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  • beastlyskronk
    replied
    Originally posted by underrated29 View Post
    Lazy thinking. The oline had given up 1 sack in 7 games until lock got hurt. Its not the OL its the QB.

    The oline isn't amazing by any means and RT is a big big problem. But saying lock cannot develop behind this line is lazy hyperbole.
    There’s some truth to it though. Lock has done well to avoid sacks, but it’s hard to develop your footwork if you’re constantly moving around to avoid pressure. It’s hard to develop pocket awareness/mobility if you have to scramble to avoid pressure. He needs better protection to be able to slide up and around in the pocket and manipulate the pocket. He needs better protection to keep his footwork from getting sloppy. He has the arm to throw from any angle and platform but that should be a bonus from your QB and not your constant.

    He’ll get better at it regardless, the kid works hard. But the injuries and poor oline will slow down that development. I hope he’s able to come back after the Jets game because he’ll inject some life into the offense and get valuable reps to improve his game. The good thing is, he is still able to work on the mental part of the game even if he isn’t playing. Hopefully the time off allows him to continue to build upon the mental aspects of playing QB like reading defense pre and post snap, identifying blitzes and calling out appropriate protections, getting the ball to his hot routes. Things of that nature that really make a QB great. The physical things will come in time and if he can get further along on the mental side it’ll lessen some of those growing pains.

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  • darryn16
    replied
    Originally posted by mojo0730 View Post
    Prescott = 40-24, which is a .625 quarterback. I don't know about you but I'd take that over what we've been doing for 5 years now.
    Put Dak behind this line and that number quickly reverses to 24-40 or worse.

    Leave a comment:


  • underrated29
    replied
    Originally posted by mojo0730 View Post
    I just don't see Lock making it through the season when he returns. Shoulder injuries for quarterbacks tend to linger and we're losing players at the drop of a hat. And the type of offense we're running is almost designed not to give the quarterback any protection.

    Also, and I hate to say this, but... Prescott >>> Lock.
    Youre not wrong with any of that, sadly.
    I tore my labrum in my shoulder and until I had surgery it severely affected my slapshot in hockey. I think we both hope you are incorrect here, but it sure looks that way

    Leave a comment:


  • L.M.
    replied
    Originally posted by Bronco51 View Post
    That's the problem I see. I don't know if this organization can build a solid squad before Lock's contract is up. So, they won't turn him into a 35-40 million dollar QB. Then what? Keep him and pray? Or hope you can draft one or go the FA route? I just don't know if we'll see his full potential any time soon.
    Nobody truly has the precognition to know these things. The hopes (however slim they may seem from our gloomy 0-3 vantage point) are: that Dotson will be better and the line play will improve this season, that Shurmur will give TE blocking help to the RT and balance the attack with more runs, that Lock will be OK and continue to develop, that we'll use our #1 draft pick (and maybe a 3rd or 4th as well) on a tackle, that the coaching staff and the F.O. will make better decisions. Tall order I know, but stranger things have happened.

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  • Rich_C
    replied
    Originally posted by mojo0730 View Post
    Any top-10 quarterback moving forward will likely command $35-40 million a year easy. So if we're thinking we're going to avoid that somehow AND obtain a quarterback who can compete with the likes of Mahomes, then I think that's a mistake.

    Again, I've seen Dak play. I believed in him from college. I think he's a great quarterback that can elevate the team. Again, he's not Patrick Mahomes, Aaron Rodgers, Russell Wilson, or in that tier. But he's certainly an upgrade at the position over anything we've had since Manning retired. And I think he can be a Matt Ryan/Phillip Rivers (in his prime)-type quarterback.
    If any QB at that level will command that price then we should be looking at draft capital instead then. IMO then we'd be better off trading 2 - 1sts and something else and look at getting one of the top two QBs in the draft. That way you can cost control the QB position AND start to bring in quality FAs to support him (IE OL).

    Leave a comment:


  • mojo0730
    replied
    Originally posted by L.M. View Post
    What do you imagine this cost to be?
    I think the Broncos call the Cowboys and see what the asking price is. Start from there. I would say if it's something akin to two first rounders and Lock...I can live with that.

    Leave a comment:


  • mojo0730
    replied
    Originally posted by underrated29 View Post
    Lazy thinking. The oline had given up 1 sack in 7 games until lock got hurt. Its not the OL its the QB.

    The oline isn't amazing by any means and RT is a big big problem. But saying lock cannot develop behind this line is lazy hyperbole.
    I just don't see Lock making it through the season when he returns. Shoulder injuries for quarterbacks tend to linger and we're losing players at the drop of a hat. And the type of offense we're running is almost designed not to give the quarterback any protection.

    Also, and I hate to say this, but... Prescott >>> Lock.

    Leave a comment:


  • mojo0730
    replied
    Originally posted by Bronco51 View Post
    That's the problem I see. I don't know if this organization can build a solid squad before Lock's contract is up. So, they won't turn him into a 35-40 million dollar QB. Then what? Keep him and pray? Or hope you can draft one or go the FA route? I just don't know if we'll see his full potential any time soon.
    I don't see how they keep Lock healthy for the remainder of this season to be honest. And if he loses a whole year of development due to injury...then I'm sorry, you have to look at other options in the off season. Again, I don't want to give up on him. But he has to play and play for a substantial amount of time. He had an okay game against Tennessee but didn't look right during the limited time he played in Pittsburgh and the sack he took that caused his injury was on him as much as it was on the offensive line. I think it was Gannon who said about 5 times before Lock took that hit that Lock needed to make his reads quick and throw the ball as soon as possible, and he wasn't doing that.

