If our offense is west coast playbook based why did we draft Ashley?

[CinnaMunMun]

I just think that if you look at ROd he catches short passes and yturns into YAC! Lelie catches and falls down.

When he has to stretch out and make circus catches sure.

When he was catching short passes late last season Lelie seemed better at YAC than before.

Besides, he is a speed WR, they usually aren't known to break as many tackles as a possesion guy like Eddie Mac, Boldin, Fitz, or Wayne.

[JRWIZ]

That all been said he was not the answer for our style of play.

Mikey had coveted a speed WR and got one that was very inconsistent.

The WCO does not rely on a deep threats. Merely WRs,TEs, RBs that can catch and RUN. YAC. Plain and simple. Just a long hand off, that is the easiest way to describe it. Once SFO had Steve young with a longer arm than Montana they modified the WCO to spread the field a bit more.

Mikey's run first also did not have a deep threat built into it, but once he had a deep threat he tried to change it around and gain QB time by doing roll outs and shotgun sets. Both of which limit the ability to RUN first.

Our line is not designed to give any QB lots of time to pick and choice through 12 or more looks like both PIT, KC or Indy's are. They just have big oafish Linemen that can block both for passing as well as running the ball.

[JRWIZ]

When he has to stretch out and make circus catches sure.

When he was catching short passes late last season Lelie seemed better at YAC than before.

Besides, he is a speed WR, they usually aren't known to break as many tackles as a possesion guy like Eddie Mac, Boldin, Fitz, or Wayne.

As has been argued adnauseum in the past.

NO one on the forum really knows for sure if ashley is in the correct position for those passes or if Jake is miss throwing them. Only those in with the coaches durning film sessions and have acess to what is being called to Jake really know for sure.

That been said, logically I would say it is a combination of the two, but do to recent developments (Walker and Marshall) and the fact that rarely did Rod or Putz have to wait for a ball from Jake, it was ashley being out of position, running a bad route, not being able to clear the CB @ the LOS, or many other reasons.

Even in their good year together 2004 his YAC sucked. Perhaps it was the TD passes caught in the endzone that brought the YAC average down. Perhaps it was the designed plays to the sidelines.

But the truth of the matter is and has been since the end of last season Mikey has been actively seeking WR help first with the brief and unsuccessful affair with TO and finally on draft day with Walker in a trade and Marshall in the draft.

Now some will argue that the same can be said about Jake, Mikey actively tried to get a couple of Back up QB's (there were a few and frankly none of them were gonna take the #1 spot from Jake) in town mostly cause he was unsure of BVP as his #2, and ultimately DAFTED cutler for 2008 or after as he was "to good prospect to pass up".

Now for some reason they decided to let ashley try the over the middle stuff last year late in the year. Perhaps to see if he could make these catches and what he could d o with them once caught.

ashley has not shown a great ability to get cleanly off the LOS in the past, and has had to run crossing routes to wipe the defender off or use his long stride speed to blow by them. He seems to have longer stride speed, but not that ultra fast burst to get up to speed instantly like some players. He has as far as I can see not shown the ability to catch to ball and get back to speed before the DB;s get him. Unless he is hit on stride perfectly he is not going to make much YAC.

[CinnaMunMun]

As has been argued adnauseum in the past.

NO one on the forum really knows for sure if ashley is in the correct position for those passes or if Jake is miss throwing them. Only those in with the coaches durning film sessions and have acess to what is being called to Jake really know for sure.

That been said, logically I would say it is a combination of the two, but do to recent developments (Walker and Marshall) and the fact that rarely did Rod or Putz have to wait for a ball from Jake, it was ashley being out of position, running a bad route, not being able to clear the CB @ the LOS, or many other reasons.

Even in their good year together 2004 his YAC sucked. Perhaps it was the TD passes caught in the endzone that brought the YAC average down. Perhaps it was the designed plays to the sidelines.

But the truth of the matter is and has been since the end of last season Mikey has been actively seeking WR help first with the brief and unsuccessful affair with TO and finally on draft day with Walker in a trade and Marshall in the draft.

Now some will argue that the same can be said about Jake, Mikey actively tried to get a couple of Back up QB's (there were a few and frankly none of them were gonna take the #1 spot from Jake) in town mostly cause he was unsure of BVP as his #2, and ultimately DAFTED cutler for 2008 or after as he was "to good prospect to pass up".

Now for some reason they decided to let ashley try the over the middle stuff last year late in the year. Perhaps to see if he could make these catches and what he could d o with them once caught.

ashley has not shown a great ability to get cleanly off the LOS in the past, and has had to run crossing routes to wipe the defender off or use his long stride speed to blow by them. He seems to have longer stride speed, but not that ultra fast burst to get up to speed instantly like some players. He has as far as I can see not shown the ability to catch to ball and get back to speed before the DB;s get him. Unless he is hit on stride perfectly he is not going to make much YAC.

Whether or not it was Ashley's fault, which it might be, I don't know, I just wanted to state that Ashley just isn't a YAC guy. Especially if he gets hit.

[LoyalSoldier]

NO one on the forum really knows for sure if ashley is in the correct position for those passes or if Jake is miss throwing them. Only those in with the coaches durning film sessions and have acess to what is being called to Jake really know for sure.

I do think Lelie has a large part in that. You can say Jake has trouble hitting recievers in stride, but once in a while Lelie is going to be hit close enough. Rod has been hit in less than in stride, but still manages to get free.

