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  • #16
    Noah has been very “meh” for me. I hope he develops.
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    • #17
      Originally posted by flosstein View Post
      My point was it was bad to compare Butt to JT. Two different styles and different and two different mentalities on how they approached the game week after week.
      And I guess my point is I don’t know how you can possibly know that at all when he hasn’t lasted more than a single game every season since we drafted him.
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      • #18
        Originally posted by DenverBlood View Post
        And I guess my point is I don’t know how you can possibly know that at all when he hasn’t lasted more than a single game every season since we drafted him.
        Because aside from being a Bronco fan, I’m also a Michigan fan and watched him put in work for 4 years in both an option style offense and a smash mouth offense. Never played soft, never played scared. Great hands and was a solid reliable target. Classic blue chip player. He just had a run of unfortunate serious knee injuries derailed what could’ve been a great player.

        That’s how I know.
        #swapping

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        • #19
          Originally posted by flosstein View Post
          Because aside from being a Bronco fan, I’m also a Michigan fan and watched him put in work for 4 years in both an option style offense and a smash mouth offense. Never played soft, never played scared. Great hands and was a solid reliable target. Classic blue chip player. He just had a run of unfortunate serious knee injuries derailed what could’ve been a great player.

          That’s how I know.
          Well did you also watch Julius Thomas in college?

          Comparing college work ethic to nfl after they start getting paid is apples to oranges.
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          • #20
            Originally posted by flosstein View Post
            Because aside from being a Bronco fan, I’m also a Michigan fan and watched him put in work for 4 years in both an option style offense and a smash mouth offense. Never played soft, never played scared. Great hands and was a solid reliable target. Classic blue chip player. He just had a run of unfortunate serious knee injuries derailed what could’ve been a great player.

            That’s how I know.
            Glad to see some perspective in this over whelming negative wave that has hit the forums in wake of our 2-5 record.

            I seem to remember about the same time last year people were saying Chubb was a bust.
            Time to build on the win and grow the team from some solid play higher level of play

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            • #21
              Originally posted by DenverBlood View Post
              Well did you also watch Julius Thomas in college?

              Comparing college work ethic to nfl after they start getting paid is apples to oranges.
              I understand why you would apply this to some players but this can not be applied to every player.
              Time to build on the win and grow the team from some solid play higher level of play

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              • #22
                Originally posted by denverblood View Post
                a bit extremely premature for this thread. At least with bolles we’ve had 2 1/2 years of failing miserably to judge him off of before that thread popped up.
                :d:d:d:d:d:d:d:d
                All it takes to win is doing whatever it takes to win: COMMITMENT

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by Letswinplz77 View Post
                  :d:d:d:d:d:d:d:d
                  If you start at the top of the thread you’ll see someone already did that.
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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by DenverBlood View Post
                    A bit extremely premature for this thread. At least with Bolles we’ve had 2 1/2 years of failing miserably to judge him off of before that thread popped up.
                    How do you figure? I didn't claim anyone was a bust. All I said was he couldn't play (because he cut his foot)

                    What I can evaluate is what I see. I don't know if he's going to pan out. But the negatives are piling up. And I'm not talking about bottom line production. I'm talking about the kind of things you can see with your eyes. ie...

                    Passion -- I don't see any - do you?
                    Desire -- Does he attack catches? Or does he alligator arm? (compare to little E Sanders.... that little guy plays BIG~~ Noah plays small
                    Love for football -- again I it doesn't seem like he's having any fun out there. You can make your own destiny
                    physicality -- clearly this is what bothers me most. He's a giant that can fly down the field but he doesn't assert his physique. Remember Brandon Marshall 15? physical
                    sportsmanship -- he doesn't do much to bail out his QB when the ball is in the air. Instinct seems lacking.
                    intelligence -- evidently he cut himself badly enough that he couldn't practice ...... with a a tool that is child proof. Fangio called one of the oddest injuries he's ever seen (top 5)

                    Of course I don't spend the day with the guy so all I can do is go by what I see. I realize he's a rook and it takes time for TE's ...........but you can tell when a guy comes out hungry and confident and has a football attitude regardless of what his bottom line production is.

                    With Elway's history of draft picks, can I just give the kid the benefit of the doubt? No I can't.

                    I wasn't unhappy when he was picked. But at his size and speed you expect a physical presence out there ..... I mean a DB half his size punk'd strip fumbled him on a catch........ remember that? Play your size at least.
                    The beatings will continue until morale improves....

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by DenverBlood View Post
                      Well did you also watch Julius Thomas in college?

                      Comparing college work ethic to nfl after they start getting paid is apples to oranges.
                      Again, major injuries have derailed Butt's NFL career. He's not sitting out for minor weekly aches and pains, that's not who he is. JT was never a physical football player. He wasn't really a player at all. Because remember he only played one season in college. He was on our board because in the PM type offense he could run fast, jump high and catch. He wasn't relied on to block, because that was something that was never in his game.

                      Similar thing with Fant as with JT. But solid, reliable catching was never part of his resume. So it's not so much that he's a bust, but not the right fit for what we want to do offensively.........whatever that is????
                      #swapping

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by flosstein View Post
                        Again, major injuries have derailed Butt's NFL career. He's not sitting out for minor weekly aches and pains, that's not who he is. JT was never a physical football player. He wasn't really a player at all. Because remember he only played one season in college. He was on our board because in the PM type offense he could run fast, jump high and catch. He wasn't relied on to block, because that was something that was never in his game.

                        Similar thing with Fant as with JT. But solid, reliable catching was never part of his resume. So it's not so much that he's a bust, but not the right fit for what we want to do offensively.........whatever that is????
                        Thomas was drafted in 2011 before we even had Manning. He was drafted by Fox when we still had Orton/Tebow and were still a run first offense. Thomas was drafted purely on potential.
                        Eternal Broncos Optimist

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                        • #27
                          Hockenson was the TE to draft. Once he went off the board, TE shouldn’t have even been an option for Denver in the first. Based on the offensive scheme they planned on running, I liked Andre Dillard.

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                          • #28
                            Can we give the rook some time before we unrationally label him a bust
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                            when do native Americans become human and not mascots

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by arapaho View Post
                              Can we give the rook some time before we unrationally label him a bust
                              That's fair

                              ...but in the meantime, it's also fair to point out the significant shortcomings that fail the eye test. I sincerely hope he shows some kind of effort and desire and passion. Because till now, it's been lacking. Rookie having a slow start is not surprising but don't let it be because you're scared or because you're not engaged.

                              On the other side of the same coin you have a guy like Lindsey who came in as a rook and ran like he was as big as Noah. Physical player.

                              Noah was drafted for his size and speed. USE THEM BOTH

                              If he just looked like he was trying as hard as he could, I wouldn't bring up lack of production. And like I said production isn't what my point is about.
                              The beatings will continue until morale improves....

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by The Excellector View Post
                                Hockenson was the TE to draft. Once he went off the board, TE shouldn’t have even been an option for Denver in the first. Based on the offensive scheme they planned on running, I liked Andre Dillard.
                                Out side of week 1 Hockenson has struggled in the Lions offense as well.

                                Which is why maybe it’s fair to not judge them on their first 7 games in the league.
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