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  • Originally posted by broncolee View Post

    I’m all for giving Lock another chance.

    I don’t think it’s going to happen if the Broncos have a chance at one of the top qb prospects. If that’s the case, I hope it’s Fields.

    If they don’t take a quarterback in the first, I hope they take the best player available at #9.
    I’m not sold on Fields but if we get him and he is as good as you think hopefully that happens and I’m wrong
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    • Originally posted by beastlyskronk View Post

      Baker Mayfield didn’t seem to have a problem his rookie season either. Then they loaded up with weapons for him and he bombed year 2 before settling in as a game manager in year 3. Different people will react differently than others. Let’s see how Herbert plays next season with a new coaching staff and one of the best young offensive mind before we start crowning him.

      Drew needs consistency. I don’t think the 4-1 was a mirage, him and Rich just meshed together well. Even though Rich had some terrible play calls, him and Lock could’ve developed together. Bringing in Shurmur didn’t just bring a new offense, it also brought different philosophies, different reads, different coaching as well as with Drew going into year 2 the added responsibility of executing an expanded playbook and not one that just caters to what he does well. And even though there were plays that were similar to what Scangerello would call, it was undoubtedly coached different due to their different philosophies on offense.

      Going into year 3 Lock has something he’s never had before. He has that consistency, instead of just knowing what he needs to work on, he now knows what he needs to work on and how he needs to work on those things as it relates to the offense. Lock puts in work, I don’t doubt that for a second, but knowing what to work on is only half the battle for QBs in the NFL. Knowing how to work on those things in relation to the offense itself and how the plays/players are being coached is a huge aspect to a QB’s success that gets overlooked. Is it a coincidence that his numbers throwing to Patrick or Fant are vastly different than Jeudy or Hamler? Or is it that they were guys Lock already had experience with and had a better understanding of how those guys would react to certain coverages?

      The answer is never as simple as “well this guy didn’t have a problem so our guy just isn’t good enough”. There’s a lot that goes into playing the QB position and Lock was in a vastly different situation than Herbert, it isn’t an apple to apple comparison.
      For me, the problem is Lock is making the same mistakes he did in college. He hasn't shown any signs of improving his mechanics or decision making. His footwork has not improved at all and he consistently puts the ball in harm's way. You don't need consecutive years with an OC to figure that out.

      And yes, you can compare Lock to Herbert. One has elite talent and intangibles and the other doesn't. And it showed last year.

      There's no way you can tell me you wouldn't trade Lock for Herbert straight up right now....

      Apparently, the Broncos were willing to trade Lock for Wentz if the report from last week was true, not to mention the that they tried to trade for Stafford. Tells you what Denver evidently thinks of Lock.
      Last edited by sra84; 04-07-2021, 01:26 PM.

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      • Originally posted by BroncoFanDK View Post

        Maybe the 4-1 was a mirage, but what is not is Lock's lack of maturity, and that is where a veteran QB helps.
        Lock has the skills but he seems to mentally be a combination of Jay Cutler and Paxton Lynch.
        Yes that have been better young QBs than Drew Lock and that is the reason we are discusing him.
        heres josh allens first 18 starts

        2988 yards, 17 tds 14 ints

        heres locks

        3953 yards, 23 tds, 18 ints

        we are discussing him because some people think a 2nd round qb, that came in as a project in the second round and now with basically a rookies years worth of starts (18 starts 17 actual games played) should look like a sure fire HOF prospect already, despite playing on the leagues youngest offense having 6 of the 11 starters either rookie or raw 2nd year players with the entire offense learning a new offense
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        when do native Americans become human and not mascots

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        • Originally posted by sra84 View Post

          For me, the problem is Lock is making the same mistakes he did in college. He hasn't shown any signs of improving his mechanics or decision making. His footwork has not improved at all and he consistently puts the ball in harm's way. You don't need consecutive years with an OC to figure that out.

          And yes, you can compare Lock to Herbert. One has elite talent and intangibles and the other doesn't. And it showed last year.

          There's no way you can tell me you wouldn't trade Lock for Herbert straight up right now....

