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  • Originally posted by LordTrychon View Post

    He didn't have bad games? Funny, seems like there was like a 4 game stretch he had where he didn't perform as well.

    Let's see -

    3 wins, Passer rating over 100 in each with 0 picks...

    Had a concussion, went out before the half, the first of 4 losses in a row...

    4 games below 100 passer rating, with 5 picks in the three games after the concussion

    Then two games with a rating over 100 and 0 picks.

    Seems like there was a bit of a low point or area there. Surely that didn't bring his rating down at all to a point it needs to recover from. Some sort of... what's the word? Oh, right... slump.



    Ah, ok... well he has 14 touchdowns, which only 12 QBs have more at this point...

    And I could have sworn I had multiple posters telling me before the season his ceiling was 15, so I guess we're in real trouble for the rest of the season... only one more TD we can get out of Teddy this year. Better pack it in.

    Wish we had one of the 12 non-backup QBs in the league.
    I heard his season sack ceiling was 31 and he’s at 26, let’s hope he doesn’t set his ceiling higher this season.

    Comment


    • The people that are down on Teddy are more down on the organisation for not trading for franchise QB, or drafting a potential franchise QB. That's fair enough. We've only had one since 1999.

      However, when Elway won his SB's, how did he do it? Was he by that stage a franchise QB who could win games on his own? Or did he rely on one of the great RB's at the peak of his powers and perhaps the greatest O Line in Broncos history?

      Teddy may not have been what anyone really wanted, and he may not be able to rack up 30+ points on more than the odd occasion; but as part of a balanced offence (ok a heavily run oriented offence) he can succeed. Just as Elway did in 1997 and 1998.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by famicommander View Post

        The chart indicates he's a middle of the road to slightly above average starter. Only three guys are better than he is at completion percentage above expected and he's roughly on par with Derek Carr, Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen, Dak Prescott, Jalen Hurts, Baker Mayfield, and Carson Wentz in terms of points added.

        He's also the only semi-competent QB we've had since Manning.
        Right. For clarity, I think he's done well for us this year. Top 5? No. Top 10? Probably not. Top half of the league and not deserving of a lot of the comments he gets?

        Absolutely.
        Thanks, Reid!
        sigpic
        Click on my sig to read JetRazor's and my story. Or PM me with any questions.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by famicommander View Post

          The chart indicates he's a middle of the road to slightly above average starter. Only three guys are better than he is at completion percentage above expected and he's roughly on par with Derek Carr, Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen, Dak Prescott, Jalen Hurts, Baker Mayfield, and Carson Wentz in terms of points added.

          He's also the only semi-competent QB we've had since Manning.
          Semi-competent? What's that? There's competent and incompetent. Not sure I've heard of semi-competent. Are you reluctant to say Teddy is competent or incompetent, so you try to have it both ways?
          "Stultum est timere quod vitare non potes." ~ Publilius Syrus

          Comment


          • Originally posted by samparnell View Post

            Semi-competent? What's that? There's competent and incompetent. Not sure I've heard of semi-competent. Are you reluctant to say Teddy is competent or incompetent, so you try to have it both ways?
            My point was that regardless of your estimation of Bridgewater, literally every other QB we've tried since Super Bowl 50 has utterly failed to approach semi-competence. I wasn't hedging my bet on Teddy, I was highlighting that even an overly harsh or pessimistic evaluation of Bridgewater still places him orders of magnitude above Lock, Rypien, Allen, Driskell, Siemian, Keenum, Flacco, Osweiler, or Lynch.

            The numbers say Bridgewater is average to above average as a starter in this league. It's been years since we've been able to claim that with a straight face about a Denver Broncos QB.
            Anyone seen Jake Plummer?

            Comment


            • Bridgewater ranks this season (qualified passers only)
              Completion percentage: 2nd
              Passing TDs: 13th
              Passing Yards: 11th
              Yards per attempt: 11th
              Passer rating: 9th
              Air-yards per completed pass: 11th
              Bad throw percentage: 8th lowest
              On-target percentage: 6th
              Interception percentage: 11th
              Touchdown percentage: 14th
              Net yards per pass play: 19th
              Passing first downs: 10th

              What kind of help is he getting?
              YAC per completion: 28th
              Sacked: 4th-most
              Sack percentage: 7th worst
              Throw-aways: 8th most
              Pressured percentage: 2nd (only Zack Wilson has been pressured on a higher percentage of dropbacks)
              Times hit: 9th most
              Times pressured: 3rd most
              Times hurried: 5th most

              Pretty obvious they need to protect him better.

