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  • Originally posted by Capt. Jack View Post
    Elway has been a great GM for the Broncos, 2 Super Bowl appearances, and a Super Bowl championship!
    If we replace him, who would be a better GM for the Broncos ?
    (Elway should have learned a lot by this point, and is an experienced GM now.)
    Any GM could have done what Elway did with Manning at QB. It’s what he’s done after Manning that’s really defined him as a GM, which is a complete failure with no HOF QB to clean up his mess.

    Comment


    • Elway is a great GM!!!
      NFL FOOTBALL GOD
      (IMHO)
      https://i.imgur.com/YpWz9fm.jpg

      Comment


      • Originally posted by samparnell View Post
        The O-Line starters in the first game were Bolles, Leary, Paradis, McGovern and Veldheer. They played all the snaps in game 1 against Seattle.

        Veldheer started game 2 against Oakland, but was hurt and left the game after 32 snaps. Turner took 35 snaps the rest of the way, I believe. Veldheer was Questionable for game 3 at Baltimore, but started and played all the snaps at RT. Veldheer started against KC, but played 16 snaps before Turner came in for the remaining 44.

        Veldheer was out for the following game at NYJ, so Turner took all the snaps at RT in that game. Bolles had to leave the game for 12 snaps and Wilkinson filled in.

        I had forgotten that McGovern missed the start against the Rams in game 6. Veldheer was Questionable for that game and did not play. Turner started at RT and took all the snaps along with Bolles and Paradis. Leary started at LG, but played 38 of the 66 snaps. He was out for the next game and on IR after that. Garcia started at RG and took 44 of the 66 snaps. McGovern had 50 snaps against the Rams.

        Veldheer was Out for game 7 at Arizona and game 8 against KC. Bolles, Garcia, Paradis, McGovern and Turner started and played all the snaps in game 7 at AZ and in game 8 at KC.

        Veldheer was back for the second half of the season and took over at RT against the Texans in game 9. Paradis got hurt after playing 26 of the 66 snaps and Wilkinson came in for the remaining 40 snaps with McGovern moving to C, I believe. Paradis was on IR the rest of the season as was Max Garcia.

        After the bye, the starters in game 10 at LA Chargers were Bolles, Turner, McGovern, Wilkinson and Veldheer and they took all the snaps in that game. Same for game 11 against the Steelers, game 12 at Cincinnati, game 13 at San Francisco, game 14 against the Browns and for game 15 at Oakland. They also started the last game against the Chargers, but Gradkowski and Jones got some snaps, too.

        There are several reasons O-Line coaches shuffle their guys. They want to see how well they play at different spots. They try to find the best spot for each guy. And, they are looking for the right chemistry among their players. Shuffling is also necessary when dealing with injuries to starters.
        With all due respect, this post was a rambling waste of time, and doesn't really address the decisions I referenced as being silly ones. Connor McGovern was getting it done throughout the first 5 weeks of the season, especially as a run blocker, you watch closely, you would of known that. Do you recall then when Joseph said "changes are coming", and everyone thought quarterback, defensive coordinator, something drastic. Well, the change was moving out Connor McGovern for Max Garcia, you didn't answer, you rambled, did you think that was a smart move ?

        What did you think of the 2017 move I referenced, when we rotated guards every other series ? A positional group that relies on continuity, having a key piece constantly rotated is something I do not recall seeing very often ever in the NFL, again speaking to the stupidity of the coaches a year ago. The guy they were rotating in was also the guy they decided to bring into the lineup when they benched McGovern going into the Rams games as I said, 1 month before the Paradis injury you thought was the reason Garcia began playing.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by johnlimburg View Post
          With all due respect, this post was a rambling waste of time, and doesn't really address the decisions I referenced as being silly ones. Connor McGovern was getting it done throughout the first 5 weeks of the season, especially as a run blocker, you watch closely, you would of known that. Do you recall then when Joseph said "changes are coming", and everyone thought quarterback, defensive coordinator, something drastic. Well, the change was moving out Connor McGovern for Max Garcia, you didn't answer, you rambled, did you think that was a smart move ?

          What did you think of the 2017 move I referenced, when we rotated guards every other series ? A positional group that relies on continuity, having a key piece constantly rotated is something I do not recall seeing very often ever in the NFL, again speaking to the stupidity of the coaches a year ago. The guy they were rotating in was also the guy they decided to bring into the lineup when they benched McGovern going into the Rams games as I said, 1 month before the Paradis injury you thought was the reason Garcia began playing.
          Sorry to have wasted your time. A note for future reference might be to skip reading my posts. As far as addressing the O-Line shuffling decisions of 2018 are concerned, I reviewed the whole season on a game-by-game basis including the Rams game in which Connor McGovern had fifty snaps.

