he can offer because Flacco's 26th ranked offense is going to continue to lose us games.
      Last edited by JvDub95; 10-12-2019, 06:55 PM.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Fantaztic7 View Post
        No, you haven’t stood by what you said. You said Flacco holds the ball too long. If you can provide some examples broken down in detail as I have, then you can stand by what you say. That would take real effort, something you haven’t done.
        2011 article......

        https://profootballtalk-nbcsports-co...eague-in-holdi


        2017 article.....

        https://ftw-usatoday-com.cdn.ampproj...ury-film-study

        And a quote from this article.....


        "Flacco was once one of the league’s biggest gunslingers. Now he’s a conservative version of Alex Smith. "

        Comment


        • Originally posted by atwaterandstir View Post
          I see many calling for Lock but I am yet to see one thing from the team that leads me to believe he is even in consideration to be the Broncos starting QB.

          The questionable I.R. designation was one of many situations including more recently the Flacco restructure. However, more alarming was the 9 draft day picks that were traded between our picks 20 and 41. Despite having picks 41 and 57 (at that point) we didn't make a move to secure Lock. Seemingly having no fear of these 9 other teams jumping them for Lock. When he was still available after we picked Risner at 41 then we made a move at 42.....even ensuring a (slightly) lower contract for Lock.

          Truth be told the team has handled Drew Lock like they view him as a backup QB.
          Teams don’t draft QBs in the 2nd round if all they see them as is a backup.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by JvDub95 View Post
            They're treating him like he is a rookie that needed time to develop.....

            Of course he isn't being considered for the starting gig, he's on IR?!?!? We have no idea who was targeting Lock, there were rumors that GB was interested as a grooming project behind Rogers. NY was so worried that other teams were going to Target Jones if they passed and panicked and took him at 6.

            The main reason (from what I've read) they put him on IR was so there wouldn't be any fan backlash and calling for the backup when/if Flacco sucked. I guarantee that would be happening already and will be happening when he is activated. The team will have to at some point see what he can offer because Flacco's 26th ranked offense is going to continue to lose us games.
            Or, the team wanted to protect Lock’s future by not risking further injury. It was reported Lock had a Grade 2 sprain, which involves partial tear of the ligament. Although he didn’t require surgery it was still a bad sprain. In that scenario you don’t want a guy to push too fast. The Broncos didn’t know they would open the season 0-4, so it’s ridiculous to believe he went on IR to avoid controversy. If the Broncos were concerned with a controversy they wouldn’t have drafted a quarterback.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by JvDub95 View Post
              2011 article......

              https://profootballtalk-nbcsports-co...eague-in-holdi


              2017 article.....

              https://ftw-usatoday-com.cdn.ampproj...ury-film-study

              And a quote from this article.....


              "Flacco was once one of the league’s biggest gunslingers. Now he’s a conservative version of Alex Smith. "
              Articles from 2016-17 aren’t relevant to games being played in 2019 with a new offense and OC.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Fantaztic7 View Post
                Articles from 2016-17 aren’t relevant to games being played in 2019 with a new offense and OC.
                Completely relevant.......in 5 years he was the same player then and he is the same player now

                Comment


                • Originally posted by JvDub95 View Post
                  Completely relevant.......in 5 years he was the same player then and he is the same player now
                  Joe’s 66.7% comp rate and 7.5 yards/attempt are career highs. Yards per game and rating are above career averages. Objectively, he’s improving. Those articles aren’t relevant because he’s not as conservative as the quote you posted. The yards per attempt disprove that point.

                  By the way I support Lock playing if and when the Broncos are eliminated from the playoffs.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by JvDub95 View Post
                    They're treating him like he is a rookie that needed time to develop.....

                    Of course he isn't being considered for the starting gig, he's on IR?!?!? We have no idea who was targeting Lock, there were rumors that GB was interested as a grooming project behind Rogers. NY was so worried that other teams were going to Target Jones if they passed and panicked and took him at 6.

