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  • Jersey Retirement

    Does anyone feel as bad as I do concerning the NON-retirement of Terrell Davis' #30 jersey, and Steve Atwater's #27 jersey? Thats 2 h.o.f. caliber players that I really don't think got all the respect they deserved even from the Broncos Organization. Elway's #7 deservingly got retired, but didn't the afore mentioned players deserve it as well?? Their contributions over the years were huge, especially in the 2 superbowl wins. Your thoughs please

  • #2
    I'll have the first jersey retired as a fan.


    Here it is.

    Comment


    • #3
      although they were great here....

      ... to say they are HOF players is debateable (unfortunately). They both had a huge impact on the game locally.... but TD didn't get to hang around long enough to establish himself as a no doubt hall of famer.....

      Atwater, had a bigger impact on the game as a whole... but besides being a crushing tackler, really didn't put up HOF numbers....

      Honestly, if you start retiring numbers... you haveta start with a guideline(s)... only retiring the numbers of HOF members is a clear cut natural dividing line....

      the rest can go ring of fame.....

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by kryomid
        ... to say they are HOF players is debateable (unfortunately). They both had a huge impact on the game locally.... but TD didn't get to hang around long enough to establish himself as a no doubt hall of famer.....

        Atwater, had a bigger impact on the game as a whole... but besides being a crushing tackler, really didn't put up HOF numbers....

        Honestly, if you start retiring numbers... you haveta start with a guideline(s)... only retiring the numbers of HOF members is a clear cut natural dividing line....

        the rest can go ring of fame.....

        8 Probowls for Atwater is a pretty big friggin number.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by kryomid
          ... to say they are HOF players is debateable (unfortunately). They both had a huge impact on the game locally.... but TD didn't get to hang around long enough to establish himself as a no doubt hall of famer.....

          Atwater, had a bigger impact on the game as a whole... but besides being a crushing tackler, really didn't put up HOF numbers....

          Honestly, if you start retiring numbers... you haveta start with a guideline(s)... only retiring the numbers of HOF members is a clear cut natural dividing line....

          the rest can go ring of fame.....

          interesting points

          Comment


          • #6
            although i see your points kyromid, think about this....Gayle Sayers had a short career as well, and he's a h.o.fr

            you talk about Atwater's contribution being mostly noted for his crushing hits, isn't that the same for Lynch now?? I bet you that Lynch will be a first ballot h.o.fr.

            Comment


            • #7
              I am somewhat with the NFL on this. The NFL disdains jersey retirments. So do I. However sometimes a great player comes along and you want to pay respect to them. So I feel some jerseys should be retired. But only major contributors to the organization. Like with the Browns Jim Brown's #32 , Lou Groza's #76, and Otto Graham's #14 would remain retired. No other numbers would be retired unless that player breaks all-time Browns records and contributes enormously to the team. So Bernie Kosar's #19 would not be retired. Because he is merely #3 on the Browns all-time Quarterbacks List. However if someone came and broke all of Brian Sipe's records then he should definately be retired.
              The Browns are gone; I'm not a fan of the Impostors

              The real Browns are in Baltimore, see?

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Bigwheel
                although i see your points kyromid, think about this....Gayle Sayers had a short career as well, and he's a h.o.fr

                you talk about Atwater's contribution being mostly noted for his crushing hits, isn't that the same for Lynch now?? I bet you that Lynch will be a first ballot h.o.fr.

                Lynch never had as many Pro-Bowls as Atwater.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by The Dark Knight
                  Lynch never had as many Pro-Bowls as Atwater.

                  that's my point dark, if Lynch gets in, then surely Atwater should

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    maybe...

                    Originally posted by Bigwheel
                    although i see your points kyromid, think about this....Gayle Sayers had a short career as well, and he's a h.o.fr

                    you talk about Atwater's contribution being mostly noted for his crushing hits, isn't that the same for Lynch now?? I bet you that Lynch will be a first ballot h.o.fr.

