Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Lets Poll It....Do You Want Aaron Rodgers To Lead The Denver Broncos?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by broncolee View Post

    If your opinion is accurate, we might be in for a longer wait to find the right guy.

    They might as well have not traded for Bridgewater and let Lock finish out his contract, if there are no answers in next year’s draft.
    Look, I hope Lock works out. With time and assets we've invested around him, I hope it all pays off. Because I don't see any QB coming out next year that offers much more than what Lock does.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by sra84 View Post

      What bad information? I said it's my opinion.

      You're looking at measurables, arm strength, athleticism. That only gets you so far. To me, they have to have the mental acumen, some quality production against the better teams of college football, and, preferably 3 years as a starter.The mental makeup and experience is equally important for a QB. I'm simply saying I don't see any QB in that class that makes me say ' Wow, I really hope we can get him next year'.​​​​​

      And I'm talking about first round QB's....top of the first round. Not late first, second round or later QB's. I've already stated in another thread that we've gone down that road numerous times. We need to target a top flight QB prospect....if Lock doesn't pan out.

      i am talking your giving bad information about QB classes. calling one weak when it was not while other strong when they look like they are gonna be weak.

      now your back tracking. if you judge a QB then you have to judge all the QB that comes out of it. to say otherwise is just wrong. if you don't give a class a credit for a good QB cause he wasn't drafted in the first round. thats a super narrow way to look at it. it is also not the smartest way to look at.

      out of first round QB i take it Lawrence was the only one you liked and we had no chance. cause none of them had 3 years as a starter outside him.

      i just don't feel you have looked into this class with what you are saying. both Howell and Rattler had good production against top 25 teams. both have all the talent and everything you look for in a QB. both will end up being top ten picks. plus there is still this year they should improve. this seems kinda dumb debating how good a class will be a year before it happens. where the teams have a 12-13 games to play before they are drafted.
      sigpic
      oakland raders gm
      latavis murray trade bait

      Comment


      • Originally posted by CanDB View Post

        Rodgers and Adams you say! Lets see, possibly the #1 QB and the #1 WR in all of football!! Think of the production with Adams, Sutton, Patrick and Fant....along with Gordon and Williams.

        OK....dream's over. Time to get back to reality. (but they can't have Risner!)

        Maybe we pay them in this stuff...




        I like the term “intoxicating”. Because the possibilities are heady to think about. Until reality sits in!

        But let’s not try to ignore that there are posters on this site that would read that asset list and willingly make that trade.

        I am solidly in the “ let’s keep rebuilding with Lock at QB” opinion. But I’m more then willing to listen if Rodgers actually becomes available. But I have serious limitations. Obviously multiple picks over the next three years. But I’m very selective on any players included. Simply because any key players will be difficult to replace with no early draft picks and limited cap after signing Rodgers to a big extension.

        From what I see proposed, that keeps getting ignored. Rodgers at $35-40 yr is an obstacle IMO.

        Broncos inherit the very problem that GB (and teams like SEA) have after paying the huge contracts. The overall team becomes less competitive. Ever consider why GB has fallen short on numerous occasions? Why would they be unwilling to pay Rodgers?

        And they have all their picks to fill in roster holes. Where does that leave the Broncos? Paying a premium in BOTH picks and cap space. Those comparing the situation to Manning are incorrect. He signed a reasonable contract in free agency. He was added to the existing team. Same as Brady. If traded, I would expect Rodgers to have a similar team friendly attitude.

        I love the “thought” of adding Rodgers. But I question if it is truly the solution. The details of any actual trade will be interesting to see. Because it will matter on the overall impact for years to come.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by sra84 View Post

          What bad information? I said it's my opinion.

          You're looking at measurables, arm strength, athleticism. That only gets you so far. To me, they have to have the mental acumen, some quality production against the better teams of college football, and, preferably 3 years as a starter.The mental makeup and experience is equally important for a QB. I'm simply saying I don't see any QB in that class that makes me say ' Wow, I really hope we can get him next year'.​​​​​

          And I'm talking about first round QB's....top of the first round. Not late first, second round or later QB's. I've already stated in another thread that we've gone down that road numerous times. We need to target a top flight QB prospect....if Lock doesn't pan out.

          That’s the case every season though. Before this season started Lawrence was the only guy anyone was like wow I hope we can get him, and maybe handful for Fields, but no one was talking up Jones or Wilson, and most wanted to see more from Lance.

