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Rating the recent past drafts

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  • DDP32
    replied
    Road Apples---- I wasn't ripping you but nor did I ever tie into you like you seem to think I also didn't think you were attacking me. But some of your comments in your post regards what I said sure come off as smarta$$ed

    I said I doubt that there were 10 more more picks still with the Pats. And guess what if you take a look after your research you proved my point I was right except that it was 11 so I was off by one. If you look at the Broncos draft by comparison I believe from the picks you pointed out there are at least 15 guys who are still on the Broncos. So when you compare the two the Broncos come out ahead. That was my point the entire time.

    I never said that Shanhan was a genius but myu postion was to say that he doesn't know what he is doing at the draft table when you look at other teams.

    Leave a comment:


  • Road_Apples
    replied
    1999

    1a Damien Woody 17 center Excellent player (just left via FA)
    1c Andy Katzenmoyer 28 LB (played 3 years Gonzo)
    2a Kevin Faulk 46 RB (still playing for them)
    3b Tony George 91 SS (played 3 yrs Gonzo)
    5 Derrick Fletcher 154 G (Jacksonville Jaguars)
    6a Marcus Washington 180 S (Washington Redskins)
    7a Michael Bishop 227 QB (played 2 yrs Gonzo)
    7b Sean Morey 241 DB (Philadelphia Eagles)


    2000

    2 Adrien Klemm 46 T (Still there)
    3 J.R. Redmond 76 RB (Oakland Raiders)
    4 Greg Randall 127 T (San Francisco 49ers)
    5a Dave Stachelski 141 TE (played 1 yr Gonzo)
    5b Jeff MArriot 161 DE (Carolina Panthers)
    6a Antwan Harris 187 S (still there)
    6b Tom Brady 199 QB (excellent choice)
    6c David Nugent 201 DE (Oakland Raiders)
    7a Casey Tisdale 226 OLB (Ravens waived LB Casey Tisdale (injured)(Gonzo)
    7b Patrick Ross 239 FB (Jaguars- then Gonzo)

    2001

    1 Richard Seymour 6 DL (Pro BOwl)
    2 Mattt Light 48 T (still there)
    3 Brock Williams 86 CB (Chicago Bears)
    4a Kenyatta Jones 96 T (Washington Redskins)
    4b Jabari Holloway 119 TE (Houston Texans)
    5 Hakim Akbar 163 SS (Jacksonville Jaguars)
    6a Arthur Love 180 TE (Gonzo)
    6b Leonard Myers 200 CB (Detroit Lions)
    7a Owen Pochman 216 K (Giants/49ers,Gonzo)
    7b t.j Turner 239 LB (49ers,Gonzo?)

    2002

    1 Daniel Graham 21 TE (Still there)
    2 Deion Branch 65 WR (still there)
    4a Rohan Davey 117 QB (still there)
    4b Jarvis Green 126 DE (still there)
    7b David Givens WR (still there)

    These are the picks of the Patriots who have won 2 of the last three superbowls. How many of these guys are still on their roster I bet that there is no more than 10. How many of them are pro bowlers.
    Good call. Nope not many.

    I would say that Shanahans draft record is better than this and they are the team to beat today.
    Looking over the TWO lists, I agree that Denver probably has more players left on it's roster. Arguable as to how many still play in the NFL for other teams.

    Good post.

    Leave a comment:


  • Road_Apples
    replied
    DDP32:
    You people are WAY too sensitive if you thought what I said was "ripping" into Shanahan. Additionally I did not whatsoever diss you in any way shape or form. Re-read my previous post and honestly think about how it was that I dissed you - other than not responding to your original response- which I have no opinion on yet as I have not studied it. I will do that in a few minutes.
    Shanahan is a GOD. He is the man that walks on water. I don't know how Mel forgot him for the lead role when he cast his last movie. {Sarcasm- I feel I have to point this out for hypersensitivity reasons}.
    So to remark again:

    Shanahan is a MARVELLOUS, EXCELLENT, MUCHO FOOTBALL GOD. I PERSONALLY FEEL he (and his team of scouts) is nothing special when it comes to the draft. Maybe slightly above some median line. My point is the record doesn't appear to STAND OUT as Genius material. It has been mentioned, and others have said as well that he is not known for his drafting Genius but that the monker came from other facets of his football guidance. I AGREE.

    Leave a comment:


  • TXBRONC
    replied
    Originally posted by dhall26
    I always thought that pickup of Willie Middlebrooks was brilliant!!!
    It was as brilliant as the Chiefs picking up Larry Johnson.

    Leave a comment:


  • dhall26
    replied
    I always thought that pickup of Willie Middlebrooks was brilliant!!!

    Leave a comment:


  • DDP32
    replied
    Road Apples......it took me all of five minutes to look up the Pats draft and they were the only team that I looked at because they were the champs. Your point was that you though Shanahan wasn't a draft genius and I pointed out that compared to the current superbowl champs his drafting looks pretty good.

    Don't forget you were the one that started the thread and ripped Shanahan. I didn't go out and attack you and call you names I just pointed out that his draft record is better than the current top dog. Everyone is saying that the Pats are one of the best run organizations and my point is that Shanahan does as good a job if not better than them.

    I won't comment on your discussions with the others but you seemd pretty preoccupied with what they said. I presented a resonable counterpoint to what you said and you ignored or discounted it and continued on with your rant. If you want to discuss it then please feel free but if you are just going to tear into me and say that you don't have time for me then feel free not to post.

