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  • Coyer? read the post before voting

    Is Coyer the issue with our lack of defense?

    Is the defense quite talented but underutilized?

    It is mine and several others contention that coyer is responsible for our inability to get pressure on the QB. Our DL has 4-5 first round draft choice s on it, none of them drafted by Mikey.

    Our LB corp is first rate in talent and plays first rate.

    Coyer is a former LB I believe and a longtime LB coach.

    Mikey has stated he is one of the foremost planners in the game.

    His players almost revolted on him last year, he becaome more touchy feely.

    Our Pass defense while rated decently can't seem to stop QB when the chips are on the line:

    We all saw the almost record set by Ben in the AFFCG with the number of 3rd and longs that were converted.
    We all saw what an almost rookie QB in ELi Manning did to us late in the game to come back and beat us.

    Almost any QB excepting Green in the first KC game had as much time as they needed to make the play, unless we brought the 3rd Marine division on a biltz.

    Yet we had a lot of picks and fumble recoveries for the year.

    Are we expecting to much form this group of first and second rounder draft choice and all pros'.

    Or should DEN be dominating with the talent they have on this defense?
    Here is our starters and their draft position.
    Code:
    Brown  #1      engleberger #35
    Myers   #100   
    Warren #3        Dummerville #126
    Ekuban #11      Lang  #17
    
    Gold #40
    Wilson #31
    DJ         #17
    
    Bailey #7
    Darrent  #56
    Ferguson UDFA
    Lynch # 83
    Sorry folks but our worst thought of player (terms of the draft) on the team was ferguson who had 5 picks last year.

    The average draft position taking out ferguson of our starters is 34.


    Sorry folks I do not see the players as the reasons for our inability to stop offenses at critical times. Unless DEN DAL WAS and CLE are all such a poor judge of talent it has to be either the coach or the scheme.
    73
    Is it Coyer?
    41.10%
    30
    His scheme?
    52.05%
    38
    The players?
    1.37%
    1
    Mikey does not care about defense?
    5.48%
    4
    Last edited by JRWIZ; 09-08-2006, 09:16 AM.

  • #2
    I'm going to say that draft position isn't necessarily an indication of ability.


    It is an indication of a teams need and what they believe a player's potential is, not a player's production.


    I'm a Penn State guy, but Brown was overrated, even in college.

    Warren perpelxes me, as he sometimes seems to play lazy, other times seems to live up to his lofty draft pick.

    Engleberger, Myers, and Lang can all be great depth players.

    Too early to tell with ELvis.

    The back 7 is as good as any in the NFL.


    I think Coyer is partly to blame for his seeming inability to prepare for every wrinkle a team may throw out here.

    But the d-line is really not as productive as those high draft picks would suggest either.

    Everybody's gotta elevate from the norm...

    The greatest list of music I don't own on CD :sad:
    You should check these guys out

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by JRWIZ
      Is Coyer the issue with our lack of defense?

      Is the defense quite talented but underutilized?

      It is mine and several others contention that coyer is responsible for our inability to get pressure on the QB. Our DL has 4-5 first round draft choice s on it, none of them drafted by Mikey.

      Our LB corp is first rate in talent and plays first rate.

      Coyer is a former LB I believe and a longtime LB coach.

      Mikey has stated he is one of the foremost planners in the game.

      His players almost revolted on him last year, he becaome more touchy feely.

      Our Pass defense while rated decently can't seem to stop QB when the chips are on the line:

      We all saw the almost record set by Ben in the AFFCG with the number of 3rd and longs that were converted.
      We all saw what an almost rookie QB in ELi Manning did to us late in the game to come back and beat us.

      Almost any QB excepting Green in the first KC game had as much time as they needed to make the play, unless we brought the 3rd Marine division on a biltz.

      Yet we had a lot of picks and fumble recoveries for the year.

      Are we expecting to much form this group of first and second rounder draft choice and all pros'.