          Next years class is still an unknown but it’ll be more clear after the season is played. Howell looks to be the presumptive number 1 and Rattler seems to be 2, maybe flipped for some people. Slovis looks great to me, he just doesn’t have the elite arm, but he has everything else. JT Daniels may be great if he can fix his weird follow through. Desmond Ridder has a cannon and may be the most athletic QB in the draft. Jayden Daniels is super impressive for such a young player as well. D’Eriq King made some elite throws last season and if he can become more consistent he could be a steal later as he’s dropping regardless because of his height. And there a ton of other guys that vault themselves into the conversation. By the end of the college season, this very well could be a stronger class.
          Last edited by beastlyskronk; 05-21-2021, 10:01 AM.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by FR Tim View Post

            I like the term “intoxicating”. Because the possibilities are heady to think about. Until reality sits in!

            But let’s not try to ignore that there are posters on this site that would read that asset list and willingly make that trade.

            I am solidly in the “ let’s keep rebuilding with Lock at QB” opinion. But I’m more then willing to listen if Rodgers actually becomes available. But I have serious limitations. Obviously multiple picks over the next three years. But I’m very selective on any players included. Simply because any key players will be difficult to replace with no early draft picks and limited cap after signing Rodgers to a big extension.

            From what I see proposed, that keeps getting ignored. Rodgers at $35-40 yr is an obstacle IMO.

            Broncos inherit the very problem that GB (and teams like SEA) have after paying the huge contracts. The overall team becomes less competitive. Ever consider why GB has fallen short on numerous occasions? Why would they be unwilling to pay Rodgers?

            And they have all their picks to fill in roster holes. Where does that leave the Broncos? Paying a premium in BOTH picks and cap space. Those comparing the situation to Manning are incorrect. He signed a reasonable contract in free agency. He was added to the existing team. Same as Brady. If traded, I would expect Rodgers to have a similar team friendly attitude.

            I love the “thought” of adding Rodgers. But I question if it is truly the solution. The details of any actual trade will be interesting to see. Because it will matter on the overall impact for years to come.
            You have a valid case.....not that I should judge who does or does not. There is huge risk associated with any such deal. It takes guts and more important, it takes serious due diligence. But my gut goes as follows...unless we seriously overpay, like 3 firsts and other picks, and a couple of quality players (we want to keep), I believe the end result is amazingly positive. I keep harping on the Manning/Brady "effect", and how teams behind them became champions. It is more than their talent, but the confidence it brings, and the ability to secure quality players via FA and trade.

            Plus if nothing else, it takes us from being in an unsure QB position, meaning we do not necessarily have our long term guy, to an instant franchise leader, who in this case, is one of the best in history and still balling it!

            But I see that you are definitely interested in a possible trade, so that's cool. In the end, as Broncos fans, we should all be prepared for a possible trade or the fact we are going with Lock and Bridgewater. That appears to be the extent of it going into '21, so unless folks like to whine all year, that's what we will end up with, and of course, more likely to be the latter.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by FR Tim View Post


              From what I see proposed, that keeps getting ignored. Rodgers at $35-40 yr is an obstacle IMO.
              Personally, I see it another way. What keeps getting ignored is what we are about to pay Lock or Bridgewater after this season. One of these guys is about to get a Case Keenum deal from us. A deal where one year of good play could be doing nothing more than masking weakness. Our defense is loaded with talent and we are going to win games, just as Min did in 2017 with Keenum.

              Is 35 million and top tier QB play really more of an obstacle to overcome than 23 million and mediocre QB play?

              We are out of options now. We had a great chance to take a young QB and (inexpensively) figure out the QB situation, but we passed that up....so again a starting QB contract is coming for someone.


              ​​​​​

              Comment


              • Originally posted by atwaterandstir View Post

                Personally, I see it another way. What keeps getting ignored is what we are about to pay Lock or Bridgewater after this season. One of these guys is about to get a Case Keenum deal from us. A deal where one year of good play could be doing nothing more than masking weakness. Our defense is loaded with talent and we are going to win games, just as Min did in 2017 with Keenum.

                Is 35 million and top tier QB play really more of an obstacle to overcome than 23 million and mediocre QB play?

                We are out of options now. We had a great chance to take a young QB and (inexpensively) figure out the QB situation, but we passed that up....so again a starting QB contract is coming for someone.


                ​​​​​
                I see your logic. Pay a reasonably large contract to an average player (at best), or pay a large contract for a top tier QB with a remarkable resume. I think the extra mill are worth it,

                Comment


                • Originally posted by CanDB View Post

                  I see your logic. Pay a reasonably large contract to an average player (at best), or pay a large contract for a top tier QB with a remarkable resume. I think the extra mill are worth it,

                  I bring up Keenum as an example as he was a QB who only started 26 games and went through 4 coordinators and systems in 4 years then put up a nice season and someone overpaid for him. Sounds eerily similar to what we are seeing/have seen from Lock.
                  Could you imagine if we had given Keenum a 5 year deal? We are about to face this exact situation with Lock if he improves even slightly.
                  Last edited by atwaterandstir; 05-21-2021, 11:30 AM.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by atwaterandstir View Post