          Apparently, the Broncos were willing to trade Lock for Wentz if the report from last week was true, not to mention the that they tried to trade for Stafford. Tells you what Denver evidently thinks of Lock.
          from walter football

          There are a number of things that Lock needs to improve upon for the NFL. He suffers from what I call "big-arm syndrome," meaning he can have some flaws in decision-making because he trusts his arm too much. That led to him throwing some passes he shouldn't into coverage. Lock also could use some tutoring and mentoring because he was not coached up at Missouri. The Tigers had a revolving door at offensive coordinator, and sources say there are some basic things that Lock needs to pick up. However, they say he is smart and picked things up fast at the Senior Bowl. Sources say that of all the potential first-round quarterbacks in the 2019 NFL Draft, Lock has received the least amount of coaching and development.

          and comparing a 6th overall pick comeing from a advanced college offense, on a a veteran laden offense playing the same scheme for multiple years to a qb who didnt have the most coaching help coming into the league, playing on the youngest offense is kinda misleading
          sigpic
          when do native Americans become human and not mascots

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          • Originally posted by sra84 View Post

            For me, the problem is Lock is making the same mistakes he did in college. He hasn't shown any signs of improving his mechanics or decision making. His footwork has not improved at all and he consistently puts the ball in harm's way. You don't need consecutive years with an OC to figure that out.

            And yes, you can compare Lock to Herbert. One has elite talent and intangibles and the other doesn't. And it showed last year.

            There's no way you can tell me you wouldn't trade Lock for Herbert straight up right now....

            Apparently, the Broncos were willing to trade Lock for Wentz if the report from last week was true, not to mention the that they tried to trade for Stafford. Tells you what Denver evidently thinks of Lock.
            Have you watched any of Tim Jenkins videos on Drew Lock. If you haven't, please do, and then post your thoughts.

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            • Originally posted by sra84 View Post

              For me, the problem is Lock is making the same mistakes he did in college. He hasn't shown any signs of improving his mechanics or decision making. His footwork has not improved at all and he consistently puts the ball in harm's way. You don't need consecutive years with an OC to figure that out.

              And yes, you can compare Lock to Herbert. One has elite talent and intangibles and the other doesn't. And it showed last year.

              There's no way you can tell me you wouldn't trade Lock for Herbert straight up right now....

              Apparently, the Broncos were willing to trade Lock for Wentz if the report from last week was true, not to mention the that they tried to trade for Stafford. Tells you what Denver evidently thinks of Lock.
              Obviously you hate Lock and want the Broncos to kick him to the curb immediately. Is it possible to trade Lock for Herbert straight up? Is is possible to trade Lock for Mahomes straight up? Is it possible to trade Lock for Brady straight up? What's your point? Strange post.....
              Utah Bronco Freak

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              • No, I just see a guy who's put more effort into his dumb dancing and celebrations than improving his footwork and decision making.

                I hear about all the work he put in last year and saw zero improvement. Now I'm hearing about all the work he's putting in this year.... sorry, but I'll believe it when I see it.

                I was never a fan of his going into the 2019 draft. I never saw him as a franchise QB. I would have been livid if we drafted him in the first round.

                People can defend and make excuses for him all they want but I'm not sold on a guy who celebrates as much as he does for as little as he's accomplished. He's had a solid offensive line, good receivers and running backs around him. Enough to where we should have won more games like Tennessee, the second Kansas City, Las Vegas and Chargers games, not to mention his actions that cost us against the Saints.

                He took major steps back from his heralded 4-1 run at the end of 2019 whereas Josh Allen showed Improvement.



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                • Originally posted by sra84 View Post
                  No, I just see a guy who's put more effort into his dumb dancing and celebrations than improving his footwork and decision making.

                  I hear about all the work he put in last year and saw zero improvement. Now I'm hearing about all the work he's putting in this year.... sorry, but I'll believe it when I see it.

                  I was never a fan of his going into the 2019 draft. I never saw him as a franchise QB. I would have been livid if we drafted him in the first round.

                  People can defend and make excuses for him all they want but I'm not sold on a guy who celebrates as much as he does for as little as he's accomplished. He's had a solid offensive line, good receivers and running backs around him. Enough to where we should have won more games like Tennessee, the second Kansas City, Las Vegas and Chargers games, not to mention his actions that cost us against the Saints.

                  He took major steps back from his heralded 4-1 run at the end of 2019 whereas Josh Allen showed Improvement.


                  Josh Allen also didn’t have to learn a new offense during Covid. Allen has had the same offensive coordinator all 3 years in the league. Lock should get another season.

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                  • Originally posted by jazzbodog View Post

                    Obviously you hate Lock and want the Broncos to kick him to the curb immediately. Is it possible to trade Lock for Herbert straight up? Is is possible to trade Lock for Mahomes straight up? Is it possible to trade Lock for Brady straight up? What's your point? Strange post.....
                    What are you talking about?

                    I said I don't think Lock is a franchise QB.... nothing to do with hate, just what I've seen from him.