          It wasn't a futile exercise for me because it reminded me of Veldheer's struggles in the first half of the season and refreshed my memory about the order in which the starters went on IR or missed games.

          I feel like I understand the 2018 O-Line situation and don't think it's worth an argument. It's all in the past now as there is a new coaching staff including new O-Line coaches. The best thing about 2018 is that it's over. No sense in harboring bitterness or picking a fight about it.
          "Stultum est timere quod vitare non potes." ~ Publilius Syrus

          Comment


          • Originally posted by samparnell View Post
            Sorry to have wasted your time. A note for future reference might be to skip reading my posts.
            THAT is funny!
            The best thing about 2018 is that it's over.
            Thank God it is. Hopefully Elway and the rest of the FO have made good decisions with the new coaching staff and will make even better ones with the draft and free agency. Although I do not believe Flacco was a good one because really 99% of the members here would be better than KeenumSucks.
            [URL=http://s93.photobucket.com/user/Saddletramp69/media/asdf.jpg.html][/URL
            Adopted player Lindsey

            Comment


            • Originally posted by samparnell View Post
              The O-Line starters in the first game were Bolles, Leary, Paradis, McGovern and Veldheer. They played all the snaps in game 1 against Seattle.

              Veldheer started game 2 against Oakland, but was hurt and left the game after 32 snaps. Turner took 35 snaps the rest of the way, I believe. Veldheer was Questionable for game 3 at Baltimore, but started and played all the snaps at RT. Veldheer started against KC, but played 16 snaps before Turner came in for the remaining 44.

              Veldheer was out for the following game at NYJ, so Turner took all the snaps at RT in that game. Bolles had to leave the game for 12 snaps and Wilkinson filled in.

              I had forgotten that McGovern missed the start against the Rams in game 6. Veldheer was Questionable for that game and did not play. Turner started at RT and took all the snaps along with Bolles and Paradis. Leary started at LG, but played 38 of the 66 snaps. He was out for the next game and on IR after that. Garcia started at RG and took 44 of the 66 snaps. McGovern had 50 snaps against the Rams.

              Veldheer was Out for game 7 at Arizona and game 8 against KC. Bolles, Garcia, Paradis, McGovern and Turner started and played all the snaps in game 7 at AZ and in game 8 at KC.

              Veldheer was back for the second half of the season and took over at RT against the Texans in game 9. Paradis got hurt after playing 26 of the 66 snaps and Wilkinson came in for the remaining 40 snaps with McGovern moving to C, I believe. Paradis was on IR the rest of the season as was Max Garcia.

              After the bye, the starters in game 10 at LA Chargers were Bolles, Turner, McGovern, Wilkinson and Veldheer and they took all the snaps in that game. Same for game 11 against the Steelers, game 12 at Cincinnati, game 13 at San Francisco, game 14 against the Browns and for game 15 at Oakland. They also started the last game against the Chargers, but Gradkowski and Jones got some snaps, too.

              There are several reasons O-Line coaches shuffle their guys. They want to see how well they play at different spots. They try to find the best spot for each guy. And, they are looking for the right chemistry among their players. Shuffling is also necessary when dealing with injuries to starters.

              Thanks for the breakdown. This really highlights the lack of continuity on the line. It's frustrating for me to see O-Linemen struggle consistently over a very long period of time (I'm looking at you, Garcia) but I'm hoping that having a really, really good O-Line Coach will bring stability to this group and that we'll get the best out of what we have.
              Adopt-A-Bronco: Jonathon Cooper

              Comment


              • Originally posted by samparnell View Post
                Sorry to have wasted your time. A note for future reference might be to skip reading my posts. As far as addressing the O-Line shuffling decisions of 2018 are concerned, I reviewed the whole season on a game-by-game basis including the Rams game in which Connor McGovern had fifty snaps.

                It wasn't a futile exercise for me because it reminded me of Veldheer's struggles in the first half of the season and refreshed my memory about the order in which the starters went on IR or missed games.