                    I bring up Keenum as an example as he was a QB who only started 26 games and went through 4 coordinators and systems in 4 years then put up a nice season and someone overpaid for him. Sounds eerily similar to what we are seeing/have seen from Lock.
                    Could you imagine if we had given Keenum a 5 year deal? We are about to face this exact situation with Lock if he improves even slightly.
                    I understand. I was not in favour of him being signed here, after one decent season in a journeyman like career. I like rising talent, or steady talent, not just one season that seemed like an over-achieve.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by CanDB View Post

                      I see your logic. Pay a reasonably large contract to an average player (at best), or pay a large contract for a top tier QB with a remarkable resume. I think the extra mill are worth it,
                      I see the logic too. If it was simply a free agent and contract issue I would agree.

                      The issue to consider is the totality of the deal for Rodgers. Not just “a few million” more. Not just a “who’s better? Rodgers or Lock question.

                      Obtaining Rodgers would be costly. For every Bronco fan stating “a couple picks and a backup player” there is a GB fan stating “ go for everything including the kitchen sink because the Broncos are desperate “.

                      What that overall deal would actually look like is where I pause. I know some are not willing to hesitate in the least. They get all glassy eyed with the possibilities of Rodgers at QB. I get it! Just more cautious then many.

                      Give up too much and the depleted depth of impact players lost will have the Broncos competing for second place and early playoff exits
                      even with Rodgers. Get the right balance of assets and contract and it could be amazing. Get it wrong ....?




                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by FR Tim View Post

                        I see the logic too. If it was simply a free agent and contract issue I would agree.

                        The issue to consider is the totality of the deal for Rodgers. Not just “a few million” more. Not just a “who’s better? Rodgers or Lock question.

                        Obtaining Rodgers would be costly. For every Bronco fan stating “a couple picks and a backup player” there is a GB fan stating “ go for everything including the kitchen sink because the Broncos are desperate “.

                        What that overall deal would actually look like is where I pause. I know some are not willing to hesitate in the least. They get all glassy eyed with the possibilities of Rodgers at QB. I get it! Just more cautious then many.

                        Give up too much and the depleted depth of impact players lost will have the Broncos competing for second place and early playoff exits
                        even with Rodgers. Get the right balance of assets and contract and it could be amazing. Get it wrong ....?



                        I think you are referring to certain types of fans and not all of us. Because glassy eyed may be how I look when I think of him here, but because it would be that fantastic of a situation, as long as the cost is within reason. And for me reasonable will be a pain to some. You have to pay for what you want, and I really want this guy, so I think we should be prepared to pay. But I don't see us getting a cheap deal, and if I did, I would be kidding myself. No, I accept a relatively expensive exchange, and I do realize he is a costly salary. But I see it this way...with him we could be in immediate contention. Without him, I don't see us in the hunt for at least another season....possibly much longer.
                        Last edited by CanDB; 05-21-2021, 12:22 PM.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Kyousukeneko View Post

                          i am talking your giving bad information about QB classes. calling one weak when it was not while other strong when they look like they are gonna be weak.

                          now your back tracking. if you judge a QB then you have to judge all the QB that comes out of it. to say otherwise is just wrong. if you don't give a class a credit for a good QB cause he wasn't drafted in the first round. thats a super narrow way to look at it. it is also not the smartest way to look at.

                          out of first round QB i take it Lawrence was the only one you liked and we had no chance. cause none of them had 3 years as a starter outside him.

                          i just don't feel you have looked into this class with what you are saying. both Howell and Rattler had good production against top 25 teams. both have all the talent and everything you look for in a QB. both will end up being top ten picks. plus there is still this year they should improve. this seems kinda dumb debating how good a class will be a year before it happens. where the teams have a 12-13 games to play before they are drafted.
                          I'm not back tracking. I stick to my convictions.

                          I said all the time, going into the draft, that Lawrence and Fields were the only QB's I thought were first round worthy.

                          Lance was too raw, and I didn't buy into the Zach Wilson or Mac Jones hype.

                          2016: was never sold on Goff or Wentz

                          Goff doesn't have the football intelligence. We saw how helpless he was in the Super Bowl. All that talent on the Rams....he held them back.

                          I have never been keen on division 2 QB's....big fish in a small pond. Injuries aside, Wentz couldn't handle Philadelphia or competition.

                          2017: Bears were foolish to take Trubisky, everyone knows that. I was high on Watson. I admit I thought Mahomes would be decent, not as outstanding as he turned out to be.

                          2018: Liked Darnold and Allen. High potential, hard workers. Wasn't sold on Mayfield or Rosen. Didn't like their attitude.

                          2019: Was skeptical of Murray because of his height. Thought Haskins would at least be solid, so far he's a bust. Thought Jones and Lock were 2nd/3rd round picks. Can't believe Giants took Jones at #6. Was ecstatic that we didn't take Lock in the first.

