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  • I would think 1 more year for all involved, unless they fall under 500 by week 8 next year.

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    • Originally posted by Capt. Jack View Post
      I would think 1 more year for all involved, unless they fall under 500 by week 8 next year.
      Just as he said, one more year just milking it for the money, at the expense of the franchise.

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      • The problem is deeper than Elway. Since Shanahan this team has had problems acquiring players and finding coaches to develop those players.

        Really if we take out PM and Kubiak this franchise has struggled for a very long time. Its problems run much deeper than just the GM
        Time to build on the win and grow the team from some solid play higher level of play

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        • Originally posted by Hadez View Post
          The problem is deeper than Elway. Since Shanahan this team has had problems acquiring players and finding coaches to develop those players.

          Really if we take out PM and Kubiak this franchise has struggled for a very long time. Its problems run much deeper than just the GM
          If you take out PM and Kubiak, the GM looks so much worse than he does now.

          If you take out those guys and this team has zero success, don’t you start with the one common denominator which has been the GM since 2011?
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          • Originally posted by Sam_Z View Post

            If you take out PM and Kubiak, the GM looks so much worse than he does now.

            If you take out those guys and this team has zero success, don’t you start with the one common denominator which has been the GM since 2011?
            My point is we been bad for years before 2011. 2010 was maybe one of the darkest years in franchise history.

            The changes of the McD years were horrible.

            Shoot the changes from 2006 to the McD years were pretty bad.

            I do not think the problem goes away with just a GM change
            Time to build on the win and grow the team from some solid play higher level of play

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            • Originally posted by Hadez View Post

              My point is we been bad for years before 2011. 2010 was maybe one of the darkest years in franchise history.

              The changes of the McD years were horrible.

              Shoot the changes from 2006 to the McD years were pretty bad.

              I do not think the problem goes away with just a GM change
              Ok but 2006-2010 is irrelevant to this staff now because that staff is long gone.

              let’s not look for a cop out or excuses In favor of this bad GM. Yes there has been plenty wrong in every area of this team from 2016-2020 but it starts from the top with the GM.

              hahaha Do we need to get John Tafer Or chef Ramsay to come in here and prove to some of you guys where the problem lies?Lol
              Of course this isn’t bar rescues or kitchen nightmares but on the business side, the same rules apply, and its starts at the top. Please stop kidding yourselves!
              Last edited by Sam_Z; 12-19-2020, 07:15 PM.
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              • Originally posted by Hadez View Post

                My point is we been bad for years before 2011. 2010 was maybe one of the darkest years in franchise history.

                The changes of the McD years were horrible.

                Shoot the changes from 2006 to the McD years were pretty bad.

                I do not think the problem goes away with just a GM change
                Ah, the old "the problems are bigger than any GM could solve so keep Elway" defense. Changing GMs is essential to righting this ship. John Elway CANNOT draft the talent necessary to make us strong. And as long as he is GM, no top-tier coach will choose to play second fiddle to the GM. Fire him on Black Monday, and start the rebuild immediately. One more year of 4-12 or 5-11 doesn't help anyone.

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                • Originally posted by GiddyupGetEm View Post

                  Ah, the old "the problems are bigger than any GM could solve so keep Elway" defense. Changing GMs is essential to righting this ship. John Elway CANNOT draft the talent necessary to make us strong. And as long as he is GM, no top-tier coach will choose to play second fiddle to the GM. Fire him on Black Monday, and start the rebuild immediately. One more year of 4-12 or 5-11 doesn't help anyone.
                  I realize the Elway hate runs deep but I am not trying to say keep Elway.

                  I am trying to say if all we do is replace the GM and coaches than I think the problems will persist....just like they have persisted for 15 years now through various GMs and various coaches.
                  Time to build on the win and grow the team from some solid play higher level of play

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                  • Originally posted by Hadez View Post

                    I realize the Elway hate runs deep but I am not trying to say keep Elway.

                    I am trying to say if all we do is replace the GM and coaches than I think the problems will persist....just like they have persisted for 15 years now through various GMs and various coaches.
                    Shanahan and McDaniels both were de facto GMs. So what to Shanahan, McDaniels, and Elway all have in common? None of them are player personnel experts! Kevin Colbert finds amazing talent every single year in the draft at a variety of positions. Make your GM someone who has a track record identifying strong talent in the draft and free agency. Whether he played in the NFL or is a big name is irrelevant!!