                    And apparently the Broncos were willing to kick him to the curb as well for Stafford and possibly Wentz. People are just getting bent out of shape because I'm not joining the Drew Lock fan club yet.

                    I'm saying that people are making excuses for Lock when a rookie came in and had huge success. Obviously there's the difference between a franchise QB and a guy who's nothing more than an average at best QB.

                    If I'm wrong I'll admit it... but we'll see come next year.

                    We may even see who's tune changed by mid season.

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                    • Originally posted by 58Miller View Post

                      Josh Allen also didn’t have to learn a new offense during Covid. Allen has had the same offensive coordinator all 3 years in the league. Lock should get another season.
                      Everyone had to deal with covid....

                      Still, a new OC doesn't excuse poor footwork and poor decision making.... that's on Drew and he made no improvement.

                      I don't like Shurmur but those flaws are all on Drew.

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                      • Bottom line, I'm done arguing this.

                        Until I see Drew make huge, and I mean huge, strides in his mechanics and decision making.... I'm not buying him as our QB of the future.

                        Done.

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                        • Originally posted by sra84 View Post
                          Bottom line, I'm done arguing this.

                          Until I see Drew make huge, and I mean huge, strides in his mechanics and decision making.... I'm not buying him as our QB of the future.

                          Done.
                          Thank you....In Drew we Trust !!!

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                          • Originally posted by sra84 View Post

                            Everyone had to deal with covid....

                            Still, a new OC doesn't excuse poor footwork and poor decision making.... that's on Drew and he made no improvement.

                            I don't like Shurmur but those flaws are all on Drew.
                            I agree it is on him. A lot of that has to do with being comfortable in the offense and Qb’s go back to bad habits under pressure, if he can over come it this year he should be fine, if not then it is definitely time to move on.

                            Brett Farve had similar issues in Atlanta but overcame them to be a great Qb.

                            Drew Brees also struggled early in his career, and the chargers drafted Rivers instead of Larry Fitzgerald.
                            i hope we don’t give up on him too soon. I will give him this season.

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                            • Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
                              I agree it is on him. A lot of that has to do with being comfortable in the offense, and Qb’s go back to bad habits under pressure, if he can over come it this year he should be fine, if not then it is definitely time to move on.

                              Brett Farve had similar issues in Atlanta but overcame them to be a great Qb.

                              Drew Brees also struggled early in his career, and the chargers drafted Rivers instead of Larry Fitzgerald.
                              i hope we don’t give up on him too soon. I will give him this season.
                              You're right; being comfortable in an offense is a plus.
                              I feel like Drew's injury, and mechanical regress is partly due to an underwhelming offensive line.
                              A poor OL doesn't help cohesion amongst a bunch of young players.

                              I'm surprised our 2020 OL didn't perform better.
                              Does Denver move on from Cush?

                              Lock's 2020 Offensive Line:
                              Bolles / Risner / Cushenberry / Glasgow / Dotson

                              Lock's 2019 Offensive Line:
                              Bolles / Risner / McGovern / Leary / Wilkinson

                              If Denver's OL doesn't get resolved by round 3, perhaps Stanford's Davis Mills will be selected.
                              Apparently, he throws the ball in under 2.43 seconds, which is good unless it's an interception or
                              .

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                              • Originally posted by 58Miller View Post
                                I agree it is on him. A lot of that has to do with being comfortable in the offense and Qb’s go back to bad habits under pressure, if he can over come it this year he should be fine, if not then it is definitely time to move on.

                                Brett Farve had similar issues in Atlanta but overcame them to be a great Qb.

                                Drew Brees also struggled early in his career, and the chargers drafted Rivers instead of Larry Fitzgerald.
                                i hope we don’t give up on him too soon. I will give him this season.
                                While I generally like support for our QBs, I must say that it is pretty far fetched to make the argument to overlook the poor performance and lack of development with Drew Lock by insinuating that he would - should have the trajectory of Drew Brees or Brett Favre. Not every 6th round pick at QB will become Tom Brady and not every 2nd round pick will become Drew Brees.
                                If the hate was as strong for Lock as it was for Tebow, and people would actually have done highlight reels of every bad throw/decision then there would be a lot more material from Lock.
                                A huge difference is that Lock has the unearned confidence to throw into tripple coverage, across his body and off his back foot on a playaction pass. Lock has the mechanics to succeed but so did Christian Ponder, Brady Quinn, Kyle Orton....
                                There is no need to make excuses for Lock. To me it is like Kyle Orton going into the 2011 season - it could work but the confidence is low!

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