                I feel like I understand the 2018 O-Line situation and don't think it's worth an argument. It's all in the past now as there is a new coaching staff including new O-Line coaches. The best thing about 2018 is that it's over. No sense in harboring bitterness or picking a fight about it.
                It wasn't a waste of my time, and I enjoy reading your posts, just the information you provided this time here wasn't related to what I actually had said. I also wasn't trying to argue for the record, you just said "IIRC", and I just highlighted it actually happened differently to what you stated, that is all. I also felt it was an attempt to talk down to me at the same time which is fine, but it was done so in a way with information which was completely irrelevant to what I actually said, that's all.

                I know you broke down the offensive line here and the changes which constantly occurred, and you have looked up the snap counts for offensive lineman in certain games, but for future reference, the starting lineup against the Rams was actually Bolles, Leary, Paradis. Garcia, Turner, as seen in the picture from the first play below, with Paradis healthy.



                Also, here is the article in which I was referencing, where Vance Joseph said that "changes are coming", when his coaching staff decided to bench Connor McGovern for Max Garcia. If you remember correctly that was the original point I stated that was confusing, which you said you disagreed with. Believe it or not, some other people do watch the games closely as well, and from time to time do know what they are saying in relation to the team, thanks.

                https://sports.yahoo.com/vance-josep...143350375.html

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Saddletramp View Post
                  THAT is funny!
                  Thank God it is. Hopefully Elway and the rest of the FO have made good decisions with the new coaching staff and will make even better ones with the draft and free agency. Although I do not believe Flacco was a good one because really 99% of the members here would be better than KeenumSucks.
                  So far Elway seems to be winning the off season but I don’t want to speak too soon there!

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Sam_Z View Post
                    So far Elway seems to be winning the off season but I don’t want to speak too soon there!
                    What has he won? So far all I've seen is that we've broke even on the QB position, and got ourselves out of the Keenum mess that Elway himself created. Right now Elway has some ways to go before this team is in competitive shape with all the holes at nearly every single position.
                    Superbowl 50 Champions!

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by TheAsianPA View Post
                      What has he won? So far all I've seen is that we've broke even on the QB position, and got ourselves out of the Keenum mess that Elway himself created. Right now Elway has some ways to go before this team is in competitive shape with all the holes at nearly every single position.
                      I’d give him a big win for the coaching staff. And I would take Flacco over Keemun any day... the only bad thing is the dead cap from Keenum.

                      Now I don’t think Elway is dominating since it is too early to tell and FA hasn’t started but I feel he has things pointed in the right direction going into FA.
                      sigpic
                      "I'm scared if I stop all at once, the cumulative hangover will literally kill me."

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by MHS View Post
                        I’d give him a big win for the coaching staff. And I would take Flacco over Keemun any day... the only bad thing is the dead cap from Keenum.

                        Now I don’t think Elway is dominating since it is too early to tell and FA hasn’t started but I feel he has things pointed in the right direction going into FA.
                        The dead money from Keenum is insignificant since he’s being traded.

                        Even the ten million it would have been with a release would have been offset by an $11 million savings.

                        I think Elway has quite a ways to go to show that he can succeed without Payton Manning and/or Wade Phillips.
                        My Opinion isn’t determined by what the Popular Opinion is. Sometimes I agree with the Majority, Sometimes I Don’t. If My Opinion is Different than Yours, I have to Ask One Question:
                        You Mad Bro?
                        Don’t Be A Mean Girl
                        Hell No!!! To the Texans Quarterback!!!

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by samparnell View Post
                          The O-Line starters in the first game were Bolles, Leary, Paradis, McGovern and Veldheer. They played all the snaps in game 1 against Seattle.

                          Veldheer started game 2 against Oakland, but was hurt and left the game after 32 snaps. Turner took 35 snaps the rest of the way, I believe. Veldheer was Questionable for game 3 at Baltimore, but started and played all the snaps at RT. Veldheer started against KC, but played 16 snaps before Turner came in for the remaining 44.

                          Veldheer was out for the following game at NYJ, so Turner took all the snaps at RT in that game. Bolles had to leave the game for 12 snaps and Wilkinson filled in.

                          I had forgotten that McGovern missed the start against the Rams in game 6. Veldheer was Questionable for that game and did not play. Turner started at RT and took all the snaps along with Bolles and Paradis. Leary started at LG, but played 38 of the 66 snaps. He was out for the next game and on IR after that. Garcia started at RG and took 44 of the 66 snaps. McGovern had 50 snaps against the Rams.

                          Veldheer was Out for game 7 at Arizona and game 8 against KC. Bolles, Garcia, Paradis, McGovern and Turner started and played all the snaps in game 7 at AZ and in game 8 at KC.