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                    • Originally posted by GiddyupGetEm View Post

                      Shanahan and McDaniels both were de facto GMs. So what to Shanahan, McDaniels, and Elway all have in common? None of them are player personnel experts! Kevin Colbert finds amazing talent every single year in the draft at a variety of positions. Make your GM someone who has a track record identifying strong talent in the draft and free agency. Whether he played in the NFL or is a big name is irrelevant!!
                      It is odd how many people think a GM's work is just a one man show.

                      There are a team of people giving all sorts of research and advice....when different decision makers keep making bad decisions year after year for decades...maybe the front office team is just as bad as the leader...maybe worse.
                      Time to build on the win and grow the team from some solid play higher level of play

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                      • Originally posted by Hadez View Post

                        I realize the Elway hate runs deep but I am not trying to say keep Elway.

                        I am trying to say if all we do is replace the GM and coaches than I think the problems will persist....just like they have persisted for 15 years now through various GMs and various coaches.
                        Because we can see and accept the truth quicker than most in here does not constitute hate. Would you like it if you said "fire Schurmur" and I came in and said you were just hating?

                        Nobody hates Elway in here, were saying hes had more than enough time to right this ship.
                        I hate that people continously wanna write off his failures and keep him aboard, placing him above the teams success but that doesnt mean I hate him.

                        Now yes firing John isnt an instant fix but at least its a step in the right direction. Accepting that John Elway minus PM and GK is not the right guy for the job is a step in the right direction.
                        Starting fresh with a new GM with a better knack for talent is better even if he fails, at least it shows that we care more about the team than Johns Pedestal.
                        Last edited by Sam_Z; 12-19-2020, 07:51 PM.
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                        • Originally posted by Hadez View Post

                          It is odd how many people think a GM's work is just a one man show.

                          There are a team of people giving all sorts of research and advice....when different decision makers keep making bad decisions year after year for decades...maybe the front office team is just as bad as the leader...maybe worse.
                          Ive said time and time again that Matt Russel needs to go as well. The whole John Elway led front office needs to go. There now it doesnt look like Im just saying John.
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                          • Originally posted by Hadez View Post

                            It is odd how many people think a GM's work is just a one man show.

                            There are a team of people giving all sorts of research and advice....when different decision makers keep making bad decisions year after year for decades...maybe the front office team is just as bad as the leader...maybe worse.
                            Youre right, its more than a one man show.

                            Thats why I want to clean house, including the squatter sitting in Mr B's chair. Blow up the entire organization and start over!

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                            • Originally posted by Sam_Z View Post

                              Because we can see and accept the truth quicker than most in here does not constitute hate. Would you like it if you said "fire Schurmur" and I came in and said you were just hating?

                              Nobody hates Elway in here, were saying hes had more than enough time to right this ship.
                              I hate that people continously wanna write off his failures and keep him aboard, placing him above the teams success but that doesnt mean I hate him.

                              Now yes firing John isnt an instant fix but at least its a step in the right direction. Accepting that John Elway minus PM and GK is not the right guy for the job is a step in the right direction.
                              Starting fresh with a new GM with a better knack for talent is better even if he fails, at least it shows that we care more about the team than Johns Pedestal.
                              There is definitely some hate on these forums.

                              Unless one is part of the inner workings of the Broncos then one only has access to the results on the field and limited...if any...knowledge of what is actually going on inside the Broncos.

                              If you think one can "accept the truth" from that knowledge than you have powers of the mind that can probably make you a lot of money and maybe should stop wasting your time posting on internet forums.

                              Now it is cool...we all come here to the forums and discuss our opinions and our takes on things...but do not try to tell me you "accept the truth" when there is probably no way you actually know the truth.
                              Time to build on the win and grow the team from some solid play higher level of play

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                              • Originally posted by Hadez View Post

                                There is definitely some hate on these forums.

                                Unless one is part of the inner workings of the Broncos then one only has access to the results on the field and limited...if any...knowledge of what is actually going on inside the Broncos.

                                If you think one can "accept the truth" from that knowledge than you have powers of the mind that can probably make you a lot of money and maybe should stop wasting your time posting on internet forums.

                                Now it is cool...we all come here to the forums and discuss our opinions and our takes on things...but do not try to tell me you "accept the truth" when there is probably no way you actually know the truth.
                                Im talking about Johns failures as a GM...

                                Do you not see them? Dude youve gotta accept that hes failed the last five seasons and not by a small margin by huge proportions! Accept it, it is in fact truth!
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