    Leave a comment:


  • Road_Apples
    replied
    I am supposed to wait a certain amount of time and a certain number of personal attacks before I defend myself? What gives around here. Just because I am new to posting here doesn't mean I am new to posting on BB's. As far as I am concerned taking pot shots - TOTALLY UNWARRANTED BY THE WAY!- are fair game for return shots. It's as if you have some unwritten initiation ritual to rag on the new guy. I show repect to those that demonstrate the same to myself and others. I do not kiss @ss, and pucker up just because I have not posted a lot here, although I have been reading the articles etc. on this site for at least a year. I offer my viewpoints without malice and as objectively as possible and without undue negativity - I expect the same in return- from mature individuals that is.

    As far as New England, let me see if I can spend a few hours researching a team I am not interested in to come up with a response to your response- probably not. I will grant you that I have not done a full 48 Hours investigative and exhaustive research project before I submitted my opinion. It was just a 5 minute perusal and a cursory comment that stood out to me.

    In the end all I am saying is this:

    He is not a draft genius. Plain and simple, nothing more, nothing less. Nothing about his character, his abilities as a coach, play designer, co-ordinator, father, brother, husband, frat brother, student, or potential candidate for the President.
    Is all this really worth the effort?
    Sheeesh!
    Last edited by Road_Apples; 04-30-2004, 09:47 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • DDP32
    replied
    Hey Interpol.......ouch I agree that Mr. Apples did go to the attack fairly quickly. Interstingly when I posted the Patriots draft he had no comment on that.

    by the way your little symbol with that kid doing his thing makes me laugh my a$$ off every time I see it.

    Leave a comment:


  • Interpol
    replied
    Re: And for the record

    Originally posted by Road_Apples
    ### Current Ignore List ###
    BroncofanNKC
    Interpol
    LMAO!!!! That's funny stuff.

    And he has done nothing but shown temperment and class? You're joking, right? You must not of read the tone in which he posted to other people. He obviously thinks he is better than EVERYONE, and to be quite frank, if I met someone like this in real life, and he were on fire, and I had to take a piss.....he would freaking burn.


    I could care less what argument he made, whether for or against Shanny or anything for that matter, just the way he rebutted everyone with a tone of superiority(which obviously is an unjustified tone) anytime someone said something, unless of course you sided with him.

    And he read this forum for "weeks" before posting, and his very first post is stupid trivial crap that has been posted three hundred times before?

    And I am the person at fault? You guys smoked way to much on the 20th, and it obviously hasn't cleared your system yet. I will show NO respect for someone who only shows respect for the people who agree with his position. Someone like that, is well, a liberal

    Do us all a favor and take a long walk off of a short pier.

    Leave a comment:


  • Road_Apples
    replied
    And for the record

    I also fully agree with that statement.

    Leave a comment:


  • broncsx3
    replied
    Re: I believe that....

    Originally posted by EPBroncFan
    I know one thing for sure, Shanahan has been nothing but great for the Bronco organization and we would be hard pressed to try and replace him.
    Amen to that.

    Leave a comment:


  • EPBroncFan
    replied
    I believe that....

    Shanahan has outstanding skills for selecting RBs and LBs in the draft and a less than stellar record in slecting WRs and and CBs in the draft. I believe this whole subject is very subjective, almost anyone can take football facts and twist them so they support your point of view. Its called spinning, and everybody does these days. I know one thing for sure, Shanahan has been nothing but great for the Bronco organization and we would be hard pressed to try and replace him.

    Leave a comment:


  • broncsx3
    replied
    Originally posted by Interpol
    Sorry, but I am most irritated by the manner in which road_apples went about his disagreement.

    Do I think of Shanahan as a drafting genious? Who cares. All I care about is winning.
    Your kidding, right? The way he went about his disagreement? Agree with him or not, he has shown nothing but temperment and class in the way he went about his disagreement!

    He writes a well reasoned, well prepared post that expresses his view on Shanahan. Even goes through the trouble of posting all of the Broncos' picks instead of saying "Denver has sucked at drafting the last 5 years."

    Then he gets attacked by idiots calling him names and making insane points like "Shanahan won a Superbowl, nothing else matters."

    Does he come back with name calling? Nope, he further reasons his point and defends his position and, for the most part, ignores all of the unjustified insults thrown his way. All he has done is disagree with popular opinion. Man, if only this was America and that kind of action was acceptable...

    To the actual topic: I think Shanahan is an above-average drafter who had a more success at the start of his Bronco career in terms of late-round gems then he has had over the last few seasons. Still, if you find a couple of winners each year I think you are doing a pretty good job overall.

    Leave a comment:


  • DDP32
    replied
    Ladies Ladies ladies......you all sound like a bunch of whiners. Road Apples put up a post and I disareed with it. I didn't call him names I pointed out using the Patriots draft that ANY team and I would bet most teams draft does not look too well at times.

    The tag of Genius for Shanahan at the draft table comes from where? Look Shanhan is not a scout he's not out there see these kids play all he's doing is looking at some tape. That's why you have a scouting staff. Shanahan has done well in turning up some late round gems and that's probably where the rep comes from. But it does fall back on the scouts who are evaluating the players.

    Bottom line is that the team wins. If the team wasn't winning then you'd look at the draft and point to that. But the team is competative and near the top. The Patriots that I used as an example was becasue they have won the last 2 of 3 superbowls. I bet you don't hear their fans crying about the draft. But I'll bet my left nut that Charger fans at *****ing about their drafts. It's all about perspective on how your team is doing.

    Leave a comment:


  • Interpol
    replied
    Sorry, but I am most irritated by the manner in which road_apples went about his disagreement.

    Do I think of Shanahan as a drafting genious? Who cares. All I care about is winning.

    Leave a comment:

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