                    But you have to look at the game at the time they played..... TD has had his chances hurt by the success of the denver RBs after he left, as well as other RBs hitting 2000+ yards in a season....

                    Atwater, has a much stronger case...but safeties have a hard time getting into the HOF unless they have a high number of sexy stats (ints....) Dennis Smith was a 6 time pro-bowler... yet most of us agree he probably won't get into the HOF...

                    If/when Atwater does get in... it will be because of his ability to change the face of a game.... IE the superbowl against the packers... the running game of the chiefs with Okoye... he could at times take over.....

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                    • #11
                      but....

                      ... only then though... should they retire his number...

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Dawgfan
                        I am somewhat with the NFL on this. The NFL disdains jersey retirments. So do I. However sometimes a great player comes along and you want to pay respect to them. So I feel some jerseys should be retired. But only major contributors to the organization. Like with the Browns Jim Brown's #32 , Lou Groza's #76, and Otto Graham's #14 would remain retired. No other numbers would be retired unless that player breaks all-time Browns records and contributes enormously to the team. So Bernie Kosar's #19 would not be retired. Because he is merely #3 on the Browns all-time Quarterbacks List. However if someone came and broke all of Brian Sipe's records then he should definately be retired.

                        I'll pull one bit out of that;

                        "Contributes enormously to the team."

                        I would say that Atwater and Davis meet that criteria. Atwater went to the Pro Bowl out of habit, and made our defense all that much better. Sometimes, he carried it, imo.

                        Now Davis. He, again imo, was the catylist for our Super Bowl runs. Not to discredit John Elway, but Terrell Davis was the big reason we won those two games. Would we have gone with Howard Griffith as the starter? Or Glyn MIlburn? No, not a chance.

                        I've posted before that I thought TD kinda got the shaft after those two games. "This one's for John"? "This one's for you"? All very nice, but it was TD who gave those to John & us.

                        I think they both should have their numbers retired. And both belong in the Hall.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Of Terrell Davis and Steve Atwater, I feel Atwater should have his number retired. Davis was a major contributor to the Super Bowl wins that Denver had. However his career numbers are not all that impressive. There are tons of RB more deserving than him. Just because he had a 2000 yard + season doesn't mean he should have his number retired. But he should be on Denver's ring of fame no doubt ... just not have his number retired.
                          The Browns are gone; I'm not a fan of the Impostors

                          The real Browns are in Baltimore, see?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I think you can consider this a point of front office politics. If Elway's number was not retired and we had another quarterback wearing that number, Bowlen would likely be stoned to death and thrown out of town. Atwater's a few may be upset but not as many as people would like to think. I truly believe you can only retire the numbers of someone whom changed the face of your team. Elway in Denver, Montana in San Fran, Jim Brown in Cleveland, Marino in Miami, Smith in Dallas and maybe Aikman, Maddens XXXL in Oakland..Hahaha... Len Dawson in Kansas City, Namith in NYJ, Taylor in NYG and so on and so forth. But you cannot do it for every great athlete that plays on a team! Hell we would be wearing jerseys in the two hundreds and crap!

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by JWinn
                              I'll pull one bit out of that;

                              "Contributes enormously to the team."

                              I would say that Atwater and Davis meet that criteria. Atwater went to the Pro Bowl out of habit, and made our defense all that much better. Sometimes, he carried it, imo.

                              Now Davis. He, again imo, was the catylist for our Super Bowl runs. Not to discredit John Elway, but Terrell Davis was the big reason we won those two games. Would we have gone with Howard Griffith as the starter? Or Glyn MIlburn? No, not a chance.

                              I've posted before that I thought TD kinda got the shaft after those two games. "This one's for John"? "This one's for you"? All very nice, but it was TD who gave those to John & us.

                              I think they both should have their numbers retired. And both belong in the Hall.

                              excellent points

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