              The basic stats and the advanced stats all place him in the middle of the pack or in the top third of the league.
              Anyone seen Jake Plummer?

              Comment


              • Originally posted by famicommander View Post

                My point was that regardless of your estimation of Bridgewater, literally every other QB we've tried since Super Bowl 50 has utterly failed to approach semi-competence. I wasn't hedging my bet on Teddy, I was highlighting that even an overly harsh or pessimistic evaluation of Bridgewater still places him orders of magnitude above Lock, Rypien, Allen, Driskell, Siemian, Keenum, Flacco, Osweiler, or Lynch.

                The numbers say Bridgewater is average to above average as a starter in this league. It's been years since we've been able to claim that with a straight face about a Denver Broncos QB.
                OK, understand what you're saying,, but don't think it's a word.
                "Stultum est timere quod vitare non potes." ~ Publilius Syrus

                Comment


                • Originally posted by GMTD View Post
                  The people that are down on Teddy are more down on the organisation for not trading for franchise QB, or drafting a potential franchise QB. That's fair enough. We've only had one since 1999.

                  However, when Elway won his SB's, how did he do it? Was he by that stage a franchise QB who could win games on his own? Or did he rely on one of the great RB's at the peak of his powers and perhaps the greatest O Line in Broncos history?

                  Teddy may not have been what anyone really wanted, and he may not be able to rack up 30+ points on more than the odd occasion; but as part of a balanced offence (ok a heavily run oriented offence) he can succeed. Just as Elway did in 1997 and 1998.
                  I’ve been down on TB since we signed him. He’s done nothing but prove me right. Elway even in his final years wasn’t as bad as TB.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Locutus View Post

                    I’ve been down on TB since we signed him. He’s done nothing but prove me right. Elway even in his final years wasn’t as bad as TB.
                    This is good, admitting you have an issue with confirmation bias is the first step in making better decisions.

                    BTW, there are a lot of faulty arguments on this thread. The real issue isn't how good Teddy is relative to every other QB in the NFL. Instead, the reality is to compare Teddy to the QBs that were available to the Broncos this off season, as well as the price to get them.

                    Stafford
                    Teddy
                    Wentz
                    Darnold
                    Cam
                    Fields
                    Jones
                    Lance - I included him because the 49ers traded for his draft position.

                    Cost - Cam was a FA, but other than him Teddy had the lowest cost of acquisition, by far.

                    I didn't see a lot of the Teddy haters on this thread clamoring for giving up 2 firsts and a third, PLUS more for Stafford, and he's the only QB on this list helping his team more than Teddy has this season.

                    And the reality will be finding a QB that is AVAILABLE next year that is better than Teddy, and he may not even be back next year.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by GMTD View Post

                      You've just described every QB outside the top 10. There's no reason why a QB outside the top 10 can't make the playoffs. They will generally need a very good running game, a good defence, and some good fortune but it can be done and has happened many times.

                      Let's say he does get us to say the Divisional Round of the playoffs. Even if we then move on we will do so from a position of strength and be able to attract a better quality of free agents.
                      Yep. As a matter of fact, 14 teams will make the playoffs. Therefore if we claim there is a direct correlation between the best QBs and playoff teams (which there isn't), then every year from now on there will be 4 non-top 10 QBs in the playoffs. It's mathematically impossible not to have 4 non-top 10 QBs in the playoffs.
                      lvbronx
                      Old School
                      Last edited by lvbronx; 11-13-2021, 08:00 AM.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by lvbronx View Post
                        Yep. As a matter of fact, 14 teams will make the playoffs. Therefore if we claim there is a direct correlation between the best QBs and playoff teams (which there isn't), then every year from now on there will be 4 non-top 10 QBs in the playoffs. It's mathematically impossible not to have 4 non-top 10 QBs in the playoffs.
                        At the moment there are six NFC teams with winning records; AFC has eleven. Seems likely the #7 seed in NFC playoffs may have a losing record.
                        samparnell
                        Soy Capitan Meshpoint
                        Last edited by samparnell; 11-13-2021, 07:35 PM. Reason: correction
                        "Stultum est timere quod vitare non potes." ~ Publilius Syrus

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by famicommander View Post

                          My point was that regardless of your estimation of Bridgewater, literally every other QB we've tried since Super Bowl 50 has utterly failed to approach semi-competence. I wasn't hedging my bet on Teddy, I was highlighting that even an overly harsh or pessimistic evaluation of Bridgewater still places him orders of magnitude above Lock, Rypien, Allen, Driskell, Siemian, Keenum, Flacco, Osweiler, or Lynch.