                    The main reason (from what I've read) they put him on IR was so there wouldn't be any fan backlash and calling for the backup when/if Flacco sucked. I guarantee that would be happening already and will be happening when he is activated. The team will have to at some point see what he can offer because Flacco's 26th ranked offense is going to continue to lose us games.
                    After IR, obviously......are you serious with that? If that point confused you I doubt you are understanding the draft day logic I was implying.

                    As for your second point, that's exactly right......teams panic when they are afraid their QB might get away. It may be the only position of panic in the entire draft.
                    Our team did the complete opposite of panic and actually waited while all these picks (between 20-41) were being traded. No matter how bad of GM people think Elway is, nobody would sit back and watch all that movement of they truly feared their franchise QB had a chance to get away.

                    And "fan back lash" is a ridiculous reason to think he went on IR. If Elway even remotely feared anything like that, then restructuring Flacco into guarantees would NEVER have been considered.
                    Last edited by atwaterandstir; 10-12-2019, 07:28 PM.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Fantaztic7 View Post
                      Joe’s 66.7% comp rate and 7.5 yards/attempt are career highs. Yards per game and rating are above career averages. Objectively, he’s improving. Those articles aren’t relevant because he’s not as conservative as the quote you posted. The yards per attempt disprove that point.

                      By the way I support Lock playing if and when the Broncos are eliminated from the playoffs.
                      I was helping Bob out because I agree with him, I watch the games and I see him holding it way too long and taking sacks and costly picks because of it. He's holding almost as bad as Keenum did. I don't see how completion percentage and yards per attempt have anything to do with holding onto the ball too long.

                      If he had any kind of scrambling ability holding the ball wouldn't be that big of a deal. Wilson is the king of it but he can move around unlike the statue that is named Flacco
                      Last edited by JvDub95; 10-12-2019, 07:30 PM.

                      Comment


                      • Flacco’s stats through 5 games:

                        66.7% comp rate
                        1258 pass yards
                        6 TD
                        251.6 yards/game
                        7.5 yards gained/attempt
                        11.5 yards gained/completion
                        90.8 rating

                        Just for clarification is Flacco average or below average?

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Fantaztic7 View Post
                          Flacco’s stats through 5 games:

                          66.7% comp rate
                          1258 pass yards
                          6 TD
                          251.6 yards/game
                          7.5 yards gained/attempt
                          11.5 yards gained/completion
                          90.8 rating

                          Just for clarification is Flacco average or below average?
                          Stats don't tell the story....26th ranked scoring offense, below avg

                          Comment


                          • If Flacco had some escape ability it would be ok, but he makes me hold my breath every time that pocket collapses. For such a seasoned QB his pocket awareness is awful.

                            If he has always played like that in the pocket it would have been really hard to be a fan of that Ravens team for as long as he was there. It's hard enough trying to become a fan of his now for the time being.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by JvDub95 View Post
                              I was helping Bob out because I agree with him, I watch the games and I see him holding it way too long and taking sacks and costly picks because of it. He's holding almost as bad as Keenum did. I don't see how completion percentage and yards per attempt have anything to do with holding onto the ball too long.

                              If he had any kind of scrambling ability holding the ball wouldn't be that big of a deal. Wilson is the king of it but he can move around unlike the statue that is named Flacco
                              You pulled this quote from the article:

                              "Flacco was once one of the league’s biggest gunslingers. Now he’s a conservative version of Alex Smith.”

                              Now, you changed the topic after posting that quote because the facts from this season disprove your quote. It’s also a fact that Flacco is playing better than his career average including career highs for comp% and yards gained/attempt. The fact that his yards gained per attempt is a career high completely disproves any notion that he’s the same.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by JvDub95 View Post
                                Stats don't tell the story....26th ranked scoring offense, below avg
                                I didn’t ask about the offense - is Joe an average or below average quarterback based on those stats?

                                Comment

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