      Or should DEN be dominating with the talent they have on this defense?
      Here is our starters and their draft position.
      Code:
      Brown  #1      engleberger #35
      Myers   #100   
      Warren #3        Dummerville #126
      Ekuban #11      Lang  #17
      
      Gold #40
      Wilson #31
      DJ         #17
      
      Bailey #7
      Darrent  #56
      Ferguson UDFA
      Lynch # 83
      Sorry folks but our worst thought of player (terms of the draft) on the team was ferguson who had 5 picks last year.

      The average draft position taking out ferguson of our starters is 34.


      Sorry folks I do not see the players as the reasons for our inability to stop offenses at critical times. Unless DEN DAL WAS and CLE are all such a poor judge of talent it has to be either the coach or the scheme.
      Look, Coyer is the only one to blame. He doesnt turn his linemen loose. They are to go straight ahead and not make a play. While the linebackers are supposed to make the play. Our team would be so much better with a top tier coordinator.

      I also have a problem with how Coyer has our DB's lineup 10 yards off the line on every play. I know it's helpful sometimes but team's adjust.

      Which brings me to the fact that Coyer cant make adjustments, during a series, a quarter, at halftime or during an entire season.

      Comment


      • #4
        It's a new year.

        Defensive failure? Without one game played? Come on.

        Comment


        • #5
          Coyer sucks. With our personnel, we should CLEARLY DOMINATE alot on the defensive side of the ball. Our DBs don't challenge the WRs for some reason, and we blitz way too much which simplifies reads for the opposing QBs. Coyer has a great inability to adjust to what's happening to his D on the field. A good coordinator makes those adjustments, and recognizes the weaknesses in his own scheme. Coyer does not. I hate the guy. He's what's holding this team back, NOT Jake Plummer.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Jared
            I'm going to say that draft position isn't necessarily an indication of ability.


            It is an indication of a teams need and what they believe a player's potential is, not a player's production.


            I'm a Penn State guy, but Brown was overrated, even in college.

            Warren perpelxes me, as he sometimes seems to play lazy, other times seems to live up to his lofty draft pick.

            Engleberger, Myers, and Lang can all be great depth players.

            Too early to tell with ELvis.

            The back 7 is as good as any in the NFL.


            I think Coyer is partly to blame for his seeming inability to prepare for every wrinkle a team may throw out here.

            But the d-line is really not as productive as those high draft picks would suggest either.
            When the problem rests with the scheme and the players, that pretty
            well covers it, doesn't it?

            Sorry, JR, but I can't vote. You don't have a selection for "All of the Above" (Except
            the Mikey one).

            -----

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by topscribe
              When the problem rests with the scheme and the players, that pretty
              well covers it, doesn't it?

              -----

              Pretty much.


              It's a fairly synergistic relationship. Neither one can look competent without the other.


              Historically, under Shanahan, the defensive line has never been great.

              I think Coyer over compenstates for this with his penchant for blitzing.

              In any team sport, it is hard to pinpoint one thing as the problem. Yes, Coyer's seeming inability to adjust is problematic.

              But players not really peforming well is a problem too.

              Everybody's gotta elevate from the norm...

              The greatest list of music I don't own on CD :sad:
              You should check these guys out

              Comment


              • #8
                It's Coyer and his scheme.

                I've been against LC for some time now. The sad part is, he almost made a believer out of me last year. Too bad he once again proved his inability to coach in last years AFCCG.

                Bottom line, I just don't think that he is clever enough to match up with some of the better offensive coordinaters in the league.

                Comment


                • #9
                  How on earth can you blame our players? That group is so talented and skilled. Our problems lie in droped coverages, and I maintain that if Champ is droppibg coverages things must be too complicated, D-line rushing right ahead, a scheme discision, playing away from recivers, another scheme discsion. The players can't just decide to do what they want.

                  If the D-line pulled a stunt when told to bull rush, they'd get chewed. LaVar Arrinton did what he wanted to out there on the field, got results, got bench and then traded. You can't improvise in the NFL. Players have to do what the coach calls, period.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The scheme in last years AFCCG left alot to be desired. But to label the Defense a failure seems a bit excessive.