                          The numbers say Bridgewater is average to above average as a starter in this league. It's been years since we've been able to claim that with a straight face about a Denver Broncos QB.
                          I know what you meant.

                          Originally posted by famicommander View Post
                          Bridgewater ranks this season (qualified passers only)
                          Completion percentage: 2nd
                          Passing TDs: 13th
                          Passing Yards: 11th
                          Yards per attempt: 11th
                          Passer rating: 9th
                          Air-yards per completed pass: 11th
                          Bad throw percentage: 8th lowest
                          On-target percentage: 6th
                          Interception percentage: 11th
                          Touchdown percentage: 14th
                          Net yards per pass play: 19th
                          Passing first downs: 10th

                          What kind of help is he getting?
                          YAC per completion: 28th
                          Sacked: 4th-most
                          Sack percentage: 7th worst
                          Throw-aways: 8th most
                          Pressured percentage: 2nd (only Zack Wilson has been pressured on a higher percentage of dropbacks)
                          Times hit: 9th most
                          Times pressured: 3rd most
                          Times hurried: 5th most

                          Pretty obvious they need to protect him better.

                          The basic stats and the advanced stats all place him in the middle of the pack or in the top third of the league.
                          Some here will say that Teddy has been to blame for holding on too long, therefore the sacks and pressures. It could be a combination of him and Oline/pass protectors. But thanks for the stats! Most of them relate to me that we have at least an average NFL QB, and that's nor exactly a terrible thing. I am a proponent of acquiring a top 10 QB (minimum), but I can't blame Paton for that shortcoming this year. He kicked tires as we understand, and even had he drafted Fields or whomever, those are not top 10 NFL QBs, this year. I say he will make a change or two at QB in the offseason.

                          Back to TB. He is definitely what he is. Not a lot of surprises, but in a good sense this year. He does not win or lose every game we play, by himself. Plus, and this is hard to quantify, we keep hearing about him as a leader, and a guy that his mates can relate to. That is worth something. I loved playing with guys like that. It gives you energy, and loyalty to mates is a powerful motivator.

                          CanDB
                          Football Immortal
                          Last edited by CanDB; 11-13-2021, 09:20 AM.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by lvbronx View Post

                            This is good, admitting you have an issue with confirmation bias is the first step in making better decisions.

                            BTW, there are a lot of faulty arguments on this thread. The real issue isn't how good Teddy is relative to every other QB in the NFL. Instead, the reality is to compare Teddy to the QBs that were available to the Broncos this off season, as well as the price to get them.

                            Stafford
                            Teddy
                            Wentz
                            Darnold
                            Cam
                            Fields
                            Jones
                            Lance - I included him because the 49ers traded for his draft position.

                            Cost - Cam was a FA, but other than him Teddy had the lowest cost of acquisition, by far.

                            I didn't see a lot of the Teddy haters on this thread clamoring for giving up 2 firsts and a third, PLUS more for Stafford, and he's the only QB on this list helping his team more than Teddy has this season.

                            And the reality will be finding a QB that is AVAILABLE next year that is better than Teddy, and he may not even be back next year.
                            . Denver should have stuck with Lock, they gave up on him too early. At worst Denver would have gotten the same production and would have known for sure Lock wasn’t the guy,

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Locutus View Post
                              . Denver should have stuck with Lock, they gave up on him too early. At worst Denver would have gotten the same production and would have known for sure Lock wasn’t the guy,
                              They already know for sure Lock isn't the guy. If he were back there instead of Teddy he'd be turning it over half a dozen times per game with this line blocking.
                              Anyone seen Jake Plummer?

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by famicommander View Post

                                They already know for sure Lock isn't the guy. If he were back there instead of Teddy he'd be turning it over half a dozen times per game with this line blocking.
                                No, they don’t.

                                Comment

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