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  • #46
    i think the problem the broncos defense had in the afccg - besides not turning the ball over - was that they threw every look they had at new england the week before and had nothing left in the playbook. i think that's why pitt was so prepared for our blitz. coyer needed to come up with something new. it didn't look like he did.

    still, had the dbs come up with the ints, it would've been a different game. again, that wasn't coyer's fault.

    i believe he did the best job with the talent he had - until the pitt game when i don't think he was adequately prepared.
    Go Bears!

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    • #47
      Let me take this a bit further to refine the point... at least, the way I see it. If you need to "scheme" to beat an offense, you are really being forced to mask a weakness on your personnel. I remember back in the late 80's, the Rams (still in LA) had to come up with their "Eagle" defense, which was a 2-5-4. It was because they DIDN'T HAVE ANY DLINE... Kevin Greene and nobody else. It worked in one game against the 49rs, then it got figured out, and they continued losing to SF.
      Don't read into this that I'm saying you don't have to worry about your game planning, because nobody can consistently win with a base defense. What I AM saying is that we need better horses up front, or we'll keep losing at the championship level. Wouldn't it just be cool to beat the other team's oline just a bit (LOT) more often? Would cover a multitude of deficiencies. This game begins and ends in the trenches.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by cabroncofanatic
        i think the problem the broncos defense had in the afccg - besides not turning the ball over - was that they threw every look they had at new england the week before and had nothing left in the playbook. i think that's why pitt was so prepared for our blitz. coyer needed to come up with something new. it didn't look like he did.

        still, had the dbs come up with the ints, it would've been a different game. again, that wasn't coyer's fault.

        i believe he did the best job with the talent he had - until the pitt game when i don't think he was adequately prepared.
        While DBs did drop some ints, and that is their fault, Coyer is the one playing them 10 yards off.

        Combine that with getting no pressure on Pittsburgh, and you give Big Ben all the time in the world with 10 yards of free passing space too. Simple slant routes and other short routes were all Pitt needed to move up the field on us.

        That AFCCG was a combination of bad play on the defensive side of the ball by the players but inexcusable instances of "wtf" moments by Coyer. Defensive-wise.
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        • #49
          Originally posted by cabroncofanatic
          so what should he have done differenlty in the afccg?

          and you need to ask shanahan, not coyer, why they didn't bring in more talent on the d-line.

          They could have made adjustments in the bilzing cause it was not working .

          He played foxworth off his receiver 8-10 yards all day and they passed almost at will had what 7or 8 3rd and longs 7plus yards.

          In INDY 2005 he did the same thing playing off the WR and manning picked us apart.

          Neither year did we get any meaningful pressure on the QB.

          Never said coyer did not draft DL. But is obvious to any watching the past four playoff except NE's that we are totally inept at rushing the passer. Except when sending the biltz which then leaves others wide open. If you are unable to put teh QB on his back as we were not he merely throws to the open WR.TE, RB all day.

          Did you not see this? Everyone else did except obviously Mikey cause he has not truly addressed getting DL personnel on the first day in the draft since 1997.

          Anything I did not address?

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          • #50
            great points might I add...

            in the AFC divisional playoff game vs. the Pats, in the 2nd half Coyer kept punt-block formation blitzing, and the pats adjusted by max protecting and sneaking out their tight end when this would happen. brady drove them down the field and easily converted each time coyer would punt-block blitz in the 3rd Q. Coyer did not change what he was doing from the first Q. On that drive, Brady and co. were ready to take the lead and not look back. If it wasn't for Champ's INT, we lose that game. Coyer then does the same thing the following week against Pitt as JrWiz mentioned above. Coyer is just a bozo, plain and simple.

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            • #51
              Originally posted by Hypnotic
              I voted that it is Coyer. He has a good scheme but does not use the play's with in the scheme at the right time. Coyer is a good coach just not a good chess player. He is a good student of the game but he is more of a good postion coach then he is a Defensive Cord.
              This is my feeling as well. The scheme works but he ends up playing conversative with a lead and that's when we have problems. Ref the PHI game last year....they got hot toward the end when Coyer went to Prevent and only slowed back down when Coyer got aggressive.


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              • #52
                Originally posted by broncos_mtnman
                A top 5 defense doesn't have too many weaknesses, neither players or coaches.

                We get it JR. You don't like Coyer. You don't like our defensive line. You wish we drafted defensive line players in every round.

                What's that you say when I post about Jake?

                Seems you have the same problem with the defense. Did Coyer kick your dog or something?

                ___________________________

                That said, I couldn't vote. Choices 1 and 2 were the same answer. 4 is absurd.

                Are there better defensive players out there? Sure. Just like there are at EVERY position, but his group played pretty darn well last year.
                Irony at it's finest.....


                .....lest you forgot about the AFCC game?