                          2020: Knew there was no way to get Burrow. Tua's injury was worrisome and I have reservations about Alabama QB's given how much they have around them to make them look good. Said the same about Mac Jones over the last few months. Really liked Herbert but knew we had to trade into top 4 to get him and knew Elway believed in Lock and wasn't going to trade up.

                          2021: Lawrence was going#1...we all knew that. I have been saying for months that I would like Justin Fields. I've been consistent.

                          When I watch QB's in college, I want to see how they do against top competition. I want to see how they handle adversity in the moment and how they respond. I want to see improvement in their game throughout the season and the progress they make year after year.

                          Arm strength, mobility....all well in good.

                          How's the footwork? Do they protect the ball? Do they force too many passes? Pocket awareness? Do they get easily flustered?

                          It's more than physical traits.



                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by beastlyskronk View Post

                            That’s the case every season though. Before this season started Lawrence was the only guy anyone was like wow I hope we can get him, and maybe handful for Fields, but no one was talking up Jones or Wilson, and most wanted to see more from Lance.

                            Next years class is still an unknown but it’ll be more clear after the season is played. Howell looks to be the presumptive number 1 and Rattler seems to be 2, maybe flipped for some people. Slovis looks great to me, he just doesn’t have the elite arm, but he has everything else. JT Daniels may be great if he can fix his weird follow through. Desmond Ridder has a cannon and may be the most athletic QB in the draft. Jayden Daniels is super impressive for such a young player as well. D’Eriq King made some elite throws last season and if he can become more consistent he could be a steal later as he’s dropping regardless because of his height. And there a ton of other guys that vault themselves into the conversation. By the end of the college season, this very well could be a stronger class.
                            That's part of the problem. Teams push a QB up their board just because of the position.

                            I've stated time and time again, I prefer a division 1 QB, preferably a multiple year starter in a power 5 conference, who's improved significantly over his college career and has held their own against the best college football has to offer.

                            Fields did that for Ohio State. That's why I wanted to draft him, especially if he fell to us and he did.

                            I don't know if people don't understand what I'm saying or what, but I've been consistent with my opinion.

                            I was never, nor am I now, convinced Lock is the guy. Hope I'm wrong, because him succeeding is the best case scenario for us.

                            I've also, consistently said, that trying to sign Jameis Winston or trading for Sam Darnold, would have been better options for competition for Lock.

                            I've also said, if I'm wrong about any of this, I'll gladly admit I was wrong and I'll eat crow.... because I stand by what I say.
                            Last edited by sra84; 05-21-2021, 12:24 PM.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by beastlyskronk View Post

                              That’s the case every season though. Before this season started Lawrence was the only guy anyone was like wow I hope we can get him, and maybe handful for Fields, but no one was talking up Jones or Wilson, and most wanted to see more from Lance.

                              Next years class is still an unknown but it’ll be more clear after the season is played. Howell looks to be the presumptive number 1 and Rattler seems to be 2, maybe flipped for some people. Slovis looks great to me, he just doesn’t have the elite arm, but he has everything else. JT Daniels may be great if he can fix his weird follow through. Desmond Ridder has a cannon and may be the most athletic QB in the draft. Jayden Daniels is super impressive for such a young player as well. D’Eriq King made some elite throws last season and if he can become more consistent he could be a steal later as he’s dropping regardless because of his height. And there a ton of other guys that vault themselves into the conversation. By the end of the college season, this very well could be a stronger class.
                              Those are interesting prospects. You're a great source of scouting information on college prospects. What's your take on Terry Wilson?
                              "Stultum est timere quod vitare non potes." ~ Publilius Syrus

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by CanDB View Post

                                I think you are referring to certain types of fans and not all of us. Because glassy eyed may be how I look when I think of him here, but because it would be that fantastic of a situation, as long as the cost is within reason. And for me reasonable will be a pain to some. You have to pay for what you want, and I really want this guy, so I think we should be prepared to pay. But I don't see us getting a cheap deal, and if I did, I would be kidding myself. No, I accept a relatively expensive exchange, and I do realize he is a costly salary. But I see it this way...with him we could be in immediate contention. Without him, I don't see us in the hunt for at least another season.
                                I was speaking in generalities, not singling any one fan.

                                And I understand there will be a hefty cost to Rodgers ( if he even becomes available).

                                My “walk away from the deal” point is at three 1st rd picks and a couple 2nd and 3rds over the next three years. Players limited to Lock and not much else. Main point is Rodgers willing to extend in the 4 yr $100-120m range.

                                But I also realize I am much more agreeable and patient to the rebuilding concept. Going with Lock this season, getting some GM/ OC/ HC consistency and seeing the development of multiple young players. Improvement and battle for a wild card spot.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X