    Leave a comment:


  • L.M.
    replied
    Originally posted by mojo0730 View Post
    I think any top-10 quarterback is worth mortgaging the farm. If you have a top-5 list which includes say, Mahomes, Wilson, Rodgers, Brady, and Brees (the latter two's ages not withstanding), and then the next tier which includes Roethlisberger, Jackson, Watson, Ryan, and Prescott...then yes I would say all those quarterbacks would be worth mortgaging the future over, even if Prescott isn't as good as Mahomes.
    What do you imagine this cost to be?

    Leave a comment:


  • underrated29
    replied
    Originally posted by mojo0730 View Post
    You're not developing Lock behind this offensive line. Even when he comes back, his shoulder will be an issue all season long and I would surmise that he'll wind up on IR at some point sooner or later. They're not doing anything to protect the quarterback and the injuries are mounting.

    And the Cowboys will most definitely give up Prescott for the right price. If they 100% believed in him they would have signed him to a long-term extension by now.


    Lazy thinking. The oline had given up 1 sack in 7 games until lock got hurt. Its not the OL its the QB.

    The oline isn't amazing by any means and RT is a big big problem. But saying lock cannot develop behind this line is lazy hyperbole.

    Leave a comment:


  • Bronco51
    replied
    Originally posted by L.M. View Post
    Nothing less than a guy of Peyton Manning's caliber is worth making the rather desperate move of "selling the farm", sacrificing significant assets, and that ain't Dak. Even if we could pry a great QB away, all hopes are then pinned on one person being the "savior", and if he goes down to injury behind of our porous o-line, or from some fluke, because we've put all our eggs in one basket, then we're truly screwed.

    Building up the team, properly addressing the fundamental structure of the offense, the O-line, and adding quality depth, are the things to do now while Lock is on a rookie contract. If we can solidify that line, and improve the pass protection, then his injury risk is lowered. Then he doesn't have to continually scramble out and try to make things happen on the run and he can make a play from the pocket.
    That's the problem I see. I don't know if this organization can build a solid squad before Lock's contract is up. So, they won't turn him into a 35-40 million dollar QB. Then what? Keep him and pray? Or hope you can draft one or go the FA route? I just don't know if we'll see his full potential any time soon.

    Leave a comment:


  • mojo0730
    replied
    Originally posted by Megalodon30 View Post
    What has he proven? What can you point to to say that Dak is a Super Bowl level QB?
    He scores points, throws for lots of yards, and by all accounts is a pretty decent human being. Again, a Super Bowl isn't guaranteed regardless but I feel Dak is an immediate upgrade over what we have and have had over the past 5 years. He's 41-26 as a starter which also is an upgrade over what we've endured for 5 years.

    So yeah...you're getting a proven veteran who can lead an offense effectively and has a winning record as a starter. Checks the boxes I care about.

    Leave a comment:


  • L.M.
    replied
    Originally posted by Megalodon30 View Post
    Wilkinson is out so that's a huge plus for our pass protection already. I'll see how they do with a different RT before I make any serious judgements about how good bad our o-line really is. If the whole line really is bad, than it will be a lot harder to develop Lock, but then why would we want Stafford? He's been hurt a lot and there's no reason he wouldn't get hurt here.

    And as far as Prescott, I wouldn't want him. I want nothing to do with a QB that wants a giant $40 million contract that has yet to prove anything in the playoffs. The potential of Lock >>> Anything Prescott offers.
    The line folded at multiple points on the play where Lock got injured. Lock's mobility masked deficiencies but its expiration date was reached. It's going to take one or two better linemen and some time for them to gel into one unit. There has to be better consistency, and a pocket when we need one.

    Leave a comment:


  • mojo0730
    replied
    Originally posted by L.M. View Post
    Nothing less than a guy of Peyton Manning's caliber is worth making the rather desperate move of "selling the farm", sacrificing significant assets, and that ain't Dak. Even if we could pry a great QB away, all hopes are then pinned on one person being the "savior", and if he goes down to injury behind of our porous o-line, or from some fluke, because we've put all our eggs in one basket, then we're truly screwed.

    Building up the team, properly addressing the fundamental structure of the offense, the O-line, and adding quality depth, are the things to do now while Lock is on a rookie contract. If we can solidify that line, and improve the pass protection, then his injury risk is lowered. Then he doesn't have to continually scramble out and try to make things happen on the run and he can make a play from the pocket.
    I think any top-10 quarterback is worth mortgaging the farm. If you have a top-5 list which includes say, Mahomes, Wilson, Rodgers, Brady, and Brees (the latter two's ages not withstanding), and then the next tier which includes Roethlisberger, Jackson, Watson, Ryan, and Prescott...then yes I would say all those quarterbacks would be worth mortgaging the future over, even if Prescott isn't as good as Mahomes.

    Leave a comment:


  • Megalodon30
    replied
    Originally posted by mojo0730 View Post
    I'm not thinking "win now". I'm thinking at 0-4 the season is over and with this team the likelihood that we can actually develop a quarterback like Lock, much less keep him healthy, is improbable.

    With Dak, you can bring him in and actually build a team around his talents. He's a proven quarterback and he could have 10-15 years left easy to continue playing.
    What has he proven? What can you point to to say that Dak is a Super Bowl level QB?

    Leave a comment:

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