[Dream]

Now people can stop crying about Lelie not "producing" enough here in Denver when they've already given into the fact that he's not an ideal guy for the system here in Denver. Go figure.

[Lorcust]

Now people can stop crying about Lelie not "producing" enough here in Denver when they've already given into the fact that he's not an ideal guy for the system here in Denver. Go figure.

Man, I'm just sick of his logic now. He wants a chance to compete for the number 1 spot. Shanahan publically calls him out to give him a chance to do what he wants. He doesn't show up. I hope he doesn't come up with some crap like, "Well, I was going to show up at mini-camp, but you were bowling that day. Sorry, how does training camp sound?" His agenda now is just to find a team with less receiver talent so it's easier to climb to the top, that's all it appears to be to me.

[JRWIZ]

Whether or not it was Ashley's fault, which it might be, I don't know, I just wanted to state that Ashley just isn't a YAC guy. Especially if he gets hit.

I remember seeing him in his first years here make a great catch on the ball and then when falling lose the bal when he hit the ground.

From those years I don't many times when he actually ran with the ball more than a step or two after the catch.

I was thinking I was the only one that saw these things.

[JRWIZ]

Man, I'm just sick of his logic now. He wants a chance to compete for the number 1 spot. Shanahan publically calls him out to give him a chance to do what he wants. He doesn't show up. I hope he doesn't come up with some crap like, "Well, I was going to show up at mini-camp, but you were bowling that day. Sorry, how does training camp sound?" His agenda now is just to find a team with less receiver talent so it's easier to climb to the top, that's all it appears to be to me.

Now question is what team would it be?

NFC

CAR NO
WAS no
ARIZ not a chance
STL nope
TB no
GB NO
NYG NO
DAL NO
NOL NO


CHI slight maybe
ATl maybe
MIN maybe

AFC

Mikey is not gonna trade to anyone in the West unless we get something great in return.
DEN burnt to many bridges here.
CIN you got to be kidding
IND more of the same
MIA more of the same
BAL nope
CLE no
NE not needed
PIT beat out Wards sure
NYJ beat coles not gonna happen
HOU they are not that stupid
TEN I don't think so.

BUF would serve him right colder than a witches **** in a brass bra
JAX maybe but I don't think they are that hard up for ashley.

Afraid this clown is gonna be a #2 or 3 forever.

[TXBRONC]

That makes no sense at ALL! Hes a little skiny piece of crap. I thought the west coast was based on YAC like T.O and ROD Produce. Maybe shanny just messed up draft day picking him. I thinki if Lelie played for the Pats he would become Toms go to guy. Even if he Played for the Lions this year. Martz would make him a probowler.

Just because its a West Coast style of offense doesn't mean you don't want speed out their.

[Dream]

Now question is what team would it be?

NFC

CAR NO
WAS no
ARIZ not a chance
STL nope
TB no
GB NO
NYG NO
DAL NO
NOL NO


CHI slight maybe
ATl maybe
MIN maybe

AFC

Mikey is not gonna trade to anyone in the West unless we get something great in return.
DEN burnt to many bridges here.
CIN you got to be kidding
IND more of the same
MIA more of the same
BAL nope
CLE no
NE not needed
PIT beat out Wards sure
NYJ beat coles not gonna happen
HOU they are not that stupid
TEN I don't think so.

BUF would serve him right colder than a witches **** in a brass bra
JAX maybe but I don't think they are that hard up for ashley.

Afraid this clown is gonna be a #2 or 3 forever.

Nice insightful post. I know it took a lot of thought.

[The Hamburgler]

I thought we ran a form of the West coast. Not its true form.

[JRWIZ]

Nice insightful post. I know it took a lot of thought.

Thanks. :

[xX-Bronco-Xx]

Its true stats don't matter, But Ashley is probably the best deep threat after Randy. No way is he the best after Randy just to name a few: Steve Smith, Terrell Owens, Chad Johnson. He wouldn't even be in the top 15 of my list of deep thread WR's.

Ashley get us in postion for the score, Probably every long catch he had this season he got us in postion to get a FG or TD. He also kept the saftey back because of his speed and ablity to catch over the shoulder like its nothing. Which opens up the running game. Don't know about the fg's and if your talking about past seasons but he only scored 1 TD in the 2005 season.
Walker im not sold on him yet, because Brett Farve and the packers really love passing. That is the year Brett Farve had one of the best years of his career. You can tell they passed more, because Ahman Green Carries went from 355-1883 to 259-1163. Which is a 720 yard drop off!!!!! Brett's pass attempts went from 471-3361 to 540-4088 which is a 727 yard gain!! Soo 720 of ahman's yard pretty much went to brett 's passing yards. Believe me Walker > Lelie
But back to ashley I wish he wouldn't be such an ass and come to camp and compete for #1 or #2 and wait till Rod retires and Show the teams that said he cant be a #1 that he is worthy enough to be one. I sort of agree but the sad part about it is that he chooses not to compete or will not against a 36 year old WR and a still not fully recovered WR which imo is pretty pathetic.
Don't get me wrong i still think Javon will do good in our system. But im not completely sold on him. Donald drvier only started 11 games that year. Donald is probably one of the most underrated WR's in the league. Idk what Donald has to do with the Broncos

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[JRWIZ]

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At least put your response in another color and use the enter key to differentiate the next sentence or Idea. It was a tough read at best.