                    To me, the best way to measure a defense's effectiveness is by the amount of points they allow.

                    Last year, the Broncos gave up 258 pts. Only the Colts gave up less in the AFC at 247. Pittsburgh also gave up 258. In the NFC, only the Bears allowed less at 202.

                    So, only 2 teams in the NFL allowed fewer points to be scored than the Broncos did last year. That is not my definition of failure.

                    Again, I do agree there is room for improvement. The AFCCG was terrible. But overall, Coyer has done a good job, imo.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Didnt vote because where our defense is lacking, is pressure by the front 4. The back 7 is very good like Jared said.
                      sigpic

                      http://www.reverbnation.com/play_now/song_1804775

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by JRWIZ
                        Is Coyer the issue with our lack of defense?

                        Is the defense quite talented but underutilized?

                        It is mine and several others contention that coyer is responsible for our inability to get pressure on the QB. Our DL has 4-5 first round draft choice s on it, none of them drafted by Mikey.

                        Our LB corp is first rate in talent and plays first rate.

                        Coyer is a former LB I believe and a longtime LB coach.

                        Mikey has stated he is one of the foremost planners in the game.

                        His players almost revolted on him last year, he becaome more touchy feely.

                        Our Pass defense while rated decently can't seem to stop QB when the chips are on the line:

                        We all saw the almost record set by Ben in the AFFCG with the number of 3rd and longs that were converted.
                        We all saw what an almost rookie QB in ELi Manning did to us late in the game to come back and beat us.

                        Almost any QB excepting Green in the first KC game had as much time as they needed to make the play, unless we brought the 3rd Marine division on a biltz.

                        Yet we had a lot of picks and fumble recoveries for the year.

                        Are we expecting to much form this group of first and second rounder draft choice and all pros'.

                        Or should DEN be dominating with the talent they have on this defense?
                        Here is our starters and their draft position.
                        Code:
                        Brown  #1      engleberger #35
                        Myers   #100   
                        Warren #3        Dummerville #126
                        Ekuban #11      Lang  #17
                        
                        Gold #40
                        Wilson #31
                        DJ         #17
                        
                        Bailey #7
                        Darrent  #56
                        Ferguson UDFA
                        Lynch # 83
                        Sorry folks but our worst thought of player (terms of the draft) on the team was ferguson who had 5 picks last year.

                        The average draft position taking out ferguson of our starters is 34.


                        Sorry folks I do not see the players as the reasons for our inability to stop offenses at critical times. Unless DEN DAL WAS and CLE are all such a poor judge of talent it has to be either the coach or the scheme.
                        Basically all of your poll positions agree with each other. Call that a poll? Absolutely idiotic...Is there a problem with the defense? I dont think so...there are two things I care about in the numbers game: turnover differential and third down coversions.

                        Denver, in 2005, + 20 turnover differential. This is the ultimate result of pressure, not sacks. Sacks are overrated.

                        There is NOTHING wrong with the defensive schemes. What is needed is better execution. Coyer is doing a fine job.
                        Rest in Peace, Darrent and Damien. You will be forever in our thoughts

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          His lack of adjustments is what hurts us the most.I watched a few of the game up here in boston and the one thing I always see is that the patriots always adjust if something is not working..We on the other hand almost never do,I think this is our weakest area on defense..
                          sigpic

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by BANJOPICKER1
                            His lack of adjustments is what hurts us the most.I watched a few of the game up here in boston and the one thing I always see is that the patriots always adjust if something is not working..We on the other hand almost never do,I think this is our weakest area on defense..
                            I completely agree. It is Coyer and his lack of adjustments that hurt the team. So my answer is a combo of Coyer and his scheme. His initial game scheme is usually good. It is his lack of adjusting that sucks. That is why I will just pick Coyer.
                            Patriotic dissent is a luxury of those protected by better men than they.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              the defense is good. The most important things are turnovers, points allowed and 3rd down converstations. They did great with the first two they just need to prepare better for the 3rd. Also Coyer does need to adjust better when something is not working. If the denfense fixs those 2 things they will be much better.
                              President Cool

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