                We sure wouldn't want to spread some of the blame, now would we......
                "It does not take a majority to prevail, but rather an irate,
                tireless minority keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of
                men."

                -- Samuel Adams

                sigpicJacks RULE!!!!!!

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by JRWIZ
                  Now the real question is although they are or at least should be extremely talented by nature of their draft positions.

                  Are they all that talented and being held back by the system.

                  Should we not be getting players that consistently fit into the system or should the system be adapted to the talent on hand.

                  Anyone that blindly thinks that our Defense is all that great better look back to a few of those games last year. Pitt ate it alive,
                  MIA 426 yards,
                  WAS 447, 125r/322p,
                  NE 388 yards 89/299,
                  NYG in loss because we could not stop manning,
                  we got BYE when we played Philly even though Mcnabb playing hurt without a real Rb they got 351 yards last year. A mere shadow of Mcnabb what he could have been, showed up that day.
                  OAK 335 yards
                  DAL 314 yards and 35+ minutes of TOP.

                  AT KC 421 yards 168r/253p TOP 32.27 Both defense allowed 4.5 YPC running the ball does that sound like we have a top 5 defense?

                  BAL had more yards 323 than we did.

                  BUF, JETS and the last game in OAK we killed them dominated them why because they sucked more than we were great.

                  Had we not knocked brees out of the SAN game who knows for sure if we would have won that one as we had a whooping 5 more yards than they did.

                  Sorry folks I do not share you massive enthusiasm with this past years defense. I for one have not seen a great deal of upgrade in it other than we won't be playing THREE raw rookie CB's.
                  Well, to be fair, jr.....

                  ....yardage isn't what makes for a good indicator for defense, imo...


                  ...Denver has always had the 'bend but don't break' ideology, since I can remember. Plus, there are NFL players on both sides of the ball....so it's almost impossible to keep an Offense down an entire game....other than a few here/there.

                  But overall, I agree with your assessment of the defense.....their final ranking was not indicative of their play....
                  "It does not take a majority to prevail, but rather an irate,
                  tireless minority keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of
                  men."

                  -- Samuel Adams

                  sigpicJacks RULE!!!!!!

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Combination of many things, but I believe Coyer is the root of it all.

                    He doesen't adjust, and what gets me is that is what essentially got Ray Rhodes driven out of town (MNF against the Raiders).

                    I don't understand certain people here. Peyton Manning puts up nearly 250 yards just by going after one player (our last playoff loss to Indy), and its a certain player on offense who gets all of their rage. Hey I was mad a little with that player for not being able to answer those scores, but to give Coyer a free pass for that?



                    *not aiming that at a particular poster
                    You've got to know when to sack em...

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by broncos_mtnman
                      We lost THREE games last year.

                      How can you say he lost us a couple of games?

                      According to you, if Coyer were just a little better, we would have gone 16-0 last year.

                      Get real....

                      No, Mr mathematician man.....


                      ...denver would have been 15-1 in the regular season....


                      ....and 3-0 in postplay.
                      "It does not take a majority to prevail, but rather an irate,
                      tireless minority keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of
                      men."

                      -- Samuel Adams

                      sigpicJacks RULE!!!!!!

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Originally posted by JRWIZ
                        They could have made adjustments in the bilzing cause it was not working .
                        what "adjustments" to the blitz? be specific.


                        Originally posted by JRWIZ
                        He played foxworth off his receiver 8-10 yards all day and they passed almost at will had what 7or 8 3rd and longs 7plus yards.
                        the only explanation i have for this is that they didn't want to give up the big play. with the blitz, fox had no help. the blitz wasn't working, so roeth had time. if fox had played tighter, his guy could've gotten behind him and down the field. remember: the guy's a rookie.

                        look at the game the week before against the pats. the blitz was working. brady didn't have time to go deep. fox didn't play loose on his guy.


                        Originally posted by JRWIZ
                        In INDY 2005 he did the same thing playing off the WR and manning picked us apart.

                        Neither year did we get any meaningful pressure on the QB.
                        you just answered your own question. w/o "meaningful pressure on the qb", it's hard to stop a good passing attack.

                        Originally posted by JRWIZ
                        Never said coyer did not draft DL. But is obvious to any watching the past four playoff except NE's that we are totally inept at rushing the passer. Except when sending the biltz which then leaves others wide open. If you are unable to put teh QB on his back as we were not he merely throws to the open WR.TE, RB all day.
                        so why don't you blame shanahan for not getting adequate line personnel???


                        Originally posted by JRWIZ
                        Did you not see this? Everyone else did except obviously Mikey cause he has not truly addressed getting DL personnel on the first day in the draft since 1997.
                        bingo. blame mikey if we don't have the right guys on the d-line. not coyer.
                        Last edited by cabroncofanatic; 09-10-2006, 07:50 AM.
                        Go Bears!

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