                          Veldheer was back for the second half of the season and took over at RT against the Texans in game 9. Paradis got hurt after playing 26 of the 66 snaps and Wilkinson came in for the remaining 40 snaps with McGovern moving to C, I believe. Paradis was on IR the rest of the season as was Max Garcia.

                          After the bye, the starters in game 10 at LA Chargers were Bolles, Turner, McGovern, Wilkinson and Veldheer and they took all the snaps in that game. Same for game 11 against the Steelers, game 12 at Cincinnati, game 13 at San Francisco, game 14 against the Browns and for game 15 at Oakland. They also started the last game against the Chargers, but Gradkowski and Jones got some snaps, too.

                          There are several reasons O-Line coaches shuffle their guys. They want to see how well they play at different spots. They try to find the best spot for each guy. And, they are looking for the right chemistry among their players. Shuffling is also necessary when dealing with injuries to starters.
                          Originally posted by johnlimburg View Post
                          It wasn't a waste of my time, and I enjoy reading your posts, just the information you provided this time here wasn't related to what I actually had said. I also wasn't trying to argue for the record, you just said "IIRC", and I just highlighted it actually happened differently to what you stated, that is all. I also felt it was an attempt to talk down to me at the same time which is fine, but it was done so in a way with information which was completely irrelevant to what I actually said, that's all.

                          I know you broke down the offensive line here and the changes which constantly occurred, and you have looked up the snap counts for offensive lineman in certain games, but for future reference, the starting lineup against the Rams was actually Bolles, Leary, Paradis. Garcia, Turner, as seen in the picture from the first play below, with Paradis healthy.



                          Also, here is the article in which I was referencing, where Vance Joseph said that "changes are coming", when his coaching staff decided to bench Connor McGovern for Max Garcia. If you remember correctly that was the original point I stated that was confusing, which you said you disagreed with. Believe it or not, some other people do watch the games closely as well, and from time to time do know what they are saying in relation to the team, thanks.

                          https://sports.yahoo.com/vance-josep...143350375.html
                          That's what I said in post #1031 (highlighted above) the last paragraph of which is most relevant about the reasons O-Line coaches shuffle players. Head Coaches and Offensive Coordinators should let the O-Line Coach decide who the five are and where they line up. OCs need to work closely with the O-Line Coach on how to implement the playbook, especially how to block angle run plays against each front.

                          In 2014 Beadles had left in free agency and Clady was back from IR. Someone decided it would be a good idea to move Orlando Franklin from RT to LG and start Chris Clark at RT. Denver's rushing attack was about half zone/half angle at the time. The questions about that move were: could Franklin pull to the opposite TE hole and get there before the RB, and could Clark consistently deliver an authoritative down block? Franklin did a good job at LG, but Clark was benched by midseason. It was never stated, to my knowledge, who made that decision, but I doubt it was Dave Magazu. It was either Gase, Fox or Elway, but I doubt if we'll ever know.

                          Coaches are people and make mistakes just like everyone else. What we don't have access to in evaluating team performance and decision making is: having a playbook; having a weekly practice schedule; being able to watch practice; observing meetings; and, getting the daily report from the training room. All we can do is watch the games and ask ourselves exactly what it is we see.
                          "Stultum est timere quod vitare non potes." ~ Publilius Syrus

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by SMR81 View Post
                            Any GM could have done what Elway did with Manning at QB. It’s what he’s done after Manning that’s really defined him as a GM, which is a complete failure with no HOF QB to clean up his mess.
                            Is that you Dan?

                            Comment


                            • Ravens fan here,
                              I just wanted to say that Joe can be good under the right circumstances. He needs time in the pocket and a reliable pass-catching TE. The major issue the Ravens had was that they never built an offense around him since the Superbowl. His best wide receiver in the last 5 years was Steve Smith who was in his mid 30's. I can't even count how many times the recievers let Joe down by dropping perfect thrown balls. Joe wasn't perfect by any means, but the stats don't show the entire story. I will say that Joe will give you guys his all. When he tore his ACL, he still was on the field for a few plays. He will play through injuries if he can and take hard hits to deliver a throw. He will make some head scratching throws, but he is clutch under 2 mins. He is at his best during a high tempo offense. If you anyone has questions about him, I have watched all of his games as a fan.

                              Good luck to your season. I'll be rooting for you guys because of Joe

                              Comment


                              • FYI, per the Code of Conduct, negative monikers of the team, players, etc, are not permitted.

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